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Top TigerNet [30181]
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what a wild football season
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Nov 27, 2023, 10:37 AM
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First and foremost - we whoooooped dat sakerlinassss and couldn't even score a TD on offense lol. Love it. Beating them is the expectation and I loved it. Just a pure imposition of will on our opponent, with them knowing they couldn't move the ball on us no matter what they tried. It was a fantastic defensive performance.
Second, I need to eat some crow on a few topics:
1- Pork Chop. By the numbers, defense performed well above where I thought we would. Cherry on top was the beat down in the roach. hat's off.
2- We finished the season 2 W's ahead of where I thought we would following Miami. Credit to Dabo and staff for turning things around, I honestly didn't think they had it in em. hat's off.
Back to character, here, negative reflections:
I drunkenly said this to Jounge Snap and to my family gameday thread, and I stand by it (warning: bold statement): If we could take snaps, hand the ball off, catch passes, and make blocks...we're a one loss ball club. Easily.
I'm not saying we win anything in the post-season, just looking back at the games we played so far.
We gave so many opportunities away due to not doing the little things...I hope it drives our coaches as crazy as it drives me haha.
I don't know the answer to fix it, but I know whatever we've been doing for 3 years has got to change on the offensive side of the football. To say I'm disappointed coming off the Garrett Riley hype during the offseason is a massive understatement. It was more of the same, yet a regression (I'd argue) in fundamentals.
I'd like to see a shake up in the coaching staff in a few key areas, but would understand if he kept / am expecting Dabo to keep it the same.
I still don't expect him to use the portal, given our youth (to his credit, our young talent is absolutely bullish). And I don't think he'd really need it, outside of maybe backfilling guys who leave to the portal, if we can put together a fundamentals focused coaching staff. The odds of finding a game breaker WR are very low, even if Dabo goes after him. It is what it is.
Mike Reed should be in assistant coach of the year conversations, IMO. Dude's an animal and Dabo better back the truck up for em and give him whatever he wants. The string of NFL caliber CBs we've had is astounding. Nate Wiggins' journey from last year WF to this year...man...that's what it's all about right there. Fires me up.
Non CFP bowl games are so meh, I don't even care who we play1, where we play, what the score is, etc. Need to develop who's coming back and put good reps on tape going into the offseason.
1For selfish reasons, I hope we don't play Tennessee again lol.
We got the leg humpers week 1. Giddy up.
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Heisman Winner [81430]
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I didn't read all of that
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Nov 27, 2023, 10:42 AM
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but also have said "if this team didn't keep making the Big Mistake" they would be undefeated. Not a National Championship team, but undefeated. If we can keep them, the young foundation is good.
I still say Dabo MUST replace any transfers with other transfers rather than recruiting more freshmen to fill the gaps.
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TigerNet Eternal Icon [187981]
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I think we look for OL in portal
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Nov 27, 2023, 10:48 AM
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we got tons of WR coming back and 2 special guys coming in, he aint gonna get a top QB, but maybe another walk on type or 5th year guy who nobody wants. We are thin at LB, but have a couple of guys coming in and if we lose our starters, we need more depth so maybe portal for this?
I know you guys will think I am nuts, but I see us doing a meaningful portal guy this year, not a superstar but a guy who can play first string - OL and maybe LB.
Hell might just freeze over.
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Heisman Winner [80240]
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Our first OL target in the portal is from D2
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Nov 27, 2023, 10:50 AM
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SO, we aren't really using the portal then
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TigerNet Eternal Icon [187981]
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Well it depends
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Nov 27, 2023, 10:52 AM
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maybe he grew up after a year in college?
Dunno, but hey, it is a start.
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Heisman Winner [80240]
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Clemson Sports Icon [57801]
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I've said this many times, but not sure I've said it on here yet
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Nov 27, 2023, 10:45 AM
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The people that have poo-pooed the Reilly hire, there is NO FARKING WAY this is the offense he wants to run. We are still running the same stupid, boringass offense as we have the last few years, and TCU is chucking it all over the field still. I guess it has to be Dabo with his thumb on it, I can't think of any other explanation.
