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Front Page Story: ACC needs to add to the good news and realign the divisions
Apr 30, 2013, 9:55 AM
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National Champion [7930]
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I like that plan...that's a good idea
Apr 30, 2013, 10:01 AM
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former ACC and Big East in divisions...need to split up Louisville, Clemson, and FSU.
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Orange Immortal [62702]
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Re: I like that plan...that's a good idea
Apr 30, 2013, 12:59 PM
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The way it stands now with the ACC championship game. About the only way to make that game exciting, would be for Clemson, Fla St or Louisville have to play that game with second string QB's. The way the coastal has been the last several years. That would be about the only way to make the ACCCG exciting. With GT every body has figure out how to beat the chop blocks. VT has the old man syndrome for a HC. Then there is Miami and UNCheat that can't get past the cheating. Then there is the fact that Swofford has done absolutely nothing to improve the ACC reputation in FB and he doesn't intend to now that he has the ACC LOCKED down to prevent any school from moving. That move was made only to prevent FB schools from increasing their value in a FB first conference. Welcome to Swofford's basketball world. Swofford has finally gotten what he has wanted for his Alumni ever since he became the ACC commissioner. A basketball first conference with several good FB schools to help him support his precious BB conference.
Message was edited by: allorangeallthetime52®
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CU Guru [1895]
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VT went to the Sugar Bowl 2 years ago.
Apr 30, 2013, 5:43 PM
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Not to mention winning 4 ACC championships over their first 7 years. It is amazing how one bad year by one team and Clemson stringing together 2 good years turns into "the last several years".
"Swofford hasn't done anything to improve ACC FB" except adding Miami, VT, and a very good at the time BC team. Or bringing in ND who will play 5 ACC teams every season. Or keeping the conference together through all of the nonsense rumors.
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Orange Blooded [4098]
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Re: VT went to the Sugar Bowl 2 years ago.
Apr 30, 2013, 4:55 PM
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yes they did! and promptly got ROBBED! and did swoffie complain and support them in any way??of course not!he only cares about basketball and UNC!!
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CU Guru [1898]
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Ring of Honor [21020]
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David: Why do they not want to realign? They tell you it
Apr 30, 2013, 10:03 AM
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isn't going to happen. Why? Sigh.
Message was edited by: AThomas®
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Valley Protector [1422]
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Lots of reasons.
Apr 30, 2013, 11:33 AM
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UNC doesn't want to be separated from either Duke or UVA, and they like getting to Atlanta every other year because of recruiting and a large number of alumni there. They also realize that in the foreseeable future the easier path to Charlotte lies in the Coastal.
UVA doesn't want to be stuck in a northern division with teams they have little history with beyond VT (26 total games against the rest of the proposed ACC North teams other than VT.
VT doesn't want to be stuck in a northern division without an assured game in NC every year.
GT, while originally pushing for a move that put them in a division with FSU, now like UNC sees that the easier path to Charlotte lies in the Coastal than the Atlantic.
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Orange Blooded [4098]
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Commissioner [944]
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Re: Front Page Story: ACC needs to add to the good news and realign the divisions
Apr 30, 2013, 10:07 AM
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Realignment talk is interesting and has some valid points, however, the strength of the teams is in a state of flux and is ever changing. I'm not sure that the conference leaders are ever going to be willing to be constantly tinkering with the divisions. I would like to see the original members moved into the same division.
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National Champion [7930]
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success will fluctuate but support for the programs over the
Apr 30, 2013, 10:12 AM
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past 10 yrs is about the same today as it was in 2003. Clemson, FSU, and VT get tremendous fan support and it's a tremendous priority to win. GT has ok fan support at best. Miami the same. NC will always be a basketball school. Now you add in Louisville to the mix and you have the heavyweights with fan support tilted to the Atlantic.
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Orange Blooded [4098]
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Re: success will fluctuate but support for the programs over the
Apr 30, 2013, 4:58 PM
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don`t try to impress Swoffie with the facts! his mind is made up that this is best for basketball and UNC
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Paw Master [16310]
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I don't understand the need for a cross div rival game. With
Apr 30, 2013, 10:09 AM
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7 teams in each division, you play 6 teams and a rival every year. If you rotate a home and home, that would mean it's going to take 13 years before you would even play that school again. Throw in there the fact you have to play ND at least once every 5 years and wow.
It may be 15-16 years before Clemson ever plays UNC again.
That's why I would not have a cross division rivalry game.
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Athletic Dir [872]
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Very Good point
Apr 30, 2013, 10:40 AM
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I do like seeing the different teams on the schedule each season.
