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110%er [5483]
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Where would we be if we had kept Rick Barnes or hired Shaka
Jan 22, 2019, 9:17 PM
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Smart?
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All-In [27366]
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We couldn't have kept Rick Barnes. Ask some Clemson
Jan 22, 2019, 9:19 PM
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"insiders" why he left. Had little to do with basketball.
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CU Guru [1779]
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Your right but for me it's not the point. With Barnes
Jan 22, 2019, 9:25 PM
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he was building something here. Now if he had stayed I don't think he would have kept the level of success here was having at the time but I still think it would have been better than anything we've had since. For me the point is, it CAN be done at Clemson to some degree, Barnes and OP shower that for short spurts. We'll never see that with Brad.
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110%er [6099]
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If Barnes couldn’t win at Texas, I wouldn’t bet on him
Jan 22, 2019, 9:28 PM
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winning a title. You never know, but I wouldn’t bet your money on it
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CU Guru [1779]
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Not asking for a title just respectability*
Jan 22, 2019, 9:37 PM
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*
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All-In [48078]
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Re: Your right but for me it's not the point. With Barnes
Jan 23, 2019, 3:41 AM
[ in reply to Your right but for me it's not the point. With Barnes ] |
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I think he would have. He took Texas to the NCAA tournament 16 out of the 17 seasons he was there. Between Clemson and Texas he went to the tournament 19 out of 21 years. Even at Providence he went to the tournament 3 out of 6 years. He also has the Vols ranked number 1 in the country at the moment. The Vols were a dumpster fire before he got there.
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Legend [16733]
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CU Guru [1133]
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Re: Where would we be if we had kept Rick Barnes or hired Shaka
Jan 22, 2019, 9:21 PM
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Best comment on here yet! I agree. It took purnell one year to flip the ###### here and start recruiting big talent like the Booker brothers and Oglesby. kc Rivers, James Mayes. We are struggling to recruit and we scrap from the bottom when we should be getting from the top. From dabo: it starts with recruiting
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110%er [7555]
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Re: Where would we be if we had kept Rick Barnes or hired Shaka
Jan 22, 2019, 9:24 PM
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very simple for Coach BB......can’t recruit can’t win......and HE can’t recruit.....Roll Tigers!!!!!
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CU Guru [1133]
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Re: Where would we be if we had kept Rick Barnes or hired Shaka
Jan 22, 2019, 9:24 PM
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Agree 100%
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Legend [16027]
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Re: Where would we be if we had kept Rick Barnes or hired Shaka
Jan 23, 2019, 4:58 AM
[ in reply to Re: Where would we be if we had kept Rick Barnes or hired Shaka ] |
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We are going to decide as a fan base to either put all of our support behind BB or Fire him. A fractured fan base will never help Clemson’s basketball program.
Look what living in DF’s shadow did to Clemson Football. And if not for the TB hire ( many may disagree) but he laid a foundation for a Genius like Dabo to build from. I am just glad the BOT and Administration did not listen to those calling for Dabo’s Head in year two.
We have primarily been a football school as long as I can remember in 70’s. BB has been mostly been given lip service. Do we have the financial resources to put into Basketball like we have with football? If so is the BOT, Administration and fans will to make the investment. Are Clemson fans willing to give Brad B or some other Coach time to change Clemson’s basketball culture which I strongly believe is a much harder job than football. We have neglected basketball for so long that it may take several years to catch up with many other programs. Maybe when Coach K leaves Duke that will be a opening for CU BB. But fans need to realize any coach has a steep mountain to climb to compete at the top of our league.
IMO the most important cultural change for Clemson basketball is to convence our players and fans they can win!
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CU Guru [1779]
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The fans will come when they see something they
Jan 23, 2019, 5:27 AM
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believe is building toward something. They did it when Barnes was here. They did it when OP was here. It wasn't much different in football during the Tommy West era. I remember a whole lot of empty seats in Death Valley during that time period. Then when Bowden got here people felt like there was hope and started coming back.
