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All-American [596]
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Atheist for Dabo
Dec 22, 2022, 11:47 PM
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I’m not a Christian. I’m a respectful Atheist. I respect the beliefs of others and I see the value in those that find peace and compassion through their God or religion. I can argue my position but why should I try to dissuade those that believe. It would be selfish of me to try to rob them of something that gives them hope and joy. Those of you that will respond and try to save me, thank you, but no thanks. I am very happy in my life as an Atheist for reasons I won’t share here.
As an Atheist, I have no problem with Dabo centering his program around Christianity. That’s his call. All I know is that Dabo is a good man that leads a program that develops young men into outstanding citizens.
Just because I don’t share your beliefs doesn’t mean I don’t share your values. We are lucky to have Dabo leading our program. I’d rather not win championships if it means not sacrificing our values. Dabo is special. Clemson is special. Outsiders will never understand.
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All-TigerNet [10824]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 12:33 AM
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Thanks. I agree with you about Dabo. He's a tremendous leader. Merry Christmas.
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Orange Blooded [2987]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 12:33 AM
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Are you an Atheist or an Agnostic? Atheist tend to poo-poo believers in GOD, and will often be confrontational about the fact there is no GOD. Agnostic's while don't believe are often open to hear the Word, the Praise, and are very tolerant because they are not sure their beliefs are 100% accurate. Agnostic's are willing to listen to both sides in hopes that one or the other gives them the ammunition to follow whole heartedly.
Just curious if you knew the difference. I think most Christians think you are Atheist if you are not a follower but you could be in state of confusion and willingly accept stories of beliefs and faith.
Its been a general observation that could be totally inaccurate but I think anyone that is willing to accept others in religion, willing to hear the word are Agnostic and have hopes of some type of persuasion to make them committed to the gospel. And that could be any religion but most accept there to be a supreme being whether you announce as Christian or not.
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CU Guru [1381]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 2:02 AM
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Your definition of agnostic is not quite right.
Agnostics are not on the fence to be persuaded by “listening to both sides”… at least none that I know, perhaps there’s grey area of peoples beliefs
Agnostics are evidence based, and faith is basically belief without evidence. Most agnostics I know are fast to say there just might be something out there, but I seriously doubt it’s what organized religion says it is, but I don’t know, and neither do you. Most of us have searched for evidence, and found none, and the word/ praise just don’t cut it
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1st Rounder [629]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 5:45 AM
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And many of us have found our evidence.
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Associate AD [828]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 10:39 AM
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If you have found evidence, then you are saying god is measurable or observable, which would mean he is not infinite, no? Which would also mean there is no "faith."
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Team Captain [476]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 6:27 PM
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You got so much wrong in such a short post.
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Orange Blooded [3050]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 6:39 AM
[ in reply to Re: Atheist for Dabo ] |
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If you care to engage farther with this, what evidence have you searched for and what do you think it would take to convince you of the exsistance of God?
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All-Pro [672]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 7:46 AM
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*further
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All-Pro [672]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 25, 2022, 12:08 AM
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How is somebody going to thumbs down me for busting the dawgs chops for using “farther” incorrectly? Oh I get it, the dawg is a sore loser as usual.
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Hall of Famer [22278]
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Two major evidences that point to...
Dec 23, 2022, 8:25 AM
[ in reply to Re: Atheist for Dabo ] |
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... the existence of an intelligent being existing.
1. The universe exists and is amazingly precisely fine-tuned.
Two choices: Nothing took nothing and created something out of nothing. OR The universe and everything in it was created by an being who is immaterial, timeless, spaceless, powerful and intelligent. Which takes more faith to believe in?
2. Life exists and is amazingly and precisely designed. Every cell in every living being has a code (DNA) that provides information to tell each cell how to operate for the good of the rest of the cells.
Two choices: All of that happened by random chance with no intelligence directing it. (Matter + time + chance = you.) OR Life was created and designed by an intelligent being. Which takes more faith to believe in?
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Commissioner [940]
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Re: Two major evidences that point to...
Dec 23, 2022, 9:58 AM
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The explanation that includes magic.
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Orange Blooded [2155]
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Re: Two major evidences that point to...
