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Ultimate Tiger [34267]
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Question...
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Jan 30, 2023, 10:44 AM
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I know and understand why the Washington Redskins, Cleveland Indians, St. John's Redmen, etc., changed their names. I get why they felt the need to change and why they were asked to do so.
I was curious as to why other teams have not felt the same pressure to change like the Kansas City Chiefs or Atlanta Braves. Is it because they have not been pressured to do so or is it because the Chief name is not considered offensive like the others (Redskins, Indians, etc.)? I know Florida State has received the blessing from the Florida Seminole tribe to continue using their name. I often wonder if Washington could have changed the name Redskins to a more respectful Native American name but still kept the Native American mascot while reaching out to get a blessing from a tribe as to what would be considered respectful. Maybe they did, but I have not heard that.
Just curious as to why some teams feel pressured to change the names and some do not or have not.
If there are any Native Americans on T-Net maybe you could provide some thoughtful input.
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Tiger Spirit [9341]
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Re: Question...
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Jan 30, 2023, 10:46 AM
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I have often wondered this myself. Looking forward to hearing the responses.
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Ultimate Tiger [33249]
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How
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Jan 30, 2023, 10:47 AM
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Clemson Conqueror [11753]
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Re: Question...
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Jan 30, 2023, 11:00 AM
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Bring back Chief Nockahoma.
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Clemson Conqueror [11114]
TigerPulse: 73%
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Here’s another one…
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Jan 30, 2023, 11:03 AM
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Since “Redskins” was so terribly offensive…
Why is it still socially acceptable to refer to people as “rednecks” ?
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Ultimate Tiger [34267]
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Re: Here’s another one…
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Jan 30, 2023, 11:05 AM
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You do bring up a decent point!
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Clemson Conqueror [11114]
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I mean… I know the answer…
1
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Jan 30, 2023, 11:12 AM
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but just putting the question out there anyway.
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CU Medallion [20802]
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Do you find the term redneck offensive?
1
Jan 30, 2023, 12:36 PM
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As a white Southerner I do not find that term offensive.
However being called a certain type of redneck could be offensive to some.
Examples such as:
White trash redneck
Inbred redneck
Stupid redneck
Those three would not be suitable sports franchise mascots imho.
Angry or Fighting Inebriated Rednecks would be acceptable in many situations.
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Ring of Honor [23742]
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Some rednecks might not like being called redneck
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Jan 30, 2023, 11:19 AM
[ in reply to Here’s another one… ] |
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right?
If I have offended any rednecks I am truly sorry.
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Heisman Winner [79948]
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Re: Some rednecks might not like being called redneck
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Jan 30, 2023, 1:01 PM
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I forgive you.
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TigerNet Elite [70848]
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Re: Some rednecks might not like being called redneck
Jan 31, 2023, 9:32 AM
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Same...
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Valley Legend [12640]
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Valley Legend [12653]
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Re: Here’s another one…
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Jan 30, 2023, 11:19 AM
[ in reply to Here’s another one… ] |
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Because no one gives a crap about white men as there is no money in it for them.
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Solid Orange [1367]
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Or
Jan 30, 2023, 11:35 AM
[ in reply to Here’s another one… ] |
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the cowboys... wouldn't that offend ranchers?
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Oculus Spirit [43143]
TigerPulse: 100%
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I find Cracker Barrel offensive***
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Jan 30, 2023, 11:52 AM
[ in reply to Here’s another one… ] |
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110%er [3686]
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Re: I find Cracker Barrel offensive***
Jan 30, 2023, 12:02 PM
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Same. My blood boils every time I drive by one.
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Top TigerNet [29930]
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Rednecks commonly refers to...
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Jan 30, 2023, 12:47 PM
[ in reply to Here’s another one… ] |
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....Southern white people.
Deragatory nicknames for them is OK.
Redneck, Hillbilly, hick, cracker, bumpkin, etc.
All of them are acceptable.
