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Standout [214]
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Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
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Jul 3, 2025, 11:21 AM
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"... wait, GOD killed children to get back at Pharaoh?"
Seems, even a child understands the moral repugnance there.
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CU Medallion [20319]
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well, Pharoah should have taken better care of his people.
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Jul 3, 2025, 11:38 AM
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Standout [214]
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Not a surprising response tbh***
Jul 3, 2025, 11:49 AM
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110%er [3693]
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110%er [3693]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
Jul 3, 2025, 3:23 PM
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When I was a kid the Sunday school teachers would go to my dad who was the pastor and say that I asked questions they couldn’t answer.
They say an inquisitive nature is a sign of high intelligence.
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Standout [214]
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Hey Pharoah, knock it off or i'll... uh... kill all the children!
Jul 3, 2025, 4:00 PM
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what the actual f
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National Champion [7300]
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Standout [214]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
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Jul 3, 2025, 8:08 PM
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well you do get front-row seats to the bs
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National Champion [7300]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
Jul 3, 2025, 10:27 PM
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Yep. Many preachers kids feel that their pastor father was a hypocrite and turn against the faith.
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Standout [214]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
Jul 3, 2025, 10:56 PM
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Are they wrong?
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National Champion [7300]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
Jul 4, 2025, 7:19 AM
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Another person being a hypocrite is not going to turn me against the faith. If it was, I would have left a long time ago.
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Standout [214]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
Jul 4, 2025, 9:41 AM
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You sure you aren't a hypocrite?
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National Champion [7300]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
Jul 4, 2025, 3:42 PM
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I am not perfect.
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CU Medallion [20319]
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Standout [214]
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Re: Cool story, bro.
Jul 3, 2025, 9:59 PM
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Didn’t realize you had to be smart to call infanticide bad. Seems pretty obvious even to elementary school kids
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National Champion [7300]
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Re: Cool story, bro.
Jul 4, 2025, 7:20 AM
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The creator can justly do as He wishes with the creation.
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Standout [214]
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Re: Cool story, bro.
Jul 4, 2025, 9:17 AM
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Sure, it's just weird that you call it good/loving.
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National Champion [7300]
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Re: Cool story, bro.
Jul 4, 2025, 3:38 PM
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Had they followed Hos commands then, they wouldn’t be fighting most the wars they are fighting now.
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Standout [214]
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Re: Cool story, bro.
Jul 4, 2025, 3:54 PM
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Where did those children/animals not follow his command and how does that absolve him anyway?
Saying he can do whatever he wants doesn’t make it any less abhorrent.
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National Champion [7300]
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Re: Cool story, bro.
Jul 4, 2025, 5:47 PM
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What He does is righteous.
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Standout [214]
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Re: Cool story, bro.
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Jul 4, 2025, 5:49 PM
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killing children, infants and animals is righteous; got it.
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Orange Immortal [66072]
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That is literally his position - LOL!***
Jul 5, 2025, 12:24 AM
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National Champion [7300]
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Re: Cool story, bro.
Jul 5, 2025, 12:24 PM
[ in reply to Re: Cool story, bro. ] |
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If God does it, It is righteous.
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Standout [214]
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Re: Cool story, bro.
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Jul 5, 2025, 12:39 PM
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that's some hardcore brainwashing you got going on there
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Orange Elite [5159]
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Clemson Icon [26207]
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110%er [3978]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
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Jul 3, 2025, 4:23 PM
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You said this was a discussion. Are you going to share how you answered your child? Did you bring them comfort with, "don't worry, there is no God and it never happened"? Did you agree that God is repugnant or evil? Did you explain that God is sovereign and acts in ways we might not understand?
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110%er [3693]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
Jul 3, 2025, 4:36 PM
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Why doesn’t god do things like this anymore?
Or do yo believe he does?
Like when a hurricane rips through a city and leaves hundreds dead is this an act of god?
Why would you want to serve that kind of god?
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110%er [3978]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
Jul 3, 2025, 4:53 PM
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God had a very specific purpose in the death of the firstborn as described in Exodus. I'm comfortable now knowing why He chose that among the plagues.