I like the idea of playing GT every season like it is, but VT wouldn't be bad. Miami would not be bad either.
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Orange Blooded [2372]
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Re: Exactly.
Apr 30, 2013, 6:44 PM
[ in reply to I don't understand the need for a cross div rival game. With ] |
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I think a better solution is as follows:
Atlantic
FSU
GT
Clemson
UNC
NCSU
UVA
VT
East
Everybody else
UNC/NCSU can play Duke and Wake OOC if they want, and FSU can do the same with UM, as they did for years. Meaningful rivalries and overall access to Florida, and NC are preserved by alignment. Rotate two/yr, preserving decent access for everyone to Florida, Georgia, SC, VA, and NC.
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Freshman [3]
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Re: Front Page Story: ACC needs to add to the good news and realign the divisions
Apr 30, 2013, 10:09 AM
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How does Miami get in the North?? I agree with you that FSU and Clemson should be in different divisions. The powers that be will decide this, not you and me. I enjoy your articles.
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Orange Blooded [3788]
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It puts them with their former Big East rivals
Apr 30, 2013, 10:17 AM
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I wonder if they would consider such a move worth the increase in travel budget for non-revenue sports teams though.
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Game Changer [1652]
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divisions aren't strictly adhered to in non-revenue sports
Apr 30, 2013, 10:41 AM
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so I don't think that would matter too much. The divisions are mostly used for football due to championship game. They use it in baseball, too, but they wouldn't have to.
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Orange Blooded [3788]
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They'd almost have to split it differently in baseball
Apr 30, 2013, 10:46 AM
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come to think of it.
There isn't much quality college baseball north of Virginia. I don't even know if Syracuse and Pitt have teams
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Valley Protector [1422]
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Of the incoming schools
Apr 30, 2013, 11:22 AM
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Only Syracuse doesn't field a team. We will have two 7 team divisions when Louisville eventually comes on line.
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Paw Warrior [5016]
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Re: Front Page Story: ACC needs to add to the good news and realign the divisions
Apr 30, 2013, 10:10 AM
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I like the idea and love the thought of playing in those divisions but just like teams want to play in Florida once every two years I think you are missing out on some exposure by not playing anyone outside of the South. Clemson has the edge on teams like BC, Cuse, Pitt, UVA in recruiting but many players want to play close to home from time to time. Giving them that opportunity every other year could be what Separates Clemson from other southern schools.
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Orange Blooded [3788]
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Using that same logic
Apr 30, 2013, 10:21 AM
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you could also get a kid from Chapel Hill who wants the chance to beat up on his hometown team every year, so he picks VT or GT instead of us because we only play them twice every 5 or 6 years.
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National Champion [7930]
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we only speak with emotion here....no logic***
Apr 30, 2013, 10:23 AM
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Paw Warrior [5016]
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Re: we only speak with emotion here....no logic***
Apr 30, 2013, 10:52 AM
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What emotion could I possibly have for wanting to play the Northern Schools? I live to the South of Clemson and will have far less opportunity to visit away games in the current divisions, but I can see the benefits on the recruiting front. I do think we should move Louisville to the other division just to insure a solid opponent in the ACC Championship but I'm not sure a complete overhaul is needed.
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National Champion [7930]
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it was a joke...nothing more***
Apr 30, 2013, 11:08 AM
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Paw Warrior [5016]
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Re: Using that same logic
Apr 30, 2013, 10:48 AM
[ in reply to Using that same logic ] |
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You are correct but we are also playing in North Carolina once a year and that allows his extended family to come see him play. I am not talking about out recruiting teams in the ACC because besides FSU/Miami we already do that. But the biggest difference for kids in East coast states between Clemson and schools like Auburn and UGA is we would play close to their home occasionally. I am sure us playing in the same division as Cuse played a role in Ebo's decision to commit to Clemson.
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Orange Blooded [3788]
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Re: Using that same logic
Apr 30, 2013, 11:04 AM
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You've got a point, but I guess the question is do you take the risk of losing a couple of guys from New York or Maryland every year in exchange for increasing your presence in the talent-rich South?
I'd lean towards the latter, you prefer the former, there's not really a good way to prove who's right.
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Dynasty Maker [3438]
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Re: Front Page Story: ACC needs to add to the good news and realign the divisions
Apr 30, 2013, 10:13 AM
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In this scheme there is no need to keep the cross-division rival. Other than FSU-Miami there are no natural rivalries between schools in the north/south divisions. I think it would be better to vary the games across the division than be locked in with only 1 varying game a year.
