|
Replies: 56
| visibility 951
|
Orange Immortal [65627]
TigerPulse: 100%
60
Posts: 49162
Joined: 2000
|
Border Crisis: What exactly is the justification for not
Sep 21, 2023, 3:22 PM
|
|
securing the border, stopping the influx of illegal entry, and controlling (as much as possible) who gets in?
I know it's asking a lot, but please try to resist the urge to deflect, redirect, or change the subject.
What is the justification for not securing the border? [Results]
| |
 |
Secure borders are not that important. |
|
The border is secure. Everything is fine. |
|
We are doing everything we possibly can already. |
|
It would be morally wrong to deny entry to anybody who may be coming here for the right reasons, so we should not deny anybody. |
|
We need all of these illegals here to fill jobs. |
|
Other. Please explain. |
|
|
|
|
|
 |
Clemson Icon [27824]
TigerPulse: 100%
54
Posts: 48313
Joined: 2010
|
Coordinated Choreographed Chaos... It's ALL intentional.***
2
Sep 21, 2023, 3:27 PM
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Immortal [65627]
TigerPulse: 100%
60
Posts: 49162
Joined: 2000
|
That's not justification, which is what I'm asking.
Sep 21, 2023, 3:30 PM
|
|
What justification do those who are engaged in this coordinated choreograped chaos give? That's what I'm asking.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Clemson Icon [27824]
TigerPulse: 100%
54
Posts: 48313
Joined: 2010
|
They don't GIVE justification; they GET cheap labor. They're
Sep 21, 2023, 10:50 PM
|
|
slowly but surely eradicating the American working middle class.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Top TigerNet [30695]
TigerPulse: 100%
55
Posts: 23149
Joined: 2002
|
Climate Change is the cloak for communism ...
Sep 22, 2023, 8:38 AM
[ in reply to That's not justification, which is what I'm asking. ] |
|
These poor people are being displaced by ... wait for it ... climate change.
Overwhelm the greatest industrial & economic superpower in the history of the world, and you can defeat them.
In military terminology, they would say "our position has been over-run".
|
|
|
|
|
|
TigerNet Icon [152585]
TigerPulse: 100%
68
Posts: 68163
Joined: 2000
|
When you need for the chaotic world around you to make
1
2
Sep 21, 2023, 3:41 PM
[ in reply to Coordinated Choreographed Chaos... It's ALL intentional.*** ] |
|
sense, you conjure up a personal reality of all-powerful elites pulling strings, since chaos couldn't possibly occur on its own. Essentially the same reason religions exist: to explain the as-yet inexplicable so that you can sleep at night.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Clemson Icon [27824]
TigerPulse: 100%
54
Posts: 48313
Joined: 2010
|
Nothing personal about Blackrock, State Street, Fidelity,etc
Sep 21, 2023, 10:38 PM
|
|
The only thing personal to me is how they manipulate the markets and thus my portfolio on a daily basis...
Religions are about beliefs... Multi-Trillion dollar investment funds are reality.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Top TigerNet [30695]
TigerPulse: 100%
55
Posts: 23149
Joined: 2002
|
|
|
|
|
|
Top TigerNet [30695]
TigerPulse: 100%
55
Posts: 23149
Joined: 2002
|
Listen ... what's that ?
Sep 22, 2023, 9:43 AM
|
|
crickets chirping.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Oculus Spirit [42964]
TigerPulse: 100%
57
Posts: 21747
Joined: 2022
|
There is no justification for not securing it.
2
Sep 21, 2023, 3:31 PM
|
|
And I don't think anybody is trying to justify it. The reason it hasn't been done is Congress lacks all ability to compromise because Congress Critters are feckless cowards beholden to the most extreme elements of their base. We need more immigrants. We need more security. There is a compromise there.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Immortal [65627]
TigerPulse: 100%
60
Posts: 49162
Joined: 2000
|
Was the existing legal process not providing enough
Sep 21, 2023, 3:35 PM
|
|
immigrants?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Oculus Spirit [42964]
TigerPulse: 100%
57
Posts: 21747
Joined: 2022
|
One could argue, quite effectively, illegal immigration
2
Sep 21, 2023, 3:40 PM
|
|
is a response to the inefficiencies of the legal process.
However, to your question, the market decides what is "enough." Congress' job is to ensure the process is as simple/fast as possible, balanced against security needs.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Top TigerNet [30695]
TigerPulse: 100%
55
Posts: 23149
Joined: 2002
|
I heard the African migrants have finally starting
1
Sep 21, 2023, 3:45 PM
|
|
coming across.