I'm not sure where I stand on things like natural disasters. I don't know if I believe that God sends hurricanes and earthquakes or merely allows them. Either way, I believe there is an ultimate good that comes from them (Romans 8:28).
Why serve a God like that? Because once you believe you have little choice.
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110%er [3693]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
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Jul 3, 2025, 5:19 PM
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You can believe in god and not believe that the events described in the Bible are literal events.
In fact most critical scholars believe they were written thousands of years after the events they describe, and there is little to no evidence that they actually happened.
I could get on board with Christianity if it was more about what Jesus taught like loving your neighbor and not judging each other than about believing in fanciful stories of antiquity.
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110%er [3978]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
Jul 4, 2025, 8:59 AM
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Which parts of the bible do you believe? You previously posted that you did not accept Jesus as your Savior ("I'm not willing to go that far" was I believe your comment). How do you decide what is true thus worth following vice things which are fictional? Do you limit your beliefs to only things you can explain or that seem to you likely to have actually happened?
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Standout [214]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
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Jul 4, 2025, 9:51 AM
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I proportion my beliefs to the available evidence. This doesn't mean I only believe things I can personally explain, as I accept scientific consensus on topics outside my expertise, but I do require good reasons to believe something is true.
The alternative leads to holding contradictory beliefs, being easily misled, and making poor decisions based on false information. If we abandon evidence as our guide, we lose any reliable method for distinguishing truth from fiction. What's your alternative for determining what's true without relying on evidence and explanation?
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110%er [3693]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
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Jul 4, 2025, 10:00 AM
[ in reply to Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt... ] |
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The parts that are believable. I use my common sense every time I hear a story. When my buddy who I’ve never seen break 100 tells me he shot an 82 I can safely assume he is exaggerating his score.
By the same token, I have no problem believing Jesus said this and went there, but when I read he calmed a raging sea I can easily chalk that up to myth or legendary development.
But besides all that, there are contradictions in theology and in logic. There are problems with believing the Bible is the perfect word of god. You hold your nose and ignore these things and that’s fine, but don’t act like I’m the one refusing to acknowledge reality.
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110%er [3978]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
Jul 4, 2025, 3:12 PM
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Safe to say then Christianity, for you, is philosophy. That's not meant as a slight. But from your view, Christianity tells us how we should live (Golden Rule) but offers little more. There is no salvation found there because there is nothing to be saved from or need for a savior.
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National Champion [7300]
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National Champion [7300]
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Standout [214]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
Jul 4, 2025, 3:52 PM
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Let’s be real here, no matter which contradiction is presented you would just rationalize it away. For example:
Staff Contradiction in the Gospels
When Jesus sends out the 12 disciples:
Mark 6:8 - “Take nothing for the journey except a staff”
Matthew 10:10 - “Take nothing for the journey…no staff”
Luke 9:3 - “Take nothing for the journey, no staff”
Same event, same instructions, opposite commands about the staff. Mark explicitly allows it, Matthew and Luke explicitly forbid it.
The usual apologetic explanations involve different Greek verbs meaning “acquire vs. carry” or different types of staffs, but these feel like post-hoc rationalizations. At face value, it’s a clear contradiction between the Gospel accounts.
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National Champion [7300]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
Jul 4, 2025, 5:51 PM
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There is no contradictions. It's Airo vs ktaomai. Jesus said same think in all accounts.
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Standout [214]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
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Jul 4, 2025, 6:01 PM
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Your argument falls apart because Luke 9:3 uses the exact same Greek verb (αἴρω/airo) as Mark 6:8, not ktaomai. The verb distinction only works between Matthew and Mark. Luke uses identical vocabulary to Mark yet gives the opposite instruction about staffs
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Orange Immortal [66072]
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A lot of people start with the premise that there are no contradictions, then
Jul 5, 2025, 1:49 PM
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set about doing backflips and using faulty logic or whatever is required to explain it away. "Free will" is my favorite, LOL!
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Standout [214]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
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Jul 3, 2025, 4:59 PM
[ in reply to Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt... ] |
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I told her that her moral instinct was correct: killing children is wrong, full stop. I'm not going to gaslight my kid into thinking mass child murder is okay just because it's in a religious text.
