GIVE AN AWARD
Use your CatCoins™ to grant this post a special award and grant the author bonus CatCoins™!


YOUR BALANCE
monetization_on
Offensive inconsistency note
Tiger Boards - Clemson Football
add New Topic
Replies: 76  

Offensive inconsistency note

emoji_events [41]
Dec 8, 2021, 10:10 AM
Reply

Everybody has their opinion on why the offense struggled this season. Playcalling. Injuries. Bad QB play. Youth. Bad OL play. Pick one. Pick two. Pick em all. So I was happy last week when I was able to sit down with a former player - of the Dabo Swinney era who played on offense under Elliott and Scott and then Elliott - who sees the game not only as a player but as a coach. Talented dude. Really knows the game and more important, knows this offense.

Here is what we discussed in abbreviated form:

He said in baseball, success starts up the middle - catcher, pitcher, short, CF. And football is the same way, that you need a good C and QB play. Clemson had neither for much of the year. He said that this year it's been the lack of consistent center play and lack of consistency up front overall. The staff puts ALOT of responsibility on the center. If he isn't 10000% in tune with what's going on, they will struggle. Especially in pass protection. Also, it's extremely difficult to just exchange guys in and out of positions. They aren't guys who are just going to mash people upfront. Including the lack of players on the outside, people know they can cover Clemson this year. In turn, they're going to send pressure and not give them the run and make them throw the football, knowing they're struggling outside. They can cover their WRs, they can stop the run because they're going to add guys into the box and it's a huge snowball effect that makes the Clemson offense look bad. Obviously, it's the coach's job to press the guys to produce but it also doesn't help that they just simply don't have the dudes they've had in the past.


He said this about 2016 and DW4: Did we have an elite OL in 2016? No. But Deshaun could make us right by getting away from pressure and could keep his eyes downfield and get it to the real athletes we had on the outside. Same with Trevor. DJ is not that guy. He is young AND he isn't a scrambling kind of guy. You pressure him enough, he is going to fold. If they can pick it up, upfront, he struggles making quick decisions.

I asked about the play calling, and he laughed. Said it's hard to make calls when you know certain parts of the playbook just won't work...you don't want to get behind the chains so you play it safe. You know you can't call the deep shots because there aren't playmakers and you're not sure the QB will have enough time. So it's safe and predictable and you have to hope someone can make a play.

I also asked if he had seen any film on Klubnik and he said yes. Said if Klubnik is as good as advertised and brings that running ability back to the offense, things should look more normal.

So, there ya go. Just some thoughts from someone who has been on the inside.

badge-seniorwriter.jpg flag link


Re: Offensive inconsistency note

[1]
Dec 8, 2021, 10:18 AM
Reply

We don’t have the dudes or are they just injured?

I believe the talent is on this team, just dinged up.

flag link

Re: Offensive inconsistency note

[2]
Dec 8, 2021, 10:32 AM
Reply

Our guys on the outside were "fine", but they certainly weren't the "dudes" they are being compared to from previous seasons.

If you make a player for player comparison of who we have and who we wanted them to play like, there isn't a single guy who reached the level wished upon them all the way down to Justyn Ross '21 not reaching the heights of Justyn Ross '18.

flag link

Re: Offensive inconsistency note


Dec 8, 2021, 11:06 AM
Reply

TigerNation88, you missed the meaning of D.Hood's reference to "dude" in your post.

D.Hood wasn't referencing any Clemson players when he made the "dude" comment.

Rather, he was referring to the former Clemson player who provided the insights about the offenses struggles this past season.

flag link

Re: Offensive inconsistency note


Dec 8, 2021, 11:54 AM
Reply

You are correct! My error, reading comprehension is still a goal of mine!

flag link

Re: Offensive inconsistency note


Dec 8, 2021, 11:54 AM
Reply

You are correct! My error, reading comprehension is still a goal of mine!

flag link

Thats one thing I don't understand about the recruitment of DJ

emoji_events [6]
Dec 8, 2021, 10:18 AM
Reply

Our offense needs a QB that can scramble to be successful(Boyd, DW4, KB2, TL16). We are handcuffing the offense with a solely pocket passed at QB(Stoudt, DJ). That's not a knock on DJ at all, I just don't get why we tried to plug in a QB that doesn't fit the system. Thank God for Klubnik!