Dec 23, 2022, 10:40 AM
[ in reply to Two major evidences that point to... ] |
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I can believe something coming from nothing more than I can believe that a being with the power to create the universe just existed.
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Orange Blooded [4365]
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Re: Two major evidences that point to...
Dec 23, 2022, 10:56 AM
[ in reply to Two major evidences that point to... ] |
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Bret,
The universe exists and all of the evidence that it provides to us points to some version of a big bang theory.
The Universe is amazingly fine tuned. 1. That is what happens when things evolve over Billions of years according to natural laws and the things that work the best in their environment are the ones that get to continue forward. 2. Perhaps the universe is not as fine tuned as you imagine. There are plenty of instances where things might be put together better than they are. The universe works well at this point in time - but it is not perfect.
Life exists and is amazingly & precisely designed. This is the same argument as above but on a more limited scale. Billions of years of evolution have led (through random mutations & what works best being the form that reproduces the most and continues forward) to the efficiency and precision that you seem to value. And again, life forms are not perfect. They continue to adapt to their changing environments through random mutation and what works.
Natural laws guide the universe and all life in it. They do not need a designer to do so.
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110%er [9028]
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Re: Two major evidences that point to...
Dec 23, 2022, 3:35 PM
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How did the stuff that evolved so perfectly get here in the first place? Something had to make the material that evolved, yes?
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All-TigerNet [10345]
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Re: Two major evidences that point to...
Dec 23, 2022, 8:10 PM
[ in reply to Re: Two major evidences that point to... ] |
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So let me get this straight. Some random #### exploded and humans and earth were magically formed? So what caused the explosion? Also seeing how no one can go back and know what happened I find this more hard to believe than anything else. BAM! Oh crap I just created an eyeball!
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Orange Blooded [3615]
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Re: Two major evidences that point to...
Dec 23, 2022, 8:56 PM
[ in reply to Re: Two major evidences that point to... ] |
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“Some version of a Big Bang” includes instantaneous creation.
In fact, the initial data from James Webb disputes the Big Bang, but evolutionary scientists are so committed to it that they have merely tweaked their model—again—without acknowledging that no amount of tweaking will resolve their contradictions.
Regarding biological evolution, evolutionists always try to portray evolution in some clinical, pristine fashion as though natural selection is a baking contest and evolution is the application of Intelligent Life. It’s not. Natural selection is very messy. And at any point, we human observers have no clue which organism (out of several possible selections) is going to produce a longer genealogical line when you consider that most organisms are extremely dependent on environmental factors. We suppose that the fittest survive when the reality may be the strongest survive, or the fastest survive, or the most virile survive, or simply the luckiest—or most divinely blessed—survive.
If significant climate change occurs on our planet, what will happen to the human race? Duh. It will survive, because some people will adapt even if whole societies don’t. Will that survival make them the fittest? Of course not, unless you redefine “fittest” after the fact.
What about homosexual relationships? For all of human existence, homosexuals have been evolutionary cul-de-sacs. But now we have developed technology that defeats biology and enables persons in homosexual relationships to procreate. So with artificial enhancements, is it possible that homosexual persons are fitter to evolve than heterosexual persons? How wise would the Evolutionary Life Force be to invest the survival of the human race in individuals who cannot reproduce naturally?
In other words, if evolution exists without a Creator, it is entirely presumptuous to describe any part of our existence—including natural laws—as successful results from any previous encounter. We all may yet be a giant evolutionary dead end. How can that be considered successful?
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Team Captain [476]
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Re: Two major evidences that point to...
Dec 23, 2022, 6:31 PM
[ in reply to Two major evidences that point to... ] |
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Bretfsu I love that you’ve doing your best to witness to them. You serve our Savior well. Sometimes we have to except that you can’t wake someone up who is pretending to be asleep.
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Associate AD [828]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 10:41 AM
[ in reply to Re: Atheist for Dabo ] |
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If you care to engage farther with this, what evidence have you searched for and what do you think it would take to convince you of the exsistance of God?
If god is infinite, there would be no measurable evidence to prove his existence.
People seeking evidence are diminishing the mere concept of god.