She doesn't need comfort about "there being no God." She needs to know her conscience is working properly when it recoils at innocent suffering.
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110%er [3978]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
Jul 3, 2025, 8:32 PM
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I'm not questioning anyone's moral instinct. I'm genuinely curious as to how you answered her question, "God killed children just get back at Pharaoh?" That's a pretty direct question. You either believe God did (even if you find it repugnant) or you don't believe happened.
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Standout [214]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
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Jul 3, 2025, 9:12 PM
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"I'm not questioning anyone's moral instinct. I'm genuinely curious as to how you answered her question"
I answered that question? Read above.
"You either believe God did (even if you find it repugnant) or you don't believe happened."
It's clearly myth. I don't think God is repugnant, as I don't think he exists. I think the human's who wrote it are morally repugnant.
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CU Medallion [20319]
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Standout [214]
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Re: First things first
Jul 3, 2025, 9:59 PM
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Explain then, why did god kill those children?
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CU Medallion [20319]
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Re: First things first
Jul 3, 2025, 10:38 PM
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Rather than posting a video for you to watch, I will give you a reading assignment. Once you finish that get back to me. Or, just explain what you understand about the book of Exodus, if you prefer.
Let me know when you are ready.
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Standout [214]
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Re: First things first
Jul 3, 2025, 10:56 PM
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Challenge accepted, what would you like me to read? Just the book of Exodus?
I only have 1 condition: You give me an explanation of why god killed the children that doesn't resort to "well god is sovereign, and he can kill whom he pleases" or "there are some things we just can't understand about god, but I assume it's a good reason".
Because if it's just that, we can skip to that part.
Deal?
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CU Medallion [20319]
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Re: First things first
Jul 3, 2025, 11:19 PM
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Listen - you accept a challenge then you don't set conditions. If you want to understand God then you don't set conditions at all. Further, setting conditions now, before you ever start, only implies you already have your mind cemented in position and there is nothing that can move your mind from where it is. That said, and since you already have everything figured out, enjoy your life.
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Standout [214]
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Re: First things first
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Jul 4, 2025, 9:14 AM
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Saw that coming from a mile away, at least I saved myself another 3 hours from reading Exodus yet again.
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Orange Immortal [66072]
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YOU are the one who claims to have it all figured out. You just don't
Jul 5, 2025, 1:57 PM
[ in reply to Re: First things first ] |
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like people pointing out things that indicate that you really don't. When Paw Prints and Big Dog and I disagree with you, it does not mean we think we've got it "all figured out". I sure don't think I do. We just disagree with you.
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National Champion [7300]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
Jul 4, 2025, 7:24 AM
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Go chew on 1 Samuel 15:3 for a while.
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Standout [214]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
Jul 4, 2025, 9:16 AM
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"3 Now go, attack the Amalekites and totally destroy[a] all that belongs to them. Do not spare them; put to death men and women, children and infants, cattle and sheep, camels and donkeys.’”"
Yikes... specifically calling out children and infants.
Not sure what your goal with this one was, seems like you support genocide I guess?
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National Champion [7300]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
Jul 4, 2025, 12:04 PM
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My point is God can do what He wants.
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Standout [214]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
Jul 4, 2025, 12:13 PM
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>My point is God can do what He wants.
And he wants to kill children apparently...
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Clemson Icon [26207]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
Jul 4, 2025, 5:17 PM
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I would carefully consider why He did that.
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Standout [214]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
Jul 4, 2025, 5:22 PM
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I'm all ears.
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Clemson Icon [26207]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
Jul 4, 2025, 6:33 PM
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Says the guy who doesnt believe Peter and John were eyewitnesses.
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Standout [214]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
Jul 4, 2025, 6:54 PM
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You're confusing two completely different things. The point isn't whether Peter and John were eyewitnesses, it's that we don't have first-hand written accounts from them claiming to have witnessed the resurrection. In fact, there are zero first-hand eyewitness claims to the resurrection anywhere in the Bible.
The Peter letters are pseudepigraphical according to mainstream scholarship. John's Gospel explicitly indicates it was compiled by others ("we know his testimony is true"). These aren't first-hand accounts even if we accept traditional authorship.