flag link

Re: Thats one thing I don't understand about the recruitment of DJ

emoji_events [5]
Dec 8, 2021, 11:01 AM
Reply

81Tigers- I am with you brother. I cannot for the life of me understand what the thought process was with his recruiting. Did Dabo and the coaching staff just assume they could teach him to be that different from what he was? I watched a few of DJ’s Bosco games and I wouldn’t have put mobility or decision making in my top 5 attributes I saw in him. He was physically dominant so when he did run it, he looked the part. But personally, I just trusted him being a 5* with a strong arm that our coaches recruited and figured he’d succeed. In retrospect, I think our offense was not well suited for DJ’s skill set. I’d pay a lot to hear what our coaches saw that made them think it would work.

Really appreciate David’s work here and the former player’s comments. Very insightful. Go Tigers!

flag link

Re: Thats one thing I don't understand about the recruitment of DJ

[1]
Dec 8, 2021, 11:14 AM
Reply

Look, we had the scrambling guy T.Phommachan ... but he couldn't pass the ball accurately.

Then, we had DJ, who if he had come in from HS with the pocket presence and subtlety skills (i.e., not staring down his primary receiver all the time), might have worked OK at the start of the season. He did better late in the season (due to good coaching), but not yet a finished QB.

You could argue that these were recruiting misses, but for most college coaches there are 'translation' challenges in projecting HS talent into college talent.

Look at how many teams recruit super duper talented HS QBs ... who then end up sitting on the bench vs. a lesser-heralded backup QB. You can go all the way back to Doug Flutie (back up QB at BC until the starter got injured or Tom Brady at MI (who was an end-of-the-bencher in college ... backing up Brian Griese).

Unfortunately in Clemson's case, TP couldn't pass worth a lick, and we to go with DJ and live through his learning process.

If DJ had all of the other intangibles (i.e., he's never going to as slippery as D.Watson or as fast as T.Lawrence), then we would have won both at Pitt and NC State, and beat the dickens out of BC, GA Tech. Top bowl destination instead of Cheez-It bowl. Oh well, it is what it was.

flag link

Re: Thats one thing I don't understand about the recruitment of DJ

[4]
Dec 8, 2021, 12:02 PM
Reply

I think sometimes cfb coaches get caught up in recruiting services STARS instead of what fits their team...DJ was highly regarded and looked awesome as A get for recruiters but he doesn't really fit what we do.
Klubinik fits a lot better, however, I think with better oline play DJ could still be very successful at Clemson

flag link

Re: Thats one thing I don't understand about the recruitment of DJ


Dec 10, 2021, 12:18 AM
Reply

Your right about our system and The qb talents. The question is will the coaching staff use Kublic and bench DJ. something has to be done because the defense will have a hard time carrying the team next year are we losing offensive recruits because they don't trust DJ to get them the ball?

flag link

Re: Thats one thing I don't understand about the recruitment of DJ


Dec 10, 2021, 12:22 AM
Reply

Your right about our system and The qb talents. The question is will the coaching staff use Kublic and bench DJ. something has to be done because the defense will have a hard time carrying the team next year are we losing offensive recruits because they don't trust DJ to get them the ball?

flag link

Re: Offensive inconsistency note

[3]
Dec 8, 2021, 10:20 AM
Reply

Thanks David - nice technical description of our woes without using accusatory language. Hopefully, the success of the team in the second half of the season carries over to the bowl game and next season.

Season's greeting to the Tigernet community!

flag link

BINGO! I've wondered, even before the season

[1]
Dec 8, 2021, 10:23 AM
Reply

started that the OL might be an issue. Only because we never knew what player was going to play what position. This "cross training": Was it because we wanted everyone to be in tune, or was it out of necessity because we didn't had the dudes and didn't know where they best fit.

As for the play calling this person is exactly correct. It's not like TE forgot how to adjust. It's because the book is limited when QB can't scramble or make more than one read. And the OL isn't cohesive.

All will be well. We are setting up for another run. Everyone chill.

badge-donor-05yr.jpg flag link

Re: BINGO! I've wondered, even before the season

[2]
Dec 8, 2021, 10:46 AM
Reply

Lettuce hope.

2022 orange level membermilitary_donation.jpg flag link

Re: BINGO! I've wondered, even before the season


Dec 8, 2021, 12:28 PM
Reply

I hope you're ripe.

