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110%er [3626]
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Ring of Honor [21600]
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Re: Psssst: Sen. Warren is not a socialist
Oct 8, 2019, 12:24 PM
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Warren is anti-trust. That's actually the opposite of socialist. Anti-trust breaks giant companies up into lots of little ones; it certainly doesn't nationalize whole industries into single publicly-held companies.
Like I've said, the biggest victory the Alt Right "media" has scored is getting people to equate socialism with anti-trust - which breaks monopolies and companies with outsized influence over the markets - up into much smaller companies, which clears the decks for the actual "free markets" that the GOP once believed in and now only pretends to believe in because they're in the hip pockets of Aetna, Phizer, BP, Goldman Sachs, and the Koch Brothers.
We had anti-trust at one point...in response to the last Gilded Age, when the Robber Barons like JP Morgan, Rockefeller, Carnegie, and Vanderbilt were busily monopolizing America. We still know their names because they were the Pharoahs of their age...just as 100 years from now people will still know the names "Jeff Bezos", "Bill Gates", "Mark Zuckerberg", and "The Koch Brothers"...because those are the Robber Barons of today's Gilded Age.
Warren's policies are mostly focused on revitalizing and modernizing the anti-trust laws we had through most of the 1900's and got away from in the '80's...with the rise of all these monopolies we're seeing again today.
The free market will indeed revitalize America...if we actually can free up the markets again.
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Paw Master [16623]
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Lol. Well, good luck with the re-branding, guys.
Oct 8, 2019, 12:49 PM
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Nearly everything out of her mouth is telling corporations how they can work. Good luck explaining to people how that’s not ACTUALLY socialism.
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Ring of Honor [21600]
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Re: Lol. Well, good luck with the re-branding, guys.
Oct 8, 2019, 1:44 PM
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Nearly everything out of her mouth is telling corporations how they can work. Good luck explaining to people how that’s not ACTUALLY socialism.
Sigh. Your one sentence illustrates very clearly that you simply don't understand the words you're using.
In a socialist system, the government nationalizes most or all major industries into a single entity - or basically, a state-created monopoly, by definition - which is then controlled by the state for the "public good". There is no "free market" in a socialist system.
Anti-trust, on the other hand, breaks up monopolies into much smaller pieces, so they have to compete for the consumer's buck. That essentially creates the free market.
If you don't understand the difference, I can't help you.
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Paw Master [16623]
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What do you think my last sentence meant?***
Oct 8, 2019, 3:48 PM
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Ultimate Clemson Legend [102349]
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You mean if the government takes over health insurance...
Oct 8, 2019, 6:54 PM
[ in reply to Re: Lol. Well, good luck with the re-branding, guys. ] |
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it would be a socialistic program? Just how man socialistic programs does it take before a nation becomes socialist?
I mean if it's like 5 maybe Warren is OK.
You are naive to believe that the dems are willing to stop socialism with just one more socialist program. Anyone who thinks the pubs won't go along with that chit to increase government power is a fool.
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CU Guru [1907]
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Re: You mean if the government takes over health insurance...
Oct 8, 2019, 7:08 PM
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SO currently we have socialist programs for SS,Medicare, health insurance, car insurance, home insurance,flood insurance ,tornado insurance, earthquake insurance, public education,welfare,snap, WIC . I could go on but maye you get the drift.
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Ultimate Clemson Legend [102349]
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So which straw breaks the camel's back?
Oct 9, 2019, 4:34 AM
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How anyone can whine about debt and spending while claiming we need another social program is beyond me.
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Orange Blooded [2462]
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Ring of Honor [21600]
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Re: That's... not socialism***
Oct 8, 2019, 2:21 PM
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See what I'm saying? The Alt-Right media - which is of course backed by mega-corp dollars - has today's GOP convinced "regulation" to keep free markets free - you know, the lifeblood of actual capitalism - is actually "socialism", and the breaking up of their illegal monopolies is somehow Un-American.