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Top TigerNet [30181]
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I think the reactions of career
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Nov 27, 2023, 10:47 AM
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suicide are a little over the top
but man, he went from sugar to #### in about, what, 2 quarters?
kind of kidding
but seriously
has to be one of his worst years by the numbers
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Clemson Sports Icon [57801]
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Without looking it up, would have to assume one of his worst years
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Nov 27, 2023, 10:49 AM
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by the numbers. I'm just saying I don't think it is on him. Maybe it is and our talent level truly is that bad on offense. But he did pretty well at TCU with lesser talent, sans quarterback IMO.
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Top TigerNet [30181]
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yeah yeah, same page
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Nov 27, 2023, 10:51 AM
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completely agree. I think a few of us have posited this as the why. I also think that has to be a discussion in the offseason with a mix-up in coaching hires. we need more experience coaches, and Riley needs the keys....or else we're wasting somewhere in the $2M/year
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TigerNet Elite [73592]
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Clemson Sports Icon [57801]
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Well then our offensive talent just flat out sucks then
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Nov 27, 2023, 10:54 AM
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which he did not recruit. From what I've seen and remember of the TCU passing offense, it is a lot of quick hits over the middle, whereas ours is a WR screen or pass out to the flat, rinse and repeat. Boring af, predictable, and oh, did I mention boring af?
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TigerNet Elite [73592]
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oh, i agree. Even when we were good, it was boring
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Nov 27, 2023, 10:58 AM
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Also, this is the 2nd 5 star qb we've turned into an avg at best qb.
Something aint right there. I though for sure Reilly would have turned Cade around but nope. He got worse as the year went on.
Cade has the throws but doesn't seem to know where to go with the ball.
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TigerNet Eternal Icon [187981]
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Not if you listen to Kyle Richardson
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Nov 27, 2023, 10:58 AM
[ in reply to I've said this many times ] |
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I heard him speak before the season and he did say we had some of that offense last year, as in a few plays, but not fully integrated and unless it is fully integrated, it will not be as successful.
Well, after the season, it looks to me like we still suck, but I know we had a lot of injuries and played some youngsters so I am anxious to see a second year of what it is supposed to do.
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Ring of Honor [22001]
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Richardson is another one that needs to see the door
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Nov 27, 2023, 10:59 AM
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Passing Game Coordinator....pffft. How's he doing? I'll tell you...not good.
Pays to be friends with Dabo.
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Clemson Sports Icon [52834]
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I don't even know what a Passing Game Coordinator does.
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Nov 27, 2023, 11:14 AM
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apparently not much.
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Ring of Honor [22001]
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Neither does he, evidently.
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Nov 27, 2023, 11:16 AM
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LOL
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Ultimate Tiger [34957]
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Let's also not forget we play a lot more...
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Nov 27, 2023, 11:28 AM
[ in reply to I've said this many times ] |
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teams with a quality defense than TCU does in a normal year. Big 12 defenses, as a general statement, suck.
Also, let's not discount how avg we are at WR and then how many have been out each game. It's not like we haven't been running any deep routes...they're just not open as much as we're accustomed to in years past when we had so many talented playmakers outside.
Take the game on Saturday...add up the dropped balls and at least 3 awesome back-shoulder throws that were misplayed by the WR. If all/most of those were completions, the game looks completely different offensively.
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Ultimate Tiger [35024]
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Randall just doesn't adjust to the ball in flight.***
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Nov 27, 2023, 1:23 PM
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Ultimate Clemson Legend [102418]
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ACC defenses are head and shoulders better than anything Riley faced...
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Nov 27, 2023, 12:45 PM
[ in reply to I've said this many times, but not sure I've said it on here yet ] |
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in the Big 12. We're running the right offense for our talent. Our main problems were fumbles and field goals. Either the boys had a change of heart, got a 4 game streak of luck or our coaches fixed the problem.