2022 white level memberbadge-donor-05yr.jpg flag link

Good analysis

emoji_events [6]
Dec 8, 2021, 10:24 AM
Reply

I would also say, "Elementary, my dear Watson." Anyone knowledgeable on the game of football could see (at least on the surface) what was going on. My question, at least for the first 9-10 games of the season was, given that our offensive staff is presumably composed of smart people, "why was nothing being done to address the situation?" No new plays were added and the same plays were being called. Tony even said, "DJ is not the same QB as DW and TL... he can't run those plays." Again, if that was the case (and it obviously was), why did he continue to send in "those plays."

In the last two games (Wake and Scar), some re-designed schemes and new plays were employed... and they worked. So, to sum it up, "Duh!"

2022 orange level memberbadge-donor-05yr.jpg flag link

Why did we continue to rely on DJ to make decisions and

[2]
Dec 8, 2021, 10:28 AM
Reply

throw the ball too often. Even against SC, we came out throwing. We eventually settled into running the football that game, but only after DJ threw a pick.

We were a little late to the party in realizing what we could and could not do offensively.

badge-donor-05yr.jpg flag link

Re: Why did we continue to rely on DJ to make decisions and

[1]
Dec 8, 2021, 10:32 AM
Reply

Based on Tony's quote in my post above, he had at least figured out "what we couldn't do." The problem was that he seemed to be unable to figure out "what we could do."

2022 orange level memberbadge-donor-05yr.jpg flag link

Re: Why did we continue to rely on DJ to make decisions and


Dec 8, 2021, 10:51 AM
Reply

He figured out that there wasn't anything we could be counted on to do until the OL became able to run block.

2022 orange level membermilitary_donation.jpg flag link

Re: Why did we continue to rely on DJ to make decisions and

[4]
Dec 8, 2021, 10:33 AM
Reply

Came out throwing against scar?

Didn't Shipley have 4 or 5 carries that covered most of the yards on the initial TD drive?

flag link

1st play was a badly thrown screen pass. 2nd was a Shipley


Dec 8, 2021, 10:45 AM
Reply

run for 13 yards. Third was a pass for 10 and a first down. Fourth was a run for no gain. Fifth was a pass for one yard. Then two runs for a TD. Shipley with 3 of the 4 runs.

Second possession: 1st play, Shipley run for 13 yards. 2nd play, DJ throws a terribly inaccurate pass to the defender for a pick.

First 2 possessions - 9 plays - 4 passes including 2 of first 3 plays. 5 runs and one interception.

badge-donor-05yr.jpg flag link

Re: 1st play was a badly thrown screen pass. 2nd was a Shipley

[1]
Dec 8, 2021, 11:01 AM
Reply

Seems like a reasonable gameplan.

The INT was a shot taken because of field position and expecting the safety to start cheating to protect missed run fits by the LBs.

In hindsight it was done a little too early to be successful.

flag link

Re: Why did we continue to rely on DJ to make decisions and

[3]
Dec 8, 2021, 11:02 AM
Reply

We did. We knew after the first 2 drives and their first few drives we had the game well in control. TE, CBV, and Dabo all knew after those initial series, we had the game won. As did they know we could always revert back to it.

So, the coaches let the kids have some fun. A la 4th and 1 call. And then TE called some stuff for DJ to throw. Kinda the mentally of let's see what we can do... Actually, very brilliantly schemed.

He did the same with WAKE but had to be a little more careful because wake could score fast. Scar couldn't.

As for David's article. Excellent. It could have easily been the same thread we had over a month ago with DrOrange..2017. Can't remember but I think you were part of that thread too. I know it was roughly 4 or 5 posters that I glean a lot of info from. Good stuff.

The coaches knew it but once the season started and a couple key injuries in camp b4 season, just too late. A coaching blunder and a ltlke bad luck. It happens. They're not perfect... But we good. Hope TE stays.

2022 orange level member flag link

that is Coaching


Dec 8, 2021, 10:34 AM
Reply

i'm just a nobody dixie youth baseball coach.

1 day i let a kid pitch 3 innings to get him into a groove.. he was struggling but he had the best arm on the team and i didn't want to pull him and blow his confidence.

I looked at the book later and he walked 21 kids in those 3 innings.

he walked a lot of kids but our infield made error after error after error. Could have easily gotten out of those innings

2022 white level member flag link

Geville Tiger on 2021 football season, "Dabo's only problem is he has to deal with turd fans questioning every move he makes.”