Even with these realigned division this conference seems so blah :/
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Orange Immortal [62702]
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Re: Front Page Story: ACC needs to add to the good news and realign the divisions
Apr 30, 2013, 11:27 AM
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Well that's b/c it is just sooooooooo blahhhhh.
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All-Time Great [88530]
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The key question is whether Louisville will have a better
Apr 30, 2013, 10:14 AM
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program than UNC, VT, GT, and Miami the next 10 years or so. I'm not so sure. Last year, Louisville scrapped out many close wins, beat UNC by 5 at home, beat Southern Miss by 4 away, beat USF by 2 at home, beat Cincinnati by 3 at home, won by 3 at Rutgers, got clobbered by Syracuse on the road, and lost to UConn on the road.
If I was going to bet money, I'd think Miami, VT, and UNC will be as good or better than Louisville the next 10 years.
Louisville had a great year last year but I wouldn't be surprised to see them back track a bit next year, and a lot in 2014 when they join the ACC.
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National Champion [7930]
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I'll take that bet anyday of the week***
Apr 30, 2013, 10:15 AM
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All-Time Great [88530]
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I'm down. UNC, Miami, and VT have more football
Apr 30, 2013, 10:24 AM
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potential than Louisville.
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National Champion [7930]
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we've got a night at the Esso on this one
Apr 30, 2013, 10:27 AM
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I'm enjoying suds on your dime 
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All-Time Great [88530]
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2023 FSU game?***
Apr 30, 2013, 10:29 AM
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National Champion [7930]
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I'm there.....you're calling me a cab :-)***
Apr 30, 2013, 10:32 AM
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Game Changer [2037]
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Thank you for saying that...
Apr 30, 2013, 10:54 AM
[ in reply to The key question is whether Louisville will have a better ] |
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at least there is one logical person on here when it comes to Louisville.
They are a solid program right now and are on the up and up, but get way too much credit.
I mean, people watched them beat Florida in the Sugar Bowl and now they have a better program than VT? Not seeing that and they are maybe on par coaching and talent wise with both Miami and UNC.
Its tough to gauge UofL bc of their conference affiliation and who they play. Like you stated, they nearly lost 5-7 games last year (one correction - they lost to UCONN at HOME - makes it look worse).
UofL may become an elite program in the future, but some folks need to stop acting like they are an elite team right now.....they aren't.
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National Champion [7930]
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they are still WAY better than who we replaced them with
Apr 30, 2013, 11:09 AM
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Maryland wasn't, isn't, never will be a good program over a sustained period of time.
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Game Changer [2037]
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Oh I agree...definitely an upgrade...
Apr 30, 2013, 12:32 PM
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I just think they get a little too much hype right now.
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Orange Immortal [62702]
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Re: The key question is whether Louisville will have a better
Apr 30, 2013, 3:30 PM
[ in reply to The key question is whether Louisville will have a better ] |
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As long as Charley Strong is there, I'll put my money on him to win. And also, they didn't give him that big raise to stay and lose. IMPO, I think that Louisville will be one of the better FB schools in the ACC as long as he is the HC.
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Orange Phenom [14935]
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My two Divisions:
Apr 30, 2013, 10:14 AM
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The Swofford Division:
- Tarholes
- Dook
- NC Stayut
- Pitt
- Syracuse
- Wake
- UVA
The Football Division:
- Clemson
- FSU
- VT
- GT
- Miami
- BC
- Louisville
Louisville and NC Stayut are floaters depending on how good they are at football (i.e. how much their fans pretend to only care about basketball).
That way we can keep to our own.
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Walk-On [132]
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Orange Blooded [4712]
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GOOD news?!?
Apr 30, 2013, 10:15 AM
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Grant of rights is nauseating
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National Champion [7930]
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you've got to follow the company line...it's a good thing***
Apr 30, 2013, 10:19 AM
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1st Rounder [649]
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Athletic Dir [872]
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Interesting Archive!
Apr 30, 2013, 10:49 AM
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I think it would work
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Associate AD [1086]
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No more "permanent rivals". They suck.
Apr 30, 2013, 10:40 AM
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No more "permanent rivals" except FSU and Miami:
Atlantic Coast Division:
FSU, GT, CU, UNC, NCST, Wake, Duke
Big East Division:
Miami, UVA, VT, L-Ville, Pitt, Syracuse, BC
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Valley Protector [1422]
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Game Changer [1652]
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Think UVA would mind being in the Big East division despite
Apr 30, 2013, 10:42 AM
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being a member since the first year?
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Ring of Honor [21020]
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If you think about it, cross border rival wars and other
Apr 30, 2013, 10:48 AM
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games in the states 1 or 2 over make the SEC.