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All-In [44055]
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This is such a B.S. excuse.
Jan 23, 2019, 12:07 PM
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We had one of our best seasons in program history last year. In 100+ seasons of basketball at Clemson, we have been to the Sweet 16 just FOUR times:
-1980 Elite Eight team under Foster -1990 Sweet 16 team under Ellis, which was later vacated due to NCAA infractions -1997 Sweet 16 under Barnes -2018 Sweet 16 under Brownell
The remarkable thing about last year's team is that we lost arguably our best player, Donte Grantham, halfway through the season. If we could've had him, I believe we would have had our best Clemson basketball team ever.
One great year obviously doesn't guarantee future success, but one would think that fans would be excited coming off of a Sweet 16 season, especially since we were ranked in the top 20 in the preseason polls this year. But guess what? We had crappy fan turnout in November and December.
The same excuses were given this year, just as they are every year, including the fact that it's football season, it's winter break, it's cold, the team is boring to watch, etc.
The basketball team needs our support. PERIOD. Schools that support basketball well don't ask their coaches to beg for facility upgrades like Brad had to. They don't require their coach to almost single-handedly raise money for donors for new facilities. They don't have fans who expect a perfect combination of scheduling, weather, and the most exciting style of play every night in order to show up.
Bottom line: our fans stink when it comes to supporting basketball. Our administration is pretty lackuster too, although their recent support gives me hope.
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CU Guru [1779]
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Call it an excuse all you want but it's the absolute
Jan 23, 2019, 12:29 PM
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truth. I grew up going to the basketball games since my dad had season tickets from the Tates Locke era up too the OP era. Perfect example was the Closest Ellis era. There were years that place was rocking, then there were times you could hear a pin drop. Your right, maybe attendance should be better for a team coming off a Sweet 16 appearance but one could argue the performance of a team returning 4 starters from that team should be better. With television games being all over the place these days, people are not going to spend their time and money to go to an event unless they feel like they are getting their money's worth. Happened in Death Valley during the Tommy West era. Lots of empty seats during some of those years.
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All-In [44055]
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Either Clemson is serious about basketball or it isn't.
Jan 23, 2019, 2:13 PM
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Based on the last 100-plus years, it is obvious that Clemson isn't.
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Legend [16160]
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Orange Blooded [2420]
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Re: Call it an excuse all you want but it's the absolute
Jan 23, 2019, 10:20 PM
[ in reply to Call it an excuse all you want but it's the absolute ] |
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I was at the game when we beat Duke who was ranked #3 at the time. The entire place stormed the floor and cut the nets down. I was up on one goal with scissors cutting it down. I still have a piece I kept
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Orange Blooded [4995]
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Re: This is such a B.S. excuse.
Jan 23, 2019, 2:40 PM
[ in reply to This is such a B.S. excuse. ] |
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Little John was one of the toughest venues to play in under Purnell.
If you build it they will come.
One good year doesn’t erase almost an entire decade of mediocrity.
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All-In [44055]
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No it wasn't.
Jan 23, 2019, 2:43 PM
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We had amazing crowds for some games, such as when ESPN Gameday was there. We also had games with many empty seats. Let's not romanticize prior eras in our history, as if we routinely had students camping out for tickets and many sellout crowds. We have never had that consistently.
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Orange Blooded [4995]
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All-In [44055]
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We have never had that kind of environment CONSISTENTLY
Jan 23, 2019, 10:52 PM
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with any coach or during any era.
Anyone can cherry pick a game here or there when we had a great environment, packed with loud fans who cheered most of the game. Unfortunately those games are few and far between in our basketball history.
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110%er [7831]
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Legend [17645]
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100% agree MackDaddy
Jan 23, 2019, 2:29 PM
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Oglesby was a wound up machine who shot like a Steph Curry. And while Coach K set up JJ Reddick with screens on every possession, Oglesby very rarely got a screen. Wasted talent.
