Replies: 87
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Oculus Spirit [83131]
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Walk-On [149]
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Re: Proud Boys Proud Boys, what you gonna do?
Oct 1, 2020, 8:03 AM
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I’m just glad somebody has the balls to stand up to these terrorists destroying our cities and I can guarantee you this.....if some real #### ever popped off and citizens of this country needed to grab their guns and fight you’ll be glad to have the proud boys with you. BLM and Antifa not so much.
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Oculus Spirit [83131]
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YeeeeHaaaw!***
Oct 1, 2020, 8:17 AM
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CU Medallion [73569]
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Re: Proud Boys Proud Boys, what you gonna do?
Oct 1, 2020, 8:05 AM
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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I have never heard of the Proud Boys until...
Oct 1, 2020, 8:15 AM
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the last couple of weeks. This is what they say they stand for:
Core Values Of The Proud Boys
Minimal Government Maximum Freedom Anti-Political Correctness Anti-Drug War Closed Borders Anti-Racial Guilt Anti-Racism Pro-Free Speech (1st Amendment) Pro-Gun Rights (2nd Amendment) Glorifying the Entrepreneur Venerating the Housewife Reinstating a Spirit of Western Chauvinism
Though these are our central tenets, all that is required to become a Proud Boy is that a man declare he is “a Western chauvinist who refuses to apologize for creating the modern world.” We do not discriminate based upon race or sexual orientation/preference. We are not an “ism”, “ist”, or “phobic” that fits the Left’s narrative. We truly believe that the West Is The Best and welcome those who believe in the same tenets as us
https://proudboysusa.com/tenets/
BLM still hasn't replaced their "What We Believe" page that they took down.
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Legend [17297]
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Pics of housewife you’d most like to “venerate”.***
Oct 1, 2020, 8:44 AM
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Heisman Winner [119748]
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Venerate or Penetrate? ;)
Oct 1, 2020, 9:11 AM
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Tropical
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110%er [9034]
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All-In [42197]
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What are their membership requirements?
Oct 1, 2020, 8:23 AM
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Asking for T3Tiger.
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CU Medallion [56105]
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You just have to declare you're a Western chauvinist.
Oct 1, 2020, 8:30 AM
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Also they're not an “ism”, “ist”, or “phobic”. Except for chauvanist, of course. They're that ist.
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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Re: You just have to declare you're a Western chauvinist.
Oct 1, 2020, 8:34 AM
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and what does that mean?
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CU Medallion [56105]
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It means they require you to be an ist.
Oct 1, 2020, 8:36 AM
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And then they say they're not an ist, which is confusing to me.
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Lot o points [155973]
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It's not that i support facsism or any ism for that matter.
Oct 1, 2020, 8:37 AM
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Ism's in my opinion are not good. A person should not believe in an -ism, he should believe in himself. I quote John Lennon, 'I don't believe in Beatles, I just believe in me.' Good point there. After all, he was the walrus. I could be the walrus. I'd still have to bum rides off people.
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Orange Blooded [3520]
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Save Ferris!
Oct 1, 2020, 9:52 AM
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Props for diving deep into the 80’s for that one.
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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so, not defending them...
Oct 1, 2020, 8:42 AM
[ in reply to It means they require you to be an ist. ] |
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nor do I plan on pledging them to get my pledge, but in our culture when we hear "chauvinism," I think most of us think of "male chauvinism."
It seems that their stance, in the true meaning of "chauvinism" they believe that Western Culture is superior. I don't necessarily agree with that, but it is not a white supremacist message. It might be culturally elitism but it isn't racism.
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CU Medallion [56105]
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I'm not taking issue with the word chauvanist.
Oct 1, 2020, 8:45 AM
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I take issue with having a single requirement that you subscribe to an "ism" or an "ist" and then saying they're definitely not about being an "ism" or an "ist."
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All-In [42197]
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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Re: My understanding is that they aren't white supremacists...
Oct 1, 2020, 8:49 AM
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interesting videos on here for those who wish to educate themselves.
https://proudboysusa.com/aboutus/
4th video is pretty good
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Lot o points [155973]
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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Uncle Tom obviously...
Oct 1, 2020, 8:51 AM
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but I'll stick to listening to MSM, thank you very much.
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Lot o points [155973]
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It seems like accusations of white supremacy and racism
Oct 1, 2020, 8:56 AM
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are to 2020 what calling someone a witch was in the 1600's.