We've just been spoiled by DW and TL both who had the best receivers in college ball at the time.
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Oculus Spirit [42285]
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Clemson Sports Icon [57801]
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Re: Hey man. Cade chucks it all over, too.
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Nov 27, 2023, 1:05 PM
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Oculus Spirit [39590]
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Re: Hey man. Cade chucks it all over, too.
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Nov 27, 2023, 1:09 PM
[ in reply to Hey man. Cade chucks it all over, too. ] |
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On multiple occasions Saturday, the coots would rush 3 and rather than step up into a completely clean pocket, he runs straight backwards into the two colliding defensive ends. The kid has no pocket presence or awareness whatsoever. Any bit of passing accuracy he has is negated entirely by his inability to see the field and skittish pocket presences.
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Oculus Spirit [42285]
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Kid is jumpier than a mexican bean on meth.***
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Nov 27, 2023, 1:19 PM
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Ring of Honor [22175]
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Thats wishful thinking BS. Smart schooled Rileys TCU offense
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Nov 27, 2023, 2:28 PM
[ in reply to I've said this many times, but not sure I've said it on here yet ] |
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in last year’s Championship game. Throwing up stats against Big 12 defenses has NEVER been impressive as evidenced by the Big 12, performance in the last 25 years. Any decent defensive coordinator with respectable talent will shut down Riley’s offense.
It’s unlikely Dabo hired someone at $2.0 M a year and didn’t turn over the reins. I think Dabo thought he hired a Chad Morris clone. Maybe Riley will learn something but that’s a lot of money to pay someone to learn on the job.
I am sure Kirby will be shaking in his boots this summer thinking about facing Garrett next fall.
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Clemson Sports Icon [57801]
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Pfft, of course Smart schooled Rileys offense
Nov 27, 2023, 4:25 PM
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TCU was way overmatched talent wise, and Smart is one of the best defensive minds in the game.
My post had nothing to do with that. Just saying the scheme we are running now is the same as we have been running for several years, which is a very different scheme than Reilly ran at TCU. Will Reilly's scheme work at Clemson/ACC if he ever gets to run it? I have no idea, but it is obvious to me that we are running "the Clemson offense" and not the scheme Reilly ran last year.
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TigerNet Champion [117557]
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I'm very much in agreement with what you say here
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Nov 27, 2023, 10:47 AM
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but think the portal HAS to be used for OL and WR help. There simply isn't enough reliable OL and WR play to sustain a great season. We had 3-4 drops against SC that killed drives. Our OL was getting overpowered by a DL that was not great. I think we might be able to get a WR, but the OL help is another story. That superstar WR out of Texas who SHOULD sign for us is undersized, we cannot depend on him to be the next gamebreaker right now.
Disaster against Duke was completely avoidable.
FSU fiasco was just us giving away the game.
Miami was a complete and total bullllshit breakdown once they got a tiny bit of momentum.
NC State was whatever it was, I don't think I watched a minute of that game. IIRC, we had a good shot in that one as well.
We would get smoked in the playoffs, but we should be in the ACC Championship game.
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Heisman Winner [82071]
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we need to get players
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Nov 27, 2023, 12:52 PM
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that hold onto the ball
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Orange Phenom [14329]
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Re: what a wild football season
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Nov 27, 2023, 10:48 AM
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I still say need new OL coach and WR coach
Love we beat Scar, but their ability to get pressure on our QB so quickly with 3 rushing, not good, and has been bad against any defense with a pulse all year.
Don't know if technique or what, but inability to get separation, coupled with just bad drops...
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Top TigerNet [30181]
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completely agree
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Nov 27, 2023, 11:07 AM
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need more experience and better recruiters.
Grisham being WR coach and recruiting coordinator is just a recipe for meh. TA can't recruit big time lineman b/c he doesn't have the resume of dudes in the league.