That said, OPP hoops was entertaining but disappeared in the clutch. With respects to Judge K, BB ball can be a little boring. Barnes could coach and kept it exciting.
I’m in SAV or would have season tickets. But it’s not just Clemson, college hoops has seriously declined with one and done generation.
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Legend [16160]
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All-In [48078]
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Re: How many Sweet 16s does OP have?***
Jan 23, 2019, 3:29 AM
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True, but out of 15 years as a HC, CBB has gone to 2 tournaments. One of tose was wit OP's players in year 1. Although OP sucked every tournament, he did take us to 3 in a row at Clemson. He even went to a couple with Dayton. Also, OP was coming in off of Rick Barnes who took us to 3 straight tournaments in a row and a Sweet 16. We used to go the tournament before CBB came around. I like CBB and I like our recruiting class next year, but he hasn't got it done overall. I am pulling for him though. There is still hope.
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Legend [16160]
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No, you're mistaken...In 15 years as a HC, he has taken
Jan 23, 2019, 2:10 PM
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teams from THREE schools to the Dance a total of 5 times...Where did you get the only two Tourneys in 15 years as a HC stat from? And OP didn't follow Barnes, he followed Shyatt...It's like your'e just making things up to fit a narrative instead of using actual facts
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All-In [44055]
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I was about to post the same response.
Jan 23, 2019, 2:13 PM
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Talk about being way off!
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All-In [48078]
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Head Coach [789]
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Re: Where would we be if we had kept Rick Barnes or hired Shaka
Jan 23, 2019, 8:40 AM
[ in reply to Re: Where would we be if we had kept Rick Barnes or hired Shaka ] |
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How many recruits does Coach Butler have on her team????? May have a lot to do with recruiting but also has a lot to do with lighting a fire under a players ace and building around something they can believe in.
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110%er [7167]
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Just so u know...none of those were options
Jan 22, 2019, 10:17 PM
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Otherwise they’d be here.
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CU Medallion [64593]
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After OP left, Shaka was never coming to Clemson***
Jan 23, 2019, 11:58 AM
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CU Guru [1852]
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Re: Where would we be if we had kept Rick Barnes or hired Shaka
Jan 22, 2019, 10:20 PM
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Wrapped up in an Adidas fbi case?
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Scout Team [193]
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Re: Where would we be if we had kept Rick Barnes or hired Shaka
Jan 23, 2019, 1:35 AM
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"Kept" Rick Barnes? How old are you?
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Orange Blooded [2320]
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Re: Where would we be if we had kept Rick Barnes or hired Shaka
Jan 23, 2019, 9:09 AM
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Do not know about him but I was in the bleachers when Tates Locke was in Littlejohn.
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110%er [5383]
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RePost concerning BB issues
Jan 23, 2019, 2:36 PM
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On offense, they refuse to go inside the arc with their athleticism & jack up 3's at about 20%. On defense, they refuse to guard anyone outside the arc and giving up about 50% to opponents.
Whoever has repeated that unfortunate rumor that BB is an "excellent X & 0 guy" is so wrong. A good coach has 2 main skills: motivate his players & adapt his philosophy to meet the skillset of his players...anyone hired at the college level knows basketball, but knowing people is just as important. IMO, Brad Brownell just doesn't relate to his guys because there is talent on our team.
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110%er [8032]
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Re: Where would we be if we had kept Rick Barnes or hired Shaka
Jan 23, 2019, 11:31 PM
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Remember when OBS left and the coot fans thought they would have their pick of coaches including Tom Herman? We laughed at them knowing a big name coach would not risk their career by coaching their team. They ended up with their 8th choice....a retread who can’t coach. Our b-ball program has the same history as coot football. We had 50k fans at the Natty parade and could not draw a full house for a noon game against a top four team immediately after the Natty ceremony. Fans would sit out in the cold for football ceremony but not walk 200 yards to watch a basketball game. Better hope CBB stays as we would be forced to hire another you never heard of and throw them into the ACC fire
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