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Paw Master [17275]
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She’s a Supreme Court justice for god’s sake.
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Jul 6, 2023, 7:52 PM
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“For high-risk Black newborns, having a Black physician more than doubles the likelihood that the baby will live, and not die,” she wrote.
Frank responded to the argument in his Journal opinion piece: "A moment’s thought should be enough to realize that this claim is wildly implausible. Imagine if 40% of black newborns died—thousands of dead infants every week. But even so, that’s a 60% survival rate, which is mathematically impossible to double. And the actual survival rate is over 99%."
Will I say it????? Yes. Our country is a joke. Spooneye will be here soon to support her argument.
https://www.foxnews.com/media/kentanji-brown-jackson-made-mathematically-absurd-claim-black-newborns-wsj-op-ed
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Varsity [104]
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Hey she checked the same boxes as Kamala
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Jul 6, 2023, 7:54 PM
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Clemson Conqueror [11572]
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Re: She’s a Supreme Court justice for god’s sake.
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Jul 6, 2023, 8:01 PM
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KBJ has a very good voice but a very bad brain.
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Orange Immortal [65679]
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Pathetic.***
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Jul 6, 2023, 8:03 PM
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Orange Blooded [3230]
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Re: She’s a Supreme Court justice for god’s sake.
Jul 6, 2023, 8:20 PM
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A lot of people believing in absurd conspiracy theories in this country right now.
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Paw Warrior [5016]
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Re: She’s a Supreme Court justice for god’s sake.
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Jul 6, 2023, 8:28 PM
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She checked a box.
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Orange Blooded [3230]
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Re: She’s a Supreme Court justice for god’s sake.
Jul 6, 2023, 8:30 PM
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We will probably both be dead before she steps down one day.
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Paw Warrior [5016]
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Re: She’s a Supreme Court justice for god’s sake.
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Jul 6, 2023, 8:35 PM
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That’s a scary thought especially if we get a few more like her.
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Paw Master [16247]
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Re: She’s a Supreme Court justice for god’s sake.
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Jul 6, 2023, 8:42 PM
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So black doctors are smarter than other doctors?
Are non black doctors racists who withhold care thereby allowing black infants to die?
What an ignorant statement for a Supreme Court justice to make.
If that’s all she had to support the continuation of affirmative action, it’s no wonder the Court ruled as it did.
I do not believe blacks are intrinsically intellectually inferior to others. I do not believe Asians are intrinsically intellectually superior to others.
High achievement begins early, begins at home.
To try to even things up at the college level is not a strategy to change the root causes of poor academic achievement by blacks and Hispanics.
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Orange Immortal [65679]
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And if we're talking about root causes, nobody dares to
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Jul 6, 2023, 9:32 PM
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mention the role that poor choices or bad behaviors play. Those are things people themselves have the power to change, but I guess it's easier to blame others, and accept the victimhood.
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Associate AD [831]
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Re: And if we're talking about root causes, nobody dares to
Jul 10, 2023, 3:44 PM
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mention the role that poor choices or bad behaviors play. Those are things people themselves have the power to change, but I guess it's easier to blame others, and accept the victimhood.
Smiling Tiger®
Can I suggest that you read some of the articles that were posted down in the scroll. I want to give you the benefit of the doubt, as opposed to some of the knuckleheads on here. But to blame "poor choices" and "bad habits" and "blaming others" suggest that you think that black Americans are causing their own high maternal mortality.
Part of why this has gotten attention now is Tori Owen, a 32-year-old Olympic sprinter, just died after giving birth. As the research has shown (if you looked at it instead of just joining Keeowee's pile-on) you would read that those trends are regardless of income or education level.
FWIW, US maternal deaths across the whole population have (as this link shows) doubled in the last twenty years. That's a deplorable fact. We have maternal mortality rates higher than our western peer countries. That it is far worse in some segments of the population doesn't made it the fault of those victims.
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/health/u-s-maternal-deaths-more-than-doubled-over-20-years-heres-who-fared-the-worst
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Orange Immortal [65679]
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Re: And if we're talking about root causes, nobody dares to
Jul 10, 2023, 7:48 PM
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My comments had zero to do with maternal mortality. I was not responding to the OP about maternal mortality, I was responding directly to ron's post, mainly addressing his comments:
I do not believe blacks are intrinsically intellectually inferior to others. I do not believe Asians are intrinsically intellectually superior to others.