Richardson and Spiller are on short leashes too.
Spiller needs one job this off season: Ball Security.
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Clemson Sports Icon [52834]
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don't remember where I read this, but I like the theory and hope its correct.
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Nov 27, 2023, 12:02 PM
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that Dabo told Riley he didn't want to throw his guys under the bus this year, so Riley can evaluate and do whatever he wants w/ his assistants after this yr. Which puts Riley's name on the firings and Dabo can still show the love to his questionable hires.
Grisham and Austin at a minimum got to go.
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Ultimate Tiger [35024]
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That makes so much sense, as it is a classic corporate move.***
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Nov 27, 2023, 1:19 PM
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TigerNet Elite [73592]
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This is the best D since the Wilkins teams. If we had even a serviceable
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Nov 27, 2023, 10:52 AM
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offense, we would've gone undefeated.
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Heisman Winner [86941]
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We'll have to dip into the portal for QB at least
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Nov 27, 2023, 10:52 AM
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Tyson used up his eligibility didn't he? And what about Helms? I think he's done as well right? We don't have a 2024 QB since we wiffed at every.single.fucking.one.of.them.
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Heisman Winner [80240]
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I think we offered four or five
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Nov 27, 2023, 10:55 AM
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but that pales comparison of Thomas Austin's 1 for 16 so far this year
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Orange Phenom [14329]
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Re: I think we offered four or five
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Nov 27, 2023, 11:04 AM
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1 for 16? really? that even sucks in baseball
solidifies my opinion on off season U-Haul changes (or Tiger Moving)
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Heisman Winner [80240]
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We have one OL commit, and I undersold it
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Nov 27, 2023, 11:13 AM
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here's the offer list
https://clemson.rivals.com/offers/football/2024
we are 1-18 on OL offers this year and now falling back to make offers to kids who have offers from USF, UTEP, etc.
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Top TigerNet [30181]
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message board over reaction time
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Nov 27, 2023, 11:16 AM
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that's enough to send TA packing right there
haha....wow that's bad.
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Orange Phenom [14329]
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Clemson Sports Icon [52834]
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18 is a lot of offers.
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Nov 27, 2023, 11:51 AM
[ in reply to We have one OL commit, and I undersold it ] |
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I mean, 1 of 18 is bad. But 18 offers means we were getting turned down early and often. Austin has to go. His resume is a GA, then 2 yrs at Ga St, then back here.
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TigerNet Eternal Icon [187981]
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Heisman Winner [86941]
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Yeah but you do what all teams have done and get a 3* or something
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Nov 27, 2023, 11:32 AM
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You have to have more than 2 scholarship QBs. And I think that's a load of BS anyways. Georgia seems to be OK with piling up QBs. We were for a while too until TL.
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TigerNet Eternal Icon [187981]
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That was pre NIL also
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Nov 27, 2023, 12:53 PM
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and yeah, we should have a guy from Mauldin or somewhere like that to come in.
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Clemson Sports Icon [52597]
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We are where we are suppose to be. Our QB play is mediocre.
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Nov 27, 2023, 10:54 AM
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Our running backs are mediocre.
Our O-line is rough.
So mediocre is where we are suppose to be.
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Clemson Icon [25991]
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Re: We are where we are suppose to be. Our QB play is mediocre.
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Nov 27, 2023, 11:11 AM
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Does seem to be the case. I would put RB above mediocre, but no ETNs for sure. We keep hearing promises about the WRs, but they dont seem to get open, they dont contest longer throws (the endzone interception was a good throw, imo), and blocking seems weak. QB is fine, imo, if we were not weak elsewhere. So, yeah, we just dont have the skill players. How else does a team not score against ucs?
With orange glasses on, its the kind of thing that can turn around. T Brown will be a soph. Noble could be the real deal. Williams and Randall could be what they are supposed to be. A lot of its, but that does happen. If so, could solve a lot of problems.