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Rival Killer [2712]
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Re: Here’s another one…
Jan 30, 2023, 12:51 PM
[ in reply to Here’s another one… ] |
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The term redneck derived from a red handkerchief worn around the neck by coal miners who were fighting Pinkerton detectives in West Va back in the 1920’s I believe. Didn’t have anything to do with a farmers tan.
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Ultimate Tiger [34267]
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Re: Here’s another one…
Jan 30, 2023, 12:52 PM
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Interesting.
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Letterman [167]
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Re: Here’s another one…
Jan 30, 2023, 9:34 PM
[ in reply to Here’s another one… ] |
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Because rednecks usually don’t vote democrat. Sorry to bring politics in, but this begged for it,
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Letterman [167]
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Re: Here’s another one…
Jan 30, 2023, 9:35 PM
[ in reply to Here’s another one… ] |
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Because rednecks usually don’t vote democrat. Sorry to bring politics in, but this begged for it,
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Letterman [167]
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Re: Here’s another one…
Jan 30, 2023, 9:36 PM
[ in reply to Here’s another one… ] |
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Because rednecks usually don’t vote democrat. Sorry to bring politics in, but this begged for it,
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Orange Beast [6297]
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Re: Question...
Jan 30, 2023, 11:28 AM
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I'm not an Indian by birth but when I was a lad,my buddy
was an Indian thru his Dad. We played cowboy's and Indians and
he sometimes wanted to be the cowboy and I be the Indian.So, can
I qualify to answer your question?
Message was edited by: irmotig®
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Oculus Spirit [43143]
TigerPulse: 100%
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I was in indian guides
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Jan 30, 2023, 11:56 AM
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Instead of cub scouts so I can relate. I grew up thinking American Indians and their stuff was cool.
Indians from India are like the opposite of cool.
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Ultimate Tiger [33249]
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Amen.
Jan 30, 2023, 11:58 AM
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And in Boy Scouts - Order of the Arrow was HEAVILY Indian themed.
Is that gone now ? ?
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All-TigerNet [6061]
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Re: Amen.
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Jan 30, 2023, 6:18 PM
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I hope not because I was tapped into the Order of the Arrow at a campfire ceremony in about 1958 and added a couple of hash marks after that.
But, given the current state of the woke Boy Scouts, the tribe may have been abandoned.
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All-TigerNet [5991]
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Your buddy was from India?***
Jan 30, 2023, 8:17 PM
[ in reply to Re: Question... ] |
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TigerNet Champion [117416]
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I've spent many moons selflessly building a bridge...
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Jan 30, 2023, 11:28 AM
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between the white man & the migrant Indian Nations.
While hutted up with my Cherokee, we've shared in fire waters & the three sisters, and yet she's never gone warpath over any of this.
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Ring of Honor [22313]
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The peyote must be pretty weak then***
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Jan 30, 2023, 5:36 PM
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Ultimate Clemson Legend [102411]
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" Little Big Man! You have returned. Don't you remember me?
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Jan 31, 2023, 5:01 AM
[ in reply to I've spent many moons selflessly building a bridge... ] |
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That hurts me deep in my heart. You look tired Little Big Man. Would you like to come in my teepee and rest on soft furs? Come and live with me and I'll be your wife!"
I can't believe you passed that up, LBM.
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Ultimate Tiger [34267]
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Re: Question...
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Jan 30, 2023, 11:40 AM
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Well, this thread seems to have taken a turn for the worse.
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Paw Warrior [4755]
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Re: Question...
Jan 30, 2023, 11:59 AM
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Cop,
You ask an open question on T-net hoping for intelligent answers and . . .
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Ultimate Tiger [34267]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: Question...
Jan 30, 2023, 12:02 PM
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True, I asked for it. lol
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Oculus Spirit [44346]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: Question...
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Jan 30, 2023, 11:43 AM
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All I can say is give it time. They will get around to being offended in due time.
Noticed Chiefs and the Noles do the same tomahawk chop as the Braves but the Braves are the only one I hear about as being an issue. And it will only be brought up if the Bravos make it to the playoffs.
Also hearing it is somehow my fault that the Memphis cops beat that man to death.
I just cannot win.
