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Replies: 53
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Webmaster [∞]
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TNET: Clemson ranked outside top-10 of Athlon 'way-too-early' Top 25
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Jan 8, 2023, 12:51 PM
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Orange Elite [5382]
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Lol!!! 7 spots below FSU. Wishful thinking
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Jan 8, 2023, 12:58 PM
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This is big time disrespect. Love it. Fire up the ROY bus!! Driving and riding all the way to playoffs
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Orange Immortal [62671]
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Re: Lol!!! 7 spots below FSU. Wishful thinking
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Jan 8, 2023, 1:07 PM
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Have to give you some coins on that my friend.
Although, I hope this fires up the staff and Dabo. I know this doesn't matter and the pre season polls will be all over the place. but, young kids do see it and I'd much rather be associated with the way too early top 5 than down in the weeds with SCar.
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Letterman [190]
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Re: Lol!!! 7 spots below FSU. Wishful thinking
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Jan 8, 2023, 5:21 PM
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Exactly, young kids see it just as they see all of these rec league coaches on here that know more about coaching football than everybody on the Clemson staff, Dabo included. Many of these so-called armchair experts are just repeating what’s being said on TV talk shows or the in game announcers. They don’t even go to the games and support the team. I wish they would keep their negative opinions to themselves.
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Rival Killer [3048]
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Re: Lol!!! 7 spots below FSU. Wishful thinking
Jan 8, 2023, 11:15 PM
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If you don’t wanna read varying opinions, I’d highly recommend not spending time on message boards. You can go back to whatever circle jerk smiley glad hand fest you need to support your righteous ego.
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Ultimate Clemson Legend [100848]
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Being outside initial Top 10 means we will have to..
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Jan 8, 2023, 1:00 PM
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slowly scratch & craw our way up the ladder so to be viable for the various weekly polls and later the CFP rankings.
Go TiGERS..ROCK!
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Game Changer [1800]
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Re: Being outside initial Top 10 means we will have to..
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Jan 8, 2023, 2:40 PM
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Back to normal for the Tigers!
Nobody gives us anything, we have to earn everything we get…..
Win every game one game at the time, and win the ACC to get a shot at the CFP.
We will have a solid Defense, and we need our offense to really score and hold the ball.
The last 2 years, 3 and Out’s have killed our Defense, and obviously hurt our scoring.
We have to move the chains and score, then play aggressive Defense.
Write that #13 on a piece of toilet paper, and use it to wipe, then flush.
Same chumps that always pick against Clemson.
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Game Changer [1800]
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Re: Being outside initial Top 10 means we will have to..
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Jan 8, 2023, 2:49 PM
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We play Notre Dame, FSU, UNC, and Wake in Death Valley….
We need to explode in those games, along with USC, NCSU, And Miami on the road.
The fun is in Winning!
Go Tigers!
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Team Captain [452]
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Unless we upgrade our talent at certain positions
Jan 9, 2023, 6:53 AM
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and improve the OC & DC performance we’re a 2-3 loss team in 2023.
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Letterman [288]
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Re: TNET: Clemson ranked outside top-10 of Athlon 'way-too-early' Top 25
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Jan 8, 2023, 1:12 PM
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Bulletin board material stuff for Dabo
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Orange Phenom [14574]
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Seems reasonable.***
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Jan 8, 2023, 1:25 PM
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Ring of Honor [22056]
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Likely poorly informed media and prior to defensive guy’s returning
Jan 8, 2023, 1:26 PM
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Add over valued portal players vs recruiting.
Now coaching is TBD next year.
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Orange Phenom [14572]
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He mentions the defenders coming back
Jan 8, 2023, 4:22 PM
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I listen to the Athlon CFB podcast on occasion and Steven Lassan is incredibly well informed.
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Tiger Spirit [9858]
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Good news IMO. Get hungry again and become predator
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Jan 8, 2023, 1:33 PM
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instead of prey.
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Letterman [185]
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Re: TNET: Clemson ranked outside top-10 of Athlon 'way-too-early' Top 25
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Jan 8, 2023, 1:41 PM
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This "too early" ranking is interesting because what the ranker sees is what so many Clemson faithful see, a continuing decline. There was a very long article in "The Athletic" a couple of days ago about recruiting, and it went through the major programs and how they had done in the current cycle. Clemson was mentioned in a single paragraph toward the end of the article, and the writer was very direct. He did not mention any of our 2023 recruits by name, said Clemson was not keeping up with the elite programs, that the key is to be at or near the top every year (as are Georgia, Ohio State, and of course Alabama), and that Clemson is no longer on that level.