High achievement begins early, begins at home.
To try to even things up at the college level is not a strategy to change the root causes of poor academic achievement by blacks and Hispanics.
That's what I was getting at. There are reasons for the disparity in outcomes that have nothing to do with racism or oppression, and addressing those things would have a big positive impact.
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Associate AD [831]
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Re: And if we're talking about root causes, nobody dares to
Jul 11, 2023, 10:19 PM
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Do you blame other people for your bad choices? Is that why you project this on people you don't know?
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Paw Warrior [5016]
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Re: She’s a Supreme Court justice for god’s sake.
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Jul 6, 2023, 9:33 PM
[ in reply to Re: She’s a Supreme Court justice for god’s sake. ] |
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Your last sentence is spot on. I have not heard it stated that way. That needs to be embraced by those who truly want things to improve for minorities.
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Associate AD [831]
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Paw Master [16247]
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Re: She’s a Supreme Court justice for god’s sake.
Jul 11, 2023, 1:53 PM
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There are a number of things that I agree with in the article. I do agree with the fact that sometimes sharing a common culture may be beneficial with a physician to patient interaction. I found that out dealing with an Asian surgeon who took care of my grandfather. I basically had to get aggressive with him to get him to spit it out that my grandfather had cancer. In some Asian cultures, there is a stigma associated with a cancer diagnosis. Go figure.
I would like to see people of all races well represented in all the professions provided they are well qualified. The article stated,"This is not a problem we can fix in a couple of years. This is the work of generations." The article further stated,"Those seeds get planted early on in grade school."
I could not agree more with those two statements.
I would need to see how the statistic of having a 10% increase in black primary care physicians, essentially equals 1 extra month of longevity, was determined. Even if true, that seems a rather negligible result. In 2022, black life expectancy was 71 years(852 months). So that extra month for a 10% increase in black primary care physicians was a .1% increase in life expectancy.I can think of a host of other changes that would have far more beneficial effects.
The article stated rather inelegantly,"The higher the representation of black physicians in the workforce per county was associated less death of any cause for county residents, Black and White. Thus, even people not actively being treated by Black physicians benefitted from their presence like the results published in JAMA in April 2023."
If the above paragraph is to be believed, all physicians should be black. I fail to grasp how I would possibly benefit from a black, yellow, brown, red, white or green physician who is not directly involved in the delivery of my health care. Their mere presence in my community means nothing to my good health.
Again, Justice Jackson presented data essentially stating that black pregnant females would greatly benefit from having a black physician. 85% of OB-GYN doctors are female and the average age is 43. So, I guess a black person just intrinsically is a better fit?
We will have more black physicians when education is pushed hard by black parents and reading, math and science are pushed early and often in K-elementary school first and then beyond. There are no shortcuts to get more black physicians in the pipeline and having more black physicians while a reasonable goal is no panacea for improving black health care.
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Associate AD [831]
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Re: She’s a Supreme Court justice for god’s sake.
Jul 11, 2023, 10:25 PM
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And we will have fewer black physicians because of the recent Supreme Court decision.
Blaming black parents when systemic oppression has denied educational opportunities to the black community is pretty sad.
If systemic oppression lands black children (regardless of their capabilities) in substandard schools, would you not want them to be given better access to opportunities that would allow them to an education that meets their actual skills.
Do you think the 10%/1 month statistic is meaningless to you because you aren't black?
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Paw Master [16247]
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Re: She’s a Supreme Court justice for god’s sake.
Jul 12, 2023, 11:08 AM
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And we will have fewer black physicians because of the recent Supreme Court decision.
Blaming black parents when systemic oppression has denied educational opportunities to the black community is pretty sad.
If systemic oppression lands black children (regardless of their capabilities) in substandard schools, would you not want them to be given better access to opportunities that would allow them to an education that meets their actual skills.
Do you think the 10%/1 month statistic is meaningless to you because you aren't black?