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Orange Blooded [4365]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 10:58 AM
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grimm,
the digits of Pi are infinite, but there is plenty of evidence for Pi.
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Associate AD [828]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 11:35 AM
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grimm,
the digits of Pi are infinite, but there is plenty of evidence for Pi.
There are many irrational numbers. We're not talking about math, we're talking about a god that is said to be omnipotent, omnibenevolent, and omniscient.
You can't find evidence for that. Once you make god "observable" you've diminished him into Q, on Star Trek Next Gen.
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Orange Blooded [4365]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 11:59 AM
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I am of the mind of Epicurus.
I think Q and god are on equal footing. They are both fictional.
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Associate AD [828]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 12:20 PM
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One of my favorite quotes!
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110%er [9028]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 3:37 PM
[ in reply to Re: Atheist for Dabo ] |
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God can indeed be infinite, it is our human abilities and intellect that are finite.
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110%er [6474]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 7:02 AM
[ in reply to Re: Atheist for Dabo ] |
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Faith is not belief without evidence. That would be the definition of "Blind faith".
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Orange Blooded [4365]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 8:04 PM
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The Oxford dictionary begs to differ
faith:
strong belief in God or in the doctrines of a religion, based on spiritual apprehension rather than proof.
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CU Guru [1047]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 8:53 AM
[ in reply to Re: Atheist for Dabo ] |
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Your definition of faith is not right. True faith is not a blind and baseless attribute. It sees the evidence and is persuaded that truth is in perfect harmony with a creator.
Unbelievers look at the same evidence and by faith except that nothing became something, and something just kept getting better till here we are. They believe by faith what men disguised as infallible scientists teaches.
We are both children of faith, just placed in two contradictory objects.
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Associate AD [828]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 10:42 AM
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Your definition of faith is not right. True faith is not a blind and baseless attribute. It sees the evidence and is persuaded that truth is in perfect harmony with a creator.
Unbelievers look at the same evidence and by faith except that nothing became something, and something just kept getting better till here we are. They believe by faith what men disguised as infallible scientists teaches.
We are both children of faith, just placed in two contradictory objects.
You are diminishing "faith".
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Orange Blooded [4365]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 10:59 AM
[ in reply to Re: Atheist for Dabo ] |
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Tator
I think that science's evidence is far more convincing that christian's - which turns out to be more assertion than evidence.
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CU Guru [1370]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 9:02 AM
[ in reply to Re: Atheist for Dabo ] |
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One translation of agnostic means ignoramus.
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CU Guru [1370]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 10:01 AM
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Look it up it’s the Greek translation
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All-American [596]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 8:47 AM
[ in reply to Re: Atheist for Dabo ] |
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I really didn’t mean to open a can of worms.
Since you asked, I would be open to anything if presented with scientific evidence. I have taken the journey to find God and came away an Atheist. I don’t see the evidence for a God, but I understand those that see it in our world and our compassion for one another. I’ve studied the Bible but I also read a lot of Richard Dawkins and Karen Armstrong. I wish others were as open to reading the opposing points of views. I know how all these religions borrowed from each other and pagan religions. I also know how the Canon was chosen. I know the Earth is at least 4 billion years old. I believe in the great flood, but I believe it took place 12,000 years ago as a result of a North American asteroid impact and led to the Younger Dryas. I believe civilization is much older than it seems. Regardless, I never try to rob others of their faith. Why take that away from people? How does that benefit them or me?
I actually raised my children in the Lutheran church out of respect for my wife. I take communion. I even “pray” with the family before meals. I don’t have any issues with God on our money or saying a prayer at a Clemson game. I keep my views to myself out of respect for others. Only my closest friends and family know where I stand. Being an Atheist in South Carolina isn’t something you advertise. I wish folks that shared my beliefs were as accepted as those who believe in a particular religion.
I try to be respectful but I do have fundamental issues with religion, particularly the institutions of Man. The Catholic Church has been responsible for a lot of good and a whole lot of bad. The same can be said of a number of religions. The hijacking of Islam is a prime example. To me, it all seems so silly and tribal. I do see value in the lessons taught in Christianity, Judaism, Buddhism and Islam. I also see value in the works of Richard Dawkins.