I have written repeatedly that Clemson appears to be returning to the pack in the ACC. This article on the "too early top 25" is essentially saying the same thing. That does not mean Clemson will become ordinary, but there is a gap between good and elite, and Clemson is now firmly on residing in the "good" camp. Coach Swinney used to talk about Alabama and the ROY (rest of y'all) bus. During those years, he was really talking about Alabama and its elite pretenders-competitors, Clemson included. Clemson is no longer seated anywhere on that bus, now reduced to wannabe along with many others seeking elite status, somewhere down the highway, almost out of view and unable to keep up.
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Clemson Icon [27824]
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You care to take a bet on that as far as the ACC Title...?***
Jan 8, 2023, 1:59 PM
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Valley Legend [12671]
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Dabo will get not another ACC crown with Streeter
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Jan 8, 2023, 4:17 PM
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Calling plays and no WR. We have no NFL worthy WRs on our roster and none coming in. We’re on a slow decline. Getting the crown this year was nice but can’t see it aligning again.
ND gonna wax us in the Valley.
Lord help us of Miami ever figures out how to play with all that talent. FSU is on the rise too.
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Freshman [2]
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Dynasty Maker [3365]
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Re: TNET: Clemson ranked outside top-10 of Athlon 'way-too-early' Top 25
Jan 9, 2023, 6:49 AM
[ in reply to Re: TNET: Clemson ranked outside top-10 of Athlon 'way-too-early' Top 25 ] |
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I do not go with recruiting rankings to determine who is elite or not. I agree with most of what you said, but players commit and then hit the transfer portal. Recruiting is not the same because you can get a 5 star and the next year they are in the portal. Also, Clemson did no justice to their recruiting when they recruited 3 3 star RB's back to back to back at the end. They also took a 3 star WR. I am not saying they are bad, but thats why the ranking fell. Overall, it was a good class, not great but good. Clemson is not on the elite level anymore, we have some good players but elite is a thing of the past with the portal. Who thought TCU would be in the Championship this year? I know I didnt and they never recruit at an elite level but maximized the portal. That is something Dabo just refuses to use. He still has the high school kids will beat experience college player mentality.
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Letterman [172]
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Re: TNET: Clemson ranked outside top-10 of Athlon 'way-too-early' Top 25
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Jan 9, 2023, 8:19 AM
[ in reply to Re: TNET: Clemson ranked outside top-10 of Athlon 'way-too-early' Top 25 ] |
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Totally disagree with this take. Clemson has consistently been in the lower end of the top 10 in recruiting every year. Only once or twice in the top 5. They were second when they landed Lawrence and XT that is the highest year ever. Only 6th when they got Watson. This year 9/10/11 is around the normal for Clemson. So to say they are falling in recruiting is just not true!
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Letterman [185]
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Re: TNET: Clemson ranked outside top-10 of Athlon 'way-too-early' Top 25
Jan 8, 2023, 1:45 PM
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This "too early" ranking is interesting because what the ranker sees is what so many Clemson faithful see, a continuing decline. There was a very long article in "The Athletic" a couple of days ago about recruiting, and it went through the major programs and how they had done in the current cycle. Clemson was mentioned in a single paragraph toward the end of the article, and the writer was very direct. He did not mention any of our 2023 recruits by name, said Clemson was not keeping up with the elite programs, that the key is to be at or near the top every year (as are Georgia, Ohio State, and of course Alabama), and that Clemson is no longer on that level.
I have written repeatedly that Clemson appears to be returning to the pack in the ACC. This article on the "too early top 25" is essentially saying the same thing. That does not mean Clemson will become ordinary, but there is a gap between good and elite, and Clemson is now firmly residing in the "good" camp. Coach Swinney used to talk about Alabama and the ROY (rest of y'all) bus. During those years, he was really talking about Alabama and its elite pretenders-competitors, Clemson included. Clemson is no longer seated anywhere on that bus, now reduced to wannabe along with many others seeking elite status, somewhere down the highway, almost out of view and unable to keep up.
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All-Pro [752]
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Re: TNET: Clemson ranked outside top-10 of Athlon 'way-too-early' Top 25
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Jan 8, 2023, 1:55 PM
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This "too early" ranking is interesting because what the ranker sees is what so many Clemson faithful see, a continuing decline. There was a very long article in "The Athletic" a couple of days ago about recruiting, and it went through the major programs and how they had done in the current cycle. Clemson was mentioned in a single paragraph toward the end of the article, and the writer was very direct. He did not mention any of our 2023 recruits by name, said Clemson was not keeping up with the elite programs, that the key is to be at or near the top every year (as are Georgia, Ohio State, and of course Alabama), and that Clemson is no longer on that level.