Chris--We'll just have to agree to disagree. I prefer school choice to allow kids of all races better access to good schools rather than continuing to rig college and med school admissions.
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Associate AD [831]
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Re: She’s a Supreme Court justice for god’s sake.
Jul 12, 2023, 11:11 AM
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School choice is great for people with generations of family wealth. People with ancestors who did not have the same opportunities to accumulate wealth and family assets? Not so much.
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National Champion [7728]
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Re: She’s a Supreme Court justice for god’s sake.
Jul 12, 2023, 11:16 AM
[ in reply to Re: She’s a Supreme Court justice for god’s sake. ] |
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The leftists who control education at every level in this country are more concerned about indoctrinating kids to be "proud" of who they have sex with than they are teaching them to read write or do math and the proof is in the test results which indicate HS graduates are less literate than ever. One would think that if the left really cared about educating minorities they would make sure they had the best educational opportunities, when the opposite is actually the case. The lefts perfectly content to churn out entire school districts of illiterate minority graduates, then cry and blame those evil Republicans when those kids can't get into college or get a decent job. Good thing their voters are the morons they were educated to be.
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National Champion [7728]
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Re: She’s a Supreme Court justice for god’s sake.
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Jul 6, 2023, 9:22 PM
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Shes the lefts ideal judge. Knows nothing about the law, shes black AND female, and believes in easily disproven conspiracy theories about black babies being killed by white doctors. Seems pretty obvious shes confusing black mothers receiving actual pre and post natal care with what happens at Planned Parenthood clinics which is responsible for the loss of more black lives than literally every other cause combined over the last 50 years. But she obviously has no problem with that fine insittution whatsoever. Moron.
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Clemson Conqueror [11572]
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Re: She’s a Supreme Court justice for god’s sake.
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Jul 7, 2023, 9:09 AM
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What is a black woman, though?
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Game Changer [1818]
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Re: She’s a Supreme Court justice for god’s sake.
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Jul 10, 2023, 12:08 PM
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No sure if she is woman since she said she doesn't know what a female is but yet she is black.
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Ultimate Tiger [36212]
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Re: She’s a Supreme Court justice for god’s sake.
Jul 7, 2023, 7:47 AM
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Will I say it????? Yes. Our country is a joke. Spooneye will be here soon to support her argument.
No, I took care of it in a different thread (link below). I don't blame you for thinking the math was crazy, because I did for a second, too. Then I took a second look at what the Justice really said.
https://www.tigernet.com/clemson-forum/message/i-think-i-found-it-32990824
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Paw Master [17275]
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So, it’s just regular absurd; not mathematically absurd.
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Jul 7, 2023, 8:04 AM
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Got it.
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Ultimate Tiger [36212]
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Nope, not absurd at all, and it might be correct.
Jul 7, 2023, 8:14 AM
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The op-ed was written by someone with poor reading comprehension, assuming (as I do) that they weren't misleading the readers intentionally.
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Paw Master [17275]
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It’s SCOTUS; it needs better than “might be correct”
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Jul 7, 2023, 8:22 AM
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A Supreme Court justice was attempting to mislead readers with made up bs, and a writer mislead readers because he couldn’t decipher her made up stats.
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Ultimate Tiger [36212]
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No, now you're misreading me.
Jul 7, 2023, 8:41 AM
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She cited a study. Studies are always subject to correction and criticism. Justices cite studies all the time, even the Justices you probably agree with. No study is immune from criticism, so there is no getting beyond "might be correct." But when I said "might be correct," I was saying that personally I don't know how good or bad that particular study was.
And by the way, that's why Justices agree and disagree with each other. Opinions aren't "correct," either. That's why they're called opinions and not facts.
To get back to the topic at hand: You seem to not understand why the op-ed was mistaken, and if you don't, then go back and re-read my initial response.
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Clemson Conqueror [11572]
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Re: No, now you're misreading me.
Jul 7, 2023, 10:23 AM
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It is important for a SCOTUS to actually read the study.
In KBJ’s case, she also needs for her staff to tell her how to interpret and summarize the study.
Either KJB’s staff is no good, or KJB is, well, …
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Ultimate Tiger [36212]
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Re: No, now you're misreading me.