Long boat ride to Mexico.
|
|
|
|
|
|
National Champion [7721]
TigerPulse: 100%
42
|
Re: Border Crisis: What exactly is the justification for not
3
Sep 21, 2023, 3:49 PM
|
|
I think a reasonable argument can be made that we need at least some of them as workers. However that in no way explains why we allow the southern border to be absolute chaos. We could shut down the border, set up a few Ellis Island type facilities down there, and funnel everyone through them to make sure we only take people who would be assets to our society, however for some mysterious reason, that concept will never come to fruition. We will allow coyotes and the Mexican gangs to have complete control over the situation while we #### in the wind.
The more important question than your initial one, IMO, is just why we have so many willing to not only accept but defend that reality.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Top TigerNet [30695]
TigerPulse: 100%
55
Posts: 23149
Joined: 2002
|
You know ... I wonder who is acquiring all the land
Sep 21, 2023, 3:50 PM
|
|
vacated by the migrants ?
Where Oprah at ?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Ultimate Clemson Legend [108484]
TigerPulse: 100%
64
Posts: 70426
Joined: 2002
|
We need their labor. Plain and simple. In return we get a
Sep 21, 2023, 4:03 PM
|
|
bigger house, a nicer yard, a cleaner house, cheaper produce, cheaper processed meats, etc.
BUT, the most important reason we need them here, working, harder, for less money, illegally, is because their labor deflates the prices of many common goods and services Americans rely on. They deflate the value of new homes, and many other things. That prevents inflation, makes debt cheaper, so we can issue more debt to buy more votes (Congress), and more and even bigger houses. Rinse and repeat.
We have a glut of college educated Americans who have no interest in manual labor jobs or careers. We have a dearth of Americans willing to do those hard jobs. No one with a college degree wants to pick lettuce. But the lettuce needs to be picked nonetheless, by SOMEONE. We have sold successive generations on the idea that a college degree is the key to being rich. So kids go into hundreds of thousands of dollars into debt, to get that degree, so they start working in a career NOT picking lettuce. And at the end of the day, with inflation roaring back, the return on the investment in college will not pay off.
I remember my father, decades ago, in the 60's and 70's, fresh out of Clemson with his degree, working in insurance, he'd see truck drivers making 5-6+ TIMES as much money as he did. We devalued the manual labor jobs so much by importing illegal labor that we flipped that situation. But now the tide has changed with inflation returning. The system is crumbling under the weight of the pandemic. We are now importing more from Mexico than China. That's a lot less "stuff" we're getting with cheap, dollar-leveraged "free trade". So prices climb as supply drops.
Is what it is I guess. Sad though that 90% of Americans have no clue about this aspect of illegal immigrants. Besides, seeing this light highlights our vulnerability and diminishes the perception that we're the world's strongest economy. We are, on paper, but in reality, if we had to stand on our own two feet, we'd be toast.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Hall of Famer [8139]
TigerPulse: 100%
43
Posts: 10466
Joined: 2013
|
No "feeding migrants to alligators isn't the solution"?
Sep 21, 2023, 4:04 PM
|
|
I'd argue if you're serious about immigration reform you need to address refugee/asylum status and work visas, not build mine fields and barbed wire.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Immortal [65627]
TigerPulse: 100%
60
Posts: 49162
Joined: 2000
|
So, to be clear, the current situation at the border is
Sep 21, 2023, 4:22 PM
|
|
just fine? If not, what is the justification for not fixing it?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Clemson Conqueror [11358]
TigerPulse: 100%
46
Posts: 12670
Joined: 1999
|
When you peel back all of the poop - I still believe these
1
Sep 21, 2023, 4:11 PM
|
|
people are viewed as potential voters. Eventually, the push will be to give them an easy path to citizenship - instant Dem voters.
Years ago - I thought it would be a good idea to offer as a compromise --> Let them in (with some vetting), give them a path to citizenship that included all of the rights of a US citizen EXCEPT the right to vote.
Also, it doesn't seem like a bad idea to have some way of limiting the places where people can easily cross.
And another thing - Mexico must be a really crappy place if folks will flee Ecuador (for example) due to living in fear for their lives and being raped daily (if you listen to the folks being interviewed) - but Mexico is not a suitable place for them to settle... : - )
Now - get off of my lawn!