There is power and peace in knowing that I control my own destiny. I try to do the right thing because it’s the right thing, not fear of sin or consequences in an Afterlife.
As someone who (admittedly & foolishly) voted for Bush, Obama and Trump, I am not dogmatic in my views. If presented new evidence or a solid argument, I’m always willing to change my position.
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CU Guru [1747]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 10:22 AM
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Kinda funny you mention the afterlife. I thought atheists didn’t believe in that. In order to believe in the afterlife, you have to believe you have a soul. That soul is where God lives. You seem to be more agnostic to me, imho.
Science isn’t always exact. It can’t explain how the soul is created. Merry Christmas!! Or, Happy Holidays!!
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Orange Blooded [4365]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 12:31 PM
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vance,
Did you actually read what he said ?
"There is power and peace in knowing that I control my own destiny. I try to do the right thing because it’s the right thing, not fear of sin or consequences in an Afterlife."
He is referencing YOUR unsupported belief in an afterlife - not his own.
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Orange Blooded [4365]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 11:02 AM
[ in reply to Re: Atheist for Dabo ] |
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I think Isaac Asimov said it best.
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CU Guru [1534]
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How do you establish that something is "the right thing"
Dec 23, 2022, 4:04 PM
[ in reply to Re: Atheist for Dabo ] |
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What if my right thing is your wrong thing? Ultimately that can only be decided by war, correct?
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Orange Blooded [4365]
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Re: How do you establish that something is "the right thing"
Dec 23, 2022, 8:06 PM
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Td
Well we could discuss it first - to see if logic and evidence supports one of our positions better than the other, no ?
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Orange Blooded [2053]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 4:10 PM
[ in reply to Re: Atheist for Dabo ] |
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I'm an agnostic atheist. So where does that put me?
> Atheist tend to poo-poo believers in GOD, and will often be confrontational about the fact there is no GOD
No they don't, there are just some really loud, annoying ones. For example, I only ever talk about it in specific forums where the topic has come up or (rarely) if it comes up in conversation.
I never bring it up outside that specific context. Most atheists don't think about it all. It's the same as not believing in ghosts. You just don't think about it, you don't pester your neighbor about believing in them.
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Orange Blooded [4365]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 8:07 PM
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Atheist are far less in your face than christians.
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110%er [9028]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 6:51 AM
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Love leads what Dabo does. Love for his family, love for the kids, teaching the players to love each other and love for watching the process of development of young boys into men of character.
Love crosses all religious boundaries and affiliations. That's why what Dabo does is different from many other "Christian" coaches.
Message was edited by: 1portroyalty®
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CU Guru [1370]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 9:22 AM
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Love is just one fruit of the spirit, there are many! But without Christ it is just human duty and feeling! It’s the life in Christ that gives us the ability to have true love as defined by the Father. Remember, if you are a Christian then a death in your old life (Just like Christ) must have occurred, not daily as I hear so much from most preachers, but once and for all , because Christ died once not over and over again. But end the end It is His spirit of Life (from the resurrection) that Lives in these mortal bodies, that gives us the ability to truly love because everything else is fleeting.
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Orange Blooded [4365]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 11:03 AM
[ in reply to Re: Atheist for Dabo ] |
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If Dabo wants to interject love into his program - and promote human love's power - then why does he have to keep bringing up god instead of love ??
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110%er [6474]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 7:00 AM
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You are the type atheist that I have absolutely no problem with. I am of a Calvinistic leaning I believe it is my responsibility to share The Gospel with you one time and then leave you alone about it. You seem that you are confident in your position to the point that you see no real need to try to convert others to that point of view. I used to work with an atheist similar to how I perceived you to be. We were very good friends. He did not mind if our SWAT team prayed before raids. He even participated. He would often say "My hoppy is golf. Your hobby is Christianity. I waste time on golf. You ware time on Christianity. You don't mind me talking about golf and I don't mind you talking about Jesus. You don't mind me inviting you to play golf and I don't mind you inviting me to church."
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Orange Blooded [3034]
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Some of my best friends
Dec 23, 2022, 7:12 AM
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Are atheists.
