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TigerNet HOFer [134539]
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Tiger Titan [48920]
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Explain why it's good.***
May 27, 2025, 8:15 AM
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TigerNet Icon [153130]
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Duh, because it's putting a bunch of minorities out of work.
May 27, 2025, 8:17 AM
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Get a real job!
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Clemson Icon [27553]
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Re: Duh, because it's putting a bunch of minorities out of work.
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May 27, 2025, 9:16 AM
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Because he doesn't want race to be a factor when it comes to hiring.
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Tiger Titan [48920]
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DEI initiatives tend to favor white women the most.***
May 27, 2025, 9:38 AM
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Clemson Icon [27553]
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Re: DEI initiatives tend to favor white women the most.***
May 27, 2025, 10:46 AM
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Well...maybe that shouldn't happen. Maybe we should all be considered equal and it should be on merit only. Maybe white women would dominate anyway. Maybe it would be Asians. Who knows?
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Tiger Titan [48920]
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Pretty sure the point of it...
May 27, 2025, 10:53 AM
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Was because people WEREN'T being considered equal.
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Clemson Icon [27553]
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Re: Pretty sure the point of it...
May 27, 2025, 12:56 PM
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Well, the point is now that it should all be based on merit and it is up to them. Fri makes it not about being equal and.not about merit. Maybe even giving someone who isn't equal a job over anymore qualified candidate or equal candidate strictly due to being a minority.
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Tiger Titan [48920]
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Shouldn't that be up to the private corporations...
May 27, 2025, 1:04 PM
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And state colleges and not up to the whims of a despot in the White House?
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TigerNet HOFer [134539]
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Ring of Honor [22391]
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DEI has an interesting history IMO
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May 27, 2025, 9:14 AM
[ in reply to Explain why it's good.*** ] |
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Initially starting in the late 90’s and early 2000’s, Diversity & Inclusion was driven by business needs based upon demographic realities such as opening / sales in new diverse markets and employee recruitment/ retention in diverse communities. DEI training and employee recruitment was part of normal HR functions. Employee resource group were formed to improve recruitment and increase retention of a diverse workforce. These groups improved teamwork within the organization.
Sales in diverse communities created additional revenue. Product development was enhanced by cultural diversity and also increased sales. Employee recruitment / retention was improving and reduced costs of turnover. DEI delivered financial results.
In the late 2010s and culminating with the BLM movement, many businesses and organizations seemed to take DEI to another level based on remedying social injustice within the broader community. New DEI leadership and departments were created in all types of organizations. DEI goals separate from normal business or organization objectives were created in a wave of trying to improve social justice.This DEI expansion and overreach created the backlash that fueled the “Woke” cultural wars.
Original DEI business objectives were legitimate but unfortunately too much of a good idea turned toxic.
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Paw Master [16725]
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I'll take a swing at that. I certainly wouldn't say that someone losing their
May 27, 2025, 9:57 AM
[ in reply to Explain why it's good.*** ] |
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job is "good" but jobs that are counter-productive or non-productive being eliminated is good.
I think about that when people talk about going to a straight flat tax...imagine if taxes were simplified to a point where everyone just paid a flat rate on everything they made. Postcard-sized tax returns. (please note, I'm not offering this example to argue the feasibility or value of a flat tax...it's just an example). How many tax accountants would the country need? Maybe there would be 5% of the current number? Now, if there are, say, a half million accounts in America whose job it is to navigate the tax system we put on ourselves...and those half million put their collective creativity and energy to some other value-producing endeavor, that's a win for the country.
If there are 3,000 people who put their energy toward DEI programs that the OP considers at best non-value-add and at worst counter-productive, then it's good that they are no longer doing it. It's good that they would put their energy and creativity toward something more value-add for society.
So, that's one answer. Of course, the more "on the nose" answer is that the OP believes that DEI programs are ultimately counterproductive, and therefore any reduction in their infrastructure is a good thing.
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Tiger Titan [48920]
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So we could argue
May 27, 2025, 10:05 AM
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That there have been DEI initiatives that have been positive and beneficial to many companies and that the response of "good" is an over simplistic generalization, and that if a private corporation wishes to continue these hiring practices without interference from an authoritarian regime, it should be able to?
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Paw Master [16725]
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Well, I was just trying to offer an explanation for "good".
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May 27, 2025, 10:37 AM
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I didn't read the article so I am not sure what all it goes into, nor am I an authority on DEI or what Trump's administration is doing about it.