Re: that is Coaching


Dec 8, 2021, 11:26 AM
Reply

21 walks AND error after error? I feel sorry for the ump and the spectators. Sometimes the mound is just too far away for the age group.

flag link

he was 15 so he was right at the correct age for 60ft


Dec 8, 2021, 12:08 PM
Reply

blamed the defense , not the pitcher which probably hurt his confidence even more than if i pulled him.. I dunno.. that is coaching.. you second guess yourself waaaaaaay more than the fans.



but yeah.. that made for long innings.. only got to the top of the 3d before they called the game.

2022 white level member flag link

Geville Tiger on 2021 football season, "Dabo's only problem is he has to deal with turd fans questioning every move he makes.”


Made me think of this


Dec 8, 2021, 12:46 PM
Reply

https://www.facebook.com/tournamentguy/videos/funniest-mound-visits-by-a-youth-baseball-coach/2748396011853926/


2022 purple level memberbadge-donor-15yr.jpg flag link

“It takes a big man to cry, but it takes a bigger man to laugh at that man.”


We scored on the opening drive so hard to complain......


Dec 8, 2021, 11:12 AM
Reply

:)

2022 white level member flag link

Re: Good analysis


Dec 8, 2021, 10:49 AM
Reply

Probably because that's the plays they were running in practice hoping DJ could adapt to and the rest of the team was familiar with. I said after game 4, just run the ball but the OL wasn't ready for that yet. This was on the entire Offense with the exception of the RB's.

2022 orange level membermilitary_donation.jpg flag link

Re: Offensive inconsistency note

[3]
Dec 8, 2021, 10:25 AM
Reply

I guess my biggest question is why do we never have the ‘dudes’ on the OL? Why can’t we recruit them? It’s been a known fact for years and we can’t seem to address it.

flag link

Re: Offensive inconsistency note

[2]
Dec 8, 2021, 10:30 AM
Reply

I would guess our NFL draft record on the OL is really hurting us on the recruiting trail.

flag link

It's one of two things:........


Dec 8, 2021, 10:31 AM
Reply

1. We're missing in evaluation, b/c on paper our last 3 OL recruiting classes have been really good

OR (my assumption)

2. We can't develop

flag link

Re: It's one of two things:........


Dec 8, 2021, 10:59 AM
Reply

I think OL recruiting has improved since '19 but that's still too recent to have much effect. I'd really like to see Greene out of Bosco in Cali (DJ's former HS) and one other 4 * added to the '22 class. If that happens we're well on our way. If that doesn't happen then we have to clean up with 5 or so really good ones in the '23 class.

2022 orange level membermilitary_donation.jpg flag link

eh? sort of agree...........


Dec 8, 2021, 11:06 AM
Reply

I believe if they're "good" then you start seeing results in year 2 so we've had 2 solid OLine classes at least in year 2 and nothing much to show for.

to add to that........even in our 2016 & 2018 National title years our Oline wasn't that great....We've ALWAYS had issues on the oline (except the Ford Days when Oline was different), but it's never been a "strength", that's why I have my reservations of whether it really can be "fixed" at Clemson. Somebody had mentioned our lack of NFL talent on Oline could be reason we don't "attract" elite Olinemen. I think it's a combo of that and lack of development by the coaches.

flag link

We had a lot of injuries on the Oline in camp and during the

[1]
Dec 8, 2021, 10:33 AM
Reply

season. We should be strong on the oline next year.

If you watched the Bama UGA game, you saw that even Bama had multiple breakdowns along the offensive line during the game. The difference was their QB could move his feet to escape pressure, keep his eyes downfield and either find an open man or gain positive yards running. An accurate QB who has some mobility gains confidence from that. One who does not can panic under the least bit of pressure.

It's going to be an interesting Spring.

badge-donor-05yr.jpg flag link

Re: Offensive inconsistency note


Dec 10, 2021, 12:00 AM
Reply

You are so right. Ga and Ala. get 330 lb guys we get 270 to 290 lb guys. bigger guys that do come are normally 3 or low 4 stars

flag link

Re: Offensive inconsistency note

[2]
Dec 8, 2021, 10:27 AM
Reply

Thanks for the insights David. They make sense and is what many of us thought, but good to hear it from a former player.

flag link

Re: Offensive inconsistency note

[3]
Dec 8, 2021, 10:29 AM
Reply

I take two exceptions with what he said.