Jul 7, 2023, 10:26 AM
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What makes you think she didn't read the study? What did she get wrong about it? I already pointed out the error in the op-ed's criticism of the Justice.
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Ultimate Tiger [35065]
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I thought you were a Trump supporter...
Jul 7, 2023, 8:20 AM
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meaning you support wildly inaccurate claims as a standard means of argument, right?
And, before you say it, I think her claims are stupid and should be called so...it just strikes me that you're pretty selective in criticizing stupid statements.
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Paw Master [17275]
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Trump’s policies vs Biden’s. Anymore dumb questions?***
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Jul 7, 2023, 8:26 AM
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Ultimate Tiger [35065]
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And you slamming all of Trump's stupid statements are...
Jul 7, 2023, 8:42 AM
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where exactly?
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Paw Master [17275]
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No need, plenty of you on here to handle that.
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Jul 7, 2023, 8:48 AM
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I was the first to slam hers. If someone else had, I would’ve moved on to the next public disgrace.
I’m like welfare; I only go where I’m needed.
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Ultimate Tiger [36212]
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Ultimate Tiger [35065]
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Orange Blooded [2058]
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Game Changer [1818]
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Re: Trump’s policies vs Biden’s. Anymore dumb questions?***
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Jul 10, 2023, 12:10 PM
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Yes policies that were pro American. You're Democrat your man Biden has China Russia policies. Obama had Iran and Soros policies no pro American ones.
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Associate AD [831]
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Paw Master [16247]
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Re: She’s a Supreme Court justice for god’s sake.
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Jul 7, 2023, 10:00 AM
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There's so much in that article that is rubbish. If one is to accept everything in this article, then we should immediately fast track admissions for black medical students to take care of not only high risk pregnant women, but blacks in general.
Since racism is so ingrained in medicine, perhaps we need to return to segregation so blacks can get the best care?
I especially was interested in this: "Some health care providers still hold false beliefs about biological differences between Black and white people, such as Black people having "less sensitive nerve endings, thicker skin and stronger bones." Those beliefs have caused medical providers today to rate Black patients' pain lower, and recommend less relief."
Is a link provided to show who thinks this way? I started and finished medical school over 40 years ago and never once heard anyone express such a stupid statement even then. Maybe there's a cretin or two who thinks that way, but that's just a stupid point to bring up.
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Orange Blooded [2058]
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Re: She’s a Supreme Court justice for god’s sake.
Jul 7, 2023, 10:24 AM
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Let's start from the beginning before you start ranting.
Do you even accept the claim that black women receive poorer care?
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Paw Master [16247]
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Re: She’s a Supreme Court justice for god’s sake.
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Jul 7, 2023, 11:10 AM
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I will acknowledge that black women, black men and black children have poorer health outcomes overall than whites.
I will acknowledge that white women, white men and white children from Appalachia have poorer health outcomes than whites from better economic environments.
I will acknowledge that those with obesity, those with poorly controlled diabetes or poorly controlled blood pressure of all races have poorer outcomes than those who are not obese, those that have controlled diabetes and those whose blood pressure is controlled. All of those conditions are more common in blacks.
There are a myriad of reasons why blacks have poorer health outcomes than whites and why black women have more high risk pregnancies than whites and poorer outcomes than whites when having a high risk pregnancy, but I don't believe racism is the main factor or even a major factor in why that is so.
People of all races without insurance receive poorer health care. Poor people of all races delay health care as it is expensive. This affects black people more as there are more poor blacks than whites.
The college educated black women that had poorer outcomes with their high risk pregnancies as mentioned in the article when compared to white college educated women with high risk pregnancies is due then to racism or were these outcomes stratified on the basis of obesity, glucose levels, blood pressure and numbers of prenatal visits?
There's no doubt that some blacks mistrust the medical community based on past heinous experiments and surgeries performed on blacks.
We offered periodically free PSA testing and digital rectal exams to men and in particular the outreach was to black men who have higher rates of prostate cancer, get it earlier and have more aggressive prostate cancers as a whole.
The response despite advertising this on "black" radio stations, in the newspaper and even enlisting black ministers to push this was very disappointing. We mostly got white guys who already had a doctor to come in.