|
|
|
|
|
|
Valley Legend [12684]
TigerPulse: 100%
47
Posts: 12292
Joined: 2013
|
your replacement citizen has entered the game
Sep 21, 2023, 4:20 PM
|
|
chew on this, the CIA arms 5 million new arrivals to subdue the south, road checks, round up firearms
WH claims its just gang violence
|
|
|
|
|
|
Clemson Icon [27824]
TigerPulse: 100%
54
Posts: 48313
Joined: 2010
|
Gametime.***
Sep 21, 2023, 10:44 PM
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Elite [5264]
TigerPulse: 79%
38
|
Re: Border Crisis: What exactly is the justification for not
Sep 21, 2023, 7:18 PM
|
|
LOL. Another "we have open borders" MAGAt narrative. 😆
|
|
|
|
|
|
Ultimate Tiger [33052]
TigerPulse: 100%
56
Posts: 16753
Joined: 2014
|
Re: Border Crisis: What exactly is the justification for not
1
Sep 21, 2023, 7:27 PM
|
|
So, you believe the mayor of Chicago and New York are lying about the issue?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Elite [5264]
TigerPulse: 79%
38
|
Re: Border Crisis: What exactly is the justification for not
Sep 21, 2023, 7:29 PM
|
|
Do we have "open borders"?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Immortal [65627]
TigerPulse: 100%
60
Posts: 49162
Joined: 2000
|
First, show where I used the term "open borders" or
1
Sep 21, 2023, 7:38 PM
|
|
said anything that wasn't 100% true.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Ultimate Tiger [33052]
TigerPulse: 100%
56
Posts: 16753
Joined: 2014
|
Re: First, show where I used the term "open borders" or
2
Sep 21, 2023, 7:40 PM
|
|
The phantoms in his head told him that.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Top TigerNet [32454]
TigerPulse: 100%
55
Posts: 19190
Joined: 2000
|
Re: First, show where I used the term "open borders" or
2
Sep 21, 2023, 7:43 PM
|
|
His/her/it's base programming
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Elite [5264]
TigerPulse: 79%
38
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Immortal [65627]
TigerPulse: 100%
60
Posts: 49162
Joined: 2000
|
I suppose it's a matter of interpretation, and perhaps
Sep 21, 2023, 8:31 PM
|
|
opinion, but to me "open borders" means anyone from anywhere is welcomed in legally at any point along the border with no interaction with any government authorities required.
Our border is not open in that sense. Yet it is certainly not secure, as we do little to deter illegal entry, and in doing so, we are actually encouraging it.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Elite [5264]
TigerPulse: 79%
38
|
Re: I suppose it's a matter of interpretation, and perhaps
Sep 22, 2023, 7:33 AM
|
|
What should we be doing differently that would "deter" people who are starving from 3rd world countries from trying to get into a wealthy country?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Top TigerNet [32454]
TigerPulse: 100%
55
Posts: 19190
Joined: 2000
|
We DO have Open Borders!
Sep 22, 2023, 8:02 AM
|
|
The Biden Admin made a clear statement to the world that illegals would be welcomed to the US from the very start of his term.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Elite [5264]
TigerPulse: 79%
38
|
Re: We DO have Open Borders!
Sep 22, 2023, 8:05 AM
|
|
What should we be doing differently that would "deter" people who are starving from 3rd world countries from trying to get into a wealthy country?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Top TigerNet [32454]
TigerPulse: 100%
55
Posts: 19190
Joined: 2000
|
Re: We DO have Open Borders!
Sep 22, 2023, 8:10 AM
|
|
Is this where we bring up 'The Georgia Guidestones' and the Left's plan to decrease the world population to ~500,000,000 people?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Elite [5264]
TigerPulse: 79%
38
|
Re: We DO have Open Borders!
Sep 22, 2023, 8:27 AM
|
|
This is the part where you're suppose to answer the question I asked. You apparently don't know. LOL.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Top TigerNet [32454]
TigerPulse: 100%
55
Posts: 19190
Joined: 2000
|
Re: We DO have Open Borders!
Sep 22, 2023, 8:29 AM
|
|
Go ahead and tell us how the Left plans to get world population under 500,000,000 first.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Elite [5264]
TigerPulse: 79%
38
|
Re: We DO have Open Borders!
Sep 22, 2023, 8:31 AM
|
|
I asked my question first. You don't have an answer, do you? 😆
|
|
|
|
|
|
Top TigerNet [32454]
TigerPulse: 100%
55
Posts: 19190
Joined: 2000
|
Re: We DO have Open Borders!
Sep 22, 2023, 8:34 AM
|
|
You never answer. Fact.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Elite [5264]
TigerPulse: 79%
38
|
Re: We DO have Open Borders!
Sep 22, 2023, 8:44 AM
|
|
It's your own fault for wandering in thread and getting pwned cause you couldn't back your narrative. Better luck next time.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Tiger Titan [48747]
TigerPulse: 100%
58
Posts: 43471
Joined: 1998
|
We do not
Sep 22, 2023, 8:44 AM
[ in reply to We DO have Open Borders! ] |
|
You can keep screaming it all you want because Fox News told you that term you don't understand, but it doesn't make it true. We do not have an open border with Mexico.