I have written repeatedly that Clemson appears to be returning to the pack in the ACC. This article on the "too early top 25" is essentially saying the same thing. That does not mean Clemson will become ordinary, but there is a gap between good and elite, and Clemson is now firmly residing in the "good" camp. Coach Swinney used to talk about Alabama and the ROY (rest of y'all) bus. During those years, he was really talking about Alabama and its elite pretenders-competitors, Clemson included. Clemson is no longer seated anywhere on that bus, now reduced to wannabe along with many others seeking elite status, somewhere down the highway, almost out of view and unable to keep up.
We are not on a decline bc of lack of talent. That’s idiotic. On 247 composite talent ranking of every college football team, we still rank 5th in overall talent. Problem is coaching and coaching alone, and who we have as our coaches.
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Clemson Icon [26235]
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Re: TNET: Clemson ranked outside top-10 of Athlon 'way-too-early' Top 25
Jan 8, 2023, 2:12 PM
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He is a parrot!!!!!!!!!!
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All-Pro [752]
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CU Guru [1574]
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Re: TNET: Clemson ranked outside top-10 of Athlon 'way-too-early' Top 25
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Jan 8, 2023, 2:34 PM
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I disagree with that. I don't see anyone the caliber of Mike Williams, Deion Cain, Hunter Renfro, or Artavis Scott currently on the team. I disagree that it is all coaching.
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All-Pro [752]
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Re: TNET: Clemson ranked outside top-10 of Athlon 'way-too-early' Top 25
Jan 8, 2023, 2:50 PM
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I disagree with that. I don't see anyone the caliber of Mike Williams, Deion Cain, Hunter Renfro, or Artavis Scott currently on the team. I disagree that it is all coaching.
I do agree that at the skill position we are not quite as talented. But I would argue that the skill guys have the potential, and are not being coached up correctly. Those guys you mentioned had Jeff Scott coaching them and he did a phenomenal job with them. But I was saying across the board we still have higher rated talent than we did then. The coaching is the major issue right now. Don’t think our guys are being developed like they were.
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CU Guru [1574]
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Re: TNET: Clemson ranked outside top-10 of Athlon 'way-too-early' Top 25
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Jan 8, 2023, 3:59 PM
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My first point, HOW are they not being coached correctly? What is it the coaches are NOT doing properly?
My second point is, the quarterback and receiver positions are crucial for Clemson to be elite. Even in the good old days, we couldn't line up and run all over people. How many times would Lawrence or Watson make a big throw on 3rd and long? Heck, that's how we won the Alabama game in 18. How many times, just in that game, did the receivers make big plays on 3rd and long to get a first down? If we don't have that advantage at receiver, we don't win that game. I don't care how many 4\5 star linebackers, safeties, tight ends, etc. we had on the roster.
My main point is, you can't look at the overall rankings. You have to look specifically at the crucial positions to get the real story.
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All-Pro [752]
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Re: TNET: Clemson ranked outside top-10 of Athlon 'way-too-early' Top 25
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Jan 8, 2023, 4:46 PM
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Listen man, don’t get so bent out of shape. I’m simply stating my opinion and what I see. The only thing I was arguing with was the original poster I replied to which said that basically we don’t have talent anymore. All I said was we still have talent across the board and that I think the coaches we have now are not developing as well as our others were. It’s either that our the guys we’ve gotten were overrated according to their recruiting rankings. Bc even a lot of our skill guys were highly rated recruits but are not performing to the level of the guys from years past. So it’s either they’re not being developed or they just are simply not that good.
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Dynasty Maker [3381]
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Re: TNET: Clemson ranked outside top-10 of Athlon 'way-too-early' Top 25
Jan 8, 2023, 8:44 PM
[ in reply to Re: TNET: Clemson ranked outside top-10 of Athlon 'way-too-early' Top 25 ] |
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Antonio Williams was a pretty darn good freshman. Look for him to have a great sophomore season.
Collins will be solid. Turner will be solid. We really need Randall to step up coming off the ACL. If this group takes the next step WR will be fine. They were freshman outside of Collins afterall.
