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Replies: 41
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Orange Immortal [65778]
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Mass deportations and the potential effects on the economy . . .
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Nov 26, 2024, 9:54 AM
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Which is more important?
(A) Standing against illegal entry into our country, and no longer welcoming or accepting those who do enter illegally.
(B) Avoiding potential economic turmoil by not having deportations.
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Paw Warrior [5027]
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Re: Mass deportations and the potential effects on the economy . . .
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Nov 26, 2024, 10:02 AM
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Maybe a better question for the parents of Laken Riley and others.
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Campus Hero [13644]
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Eye roll.***
Nov 26, 2024, 10:10 AM
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Paw Warrior [5027]
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Re: Eye roll.***
Nov 26, 2024, 10:16 AM
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I expect that from you. You don’t care.
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Ring of Honor [21681]
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Re: Eye roll.***
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Nov 26, 2024, 10:26 AM
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And we expect blind dumb tribal stupidity from you, along with a complete inability to actually talk about ISSUES like a freaking adult.
Guys like Tom I at least understand; they're narcissists and sociopaths. You're just an idiot...who seems to have little clue how dim he really is. I mean, you somehow took a wrong turn in between Athens and Chapel Hill and wound up on a freaking Clemson forum?
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Paw Warrior [5027]
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Re: Eye roll.***
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Nov 26, 2024, 10:32 AM
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I don’t have to explain to you why I’m on the board unless of course you own it. I don’t have to explain family ties to Clemson to you. You consistently present yourself as the smartest guy around. Yet, you will defend some of the most ridiculous positions that no true thinking person would defend. You want to know why I often just make superficial comments to morons like you? It’s because you are intellectually dishonest or maybe you just have no understanding of many of the things you debate. Have a great day smart guy.
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Campus Hero [13644]
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Back at you, buddy. You dont care about anything but
Nov 26, 2024, 10:26 AM
[ in reply to Re: Eye roll.*** ] |
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politicizing a family’s grief. It is tragic, but if you’re looking to blame one group or another, Republican lawmakers are just as culpable as democrat.
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TigerNet Icon [153145]
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Nor do you.
Nov 26, 2024, 11:17 AM
[ in reply to Re: Eye roll.*** ] |
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But keep pretending like you do.
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TigerNet HOFer [134584]
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C: Gotcha***
Nov 26, 2024, 10:06 AM
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Campus Hero [13644]
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Needs to be somewhere in between. There has not been meaningful
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Nov 26, 2024, 10:23 AM
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immigration reform since Reagan, both parties have kicked the can down the road. Trumps gonna hoot and holler like the clown show he is and get err’body in a tizzy before any real shid gets done. There will be some deportation , but not on a mass scale. Otherwise, that’d be like Murica hittin ourselves in the nuts repeatedly with a hammer.
We need the labor, so that will necessitate expanding the guest worker program. Make it the more effective choice for those that want to come here to work. Now to deport a buncha folks that ain’t contributing to the economy, find the cheapest way to do it and get it done. But killing a recovering economy to do it would be the height of stupidity.
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110%er [3914]
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Re: Needs to be somewhere in between. There has not been meaningful
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Nov 26, 2024, 10:32 AM
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IMO we need to deport those convicted or charged with crime while in the country as well as those convicted of crimes before they got here. I read somewhere the number of convicts was 1.3 million.
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Athletic Dir [1155]
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Re: Needs to be somewhere in between. There has not been meaningful
Nov 26, 2024, 9:13 PM
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You can’t believe what your Orange Jesus tells you. There have been more deportations under Biden than Trump. The bottleneck is immigration court.
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Ring of Honor [21681]
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Re: Needs to be somewhere in between. There has not been meaningful
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Nov 26, 2024, 11:21 AM
[ in reply to Needs to be somewhere in between. There has not been meaningful ] |
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Yup. And the frustrating part of it is, it's all just stupid, pointless, performative politicking for the Great Unwashed, done with a cynicism that just makes me genuinely hate the folks doing it. And everybody loses - the system stays messed up, the poor get poorer because their wages are getting artificially undercut, a whole lot of people doing vital work for us have to live in fear, see friends and family members who get caught just yanked away from them at a moment's notice because they got caught, all while working in crap conditions no human being should have to endure.
And of course, the folks who profit keep making bank. They always do.