1. "they can stop the run because they're going to add guys into the box"

Teams were rushing 3 and dropping 8 and Tony still refused to run the ball. Of our 3 losses we had less than 40 carries by running backs COMBINED.

2. You know you can't call the deep shots because there aren't playmakers

Justyn Ross is most certainly a deep threat play maker. Ngata was as well.

2022 purple level memberbadge-donor-10yr.jpg flag link


Re: Offensive inconsistency note


Dec 8, 2021, 10:36 AM
Reply

JR8 was playing the wrong position until his last couple of games. His first two (All American) years were built on playing the boundary. With all his talent, he was never a "slot receiver." I don't know why the offensive staff couldn't accept this. Unfortunately, it took him going to Tony and saying, "Coach, put me back on the boundary."

2022 orange level memberbadge-donor-05yr.jpg flag link

Re: Offensive inconsistency note

[2]
Dec 8, 2021, 10:38 AM
Reply

1. For the first 5-6 games of the season our OL couldn't block a 3 or 4 man front so we had to try to throw the ball against a drop 8. It didn't work because we were lacking "dudes" on the outside and a QB that could thread the needle.

2. Somebody should have told Ross that he was that guy because he spent most of the season begging for flags instead of trying to go get those passes. Ngata hardly played any games.

flag link

Re: Offensive inconsistency note

[1]
Dec 8, 2021, 10:51 AM
Reply

Our OL held their own in run blocking all year. RB was our strong point the entire season. Outside of the UGA game (which was a very small sample size because we just flat out made a pathetic attempt at running the ball) we ran the ball well even in our losses. Against NC State Shipley had over 3 ypc but was only given the ball 11 times. Against Pitt he had 5.2 ypc and given the ball a whopping 10 times. Pace had 4.7 ypc. Ran it 7 times.

2022 purple level memberbadge-donor-10yr.jpg flag link


Re: Offensive inconsistency note

[3]
Dec 8, 2021, 11:05 AM
Reply

I don't feel that "over 3 ypc" is something to tout.

Our running game was still a complete unknown against NC State. Our entire offense stunk for that game.

We abandoned the run game vs Pitt because we were behind for the entire 2nd half.

flag link

Re: Offensive inconsistency note

[3]
Dec 8, 2021, 11:26 AM
Reply

I do not agree at all. 3+ypc in a tight game in OT without a running clock can be extremely useful. Especially in the final OT drive.

1st and 10 incomplete pass
2nd and 10 5 yard run by Pace
3rd and 5 incomplete pass
4th and 5 incomplete pass

Game over.


That was horrid play calling to end that game.

2022 purple level memberbadge-donor-10yr.jpg flag link


Re: Offensive inconsistency note


Dec 8, 2021, 11:30 AM
Reply

Shipley was injured and did not finish that game.

Also to alter your historical reference.

1st and 10 - dropped pass
2nd and 10 - 5 yard run by Pace
3rd and 10 - incomplete pass
4th and 10 - same WR who dropped 1st down decides not to try to catch the ball

I don't have a detailed memory of the 3rd down incomplete pass, but it seems like the play calls on 1st, 2nd and 4th downs put the players in a position to make a play and have success.

flag link

Re: Offensive inconsistency note


Dec 8, 2021, 11:35 AM
Reply

I'm not singling out Shipley. We didn't give it to Pace like we should have either.

2022 purple level memberbadge-donor-10yr.jpg flag link


Re: Offensive inconsistency note


Dec 8, 2021, 11:27 AM
Reply

I also don't agree that our running game was unknown. Our running game broke out against SC State and GT.

2022 purple level memberbadge-donor-10yr.jpg flag link


Re: Offensive inconsistency note


Dec 8, 2021, 11:32 AM
Reply

SC State? Really?

Also we rushed for less than 150 yards and less than 4 ypc against GA Tech.

There isn't a world where I would call that "breaking out".

What Clemson did against Wake Forest and scar on the ground is what I would call the run game breaking out.

flag link

Re: Offensive inconsistency note


Dec 8, 2021, 11:33 AM
Reply

Will Shipley is the sole reason we even beat GT.