The overall concern will be the offensive one, the scheme and play calling mainly on the offensive side of the ball. I will not be hopeful with Streeter at the helm.
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110%er [3824]
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Re: TNET: Clemson ranked outside top-10 of Athlon 'way-too-early' Top 25
Jan 9, 2023, 6:20 AM
[ in reply to Re: TNET: Clemson ranked outside top-10 of Athlon 'way-too-early' Top 25 ] |
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I disagree with that. I don't see anyone the caliber of Mike Williams, Deion Cain, Hunter Renfro, or Artavis Scott currently on the team. I disagree that it is all coaching.
Did you even watch Antonio Williams? Beaux Collins will be better next year with someone to throw to him. We haven't seen a healthy Adam Randall at all! Turner showed some flash in his 2 games. Call me out next Jan 9 and let's see how it turns out! That is the fun part of college football, you never know!
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Orange Phenom [14572]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Disagree. We've clearly missed on far more recruits
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Jan 8, 2023, 4:46 PM
[ in reply to Re: TNET: Clemson ranked outside top-10 of Athlon 'way-too-early' Top 25 ] |
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I don't care what the rankings say, that 2016 roster was definitely more talented than what we have now.
What position group was better in 2022 than 2016? Definitely not QB or WR, not TE, not OL, not DL, and not secondary. I'll give you RB, and PK. LB maybe a wash, but Boulware, Joseph, O'Daniel were really good.
There were NFL guys all over that 2016 roster.
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All-Pro [752]
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Re: Disagree. We've clearly missed on far more recruits
Jan 8, 2023, 4:54 PM
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Again, same thing I said to the other guy, all I’m saying is by recruiting RANKINGS, our guys now were just as highly touted coming out of high school. I never said they were more talented than 2016 based on their on-field performance once they got to Clemson. I am saying that solely judged on recruiting rankings we have better talent based on that. Of course those 2016 guys were better based on what they did here on the field at Clemson than what the guys now are doing. But over the past few years we’ve had top ten classes, with several top 5. I was just saying that according to those classes they were supposedly better than the classes before 2016. Please try to read before you jump on my case and misconstrue what I’m saying.
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Team Captain [452]
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Top TigerNet [29862]
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Recency bias.
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Jan 8, 2023, 2:01 PM
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Ask TCU how accurate preseason polls are.
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Valley Protector [1477]
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Re: TNET: Clemson ranked outside top-10 of Athlon 'way-too-early' Top 25
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Jan 8, 2023, 2:08 PM
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Is this the same group that last year had WF and NCST ahead of us?? Good try with that one.
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Asst Coach [898]
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Re: TNET: Clemson ranked outside top-10 of Athlon 'way-too-early' Top 25
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Jan 8, 2023, 2:16 PM
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I see no problem with this...especially with the way we finished the year...i don't understand why people are mad!?
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All-In [10800]
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Re: TNET: Clemson ranked outside top-10 of Athlon 'way-too-early' Top 25
Jan 8, 2023, 2:21 PM
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For me, we are bit low and FSU is a bit high. I could see it with one at maybe 10 and the other at 11. Time will tell but our game with the Noles sets up to be another classic.
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Tiger Spirit [9218]
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Re: TNET: Clemson ranked outside top-10 of Athlon 'way-too-early' Top 25
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Jan 8, 2023, 3:26 PM
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For a preseason pole that’s probably reasonable for us. I figured we will be 11-15. Good news we will have plenty of opportunities to beat ranked teams and move up. Bad news is starting outside top 10 means margin of era is much less for a playoff stop, at least next year with only 4 teams.
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Varsity [121]
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Re: TNET: Clemson ranked outside top-10 of Athlon 'way-too-early' Top 25
Jan 8, 2023, 3:56 PM
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Time will tell but IMO FSU is being set up for failure next year with all the hype. On paper they should be an excellent team, but it seems almost every year there’s a team with super high expectations that totally falls flat. FSU may be that team next year.
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Tiger Spirit [9218]
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Re: TNET: Clemson ranked outside top-10 of Athlon 'way-too-early' Top 25
Jan 8, 2023, 5:17 PM
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I’ve spoken positively about their trajectory in the last couple of months but 6 seems a bit high. We’ll know soon enough as they play LSU right off the bat. We will also have a good idea about ourselves as it looks like we get a solid Duke team to open.
On paper our defense is much better than FSUs while we are pretty close on offense. Shaw might have edge on Cade and their WRs are better. We’re better at RB. I would give them a slight edge at OL due to their OL coach. He made sugar out of crap last year.