I don't believe many health care providers knowingly or even subconsciously treat blacks, Hispanics or poor whites any differently once they are seen.
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Ultimate Tiger [33157]
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Re: She’s a Supreme Court justice for god’s sake.
Jul 7, 2023, 12:37 PM
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Wait a minute now, you were supposed to say 'black health care baaaad. White health care gooood,' while drooling a little bit.
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Associate AD [831]
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Clemson Sports Icon [52883]
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Ohh give her a break. She can't even define what a
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Jul 7, 2023, 9:59 AM
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"Woman" is.
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All-Time Great [90578]
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"Our country is a joke."
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Jul 7, 2023, 10:23 AM
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Perhaps you should join ConpiracyTom in moving to another country that you don't consider "a joke"?
If I hated somewhere as much as you too seem to profess hating America, I'd leave. Why would you stay somewhere that is "a joke"?
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TigerNet Immortal [176659]
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It might be a good joke.***
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Jul 7, 2023, 11:11 AM
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Ultimate Tiger [33157]
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Re: It might be a good joke.***
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Jul 7, 2023, 3:43 PM
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If our country were a joke, comparatively speaking, I think it would be pretty funny and slightly dirty.
Netherlands - funny and definitely dirty.
Russia - very dark humor
France - it would only be funny if you're French.
Israel - kosher
Saudi Arabia - extremely dry
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Paw Master [17275]
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Uggh…let me break it down for you, again.
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Jul 8, 2023, 9:29 AM
[ in reply to "Our country is a joke." ] |
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I love the Clemson Tigers, but our offense has been a joke for two years. Got it?
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All-Time Great [90578]
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You have a strange sense of humor.***
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Jul 10, 2023, 9:42 AM
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Game Changer [1818]
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All-Time Great [90578]
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Ok..Biden sucks.
Jul 10, 2023, 1:13 PM
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Why not say that? Why say the whole country is a "joke"?
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Orange Blooded [2058]
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Re: She’s a Supreme Court justice for god’s sake.
Jul 7, 2023, 10:23 AM
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>Will I say it????? Yes. Our country is a joke
Well, we won't miss you when you leave.
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Paw Master [16247]
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Legend [6877]
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Re: She’s a Supreme Court justice for god’s sake.
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Jul 8, 2023, 9:50 AM
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Exactly! But the leftists can't be bothered with such minor details as knowing how to conduct a valid statistical study and control for important parameters.
Their science is 140 characters deep. No more or they might have to actually understand something which is out of the question.
Typical, but pathetic.
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Clemson Conqueror [11572]
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Re: She’s a Supreme Court justice for god’s sake.
Jul 9, 2023, 2:19 PM
[ in reply to Re: She’s a Supreme Court justice for god’s sake. ] |
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Whoopi’s Goldberg once cited on The View …
Goldberg began, “I’m hoping Dr. Jill becomes the surgeon general, his wife.”
“Joe Biden’s wife. She would never do it but, yeah, she’s a hell of a doctor. She’s an amazing doctor,” she went on, earning some scattered applause from the audience.
For TNet’s uninformed lefties (recognizing that uninformed is a redundancy), ‘Doctor’ Jill Biden has Ph.D in Education.
KBJ is taking her cognitive cues from another prominent American black woman that speaks very well, but isn’t too swift in the thinking department.
‘Joe Biden’s SCOTUS pick. She’s an amazing scrotum.’
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Clemson Conqueror [11368]
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If you have an equal number of high-risk black newborns
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Jul 8, 2023, 11:57 AM
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having a white physician as having a black physician. And of those newborns, 2 died that were treated by the white physician and 1 died that was treated by a black physician - you could possibly conclude that having a black physician doubles the likelihood that the baby will live.
But it doesn't prove anything.
I looked around a bit, but I couldn't find the specific study she cited.
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Ultimate Tiger [36212]
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Associate AD [831]
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Re: If you have an equal number of high-risk black newborns
Jul 10, 2023, 1:10 PM
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This is a subject is getting a lot of coverage.