They've actually got a significant chunk of these hapless derps turned against the basic tenets of democracy, too.
Be afraid. That's some seriously effective word-twisting.
Swarley's right about one thing, though. The adherents of actual democracy and capitalism seriously need to get better with the re-branding because they're getting boat-raced in messaging right now.
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Paw Master [16623]
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You’re swarmier over here.
Oct 8, 2019, 3:47 PM
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Who is the Alt-Right Media?
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Paw Master [16623]
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CU Guru [1907]
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Re: Psssst: Sen. Warren is not a socialist
Oct 8, 2019, 1:19 PM
[ in reply to Re: Psssst: Sen. Warren is not a socialist ] |
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As a fiscal conservative registered Republican she will get my vote against Trump now. 4 years of stupid and nothing done, actually 8-12 if one counts the years of BHO and Pub stonewalling.
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Orange Blooded [2462]
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I'll vote conservative again when we have a party
Oct 8, 2019, 2:17 PM
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The GOP is a hideous, mutated shadow. The deficit is as alive and well as ever, we are seeing continued corporate welfare, impeding states rights, and the government has no business telling consenting adults who they can and can't wed.
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CU Guru [1907]
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Re: I'll vote conservative again when we have a party
Oct 8, 2019, 3:02 PM
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My party left me, I did not leave my party.
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TigerNet Immortal [176419]
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You're really gotta rid yourself of this notion that anyone
Oct 8, 2019, 7:46 PM
[ in reply to Re: Psssst: Sen. Warren is not a socialist ] |
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who disagrees with you is some pawn of this "alt-right" media conspiracy.
Warren wants to apply rules to any company with annual revenue of $1B or greater.
This includes such devious "Robber Baron" run companies as Bass Pro Shops, Levi Strauss, Hobby Lobby, Hallmark Cards, and (wait for it)........GUITAR CENTER!!!!! Why, that's a regular rogue's alley of monopolistic abusers of the little man. They do need to be broken up, and pronto. Personally, I look forward to swinging by my local Mandolin Center, Cajon center, and Guitar Pick center for supplies.
All of these horrible companies would have to file for a charter from the federal government to continue their existence, and then follow a new and lengthy set of rules on how they run their business. The penalty for failing to follow these new rules is the federal govt shutting them down.
This isn't anti-trust, this is any reasonably large enterprise in the US (even the most innocuous) being at the beck and call of the US Govt. This won't create an anti-trust environment, this will create a mass exodus of large corporations from the US and an economic slowdown from companies trying to get under or stay under that $1B threshold.
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Paw Master [16623]
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Yeah yeah yeah Obed. But the definition of socialism... ******
Oct 8, 2019, 7:57 PM
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Ring of Honor [21600]
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Re: You're really gotta rid yourself of this notion that anyone
Oct 8, 2019, 8:47 PM
[ in reply to You're really gotta rid yourself of this notion that anyone ] |
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who disagrees with you is some pawn of this "alt-right" media conspiracy.
Warren wants to apply rules to any company with annual revenue of $1B or greater.
This includes such devious "Robber Baron" run companies as Bass Pro Shops, Levi Strauss, Hobby Lobby, Hallmark Cards, and (wait for it)........GUITAR CENTER!!!!! Why, that's a regular rogue's alley of monopolistic abusers of the little man. They do need to be broken up, and pronto. Personally, I look forward to swinging by my local Mandolin Center, Cajon center, and Guitar Pick center for supplies.
All of these horrible companies would have to file for a charter from the federal government to continue their existence, and then follow a new and lengthy set of rules on how they run their business. The penalty for failing to follow these new rules is the federal govt shutting them down.
This isn't anti-trust, this is any reasonably large enterprise in the US (even the most innocuous) being at the beck and call of the US Govt. This won't create an anti-trust environment, this will create a mass exodus of large corporations from the US and an economic slowdown from companies trying to get under or stay under that $1B threshold.
Well, now you're talking issues...and numbers.