In the ACC Clemson has historic rivalries with the UNCheat (a border war game that we have not played many times since adding BC and Miami and VT), GT (a border war game), FSU (one of those 2 states away but still close), VT (one of those 2 states away but still close (who we have not played many times), and NC State (a border war game--Textile Bowl). If Clemson played these 5 games a year it makes for great cross border and near border clashes and builds tradition and interest. Clashes far north in BC, Syracuse, and Pitt are not like cross border clashes. Most people cannot drive to them--you have to get on an airplane. You don't interact with those people like most do with Tarheels, Crackers, Floridians, and Virginians.
The ACC needs to work on building or re-building border clashes.
GO TIGERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Message was edited by: AThomas®
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Varsity [104]
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Re: Front Page Story: ACC needs to add to the good news and realign the divisions
Apr 30, 2013, 10:52 AM
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PLEASE - PLEASE - PLEASE follow the recommendation to name the divisions NORTH and SOUTH!!!
If anyone - any sticking one - actually continues to call them Atlantic and Coastal after a realignment - they should have certain body parts removed. PERIOD!
Sheesh - how stupid can anyone possibly be???
Would the idiots that named our divisions please step forward? Please make them do a lot of community service for 'stupidity'.
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CU Guru [1210]
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Nah
Apr 30, 2013, 10:56 AM
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Miami needs to be in same div with us and fsu
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Game Changer [1816]
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Brutal travel for Miami. All opponents are VA to New England***
Apr 30, 2013, 11:08 AM
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Scout Team [196]
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Re: Front Page Story: ACC needs to add to the good news and realign the divisions
Apr 30, 2013, 11:30 AM
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While they are at it they should update the brand logo including blue/beige color combination
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Freshman [1]
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Re: Front Page Story: ACC needs to add to the good news and realign the divisions
Apr 30, 2013, 11:42 AM
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It makes sense to keep rivalries that take years to develope together which this plan does. In addition travel costs are reduced and funds can be put to better use.
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Clemson Icon [24205]
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Switch Miami and Wake and I agree.***
Apr 30, 2013, 12:11 PM
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Fan [82]
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Re: Switch Miami and Wake and I agree.***
Apr 30, 2013, 1:44 PM
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^^Agree with this, but I would switch Miami with NCST or UNC to keep divisions more balanced. But division need to make sense geographically.
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Trainer [41]
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How about this...
Apr 30, 2013, 12:46 PM
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I know that Duke and UNC don't want to be split up but they could be cross division rivals. Also, even though FSU and Miami would be in the same division each team would make it to Florida at least 2 out of every 3 years from the opposing division.
Div 1:
Boston College
Louisville
Pittsburgh
Syracuse
Virginia Tech
North Carolina
North Carolina State
Div 2:
Clemson
Duke
Florida State
Georgia Tech
Wake Forest
Miami
Virginia
Rivals:
UNC - Duke
Virginia - V Tech
Wake - BC
Miami - NC State
Clemson - Syracuse
FSU - Pitt
G Tech - Louisville
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Orange Phenom [14543]
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Not sure I would characterize our signing away any chance of
Apr 30, 2013, 1:10 PM
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getting out of the ACC as good news.
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CU Guru [1895]
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The alternative was what?
Apr 30, 2013, 1:13 PM
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Wait it out? That was not an option.
The SEC was not going to happen.
The situation in the Big 12 would be no better than the current ACC. Most likely worse.
You guys kill me with the mindless ACC/Swofford bashing.
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Associate AD [1086]
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Clemson's rivalry with UNC, UVA, and VA Tech is dead!
Apr 30, 2013, 1:22 PM
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Clemson will only have 1 home and home series with UNC in a 26 year period. Likewise UVA and VA Tech.
UNC, UVA, and VA Tech may as well be in the PAC-12.
In fact, we may play a team from the PAC-12 in a bowl game more often than we play UNC, UVA, or VA Tech over the next 20 years.
Depending upon your age, you may only have one more chance to see Clemson play in Chapel Hill, Charlottesville, or Blacksburg.
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Valley Protector [1422]
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When did we
Apr 30, 2013, 4:42 PM
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have rivalries with any of those three schools?
We have won almost 2/3rds of our games vs UNC and VT. We have won over 80% of our games vs UVA. While we are culturally aligned with VT because of academics and a football first attitude the only thing we share in common with UNC and UVA is we are members of the ACC.
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Associate AD [1086]
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The only thing we share with Scar is that we are in the same
Apr 30, 2013, 8:49 PM
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state.
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Trainer [26]
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It violates the Blue Rule.
Apr 30, 2013, 1:57 PM
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Which states: Any divisional realignments must allow for UNC and Duke to possibly meet in the ACC Tournament Finals.