Being a white supremacist and or unapologetic racist is a pretty majorly despicable thing, and when the terms are just batted around so freely to describe any right-wing a-hole, it just dilutes the terms to virtual meaninglessness.
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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but all MSM, including FOX News refers to them as...
Oct 1, 2020, 9:06 AM
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a hate group.
They ran off actual white supremacists at Charlottesville.
I do remember Gavin McInnes years ago thinking his thinking was a little extreme. My calm nature forces me to be a little more diplomatic than him, but researching this group for myself helps me realize that, yet again, what I'm being fed by 2020 professional journalist is incorrect.
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All-In [42197]
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Re: but all MSM, including FOX News refers to them as...
Oct 1, 2020, 9:12 AM
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Then you aren't researching hard enough, Franc. It didn't take me long to find McInnes's racist, hate-filled statements against non-whites.
They didn't run white supremacists off in Charlottesville. They helped bring them in and organize them.
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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as you'll see from my reply below...
Oct 1, 2020, 9:24 AM
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I already looked at your research.
https://www.tigernet.com/forum/message/its-labeled-racist-27870176
In your example, the only McInnes quote I had issue with is the one about "at least they aren't n-----"
I am searching for that quote right now outside the website that cites it. Haven't found it yet.
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All-In [42197]
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Re: as you'll see from my reply below...
Oct 1, 2020, 9:36 AM
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What about the other quote I posted from him?
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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The one about Islam?
Oct 1, 2020, 9:49 AM
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I have no issue with that. Maybe Carlsbad is right about me.
Google searching the other quote, I just find quoted in other articles like this one.
https://www.orlandoweekly.com/Blogs/archives/2018/08/15/a-central-florida-political-forum-was-cancelled-after-people-found-out-one-of-the-hosts-was-affiliated-with-the-alt-right-proud-boys
Which includes sections (like most) where the narrative is problematic:
"When asked about Engels' connection with the Proud Boys, because he is frequently seen wearing the uniform and is often at organized rallies alongside Proud Boys, he said, "have many friends in the organization and have spent time at meet-ups, trying to investigate these accusations of racism, homophobia. As a gay man, I’ve encountered nothing but an atmosphere of welcoming and intense love for America."
I condemn the use of the "n" word, but I am a person of context. In those websites that's why I like all of the McInnes quotes with greater context than one sentence.
In my post below, I cited the website you used along with the ADL website. I also read through the Proud Boys website and looked at the information they provide. So I've read considered both sides of the argument.
The sentence with the "n" word from 2002 is horrible. I also don't agree with many of the ways McInnes says things.
Message was edited by: franc1968®
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All-In [42197]
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No, this one:
Oct 1, 2020, 9:50 AM
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"I don’t want our culture diluted. We need to close the borders now and let everyone assimilate to a Western, white, English-speaking way of life."
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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not a good statement...***
Oct 1, 2020, 10:05 AM
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All-In [42197]
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And as you'll see in my response to you below.
Oct 1, 2020, 9:11 AM
[ in reply to It seems like accusations of white supremacy and racism ] |
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It's proven that they are just that. I wasn't using the term loosely. Proud Boys is proudly white supremacist, and their founder's own quotes prove that.
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CU Medallion [56105]
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All-In [42197]
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That's a cute, clever move by them...
Oct 1, 2020, 8:55 AM
[ in reply to They dislike non-white skin so much that ] |
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Doesn't erase the past statements of their founder and other top level members. The intent is clear. It's more than just pro-Western culture. It views whites as superior.
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Lot o points [155973]
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So quote em.
Oct 1, 2020, 8:58 AM
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We're tryin to learn here, not validate preconceived notions.
Also, does that "past statements thing" apply to Planned Parenthood?
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All-In [42197]
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Ask and ye shall receive.
Oct 1, 2020, 9:10 AM
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The link below is a good primer (and yeah, anyone who posts a 'you can't trust the SPLC!' shall be summarily dismissed).
But here's one select quote from their founder, Gavin McInnes (ironically Canadian), talking about his neighborhood: "Well, at least they’re not n------ or Puerto Ricans. At least they’re white."
That quote is enough. He's a racist, he's proven he's a racist, and this is his organization. Case closed.