It is fascinating how one Tnutter will make a dopey post on the matter and the rest of them follow like lemmings rather than actually trying to look into what's actually going on.
https://www.npr.org/2023/07/05/1186019422/the-black-maternal-mortality-crisis-and-why-it-remains-an-issue The Black Maternal Mortality Crisis and Why it Remains an Issue : Consider This from NPR The U.S. has the worst maternal mortality rate of high-income countries globally, and the numbers have only grown. According to a new study published in JAMA, the Journal of the American Medical Association – maternal death rates remain the highest among Black women, and those high rates have more than doubled over the last twenty years.When compared to white women, Black women are more than twice as likely to experience severe pregnancy-related complications, and nearly three times as likely to die. And that increased rate of death has remained about the same since the U.S. began tracking maternal mortality rates nationally — in the 1930s. We trace the roots of these health disparities back to the 18th century to examine how racism influenced science and medicine - and contributed to medical stereotypes about Black people that still exist today.And NPR's Scott Detrow speaks with Karen Sheffield-Abdullah, a nurse midwife and professor of nursing at the University of North Carolina - Chapel Hill, about how to improve maternal health outcomes for Black women.In participating regions, you'll also hear a local news segment to help you make sense of what's going on in your community.Email us at considerthis@npr.org.
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Associate AD [831]
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Paw Master [16247]
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Re: If you have an equal number of high-risk black newborns
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Jul 10, 2023, 5:48 PM
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One more thing. If racism or racial stereotypes is the driving force behind the poor outcomes among black pregnant women that must be because OB-GYN physicians are older racist men?
Except that’s not true. 85% of OB-GYN physicians are women and the average age is 43.That’s so disgusting that we have all these non caring young racist women taking care of other women.
Racism still exists, but it is not the cause of every malady affecting blacks.
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Paw Master [16247]
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Re: If you have an equal number of high-risk black newborns
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Jul 10, 2023, 5:00 PM
[ in reply to Re: If you have an equal number of high-risk black newborns ] |
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I read this article. No one is disputing that black pregnant women are having worse outcomes than white pregnant women, but in 2023 I don’t see any proof that racism or racial stereotypes are the reason for this.
Where are the statistics on obesity rates, hypertension rates, diabetes rates and prenatal visit rates of black pregnant women compared to White pregnant women?
There can be no doubt that racism has been a factor in disparate health outcomes in the past, but to ascribe the current situation to racism is not in my opinion an honest attempt to define the why of these poor outcomes.
I do not know the particulars of the death of the former Olympic athlete. However, anecdotal stories prove nothing on a grand scale.
I’m not convinced that having an all black OB-GYN and nursing staff would drastically reduce the maternal death rate in blacks.
There are a host of higher mortality numbers in blacks over whites, but if the goal is to blame it on racism whether overt or subconscious, then we will continue to see more blacks having heart attacks, strokes, renal failure and cancer than whites on a percentage basis.
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Clemson Conqueror [11368]
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In part of the article it stated that black women are less
Jul 10, 2023, 8:24 PM
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likely to go to all of their recommended prenatal checks if their physician is white. So maybe part of the problem is that the black mothers are racist!
Just kidding (obviously) - but did anyone glean from the article why black women had better outcomes with black physicians?
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Game Changer [1818]
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Re: She’s a Supreme Court justice for god’s sake.
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Jul 10, 2023, 12:06 PM
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She became Supreme Court Justice so Biden could tick off black woman box Biden's words not mine. She failed day one when being confirmed with couldn't answer question from GOP Senator can you define females. Not sure the correct wording but she couldn't answer it. Her party if the Abortion Party and shame majority of abortion clinics in black or color neighbourhoods. Read that somewhere online during national election where they were staying majority of black females vote Democrat.
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Associate AD [831]
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Re: She’s a Supreme Court justice for god’s sake.
Jul 10, 2023, 3:33 PM
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Why do you think we only had white men on the Supreme Court until 1967?
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Clemson Conqueror [11572]
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Re: She’s a Supreme Court justice for god’s sake.
Jul 10, 2023, 8:48 PM
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Are you suggesting that the USA had racial and gender biases 55 years ago?
Why hasn’t the NYT and WAPO picked up on this?
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