Try to run through the check point on the way back into the States and tell me how open it is.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Elite [5264]
TigerPulse: 79%
38
|
Well said!!
1
Sep 22, 2023, 8:58 AM
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Immortal [65627]
TigerPulse: 100%
60
Posts: 49162
Joined: 2000
|
|
|
|
|
|
Ultimate Tiger [33052]
TigerPulse: 100%
56
Posts: 16753
Joined: 2014
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Elite [5264]
TigerPulse: 79%
38
|
Re: Border Crisis: What exactly is the justification for not
Sep 21, 2023, 7:43 PM
|
|
Were people not coming into the country illegally prior to 2021? If they were, then by your definition, we had "open borders" during the Trump years.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Ultimate Tiger [33052]
TigerPulse: 100%
56
Posts: 16753
Joined: 2014
|
Re: Border Crisis: What exactly is the justification for not
Sep 21, 2023, 7:46 PM
|
|
Yes. What's your point?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Elite [5264]
TigerPulse: 79%
38
|
Re: Border Crisis: What exactly is the justification for not
Sep 21, 2023, 7:48 PM
|
|
So by your definition we've always had "open borders" and we always will.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Ultimate Tiger [33052]
TigerPulse: 100%
56
Posts: 16753
Joined: 2014
|
Re: Border Crisis: What exactly is the justification for not
1
Sep 21, 2023, 7:50 PM
|
|
It's not my definition. It's the definition of 'Open' and 'Border'. Do you know what those words mean?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [3230]
TigerPulse: 100%
34
|
Re: Border Crisis: What exactly is the justification for not
Sep 21, 2023, 10:52 PM
|
|
Do you understand what the word nuance means?
|
|
|
|
|
|
Ultimate Tiger [33052]
TigerPulse: 100%
56
Posts: 16753
Joined: 2014
|
Re: Border Crisis: What exactly is the justification for not
Sep 22, 2023, 6:35 AM
|
|
Yes
|
|
|
|
|
|
Tiger Titan [48747]
TigerPulse: 100%
58
Posts: 43471
Joined: 1998
|
|
|
|
|
|
Ultimate Tiger [33052]
TigerPulse: 100%
56
Posts: 16753
Joined: 2014
|
Re: I don't think you know what they mean when combined.***
2
Sep 22, 2023, 8:54 AM
|
|
Just because you have policies and laws regarding borders, does not mean we do not have open borders. You can say we don't have open borders all day long, but when 3000 people per day are crossing them, then they are open somewhere. Now, we may not have open checkpoints across the border, but those check points OBVIOUSLY do not constitute the border given the number of crossings.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Clemson Icon [27824]
TigerPulse: 100%
54
Posts: 48313
Joined: 2010
|
Maybe revise that 3k figure to 9k... They're no longer just
Sep 22, 2023, 9:10 AM
|
|
walking here. They're been shipped in by the trainloads.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Blooded [3230]
TigerPulse: 100%
34
|
|
|
|
|
|
Tiger Titan [48747]
TigerPulse: 100%
58
Posts: 43471
Joined: 1998
|
Lawd, why is this hard for some of y'all
1
Sep 22, 2023, 7:55 AM
[ in reply to Re: Border Crisis: What exactly is the justification for not ] |
|
Open borders means EVERYONE can LEGALLY cross a border without ANY government interference, like traveling from SC to GA.
If a border agent catches an illegal crossing into the U.S., does he just let him go and say he's good? No? Then we don't have open borders.
This isn't hard.
And Smiling, I do know you did NOT mean we had open borders in your OP.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Orange Immortal [65627]
TigerPulse: 100%
60
Posts: 49162
Joined: 2000
|
|
|
|
|
|
Clemson Icon [27824]
TigerPulse: 100%
54
Posts: 48313
Joined: 2010
|
At least you avoided a meme...***
1
Sep 21, 2023, 10:53 PM
|
|
:UPDATE: ... for a while.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Tiger Titan [48747]
TigerPulse: 100%
58
Posts: 43471
Joined: 1998
|
I think mostly the answer is #3
Sep 22, 2023, 7:52 AM
|
|
But also some of the answer is the jobs. However, I don't think there are many who do justify it. We have a massive border and completely securing it would be an astronomical cost, thus we're doing what we can.
There are probably harsher ways to secure it, but that would cross well beyond the lines of humanity and what our nation stands for. I know there are some sick ##### here who would enjoy that, but it's not realistic.
|
|
|
|
|
|
Clemson Icon [27824]
TigerPulse: 100%
54
Posts: 48313
Joined: 2010
|
|
|
|
|
|
Replies: 56
| visibility 951
|
|
|
50