He also stated once in the New York Times, "I don’t want our culture diluted. We need to close the borders now and let everyone assimilate to a Western, white, English-speaking way of life."
Proud Boys helped organized the Charlottesville Unite the Right white supremacist march.
As for Planned Parenthood, if they still embrace the ideology of their founder, then YES, the same applies. But I'm not sure they do. Proud Boys was founded in 2016 and still fully embraces McInnes's ideology.
https://www.splcenter.org/fighting-hate/extremist-files/group/proud-boysProud Boys Subscribe to the Sounds Like Hate podcast to learn more about hate groups like the Proud Boys.? Established in the midst of the 2016 presidential election by VICE Media co-founder Gavin McInnes, the Proud Boys are self-described “western chauvinists” who adamantly deny any connection to the racist “alt-right,” insisting they are simply a fraternal group spreading an Proud Boys Subscribe to the Sounds Like Hate podcast to learn more about hate groups like the Proud Boys.? Established in the midst of the 2016 presidential election by VICE Media co-founder Gavin McInnes, the Proud Boys are self-described “western chauvinists” who adamantly deny any connection to the racist “alt-right,” insisting they are simply a fraternal group spreading an
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Lot o points [155973]
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Summarily dismiss me, amigo.
Oct 1, 2020, 9:11 AM
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The SPLC is a flat out joke. I'll still read the quotes though and get back to the thread later today....gotta go catch up on some work from being out a few days. Have groovy mornings ya'll.
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All-In [49058]
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I've got a lot of friends that work there...
Oct 1, 2020, 10:15 AM
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they've done a lot more good in the world than bad.
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CU Guru [1967]
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Re: I've got a lot of friends that work there...
Oct 1, 2020, 12:44 PM
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SPLC is a joke. Is Morris "Do as I say, not as I do" Dees one of your friends?
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All-In [49058]
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Aww...
Oct 1, 2020, 2:21 PM
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did they take all your chapter's money in a lawsuit?
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CU Guru [1967]
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Re: Aww...
Oct 1, 2020, 3:36 PM
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yeah that's your hero. Maybe you were fired from your job for being Racist and Sexist just like your hero Morris Dees. Co-founder of the SPLC pushed out for Racist and sexist behavior. Do as I say, not as I do...Its the way of the left.
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All-In [49058]
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So they pushed him out when he engaged in
Oct 1, 2020, 3:46 PM
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behavior that didn't fit their mission.
Yes, that organization sounds awful. Sorry they sued you.
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CU Guru [1967]
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Re: So they pushed him out when he engaged in
Oct 1, 2020, 5:49 PM
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I get it, it’s your racist so it’s ok.
It’s not like he was a intern that just started work there last week. The founder of the SPLC that was more than happy to to add people to his hate list because they had conservative views. I am glad that it only took them about 50 years to decide that the man leading them was exactly what they proclaimed to be fighting.
I would be willing to bet that I have the same disdain for the KKK that you have. The problem I have with the SPLC is that in order to remain relevant and quite profitable they had to broaden their scope to continue receiving their donations and began targeting groups that they disagree with politically.
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All-In [49058]
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You should read robertn's post below...
Oct 1, 2020, 10:30 AM
[ in reply to Summarily dismiss me, amigo. ] |
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I think that clears up at least where the found stands on race pretty solidly.
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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I did...
Oct 1, 2020, 10:52 AM
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it's terrible.
I also took the time to read and watch the videos on the Proud Boys website. While they do not denounce McInnes, they also seem to spend a lot of their bandwidth trying to distance themselves from much of what McInnes has said.
So, even trying to be objective and think logically, why would they even do that? I would think a true white supremacist would just say "screw you, this is what we believe...who cares what you think."
Most people I know who are racist (of course, other than myself) say what they think and believe everyone else is wrong. No need to defend their stance.
Statements like: "venerate the housewife" and "Western chauvinism" seem like carefully selected words intended to enrage the politically correct because there will be no desire to give thought to what they truly mean.
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All-In [49058]
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Because they aren't stupid...
Oct 1, 2020, 11:00 AM
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and they know they live in a world where all out white supremacy is not accepted by 90% of the people in the country anymore. They see the writing on the wall. And honestly you can see the shift in tone in Cata's quotes as well where McInnes stopped with the n-word but was still floating an ideology of white culture conformity.