What do you think a good cap would be? Because there is a point at which a company stops being a company and becomes an entity big enough to distort the market on its own...and in this era of dark money you can make an argument corporate influence over our politicians might be bigger than it was even in the Robber Baron era.
I know somebody as smart as you also knows the dangers of vertically integrated monopolies that control multiple rungs in the supply and distribution chain, too. Big can squeeze out little without ever even letting them compete.
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TigerNet Immortal [176419]
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Ask yourself, if anti-trust was the goal,
Oct 8, 2019, 9:07 PM
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Why not make the metric something relevant like market share, instead of economic success and productivity?
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110%er [3626]
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TigerNet Immortal [176419]
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I can’t say I disagree. It’s going to take some computer-
Oct 8, 2019, 9:49 PM
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illiterate 85 year old or a random Maori Tribesman to save us though, because they’re about the only people left in the world that Google doesn’t have blackmail-worthy dirt on.
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TigerNet Immortal [176419]
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And furthermore, we are walking past each other’s points
Oct 8, 2019, 9:55 PM
[ in reply to Rise of digital platforms is the issue ] |
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If the mega-tech companies are in violation of anti-trust (and I agree that many are), make that your stance and go after them.
Saying your taking down tech and then targeting something as broad and nebulous as companies with $1B in revenue is nothing more than a transparent, typically overreaching government power and money grab.
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TigerNet Immortal [176419]
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“You’re”. Sorry***
Oct 8, 2019, 9:55 PM
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Ring of Honor [21600]
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Re: And furthermore, we are walking past each other’s points
Oct 8, 2019, 10:44 PM
[ in reply to And furthermore, we are walking past each other’s points ] |
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If the mega-tech companies are in violation of anti-trust (and I agree that many are), make that your stance and go after them.
Saying your taking down tech and then targeting something as broad and nebulous as companies with $1B in revenue is nothing more than a transparent, typically overreaching government power and money grab.
Probably. There's a number of Warren's policies - and Oh My God, does she have some policies - that strike me as think-tank-type stuff, nice in theory, probably ultimately impractical...and she tacks too far left on more than a few things to suit me.
But man is big business out of control at the moment. It's not just influencing our democracy, it's stuck its arm way up its rectum and is using it as a sock puppet. And while I am something less than an ardent fan of Democrats in general, is anybody else but Warren even talking about the issue?
Personally I don't have a problem with millionaires. That's just being rich...and everybody wants to be rich. The problem is, when you start talking billions, though, at that point your money stops being money and starts being true power...power that cannot help but interfere with the democratic process. But that's individuals...I would certainly be willing to talk about when big becomes too big in regards to businesses.
What if - using the Chic-fil-A model - those $1B companies were able to duck that cap simply with a fairer ownership plan, redistributing wealth into multiple ownership? Or - God forbid - the government just crunches some numbers and determines what percentage of market share companies can grow to before they start damaging the market they're in? Because the older I get the more convinced I am that the mega-corps have got to go if democracy is to survive.
Even Mark Zuckerberg admitted today "nobody should have that much money". Then...in the very next breath he said that Warren represented an "existential threat" and he'd fight her. It's one thing to admit you've got too much...but another altogether to give that power up. And the next owner of Facebook almost certainly isn't going to have even Zuckerberg's limited compunctions; he'll just mercilessly crush all competition in the name of the company and its shareholders because that's what big businesses do if they're allowed to.
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110%er [6101]
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Ultimate Clemson Legend [102349]
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I pisz more Cherokee DNA that she has in her...
Oct 8, 2019, 3:28 PM
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entire family for at least 7 generations.
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Ring of Honor [21600]
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All-In [10883]
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This is a non-issue as far as I’m concerned
Oct 8, 2019, 8:27 PM
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If she identifies as a Cherokee Indian, then we should respect her wishes and acknowledge her as Cherokee Indian.
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TigerNet Elite [70418]
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Just a habitual liar***
Oct 8, 2019, 9:37 PM
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