2022 purple level memberbadge-donor-10yr.jpg flag link


Re: Offensive inconsistency note


Dec 8, 2021, 11:06 AM
Reply

Serious question: How can an offensive line be good at pass protection and not good at run-blocking? Is there such a huge difference in scheming, technique, or assignments? Who is too blame for being good at one, and so bad at the other?

flag link

Re: Offensive inconsistency note

[1]
Dec 8, 2021, 11:32 AM
Reply

I'm certainly not a coach nor an offensive lineman and don't know all the terminology and lingo so this is just based solely on opinion and studying the game.

We were good at run blocking and not pass protection. You've got that backwards.

Run blocking and pass protecting are actually 2 opposite philosophies. One is proactive based on moving the opposing a player forward or to the side or anywhere outside of designed run lanes. The other is reactive in that the lineman contains a rushing dlineman.

Olineman might be good at getting push off the ball and bad at being able to contain reactively to stunts and other technique used to get by him.

2022 purple level memberbadge-donor-10yr.jpg flag link


Meant to say bad at pass protection. Thanks for responding***


Dec 8, 2021, 11:42 AM
Reply



flag link

Re: Offensive inconsistency note

[1]
Dec 8, 2021, 11:35 AM
Reply

To make it really simplistic:

In the run game the OL actually has to make a space for the ball carrier to run through to have success.

This involves making the defensive players move where they don't want to move so you can run where you want to run.

In the passing game the OL just has to keep the defensive players from getting to the QB. You simply have to stop them instead of move them.

With our RPO style blocking that keeps the OL from attacking and driving down the field, it is much easier to hold guys up from a pass rush then to get them out of our way to run the ball.

We made some shifts in run blocking concepts late in the year when we did less RPO and it allowed us to have more success in the run game.

flag link

Sounds like you just named off the TOP focus for the


Dec 8, 2021, 10:39 AM
Reply

transfer portal.....o-line! Specifically, center!

2022 white level member flag link

Re: Sounds like you just named off the TOP focus for the

[2]
Dec 8, 2021, 10:43 AM
Reply

Linthicum was the number one center in his class, hopefully he’s ready this year as a sophomore/Rs freshman.

flag link

Part of that makes no sense

[1]
Dec 8, 2021, 10:42 AM
Reply

“We don’t have the dudes” that we used to? On paper we have our recruited those “dudes” tenfold, it’s not even close. Is this a recruiting issue, evaluation, development? Not having the “dudes” we’ve had in the past just isn’t true and there is way more to this than that, why don’t we when the players are better than in the past? What missed? Where is the disconnect?

Just a lot of questions, thanks for the post though, enjoyed reading it.

flag link

Re: Offensive inconsistency note

[1]
Dec 8, 2021, 10:42 AM
Reply

That's spot on. A lot of what knowledgeable football folks have realized all year. I kept saying in mid season, get Shipley or Pace in space. Run a quick pitch or screen and get Ship or Pace on the edge. Make a defender miss. When we finally did that with some success, it opened up the middle. Thanks again David.

flag link

Re: Offensive inconsistency note


Dec 8, 2021, 10:44 AM
Reply

I appreciate you relaying this person's analysis. The observations made have been stated by others on TNet but when random posters offer criticism whether constructive or not they usually get criticized by a mob of "true" Clemson fans. Maybe this post will find more acceptance considering the source. It's been a painful year for most of us.
It was all of the above but I'm less inclined to blame TE as much now. My brother and I came too that conclusion after an in depth conversation recently. Hopefully the players will have improved by next season.

2022 orange level membermilitary_donation.jpg flag link

Re: Offensive inconsistency note

[1]
Dec 8, 2021, 10:54 AM
Reply

We have the talent for throwing the ball downfield. Unfortunately the best and most experienced were injured most of the season. Secondly, Ross played a fair number of games. Why wasn’t he used more downfield? We lined him up in the slot and rarely got the ball to him when running those routes. DJ’s performance was the bigger problem. If WR’s weren’t getting the job done, I’d point to playing them out of their natural position, and only having the least experienced and/or least talented available on Saturdays. Swinney, Brown, and Ajou were not going to be the playmakers we needed when DJ wasn’t throwing the receivers open.

flag link

Re: Offensive inconsistency note


Dec 8, 2021, 11:06 AM
Reply

Agree but most of the talent was injured for most of the season. Ngata, Ladson, Ajou, EJ.