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Ultimate Clemson Legend [108402]
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I think we run a very QB dependent offense. Moreso than many
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Nov 27, 2023, 11:12 AM
[ in reply to We are where we are suppose to be. Our QB play is mediocre. ] |
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others. But one thing that has concerned me about our offense is our new OC. WHERE IS HE? Where is he talking to the media? Where is he during timeouts on the sidelines? We call a TO and I see the offense go over and I see Dabo yelling and screaming and Riley just sitting there. Dabo should be over by the defense cussing refs during timeouts and the OC needs to run that huddle. I don't see that. I don't see initiative on his part. In fairness, he may have a system that requires what we don't have, maybe we're a bad fit, and maybe we will recruit to his offense. But I don't see him taking charge enough to do that.
Just my $0.02 worth.
Pork Chop is going to be alright. He grew up A LOT this season. I didn't see that from Riley though. I see our defense as following in the heels of Venables. Looks much the same, and over time they have stepped up to be almost as good as his defenses. That's what you want to see. But on offense, I see QB issues with DJ and now Cade. WR talent is gone (mostly hurt I think), but that's no excuse. We're not running the same routes. We have no open receivers, no separation. When was the last time you saw a Clemson WR run a good hitch route, turn back to have a ball meet him right in the numbers, then curl back running while a defender falls on his ###? You saw that 20 times a game from Hunter Renfrow. And others. I never see that anymore.
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Orange Phenom [14329]
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Re: I think we run a very QB dependent offense. Moreso than many
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Nov 27, 2023, 11:30 AM
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or any success with 50/50 balls
I know we don't have a Mike Williamsesque WR, but was hoping Randal would be that guy that would go high point a ball over shorter DBs etc
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Clemson Sports Icon [52597]
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And add on top of that our perimeter blocking is dog ####
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Nov 27, 2023, 12:13 PM
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how many screens did we throw where the WR completely whiffed on the block for a TFL?
I counted at least 2.
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Oculus Spirit [39590]
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Re: And add on top of that our perimeter blocking is dog ####
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Nov 27, 2023, 12:14 PM
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Stellato misses every single block attempt
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Oculus Spirit [39590]
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Re: what a wild football season
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Nov 27, 2023, 11:10 AM
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Bold off-season prediction:
We recruit Brock Vandagriff from UGA out of the portal, and Cade Klubnik transfers out to a G5 school in Texas.
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Orange Immortal [64746]
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Do I really have to say this again? We have ONE MAN to thank for the ND,
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Nov 27, 2023, 11:42 AM
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GT, hole, and coot wins:
Tyler.
From Spartanburg.
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Top TigerNet [30181]
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lol - I was tempted to put that in there
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Nov 27, 2023, 11:44 AM
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opted against. correlation ain't causation, yeah, ok....but. if we circled a day that our team played with a little bit of fire and pulled their heads outta deyass, I'd pick Tuesday after Tyler.
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Orange Phenom [14329]
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2 different dating periods of season, BT and AT
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Nov 27, 2023, 12:01 PM
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before Tyler, after tyler
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Clemson Sports Icon [52597]
TigerPulse: 100%
59
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Joined: 2015
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TigerNet Elite [70906]
TigerPulse: 100%
61
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Joined: 2017
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Cade is terrible.
Nov 27, 2023, 12:08 PM
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That is the answer to everything you said.
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Paw Warrior [4836]
TigerPulse: 100%
37
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Re: what a wild football season
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Nov 27, 2023, 1:13 PM
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We massively reduced the RPO in the second half of the season.
CK even went under center a couple of times.
That by itself probably reduced the number of turnovers.
We did work RPO back into the offense and they used it a few times at USC.
I think our offense has a hard limit on its upside until we show we can hit some throws downfield to open up running lanes and the crossing.
Rattler's big gains were when they were tryng for a downfield shot and it wasn't there so he took off and there was one guy to beat. Same with Maye. Every time CK took off there were lots of defenders within 10 yards of the LOS and it limited his success.
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