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TigerNet Champion [117416]
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Re: Question...
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Jan 30, 2023, 11:45 AM
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CU Medallion [18105]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: Question...
Jan 30, 2023, 11:44 AM
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$s
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Game Changer [1771]
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Re: Question...
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Jan 30, 2023, 11:46 AM
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I know the Atlanta Braves do a lot of charity and show respect to the local Native American tribes. They also have certain games that are like devoted to a certain tribe and recognizes them. So the native Americans in this area support the Braves bc the Braves support them and Braves is not offensive like redskins. I’m sure it’s a similar situation in KC.
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Ultimate Tiger [34267]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: Question...
Jan 30, 2023, 11:49 AM
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I know Washington has a crappy owner in Sneider so I doubt he tried to build any relationship with anyone other than his secretaries, but I wonder if he would have reached out and tried building a relationship with local tribes and tweaked the name if things would have turned out differently.
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110%er [6166]
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Attempt at a serious answers …
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Jan 30, 2023, 11:50 AM
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The terms “Chief” and “Brave” are considered honorable and not racist. Sort of like “Commanders” or “Senators”.
However, terms describing skin color (Red Skins, Red Men) or just co-opting an entire race of people (Indians) is considered offensive.
I believe “Seminoles” could certainly fall on the side of offensive fighters tribe itself were to take exception, but apparently they have decided otherwise.
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Game Day Hero [4543]
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The Cuse use to be "orangemen" ?***
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Jan 30, 2023, 12:05 PM
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CU Guru [1574]
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Re: Attempt at a serious answers …
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Jan 30, 2023, 12:07 PM
[ in reply to Attempt at a serious answers … ] |
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The names "Chiefs" and "Braves" aren't considered honorable to various indigenous tribes.
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110%er [6166]
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Why? They are certainly not derogatory terms unless someone
Jan 30, 2023, 12:57 PM
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chooses to kmake it so.
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CU Guru [1574]
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Re: Why? They are certainly not derogatory terms unless someone
Jan 30, 2023, 2:50 PM
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You wo6ld have to ask them, but there are a number of indigenous people who think the terms are offensive. Again, the Braves nickname has been protested as far back as the 90s.
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Ultimate Tiger [33249]
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Yeah. Whatever you say, chief.***
Jan 31, 2023, 6:01 AM
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CU Guru [1574]
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Re: Yeah. Whatever you say, chief.***
Jan 31, 2023, 7:24 AM
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It's not what I'm saying. I'm just passing along the info. Feel free to stick your head in the stand.
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CU Guru [1574]
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Re: Attempt at a serious answers …
Jan 30, 2023, 12:09 PM
[ in reply to Attempt at a serious answers … ] |
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Also, the name "Vikings" is co-opting a whole race of people.
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110%er [6166]
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Vikings are a “race”? You’re trying too hard here …
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Jan 30, 2023, 12:59 PM
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But, have at it. ?
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CU Guru [1574]
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Re: Attempt at a serious answers …
Jan 30, 2023, 12:09 PM
[ in reply to Attempt at a serious answers … ] |
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Also, the name "Vikings" is co-opting a whole race of people.
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All-TigerNet [5991]
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Ultimate Tiger [33767]
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Re: Attempt at a serious answers …
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Jan 30, 2023, 12:10 PM
[ in reply to Attempt at a serious answers … ] |
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The leaders Seminole Tribe in FL actually spoke out and said they felt the FSU mascot was honoring their tribe and ancestors. Unless or until they get a different group of leaders that are of the more easily offended type, that mascot should be ok. So I guess it is probably just a matter of time.
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Top TigerNet [29930]
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A little more info on Seminoles.
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Jan 30, 2023, 12:54 PM
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The school works very hard at keeping a good relationship with the Seminole tribe. They know that if the Seminole Tribe ever objects to the name it will soon be changed.
On the other hand, in return, the Seminole Tribe gets tremendous monetary gain from the legalized gambling laws in the state. There are many political advantages given to the Seminole Tribe when it comes to casinos, etc.