2022 orange level membermilitary_donation.jpg flag link

Re: Offensive inconsistency note


Dec 8, 2021, 11:08 AM
Reply

Sorry,vI missed your second sentence. Lol.

2022 orange level membermilitary_donation.jpg flag link

Re: Offensive inconsistency note


Dec 8, 2021, 10:50 AM
Reply

For all the folks pushing for Tony Elliott to go elsewhere, consider this:

DJ never looked comfortable, the OL wasn't great, and we had injuries like we haven't seen in years. Despite all this, we started a true freshman at RB, lost our top 4 WR, DJ was hobbling on an injured knee, and we produced our best games offensively the last 3 weeks.

UConn and WF both were bad defensively. But UofSC was respectable on defense most of the year. Each of these teams knew we essentially didn't have a pass game and loaded up for the run, and we still averaged 240 RYPG and over 5 YPC.

And this was with a total of 2 juniors and 2 seniors on the 2 deep. We'll be fine offensively.

Defensively? I'm scared to see how much losing 5+ who have started will effect us, especially Skalski and Turner. We have dudes, and we should be good talent wise, but none of that will matter without the right guy at LB leading the troops. We've been spoiled between Skalski, Boulware, Tre Lamar, Kendall Joseph, Stephone Anthony, among other stars over the last decade. Good news is we have a great DL and should have a capable backfield again.

2022 white level memberbadge-donor-05yr.jpg flag link

Is this the former player you talked with?

[3]
Dec 8, 2021, 10:56 AM
Reply



flag link


Re: Offensive inconsistency note


Dec 8, 2021, 11:03 AM
Reply

So David, with the comments about Klubnik, does that mean DJ is done here and we are expecting to go to Klubnik right off the bat next year? Sounds like that would make a lot of TNetters happy to hear.

flag link

Thank you for the tempestuous post David


Dec 8, 2021, 11:04 AM
Reply

Your conversation with former player really summed it up.

1) Out of all our OL in 2021, Tigers had not one who could mentally handle the challenge at Center? Maybe Linthicum will be ready in 2022.

2) "DJ is not that guy ... You pressure him enough, he is going to fold." With no offense to DJ and Big Dave, this statement underlines DJ will never be "that guy" at Clemson. If C. Klubnik is as advertised, his mobility, leadership and accuracy will result in Cade taking over the QB job as soon as he learns the playbook.

2022 purple level memberbadge-donor-10yr.jpg flag link

Re: Thank you for the tempestuous post David


Dec 8, 2021, 11:11 AM
Reply

"You pressure him enough he is going to fold" applies to 98 out of 100 college QBs.

Especially when you take into account the ambiguous meaning of "enough" to different people.

That comment actually lost credit for the person being interviewed in my book.

Sam Hartman and Kenny Pickett were the 2 best QBs in the ACC this season and Clemson got to see first hand how you can make those QBs "fold" when you put enough pressure on them.

Hartman was a shell of himself this year at Clemson and Pickett was the same way when he visited Death Valley the previous season.

We couldn't pressure Pickett the same way on the road this season and he was totally different.

flag link

Re: Thank you for the tempestuous post David


Dec 8, 2021, 11:16 AM
Reply

I think DJ can learn to read a defense better and be quicker about but by how much is the question. I wouldn't give up on him just yet. I also think its unrealistic to think Klubnik can take the starters spot away from DJ out of the gate and may not be good for his development to out him into that role from game 1. Hopefully both DJ and Cade are good with competition and some shared snaps. We need depth at QB.

2022 orange level membermilitary_donation.jpg flag link

Re: Thank you for the tempestuous post David


Dec 8, 2021, 11:20 AM
Reply

We open with a "neutral" site against a conference opponent who should be less talented than Clemson.

Something absolutely WILD would have to happen for Clemson to start that game with a true freshman who has never played a snap on college.

That would be an enormous risk by the coaching staff to make that move.

Neither Deshaun Watson nor Trevor Lawrence were good enough to make that leap on the depth chart by that point in their careers.

flag link

Re: Thank you for the tempestuous post David

[1]
Dec 8, 2021, 12:11 PM
Reply

I agree totally with these comments. I was just a little concerned about the comments from the former player and David that almost sound like we’ve given up on DJ. I hope DJ improves next year but if not I could see a scenario very similar to KB/TL in 2018 which I thought at the time and ever since was a brilliant way for Dabo and Co to handle that situation.

flag link

Re: Thank you for the tempestuous post David


Dec 8, 2021, 11:20 AM
Reply

SocMan2® said:

Your conversation with former player really summed it up.