Go Tigers
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Orange Blooded [3839]
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Jews for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 7:23 AM
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We are lucky to have Dabo leading our program. I’d rather not win championships if it means not sacrificing our values. Dabo is special. Clemson is special. Outsiders will never understand.
GO TIGERS KICK DAT HOUND!
Happy Hanukkah!
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All-In [27371]
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Re: Jews for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 7:44 AM
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I think science has proven that the world and man has been around a lot longer than many believe. There is much more evidence to prove man has been around for thousand and thousands of year. Long before Noah!
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Orange Blooded [4365]
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Re: Jews for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 12:28 PM
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thousands ???
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All-In [27371]
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Re: Jews for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 7:08 PM
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Actually millions!
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All-TigerNet [12864]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 8:10 AM
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What an excellent post.
Happy holidays to you!
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Hall of Famer [24056]
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One of my favorite sayings was “There are no atheists in a
Dec 23, 2022, 8:27 AM
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foxhole.”
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Orange Blooded [4365]
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Re: One of my favorite sayings was “There are no atheists in a
Dec 23, 2022, 11:08 AM
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Bill,
That is a canard. There are plenty of atheists serving honorably in our Armed Forces - always have been.
http://militaryatheists.org/about/
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Orange Blooded [3050]
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Re: One of my favorite sayings was “There are no atheists in a
Dec 23, 2022, 11:23 AM
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You're a smart guy Tobias. You know that's not the point he's making.
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Orange Blooded [4365]
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Re: One of my favorite sayings was “There are no atheists in a
Dec 23, 2022, 11:53 AM
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G-dawg,
Maybe I'm not as smart as you. What IS his point ??
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Orange Blooded [3050]
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Re: One of my favorite sayings was “There are no atheists in a
Dec 23, 2022, 12:05 PM
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The point isn't that there are no proclaimed athiests in the military. The point is at the moment of our greatest distress, be that a foxhole or distress in some other facet of life, we will cry out to God.
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Associate AD [828]
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Re: One of my favorite sayings was “There are no atheists in a
Dec 23, 2022, 12:17 PM
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The point isn't that there are no proclaimed athiests in the military. The point is at the moment of our greatest distress, be that a foxhole or distress in some other facet of life, we will cry out to God.
I've always thought it should be, "there are only agnostics in foxholes," because nobody cares how their butts get pulled out of there, as long as they get out. Bet as many call out for their mothers.
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Orange Blooded [4365]
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110%er [6474]
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Re: One of my favorite sayings was “There are no atheists in a
Dec 23, 2022, 9:33 PM
[ in reply to Re: One of my favorite sayings was “There are no atheists in a ] |
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Some do and some don't. Great distress and anguish will drive the elect to God. The same distress and anguish will further harden the non elect against Him.
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110%er [9028]
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The last thing I'll say on this. Many believers, feel that
Dec 23, 2022, 8:35 AM
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when our cosmology, the existence of God or our religious practices (or lack of) are questioned, that God needs defending.
He doesn't.
We're just insecure in our beliefs. Dabo isn't. He isn't insisting (as dar as I know, then I'd have problem) that players believe like him or practice like him.
He focuses on loving each other. Period.
To all of you (even bored coots and dawgs) - I wish you Merry Christmas, happy Hanukkah, merry Kwanza or happy time off - peace and grace to all.
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Legend [19900]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 9:18 AM
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Thank you for your kind post.
The responses and thoughts that were stirred are commendable and motivated me to share as well.
Your username juxtaposed with a book I just re-read yesterday by Richard Bach. It's a short, fun, and mystically tantalizing story!
I hope you will take the time to find it...it's my thought that you will enjoy it as I did;
ILLUSIONS
The Adventures of a Reluctant Messiah
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Orange Blooded [3466]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 9:36 AM
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Happy in this life, but what about the next one?!
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Associate AD [828]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 10:48 AM
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Happy in this life, but what about the next one?!
When I die, they'll put me in the ground and the worms will eat me. The End.
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Orange Blooded [4365]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 11:11 AM
[ in reply to Re: Atheist for Dabo ] |
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Flat,
Life after death, like so many religious assertions, is supported by zero evidence.