It demeans us all, it really does, and I genuinely think nobody really wants it. A lot of the folks here talking tough about immigration would actually change their tune a lot when it's Pedro the landscaper they've seen around their neighborhood for years or Maria the maid who's cleaned houses for them...not because the guys on here talking tough are bad people but because a lot of them are actually not.
Our present system is a complete mess. And the answer isn't just "get tougher". The answer is also "let's be honest" about what we actually need, while making the rules more practical and enforceable. How the eff is any border control supposed to control two-million-plus migrants flooding across the border each year? And don't even get me started on how insane our catch-and-release system is....
This is not a problem that's going to get anything but worse with blind dumb partisanship. There's more than two answers, especially when both of them are completely stupid.
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Athletic Dir [1155]
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Re: Needs to be somewhere in between. There has not been meaningful
Nov 26, 2024, 8:57 PM
[ in reply to Needs to be somewhere in between. There has not been meaningful ] |
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You have to pay guest workers a wage much higher than the minimum wage. It would be nice to be able to have guest workers do all the hard work, but it will raise the cost of food and construction more than orange shitbag’s tarriffs.
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Ring of Honor [21681]
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Re: Mass deportations and the potential effects on the economy . . .
Nov 26, 2024, 10:51 AM
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Well, to me you need to satisfy both.
We need the labor. Period. Groceries and housing are already far too expensive; it seems like a really bad idea to deport millions of people who tend our farms and build our houses. I'm not quite sure how Donald and the GOP are going to reconcile the obvious connection between cause and effect when our groceries and housing spike further but I have no doubt Fox News will manage it.
On the other hand, it suits nobody to have a horde of unregistered illegals sneaking across the border en masse either. You're instantly creating an underclass that has no rights against employers who abuse or refuse to pay them for their work, an underclass that can't even go to the hospital without risking deportation when they're sick or injured. On top of which, in our present messed-up circumstance, we don't even know how many illegals there even are, and we're certainly not vetting out the obvious criminals. You also risk disrupting American society and culture when you bring in an indigestible lump of migrants who by definition are excluded from integrating into America itself precisely because they're here illegally. This group also pays no taxes, which further increases resentment and ostracization from American citizens.
The obvious solution is a Guest Worker system where those who arrive looking for work are vetted, and then, if there's demand for their skill or trade - even if it's just seasonal farm labor - they're granted work permits, which gives them protections and recourse against employer exploitation (and also incidentally allows them access to basic stuff like medical services no human being should have to try to do without), while at the same time ensuring the Venezuelans and El Salvadorians aren't emptying their prisons of gang-bangers and sending them north...and, oh, yeah, also ensures migrant workers are paying taxes for the public services they use. I also think there should be some path to citizenship for those who really want it, though it shouldn't be easy. I think we'd wind up shocked how many really weren't interested in becoming Americans...and were a lot more interested in sending money home and saving enough they themselves can live like kings back home.
A Guest Worker system also allows you to be a lot more aggressive about deporting the actual illegals and fining the ever-living crap out of those who employ them - and gives those who are here legally incentive to NOT protect the illegals because the illegals would be undercutting the value of their labor.
To me, that's the only way to solve our current mess.
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Paw Master [16301]
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Re: Mass deportations and the potential effects on the economy . . .
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Nov 26, 2024, 1:28 PM
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I agree with a lot of what you are saying, but illegal immigrants since 1986 with the passage of EMTALA do have access to health care via the ER.
That is not an efficient delivery system of health care, but no one regardless of income or citizenship status can be turned away from the ER or even admitted to a hospital for services if they are needed to stabilize the patient.
Additionally, illegal immigrants do pay taxes typically but aren't eligible for Medicaid or Medicare. They actually pay billions in taxes.
IMO, we need to lean on Mexico to tighten their borders, both southern and northern, begin deporting those with a criminal background whether here or in their native land, establish a number of needed guest workers and penalize those who came here illegally with fines that are stiff enough to find out who is really interested in becoming a citizen. There should be no blanket amnesty.
Biden screwed up an already screwed up system. It is time, past time to attempt to fix it and part of that is to tighten up drastically the influx that has been occurring, quickly begin removing the gangbangers and criminals and then get a handle on who is here and do we need them.
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Athletic Dir [1155]
TigerPulse: 79%
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Re: Mass deportations and the potential effects on the economy . . .
Nov 26, 2024, 9:05 PM
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At least with meat-packing, increasing the guest work duration past six months would help. Many undocumented workers were previously guest workers who didn’t return home after six months to wait six months for another stay.