What we have is Paul claiming he talked to Peter. That's secondhand testimony at best. You keep inflating this into multiple independent eyewitness accounts when it's really just Paul (who didn't witness it) and authors writing decades later doing all the heavy lifting, not the supposed eyewitnesses themselves.
This isn't controversial. It's basic biblical scholarship that you apparently haven't engaged with.
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Clemson Icon [26207]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
Jul 4, 2025, 11:49 PM
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You just like keeping things going in circles. Fine. But for the record:
- 1st Peter affirms resurrection. Objective evidence affirms Peter as the writer.
- John's letters affirm resurrection.
- John's Gospel written by "a disciple whom Jesus loved".
You dont have to follow Jesus. That's up to you. But the 'no eyewitness' thing is a loser.
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Standout [214]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
Jul 4, 2025, 11:53 PM
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You just don’t understand what first person eye witness account means.
Can’t help you with that one
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Clemson Icon [26207]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
Jul 5, 2025, 12:02 AM
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LOL! Now you're down to differentiating between a biographical account and a statement of fact by a witness in a letter? At this point, "When your opponent is self destructing, stand aside" is the best course, so I'll leave this to you. You have the last word.
You should post under your second handle, 16and18. I forget the first one. Pawprintnotfound is accurate enough.
Message was edited by: CUintulsa®
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Standout [214]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
Jul 5, 2025, 12:10 AM
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Lol admit to overstating your evidence and then exit the conversation.
Nice!
“ When your opponent is self destructing, stand aside"”
Thanks for the example 🤣
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Standout [214]
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National Champion [7300]
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Standout [214]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
1
Jul 4, 2025, 5:52 PM
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I think you might have stockholm syndrome.
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National Champion [7300]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
Jul 4, 2025, 8:35 PM
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I think you have delusions from Satan
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Standout [214]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
Jul 4, 2025, 8:36 PM
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I bet you do, that sounds crazy
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National Champion [7300]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
Jul 4, 2025, 11:11 PM
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I don't care how it sounds.
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Standout [214]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
Jul 4, 2025, 11:13 PM
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Obviously
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Clemson Icon [26207]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
Jul 4, 2025, 5:13 PM
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You have gone from denying evidence to proposing the judgement of the Creator by a 3rd grader. You're headed in the wrong direction.
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Standout [214]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
Jul 4, 2025, 5:52 PM
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Do you have an example of me denying evidence? Pointing out that we have no first-hand eyewitness claims to the DnR is a statement of fact backed by people way smarter than us. I'd love to see this supposed denial of evidence i've made.
Also, you don't have a moral repulsion to the killing of innocent children when the conflict was between Pharoah and God? Again, even a 3rd grader can see that one.
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Clemson Icon [26207]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
Jul 4, 2025, 6:07 PM
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An entire thread. We looked at first hand witnesses, you then say no first hand witnesses. Okay, carry on.
Morals are about us. Our actions can be unconstitutional, but the Constitution cannot be. Likewise, If God does a thing, it is right. If He does something one doesnt understand, the next step is to understand who He is. Whining about it will not change who He is, who one is, and how those two relate. When we face Him, "What I figured was, see, ..." will not be relevant. Even less, the objections of a 3rd grader.
You get your morals from Greta Thunberg, I take it.
Message was edited by: CUintulsa®
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Standout [214]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
Jul 4, 2025, 6:22 PM
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>An entire thread. We looked at first hand witnesses, you then say no first hand witnesses. Okay, carry on.
Incredibly dishonest but ok. Point to a single example and we can discuss it.
>You get your morals from Greta Thunberg, I take it.
If Thunberg thinks killing innocent children is wrong, then I'd agree with her. Your flagellation of third graders pointing out obvious bad character issues says way more about you.
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Clemson Icon [26207]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
Jul 5, 2025, 12:05 AM
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"Flagellation of 3rd graders"! Oh my! LOL.
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Standout [214]
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Re: Interesting discussion with my 3rd grader after watching Prince of Egypt...
Jul 5, 2025, 12:11 AM
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Curious that bothers you but slaughtering innocent children doesn’t
Those are some batchit morals
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