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Orange Blooded [2053]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 4:12 PM
[ in reply to Re: Atheist for Dabo ] |
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Sadly, there doesn't appear to be one. That's what makes this one so important and beautiful.
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110%er [5095]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 9:52 AM
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I appreciate your honesty and openness. Even us Christians have questions about the spiritual journey they are on. I encourage non believers to take a look at the Bible. If the Bible is not real then I think we can assume it was put together by someone who intended it for evil. Why would a evil person write a book that teaches us to live a life of love and peace? Why would a person that is good just make it all up? The stories the Bible teaches are so unique that I don't believe could be made up.
It was wrote thousands of years ago. It was wrote in such a way that it leaves little doubt about the existence of Jesus Christ.
Merry Christmas everyone.
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Orange Blooded [4365]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 11:12 AM
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newnan,
How do you make the leap from the Bible not being real to it had to be created for evil purposes. There are at least a dozen other feasible possibilities.
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110%er [5095]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 1:02 PM
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Some people don't believe the Bible is real. I was trying to make the point that if it's made up then what would be the reason?
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Associate AD [828]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 12:58 PM
[ in reply to Re: Atheist for Dabo ] |
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Why would a evil person write a book that teaches us to live a life of love and peace? Why would a person that is good just make it all up? The stories the Bible teaches are so unique that I don't believe could be made up.
It was wrote thousands of years ago. It was wrote in such a way that it leaves little doubt about the existence of Jesus Christ.
It was less "written" than "assembled" by church elders (and Popes) over the years, as a guide to keeping the flock in order. It needs to be considered as more of a historical/literary document than divine one. And, of course, why discount the books that weren't included in what is now considered the Bible. (The Gnostic Gospels, etc.)
A book on paper is not proof of the existence of JC any more than Action Comics #1 is proof of the existence of Superman.
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Walk-On [127]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 10:19 AM
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Agreed. I'm agnostic myself, but respect others belief if it leads them to a good life. Dabo talks the
talk but he also seems to walk the walk, unlike some hypocritical "Christians" (Tommy Bowden comes to mind). As long as the requirements are to be a good person and don't mandate a specific religion, I'm fine with it.
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All-In [25943]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 10:28 AM
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Sorry to hear about you agnostic and atheist folks. However, it is my true belief that if you are lying on your deathbed and are conscious, you will pray. Remember this, even atheist don't name their children Judas. Also, Christians cannot save people. Only Jesus Christ cab do that. However, we can lead them to him. Merry Christmas and a safe New Year.
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Orange Blooded [4365]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 11:14 AM
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2000,
Your belief does not make it so.
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Associate AD [828]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 12:14 PM
[ in reply to Re: Atheist for Dabo ] |
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Sorry to hear about you agnostic and atheist folks. However, it is my true belief that if you are lying on your deathbed and are conscious, you will pray. Remember this, even atheist don't name their children Judas. Also, Christians cannot save people. Only Jesus Christ cab do that. However, we can lead them to him. Merry Christmas and a safe New Year.
No need for Christians to be so condescending.
Don't worry, when I'm on my deathbed, I suddenly won't change my world view. What value would it have if it could be swayed so easily in a difficult time.
Even atheists don't name their children Judas. ##### does that even mean? They don't name them "Adolf," either.
Happy Holidays!
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Orange Blooded [4365]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 10:44 AM
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Reality
I think that you, as an atheist, realize that Dabo could teach our young athletes quality values without interjecting his mythological beliefs into that teaching.
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All-American [596]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 11:21 AM
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Reality
I think that you, as an atheist, realize that Dabo could teach our young athletes quality values without interjecting his mythological beliefs into that teaching.
The players that come to Clemson to play for Dabo know who he is and what he believes. I’m sure some lean more to my side of things. It doesn’t change his values. That is what makes the man special. If he were a full of garbage or hypocritical Christian, I would struggle to support him as I do. You have to admire his (and others) faith even if it seems somewhat archaic from my point of view. Of course his faith in DJU may have cost us a title shot. I respect him for caring about a kid that gave Clemson everything he could. I think he genuinely loves his players and sometime love blinds us.