The first part of your question is a bit too broad to address. I can't support or condemn unspecified initiatives or someone's assessment of them as positive.
Regarding the regime comment...I guess Trump's administration is forcing the dismantling of a lot of these programs. I guess if it is interpreted as discriminatory, which I think could easily be argued, then you can easily make the argument that they should not be able to continue them without the government being involved. Or, if you can see that argument and think that a company should be allowed to continue to have the program in place, you would also have to argue that a high-priced law firm that only hires white males should be able to continue to only hire white males, right?
I don't know. I took a flier on the OP's take and thought it would be an addition to the discussion but I suspect I'm not ready to deep dive into this stuff.
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Ultimate Tiger [35141]
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Depends on how its done and what is cut...
May 27, 2025, 10:00 AM
[ in reply to Explain why it's good.*** ] |
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for sure in larger companies, DEI initiatives can be way overshot - leading to inefficient and ineffective behaviors.
I'm not sure much can read into macro stats of job titles, because it very much depends on what was actually being done.
A lot of these positions and processes were added in companies to fulfill outside measures to make SRI folks happy.
At our company, we don't have a single title that includes anything close to "DEI". But that doesn't mean we have any level of discrimination...in fact, far from it. Of course, we're a private company and don't to respond to the needs of investors.
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TigerNet HOFer [134539]
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Because the most qualified should get the job
May 27, 2025, 12:09 PM
[ in reply to Explain why it's good.*** ] |
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Regardless of race, gender, etc.
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All-Time Great [88744]
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Nearly every DEI initiative does that.***
May 27, 2025, 12:14 PM
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Ultimate Tiger [35141]
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meh...not from what I've seen...
May 27, 2025, 12:55 PM
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they may say that and many do focus on broadening the applicants...BUT...there are plenty that measure how many of whatever group are hired and not stay focused on getting the best person for the job.
We get some of the big guys trying to push DEI initiatives on us as a supplier (Siemens and ABB as an example) and they fit the negative stereotypes to a tee. Heck, we have an audit next month from one of these big companies and it's not a quality audit, but instead, a social audit. It's going to be a very long 3 days!
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All-Time Great [88744]
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I've been fortunate I guess to not be in companies with more than 2000
May 27, 2025, 1:02 PM
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employees, sounds terrible when it gets too corporatized.
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TigerNet HOFer [134539]
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Tiger Titan [48920]
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Shouldn't that be up to the business?
May 27, 2025, 12:51 PM
[ in reply to Because the most qualified should get the job ] |
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If they want to use DEI hiring practices, shouldn't they have that option without government interference?
DEI initiatives, when done properly, aren't about cutting more qualified people out of jobs.
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Ultimate Tiger [35141]
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Yes, certainly and in both directions....
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May 27, 2025, 12:57 PM
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meaning government shouldn't force DEI on a company (which the federal procurement rules do to some extent) and they shouldn't preclude a company from using DEI either.
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Clemson Icon [27553]
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Re: Part Pol, part Biz
May 27, 2025, 9:15 AM
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I agree.
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All-In [10824]
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Not what I expected
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May 27, 2025, 9:45 AM
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This post isn't about Pol Pot?
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Clemson Icon [27553]
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Re: Not what I expected
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May 27, 2025, 10:46 AM
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Pol Pot wasn't bad. There were fine people on both sides.
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Paw Master [17333]
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Dems legalized discrimination and called it DEI.
May 27, 2025, 12:32 PM
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Anyone supporting it; is backwards as fk.
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TigerNet Champion [121458]
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Re: Part Pol, part Biz
May 27, 2025, 3:10 PM
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instead of focusing on your success, you are focused on the failures of others, and seemingly take joy in it?
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National Champion [7798]
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Re: Part Pol, part Biz
May 27, 2025, 3:25 PM
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I've worked for companies that paid managers bonuses for hiring DEI candidates. Nothing about them mattered other than that they weren't straight, white, males and that would get the manager a nice bonus. And I can assure you they hired some absolute idiots to take jobs we had actual well qualified internal people trained and ready to do, other than the fact they were straight, white males. If that isn't discriminatory I'm not sure what would be. I've also worked for a company that gave special rates and terms/conditions to one specific race of customers. No other race was eligible. That wasn't technically a DEI issue, I suppose, since they weren't employees, but it's reflective of the modern corporate mindset that discrimination is AOK as long as it's in favor of the correct groups. And these were major companies with hundreds of thousands of employees, stockholders, etc that you've all heard of, not some random small business that's gone off the reservation.
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