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Athletic Dir [1155]
TigerPulse: 79%
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Question: Are Venezuelan gangs still taking over Colorado cities?
Nov 26, 2024, 9:49 PM
[ in reply to Re: Mass deportations and the potential effects on the economy . . . ] |
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That story dropped from Fox News, as if the election miracle solved the problem. The attention span of the Fox viewer is pretty short. Some of them have a whole spare room of My Pillows because they keep forgetting they already bought plenty.
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Orange Phenom [14755]
TigerPulse: 100%
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IMO you are posing a false "either or" choice....
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Nov 26, 2024, 11:45 AM
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Depending on the statistics you believe there have been anywhere from 7 to 11 million illegals entering the USA during the Biden regime. Even in the highest estimates I've seen - the main industries (agriculture/food and construction) where the "illegals are needed" account for 2 to 4 million workers (no one really knows for sure because its hard to track such illegal employees).
Considering we already had 15 million illegals before the Biden administration a whole bunch of those illegal workers so many are afraid of losing were already filling all those jobs before the Biden Admin opened the illegal flood gates. I'll make a bold prediction - less than 10% of all those illegals coming in during the Biden Admin are actually filling necessary jobs. It's just a fact that we've got a lot of illegals in this country whose deportation will have zero affect on our economy.
Secondly - the truth of any deportation plan is that there are limits to the amount of Government resources that can be brought to bear in that endeavor - especially in the first year or so. Therefore those limited Government resources are going to be focused on the criminal elements, those that US courts have denied asylum, and illegals siphoning off resources without a noticeable contribution (eg.. unemployed and new arrivals). These are the low hanging fruit of which there are plenty to occupy our Governments limited deportation capabilities in the near term.
While the low hanging fruit is being deported, you can bet some real discussions are going to be had regarding the "illegal" economic contributors and what can be done to bring them out of the shadows in order to give them some kind of legal status - guest worker visa or something of the sort. This can be done by working with the industries that require these workers where the individual company vouches for the dependability and character of their current illegal employee.
The bottom line is we are supposed to be a nation of laws with a defined border with legal immigration processes. It is high time we reestablish that system and have some control of who is allowed to immigrate into this country. We can meet every one of our economies requirements through a legal immigration system - we just have to be willing to stop the illegal flow of which mass deportations is integral to that effort.
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Ring of Honor [21681]
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Re: IMO you are posing a false "either or" choice....
Nov 26, 2024, 12:03 PM
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I agree, but you say: "there are some real discussions that are going to be had", and I'm saying: "Really? By who? And where?" Because I'm not seeing any outlet for it right now.
The Dems aren't having discussions. Their current plan is Catch And Release, and they shriek at anybody who says: "you know, maybe that isn't such a great idea..." The MAGA's aren't having discussions either, they're just being angry jacka$$es and snarling and herping and derping at the people who are actually trying to have discussions. Yeah, sure, let's round five million people up like cattle, great idea. Because that's just who we are as a nation and as a culture. And how's that even supposed to work again? What do you even do with five million people? The world's biggest tent city out in the desert? Sounds awesome. Hold our beer, Africa. We'll show you what a real refugee crisis looks like.
And so here we are, with a complete train wreck on our hands. And everybody's losing. Well, except for the handful of moneyed interests that continue to make bank courtesy of our present messed-up system.
Where are the adults in the room? Where's our place at the table?
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Clemson Icon [27834]
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Nothing like hyperbolic exaggeration... Take a Xanax or do some shots.***
Nov 26, 2024, 1:25 PM
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Paw Warrior [5027]
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Re: Nothing like hyperbolic exaggeration... Take a Xanax or do some shots.***
Nov 26, 2024, 2:28 PM
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He seems angry today.
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Clemson Icon [27834]
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His grant money must be getting tight...***
Nov 26, 2024, 5:32 PM
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Paw Warrior [5027]
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Re: His grant money must be getting tight...***
Nov 26, 2024, 5:43 PM
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Or maybe his whitey tighties.
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Athletic Dir [1155]
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Re: IMO you are posing a false "either or" choice....
Nov 26, 2024, 9:08 PM
[ in reply to Re: IMO you are posing a false "either or" choice.... ] |
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Only legit asylum applicants are being released. We are actually deporting a lot of people who cross the border. As many as the courts can handle.
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Athletic Dir [1155]
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Re: IMO you are posing a false "either or" choice....