1) Out of all our OL in 2021, Tigers had not one who could mentally handle the challenge at Center? Maybe Linthicum will be ready in 2022.

2) "DJ is not that guy ... You pressure him enough, he is going to fold." With no offense to DJ and Big Dave, this statement underlines DJ will never be "that guy" at Clemson. If C. Klubnik is as advertised, his mobility, leadership and accuracy will result in Cade taking over the QB job as soon as he learns the playbook.


DJ will still get his shot before Cade gets the start. Also, this tells you a LOT about what the staff felt about Puma.

Personally I still feel TE was very slow to adapt to the realities of our offensive capabilities this year. He seemed to be in the repeat cycle for the first 7 or 8 games. He really lacked displaying any creativity to compensate for our shortcomings. The lack of a dynamic QB exposed TE's lack of creative play-calling. I suspect that is why he is looking at Duke and Va jobs and not the likes of a Miami job.

flag link

Re: Offensive inconsistency note


Dec 8, 2021, 11:24 AM
Reply

Was talking to someone the other day and agree. Also don't think that TE isn't getting enough credit for completely restructuring our offense. Just looking at the score of the SCAR game one would say "man the QB must have played well!" But the Box tells a different story. TE had to turn us into an almost full on run team and still found a way to win 5 in a row and 7 of 8 at the end of the season.

2022 student level member flag link

Yes…we definitely adjusted….

[2]
Dec 8, 2021, 11:39 AM
Reply

I think it’s fair for folks to have some qualms with our offensive philosophy/play calling early in the season….but clearly we adjusted and put points on the board the 2nd half of the season.
When you consider all the injuries at literally every position on offense, TE did a good job making it work from the FSU game on with the limitations we had at QB and due to injuries. We finally started scoring more than 20 points at that juncture.
If Shipley catches that wide open perfect pass in the Pitt game to go up 17-0…we probably all feel different about the whole season.
I’m pretty sure we’ll get it figured out…that the QB situation will improve one way or another, we’ll get some WR healthy, and are bringing back a 3 headed monster at the RB position. Not sure about the OL. We’ll see. Definitely will bring back a lot of experience on offense next year.
For now, 10 wins is in sight this season…would be a solid accomplishment for this particular team. It could have really gone sideways, but they held together.

flag link

Member when we threw a shovel pass


Dec 8, 2021, 11:34 AM
Reply

For a Pick 6 ......

I dont think Saban practices that with his offense

2022 white level memberbadge-donor-05yr.jpg flag link

Re: Offensive inconsistency note


Dec 8, 2021, 11:35 AM
Reply

David, thanks for passing this along. The fact that it needs to be explained hurts my head. There is a real need for the boreds to be heavily medicated.

badge-donor-05yr.jpg flag link

Sounds like excuses. I think our scheme has more

[1]
Dec 8, 2021, 11:39 AM
Reply

to do with the struggles and lack of ability to adapt when things are obviously not working, or to take a snap under center to get 6 inches.

2022 white level memberbadge-donor-10yr.jpg flag link

Re: Sounds like excuses. I think our scheme has more

[1]
Dec 8, 2021, 11:55 AM
Reply

In regards to the O-Line, WR’s and QB - where was the coaching and player development to improve these areas since spring practices began?

My worst fear of promoting from within on the offensive side. Our D bailed us out all year. Now, with BV gone - we’d better get it right with our DC, and upgrade our OJT assistants.

flag link

exactly. People seem to think that coaching is just showing


Dec 8, 2021, 4:27 PM
Reply

up at the game Saturday and making decisions then. Like they have no effect at all on the abilities, discipline, fundamentals, or performance of the players. It's strange.

2022 white level memberbadge-donor-10yr.jpg flag link

Replies: 76  

TIGER TICKETS

FB GAME: Season Tickets
FOR SALE: *PSA* DO NOT WHATEVER DO NOT BUY ANYTHING FROM “Phillop Jones” his real name is Dwayne Potts and he ...

Buy or Sell CU Tickets and More in Tiger Tickets!

Tiger Boards - Clemson Football
add New Topic
5899 people have read this post