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CU Guru [1895]
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There aren't and haven't ever been Basketball Divisions
Apr 30, 2013, 2:01 PM
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(and of course Duke and UNC are in the same division for sports that do use the divisions.)
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Game Changer [1816]
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Eject Duke, Wake, UVA & Cuse. Round-robin a REAL conference!
Apr 30, 2013, 1:58 PM
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Yeah... I know... It's a fantasy, and we need contrived divisions and championship games to make money.
But I hate dividing conferences into 2 divisions and I despise permanent-rivals, both of which enable teams to win their division and/or conference based on luck of the draw rather each team playing every team in their conference.
I wish the NCAA had mandated a maximum of 10-teams per conference with mandatory round-robin schedules.
I guess I'm just a crusty old man.
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All-TigerNet [12666]
TigerPulse: 86%
47
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Joined: 2011
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Why would Miami want to be right back on an island within
Apr 30, 2013, 2:02 PM
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its division just like it was in the Big East? Why on earth would VT and Virginia agree to such an alignment? Talk about one division being much stronger than the other, this would do it. What about everyone getting exposure up and down the coast?
I like the ACC's zipper approach and see the reasoning behind it. Tweak one team, maybe, but aligning them to resemble the old Big East and ACC is not good.
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MVP [548]
TigerPulse: 54%
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Make it easy North / South!!!!!!
Apr 30, 2013, 2:16 PM
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Nobody outside of the ACC knows who is in the Atlantic and Costal divisons. You would be hard press to find people who even know what the divisons are named.
Change it asap.
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Game Changer [1816]
TigerPulse: 67%
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Easy to remember. Easy for VT to win North, but South brutal***
May 1, 2013, 12:08 PM
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Walk-On [146]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: Front Page Story: ACC needs to add to the good news and realign the divisions
Apr 30, 2013, 8:28 PM
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There are a ton of long-term benefits to realigning geographically.
To not do it at this point and time is absurd.
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Varsity [104]
TigerPulse: 92%
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Re: Please explain how locking us in the ACC
Apr 30, 2013, 9:13 PM
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for the next 20+ years is good news?? We suck in basketball, always have and always will. Basketball doesn't pay the bills, never has and never will at Clemson!!
As long as ESPN is running College Football and John Swofford is ACC Commish, we will be screwed.
Going back into hibernation until 8/31!!
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Varsity [104]
TigerPulse: 92%
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Re: PS and thank God, Barker is gone!!***
Apr 30, 2013, 9:15 PM
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Orange Phenom [14989]
TigerPulse: 82%
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Posts: 23438
Joined: 1998
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All-TigerNet [5919]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Where do want to go, that we had any chance of
Apr 30, 2013, 9:48 PM
[ in reply to Re: Please explain how locking us in the ACC ] |
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attaining?
SEC - usc would not let us in.
Big 12 - no natural rivals, shaky conference and long travel to a different time zone.
B1G - not happening and no natural rivals.
Independent - funny
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Tiger Titan [50651]
TigerPulse: 79%
58
Posts: 36963
Joined: 2003
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Maybe this is a dumb question, but why do we need divisions?
May 1, 2013, 2:01 AM
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Why not have a random schedule each year, except for perhaps one or two "rivalry games." Otherwise, you get who you get. The top two teams play for the conference championship.
What is the problem with this?
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Member [21]
TigerPulse: 85%
3
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If ACC wants to be "Big Boy" football, it should have a ....
May 1, 2013, 5:58 AM
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"Big Boy" division.
Clemson
FSU
VT
Louisville
GT
Miami
NC State (or maybe Pitt)
Winner of the division gets to host the ACC Championship.
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Tiger Cub [11]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: Front Page Story: ACC needs to add to the good news and realign the divisions
May 1, 2013, 3:42 PM
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Realignment looks like it makes too much sense for Swofford to consider. I like your alignment except for travel reasons, I would swap FSU and Miami.
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Walk-On [132]
TigerPulse: 44%
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Re: Front Page Story: ACC needs to add to the good news and realign the divisions
May 1, 2013, 11:14 PM
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Completely agree 100% with your division breakdowns. Way back in November I suggested they put all the ACC Charter schools in the same division. I wouldn't mind playing UL every year and I know FSU wants GT to be in their division so I think your breakdown makes the most sense. FSU/Clemson/GT and the NC schools. UL/VT/Miami. That works out to be somewhat balanced, although the FSU/Clemson side is still stronger.
http://ryankantor.com/2012/11/28/how-the-acc-could-realign-divisions-to-preserve-tradition/
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