Nov 30, 2024, 8:22 AM
[ in reply to IMO you are posing a false "either or" choice.... ] |
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Your numbers are mostly inflated. Like most clueless idiots, you confuse each encounter or border crossing with a unique person, and then don’t consider the unique persons who enter for a limited time and then leave. Many workers enter seasonally and return to family periodically, especially from mexico. The believable estimates say we passed the record 12 million from 2008 and might have 16 million undocumented now. Guess what also grew since 2008? That’s right, the entire country.
When Trump resurrected fear of immigrant among you, the clueless idiots, the number of undocumented immigrants had been steadily decreasing since 2008.
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110%er [3660]
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no matter what they say or do, we will always have illegal immigration
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Nov 26, 2024, 11:59 AM
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these guys are all talk. Mass deportations ain't happening because the states aren't going to let it happen.
If you think mass deportations are going to happen in Rock-Red South Carolina, you crazy. The owners of ag and construction businesses in this state are some of the most egregious exploiters of the illegal immigration economy. The corrupt politicos in Columbia will have a few token arrests, it will be a well-managed and dramatic show of force, but if you count the heads, the vast majority of illegals are going to stay put.
I'm sorry y'all fell for all the big talk.
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Clemson Icon [27834]
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Currently, all the "big talk" is about deporting the criminal element. It's been
Nov 26, 2024, 1:29 PM
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dramatically sensationalized by the left to include any and all... It's purely BS scare tactics.
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All-Time Great [90858]
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Who told us that the immigrants are eating our pets?
Nov 26, 2024, 1:30 PM
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That seemed uh, "senstionalized".
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Clemson Icon [27834]
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Who told us the natives ate his uncle...? He's still 'in charge' ?!?!?***
Nov 26, 2024, 1:45 PM
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All-Time Great [90858]
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WTH does that have to do with sensationalizing immigration?
Nov 26, 2024, 3:00 PM
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Absolutely nothing.
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110%er [3660]
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TigerNet Champion [121484]
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you think we should have been having this debate
Nov 26, 2024, 12:22 PM
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BEFORE the election?, because it is pointless now.
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Clemson Icon [27834]
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Dems lied about it then, too...***
Nov 26, 2024, 1:30 PM
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National Champion [7817]
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Re: Mass deportations and the potential effects on the economy . . .
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Nov 26, 2024, 3:52 PM
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Mass deportations has a nice ring to it but I'll settle for them rounding up the violent criminals and drug runners along with an immediate freeze of public assistance to anyone who isn't here legally. If they're really here to work we shouldn't be buying their groceries and paying their rent. Add in us doing whatever is needed to destroy the cartels which currently make a fortune off of our incompetence/disinterest at the border and that would be a good start even for the most hard core MAGA types. Of course left wing kooks will scream bloody murder at all of this and do everything in their power to keep their beloved illegals, criminals included, on the public sole and registered to vote, but we already know they aren't serious people so their opposition should be confirmation of being on the right path.
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Paw Warrior [5027]
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Re: Mass deportations and the potential effects on the economy . . .
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Nov 26, 2024, 5:47 PM
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Agree 100%. Get rid of the criminals and drug runners. Cut off all assistance to illegals. They get zero, none, or should I say nada? Do that and the flow will decrease significantly and many will self deport. It’s not that complicated.
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Campus Hero [13551]
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c) eliminate the welfare state and let them self-deport
Nov 26, 2024, 6:52 PM
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but since that isn't an option, A
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Athletic Dir [1155]
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Re: c) eliminate the welfare state and let them self-deport
Nov 26, 2024, 9:52 PM
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Hate to break it to you, but the typical illegal works much harder than you and contributes more to the country. I’m extrapolating based on your demonstrated intelligence, of course.
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Campus Hero [13551]
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Then their countries shouldn't be third world sh**holes, right? Let them
Nov 28, 2024, 4:05 PM
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go back there and work hard.
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Athletic Dir [1155]
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Re: Then their countries shouldn't be third world sh**holes, right? Let them
Nov 29, 2024, 8:39 AM
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For the most part, they are making this country better. While lazy people like you live off their labor. Be thankful they are working so you don't have to.
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Clemson Icon [27834]
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Go pound sand, PUNK.***
Nov 29, 2024, 8:47 AM
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Athletic Dir [1155]
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Re: Go pound sand, PUNK.***
Nov 29, 2024, 9:27 PM
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Angry little fellow. Take your meds.
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