Message was edited by: raider12®
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Varsity [104]
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Re: TNET: Clemson ranked outside top-10 of Athlon 'way-too-early' Top 25
Jan 8, 2023, 4:24 PM
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Orange Blooded [2474]
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Re: Finally cycling out after all these years
Jan 8, 2023, 4:50 PM
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Never thought I’d see the day ☹️
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Rock Defender [63]
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Re: Finally cycling out after all these years
Jan 8, 2023, 8:06 PM
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Yep, & yes, it hurts. So sad that we couldn’t maintain elite status, but the ONLY 2 proven teams that have done it for decades are Alabama & Ohio State (barf!). 11-3 is a good, solid season. Elite……., no. Reality has returned Tiger Nation.
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Varsity [104]
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Yeah but the HC's getting paid elite money
Jan 8, 2023, 9:37 PM
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to deliver elite results. Better figure out how and quick.
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Orange Elite [5372]
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Just cut the coaching salaries back to good not elite
Jan 9, 2023, 1:44 AM
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compensation levels. Then we can all stop complaining about them being overpaid for just delivering above average performing teams.
One way or another, something has to give. Either consistently deliver elite teams to get elite pay or adjust the pay down.
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Letterman [290]
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Re: Yeah but the HC's getting paid elite money
Jan 9, 2023, 5:51 PM
[ in reply to Yeah but the HC's getting paid elite money ] |
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People need to stop crying about Dabo's money. Clemson is paying that. Not you. If Dabo leaves, you will all be real sorry... Watch.
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National Champion [7930]
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Seems reasonable- given our offensive challenges
Jan 8, 2023, 5:14 PM
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and an apparent lack of desire to make coaching changes
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Freshman [10]
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Re: TNET: Clemson ranked outside top-10 of Athlon 'way-too-early' Top 25
Jan 8, 2023, 8:34 PM
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This is the best thing that could happen to the guys going into next season. Back up the ROY bus
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Associate AD [831]
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Re: TNET: Clemson ranked outside top-10 of Athlon 'way-too-early' Top 25
Jan 8, 2023, 11:08 PM
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I don't understand why people get worked up about this stuff. Given how we ended the season, we will probably be ranked in the neighborhood of #13 in the final poll.
We're thrilled to have some key returning starters on defense, but we lost some big ones. If we're as good as this year's defense... it'll be a good defense that still isn't what it was in our championship years.
While I hope the offense is better with Cade under center, will the playcalling be better? (Hopefully, at worst, our offensive schemes lend themselves to Cade's skills.) The O-Line has been our Achilles Heel for two years. Do we have reason to believe it will be better next season.
Yeah, we beat FSU, but they ended the season playing way better than us. They also have key starters coming back. AND Mike Norvell shows a willingness to use the portal to improve his team. Why would we be surprised that they are projected ahead of us.
I wish I'd known that the only thing that kept us out of the playoffs the last two years was the lack of bulletin board material.
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Orange Elite [5372]
TigerPulse: 92%
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I prefer not being ranked too high to start the season…
Jan 9, 2023, 1:53 AM
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Just to keep the team focused on climbing the ladder. Now the pressure will really be on this year with ND and FSU getting better.
I am curious to see how the sunshine pumpers will explain away losing if we lose 4 games and the ACC title in 2023. I hope we don’t, but it is entirely possible if the offense doesn’t dramatically improve. We will need to score at least 35+ per game just to have a shot at the ACC title and the CFP.
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Recruit [76]
TigerPulse: 64%
8
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Preseason ACC darlings lol
Jan 9, 2023, 3:28 AM
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2021 UNCheat finished unranked
2022 NCSU will finish unranked
2023 FSU will they continue the trend?
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All-Conference [435]
TigerPulse: 88%
17
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Re: TNET: Clemson ranked outside top-10 of Athlon 'way-too-early' Top 25
Jan 9, 2023, 6:40 AM
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Clemson is ranked 7 spots behind FSU because FSU has been using the Transfer Portal to boost their roster, something Dabo refuses to use. I could not care any less where Clemson starts in the Way Way Way to early poll. It will all workout in the end, one way or the other. Go Tigers!
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Rock Defender [63]
TigerPulse: 58%
7
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Re: TNET: Clemson ranked outside top-10 of Athlon 'way-too-early' Top 25
Jan 10, 2023, 6:23 AM
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A Program in DECLINE. It was a fun ride though!!!!!
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Replies: 53
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