Some would call it a quid pro quo.
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110%er [9905]
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Re: Attempt at a serious answers …
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Jan 30, 2023, 12:43 PM
[ in reply to Attempt at a serious answers … ] |
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Senators are considered honorable? That’s a broad brush with a lot of bristles missing ?.
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Top TigerNet [29930]
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Braves were under serious pressure....
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Jan 30, 2023, 12:50 PM
[ in reply to Attempt at a serious answers … ] |
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.... to change their name. Remember when Jane Fonda was married to Ted Turner. She basically refused to do the warchant (stolen from FSU).
Braves got rid of Chief Knockahoma. But, they did not give in to pressure to change the name.
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Valley Legend [12640]
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Re: Attempt at a serious answers …
Jan 31, 2023, 9:46 AM
[ in reply to Attempt at a serious answers … ] |
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Quote: Sort of like “Commanders” or “Senators”.
I'm sorry, but I find the name "senators" extremely offensive. It makes me think of poor moral character, thievery, malfeasance, pompousness, self-indulgent, arrogance, hubris, just to name a few. Who would want that stupid name?
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CU Guru [1574]
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Re: Question...
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Jan 30, 2023, 12:05 PM
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Back when the Braves first made the World Series in 91, there was a lot of controversy about the name. There was also a lot of controversy about the Cleveland Indians name around that time as well.
Interestingly, the Washington Redskins name was not controversial at the time.
I would say that the NFL gas become much more prominent, and MLB less so, hence the reason the Redskins are now controversial and the Braves are not.
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All-TigerNet [5991]
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I don’t know how Kansas City have gotten away with it…
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Jan 30, 2023, 12:08 PM
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Given the weird origin (Harold Bartle) and the chants and symbolism they currently use. There’s also the fact that there have been Native American protests over their name “Chiefs” being used.
The Atlanta Braves have gotten away with it too. Some controversy popped up as recent as 2021, but they’ve kept the name. That franchise did have some horrible names before that (Beaneaters, Doves, etc…)
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National Champion [7612]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: Question...
Jan 30, 2023, 12:43 PM
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Washington D.C., New York City, Cleveland are liberal strongholds and have been for decades. They all do what the pastie faced liberal machine tells them to do. Places where common sense still reigns have stood their ground and refused to change. It has nothing to do with respect of the Native Americans. They don't care one way or the other. Some Native American groups actually view the names as complements. It is white liberals who are offended by anything and everything.
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TigerNet Elite [69891]
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The Indians I know and associate with do not find those
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Jan 30, 2023, 12:50 PM
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terms offensive ... mainly because they are from India.
Matter of fact, a good friend of mine from high school and college, who is Indian, is a huge Braves fan.
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All-TigerNet [5915]
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If any of them had to go. You would think it would be
Jan 30, 2023, 1:44 PM
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Oculus Spirit [44346]
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Re: If any of them had to go. You would think it would be
Jan 30, 2023, 2:03 PM
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One of my favorite Braves logos!
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Valley Legend [12151]
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Re: Two things I know
Jan 30, 2023, 10:01 PM
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1. Don't take any wooden nickels
2. DON'T TRUST WHITEY!
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Ultimate Tiger [33249]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Joined: 2011
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3. Lord loves a workin’ man.***
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Jan 31, 2023, 6:03 AM
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110%er [3722]
TigerPulse: 100%
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The names do not bother me...
Jan 30, 2023, 10:14 PM
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Getting rid of the names not only relieves white guilt... but it makes Native Americans vanish from the conversation.
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110%er [4063]
TigerPulse: 100%
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UNC, Tennessee, & Ole Miss should ALL be forced to change…
Jan 31, 2023, 7:31 AM
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…their names.
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Game Changer [1722]
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Re: Question...
1
Jan 31, 2023, 8:15 AM
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Well, I'm part Indian, my grandmother was full blooded Cherokee, my grandfather half Cherokee. This #### is propped up propaganda, these teams honor the native Americans and is not offensive at all. It's just funny how different races can find something offensive for someone else, like male feminists,lol.
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