I believe we all can share good values without necessarily sharing the same beliefs.
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Orange Blooded [4365]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 11:51 AM
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Reality
I agree that we can share values without having to share beliefs, but I am concerned that if Dabo truly believes that - then why would he say, to the national press, that Clemson Football was built in god's image. Why wouldn't he say something about mentoring your people and putting our values first in our program.
I am NOT so sure that non-christians kids are being recruited and treated the same as the christian kids. For many years I have sublimated my religious concerns with your faith that Dabo was doing right by all of his kids. But when he makes a statement like he just did, it makes it harder for me to put aside my concerns. Do you have any evidence that might help me make my peace with Dabo's overt christianity ?
Finally, if Dabo allowed his "love" for DJ to start the 2nd best QB, then he played favorites and by doing so rejected his responsibility to the rest of his players. Is it possible that he might make similar choices between his religious and non-religious players ? Is it possible ?
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Associate AD [828]
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Well said, Tobias!
Dec 23, 2022, 12:32 PM
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And people like to forget we aren't Liberty or BJU, we are a state university.
I like to share this story because it always amuses me. While my parents raised me in the church and even sent me to church schools through 3rd grade (and I never had a single bad experience in either), the god concept never sat well with me. I remember just in Junior High I was going through confirmation classes and said that I didn't want to do it. I was given the choice - get confirmed in the church or write every living relative saying why I was not. Going through the process seemed like the path of least resistance.
Jump forward to 9th grade. I was the youngest person in my class, a year less mature, and a complete dork. One day I was sitting in the hall waiting for my next class. A cheerleader (!) stopped in front of me and started actually speaking to me. I couldn't believe it. Was I suddenly cool? She reached down with a piece of paper and said, "I think you might like to come to this." She could have invited me to an Amway meeting and I would have happily said yes. I mean, I had no self confidence whatsoever. I was a fat little kid with low self esteem.
Anyway, I glanced at the paper and it was for a bible study group. I don't know where the strength came over me, but I handed the paper back and said, "no thanks, I'm an atheist." Now, I grew up in Greenville. I might as well confessed to being a serial killer. And that was knocking me off the cheerleader list forever. But it was my declaration of independence. And I've never been afraid to tell anyone, ever since.
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Orange Blooded [4365]
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Re: Well said, Tobias!
Dec 23, 2022, 3:27 PM
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Grimm,
I have a similar story although there is no cheerleader in mine. I was raised in the Lutheran church and went through Confirmation. However, in the next year we had a missionary come to our Sunday School class. They showed us slides of them giving a new Ford tractor to a African village - and the increase of crops the next year - and all of the Bibles that they gave out.
So I raised my hand and asked, "you guys used a Ford tractor (which the natives had never seen before)_ to increase their crop yield 10x - then you told them it was all a part of god's bounty - and then you converted them to christianity. Why not convert then to Fordism instead ?
That was pretty much the end of my involvement with the Lutheran Church - and religion in general.
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Associate AD [828]
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Re: Well said, Tobias!
Dec 23, 2022, 3:36 PM
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LOL - great story!
Funny as I was also raised Lutheran. We were Missouri Synod, before they went off the deep end into speaking in tongues, et. al.
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All-In [27301]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 12:34 PM
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Because you consciously capitalized the g in God, I can only assume you were once a Christian and have turned from God. Remember He is waiting with open arms for you brother. Merry Christmas.
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CU Guru [1669]
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Re: Atheist for Dabo
Dec 23, 2022, 3:40 PM
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Your maturity and respectfulness are appreciated, and somewhat unique in today’s environment (especially social media).
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Orange Blooded [2594]
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Wow. This is really deep.
Dec 23, 2022, 7:26 PM
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I appreciate the discussion tho.
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Orange Blooded [3462]
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Reality 2003 thank you for that post
Dec 23, 2022, 8:15 PM
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I am a Christian and I found your post very thoughtful. While I may disagree with Atheists on theological issues, there is so much more that I agree with Atheists on. But yeah Dabo is doing what he believes is right. We need more of that.
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