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Top TigerNet [30041]
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Was the majority of fans complaining about Hatfield? Lee?
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May 25, 2023, 11:52 AM
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It is not that we want Brownell to fail or hate if he gets a team to a first round NIT loss at home. We want more. Just like we did when other coaches were not winning enough. Simple as that. No arguments with any of you, because it will do no good. You have your beliefs and I respect them, but I do not have to agree with them.
Yes I meant to post on this board because I am primarily asking about Hatfield and West and Lee.
Message was edited by: Clemsonohiotiger®
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Paw Warrior [4836]
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Re: Was the majority of fans complaining about Hatfield? Lee?
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May 25, 2023, 12:01 PM
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It's not just winning enough either.
It's what the coaches say that make it clear this is the best they can do.
We lost a game one year with Hatfield, I think it was to Duke, and afterwards the coaches were saying they were confused by Duke's schemes and hadn't planned for them and that's why they lost and looked incompetent doing it.
That's when I knew we needed a new coaching staff.
and Brownell gives the same type of answer when we lose...
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All-In [10404]
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Re: Was the majority of fans complaining about Hatfield? Lee?
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May 25, 2023, 12:12 PM
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That was Mike O’ Cain under Bowden.
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Game Changer [1697]
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Re: Was the majority of fans complaining about Hatfield? Lee?
May 25, 2023, 12:58 PM
[ in reply to Re: Was the majority of fans complaining about Hatfield? Lee? ] |
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This. And everything I've seen is accurate but it is also the way we won under Hatfield. Seems we were always sliding into an 8 win season... never really had command of our seasons. In other words, we got lucky.
In certain games luck is better than skill but when a dragon is based on luck (like our last 2) then no one has confidence.
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Hall of Famer [8226]
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Re: Was the majority of fans complaining about Hatfield? Lee?
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May 25, 2023, 2:46 PM
[ in reply to Re: Was the majority of fans complaining about Hatfield? Lee? ] |
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You're thinking about when we lost to Wake Forest at home under Hatfield. They were running the option, And we couldn't stop it, even though we were an option Team. It's the most pathetic performance by Clemson team I've ever witnessed.
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Top TigerNet [30605]
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Re: Was the majority of fans complaining about Hatfield? Lee?
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May 25, 2023, 12:02 PM
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Hatfield was not part of the Clemson family. He had little to do with Clemson things other than football. From what I understood, he lived away from Clemson and was seldom seen around campus. Also did not have a good personality. Others may be able to add more.
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Ultimate Clemson Legend [101580]
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I heard he destroyed relationships with high school coaches
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May 25, 2023, 12:07 PM
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that had been built up over the years. And that his football practices were night and day different (in intensity) than DF's practices.
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Ultimate Clemson Legend [101767]
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Ford's were brutal and players loved game days because it
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May 25, 2023, 12:09 PM
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was easier than practicing. Hatfield practices were like powder puff teams warming up.
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Top TigerNet [32927]
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Orange Blooded [2399]
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Re: Was the majority of fans complaining about Hatfield? Lee?
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May 25, 2023, 12:26 PM
[ in reply to Re: Was the majority of fans complaining about Hatfield? Lee? ] |
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Plus Hatfield's wife was allegedly only seen at his press conferences announcing his hiring and so-called separation. West admitted he was fired for not winning enough games.
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Ultimate Clemson Legend [101767]
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Definitely Hatfield but not as many with Lee.***
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May 25, 2023, 12:03 PM
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Paw Warrior [4790]
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Nobody liked Hatfield
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May 25, 2023, 12:04 PM
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But he had the misfortune of being the coach after Danny Ford. It'll be the same for whatever schmuck we find to replace Dabo after he Ascends to Heaven to join His Heavenly Father.
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TigerNet Elite [73793]
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Re: Hatfield wasn't Danny Ford.
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May 25, 2023, 12:32 PM
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In his first year Clemson lost to Virginia for the first time (29-0 previously). He also lost to Wake Forest his final 2 years. Hatfield left when he saw there wasn't much support for him and Tommy West was brought in due to being previously on Ford's staff. The mediocrity that started under Hatfield continued through West and Bowden.
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All-In [10896]
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Re: Was the majority of fans complaining about Hatfield? Lee?
May 25, 2023, 12:39 PM
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I was in the crowd that walked to the President's home to protest Danny being fired and for the huge majority of fans, Hatfield had no chance. Only another National Championship would have given Hatfield a chance. As for Lee, we are not a baseball school and he was just another coach.
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Ultimate Clemson Legend [101580]
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We had the talent to win the national championship in 1990..
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May 25, 2023, 1:00 PM
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but not the coaching
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110%er [6166]
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Just not going 5-6 with a ton of talent would have helped.
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May 25, 2023, 2:38 PM
[ in reply to Re: Was the majority of fans complaining about Hatfield? Lee? ] |
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Winning a National Title was not necessarily the expectation.
After all, Danny had consistently fallen short of that goal in the years following 1981.
Honestly, Hatfield was behind the 8-Ball from the start with fans, but he didn’t do much to improve the situation.
He was aloof and not a very good recruiter. He was not a great game day coach, and he was not a particularly strong disciplinarian, allowing his players to slack off in summer workouts.
Probably maintaining the 10-2 standard that Danny was riding would have cooled the ire toward Ken Hatfield, but when he went 5-6 and that sealed things.
His last year though he managed to win games, was very rocky and not particularly encouraging.
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Game Changer [1813]
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Nah, we WAS free-basing a lot back then so it was all good &...
May 25, 2023, 1:01 PM
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a secondary priority—
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Standout [328]
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Re: Nah, we WAS free-basing a lot back then so it was all good &...
May 25, 2023, 1:36 PM
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The coach? Hatfield could not coach and the team went down hill in conditioning like a lead weight thrown from a blimp.
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Associate AD [831]
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Re: Was the majority of fans complaining about Hatfield? Lee?
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May 25, 2023, 1:51 PM
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The fans hated Ken Hatfield pretty much from jump, simply because he was not Danny Ford.
I'm going to disagree with what a couple of people have said. The man could coach. He won at Air Force and Arkansas before he came to Clemson. He was an Arkansas alumn who went to an Orange Bowl and won the Southwest Conference his last two seasons there before coming to Clemson. Outside of the Clemson, hiring him away from his dream job, where he was succeeding, seemed like a major coup for the program - that we really had reached the big time.
He went 10-2, 9-2-1, a bad 5-6, and 8-3, and quit before he got the shove. But the biggest problem (back to his actual coaching) is that his teams had boring offenses and attendance dropped. And he should get credit for running a squeaky clean program.
People liked Tommy West for being part of the family, but he was plain and simply a bad coach. Terrible coach. He got six years, which seemed longer than Brad Brownell's thirteen.
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Walk-On [137]
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Re: Was the majority of fans complaining about Hatfield? Lee?
May 26, 2023, 4:52 AM
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Ken Hatfield was NOT Danny Ford, period. Fans are all about family and culture, until it’s not. In football anyway. Fans won our first NC, and then they thought we should be winning it every other year. Ken Hatfield never had a chance. Fans were mad about losing Danny, and by golly, it showed. This post won’t be a popular one, for sure.
Go Tigers
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Hall of Famer [8226]
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Re: Was the majority of fans complaining about Hatfield? Lee?
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May 25, 2023, 2:48 PM
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People were losing their minds over Hatfield, warning him gone. He wasn't Danny and was a poor substitute.
People were losing their minds, and one in West gone,..he was a Danny substitute, but had no idea how to run an offense
Grumblings had started about Lee as well. He was highly touted, but just never really could put it all together.
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