And this is an org that has only been around since 2016. Do you really think in four years they were attracted to a leader who spit out the n-word all the time, then realized that was not wholesome, then decided to distance themselves from him and now are all about inclusion and love for their fellow man?
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All-In [49058]
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Honestly, let me add to that...
Oct 1, 2020, 11:06 AM
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they see a moment in history right now where a lot of people, like yourself, who are not racists, are so tied into Trump, or so anti-democrat, that you will defend anything that helps his cause if given even the slightest foothold. So they modify their message to give it just enough defensibility that they can get themselves aligned with a cause you do support.
And before long, you've defended them so much against attacks from the dirty democrats who hate Trump, you find yourself aligned with them. And then it becomes harder to stop defending them.
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All-In [42197]
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THIS^^^^^^
Oct 1, 2020, 11:13 AM
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They know they can't attract massive support with a white supremacy message. So they'll try to rope people in with the pro-Trump message.
They are not worthy of an ounce of defense on this board from anyone, and Trump should be condemned for supporting them.
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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I'm not defending them...
Oct 1, 2020, 11:47 AM
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nor is anybody persuading me with a "pro-Trump" message. If a sack of rocks was running against a progressive politicians wanting to do what they are suggesting I would vote for the sack of racks. I hate that Trump is the face of my party and what I think is best for our country.
On what the Proud Boys say they believe:
Core Values Of The Proud Boys
Minimal Government - check Maximum Freedom - check. I don't consider myself libertarian, but I am all for freedom that does not infringe on the inalienable rights of other citizens. Anti-Political Correctness - check. I can't stand PC Anti-Drug War - I'm not a legalize everything type person (which is why I'm not a libertarian) but I think our war on drugs has been ineffective and misdirected. I believe there are solutions to drug abuse that aren't found in the governemnt Closed Borders - I'm for a systematic, legal path to citizenship. There has to be control of our borders. Everybody wants to come here and I don't blame them. But it must be controlled. Anti-Racial Guilt - racism exists. It's a heart problem. There are also systematic problems in our government, but people are not automatically bad or privileged just because of their race. Anti-Racism - check Pro-Free Speech (1st Amendment) - check Pro-Gun Rights (2nd Amendment) - check Glorifying the Entrepreneur - not exactly sure what this means. I am all for capitalism and a system that rewards hard workers and people who contribute to society. Venerating the Housewife - I believe this is purposely worded to trigger the PC crowd. I think it is ideal for the family and society for the mother to be in the home while the children are growing up. Unfortunately, we have created an economy where that is really difficult for a household to make it on one salary. A mother should be among the most highly honored people in our society. Does this mean they should not work? No. Does this mean they should not get equal pay for equal work? No. But I believe society is better served when men are men and women are women. It's unfortunate when we shout about science deniers and then deny the obvious physiological and emotional differences between men and women. Reinstating a Spirit of Western Chauvinism - this is obviously a push back on painting the United States as a selfish, evil nation. While I do not agree that our culture is superior to other culture around the world. I have no issue with patriotism and pride in the United States as great nation - probably the most blessed and successful experiment in the history of this planet.
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All-In [49058]
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You're not defending them...
Oct 1, 2020, 11:51 AM
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but you are ignoring the past four years in favor of lauding how much you agree with their website as of today.
And in my post that triggered this offshoot of discussion, I said pro-Trump or anti-democrat. I've always figured you as more of an anti-democrat.
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Oculus Spirit [79429]
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All-In [42197]
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Re: Sounds like the same phenomenon you see with BLM/antifa
Oct 1, 2020, 11:21 AM
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I think that very well could be a valid point. I still argue they are not well organized and thus struggle to make any real strides, but I could see how they are also trying to lure people in with watered down messages.
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Oculus Spirit [79429]
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I really think you need to check out the riot/protest
Oct 1, 2020, 11:30 AM
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live streams. I think you would find them interesting. They also show how highly organized and funded they are. Their tactics and even gear have evolved so much over the course of 3-4 month it's rather scary, and you can watch it play out in real time.
My take is that people are taking sides, even if they're doing it subconsciously. The people who don't align with BLM/antifa will naturally gravitate toward groups like the Proud Boys. If things don't start de-escalating it's going to get ugly IMO.
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All-In [42197]
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Re: I really think you need to check out the riot/protest
Oct 1, 2020, 11:36 AM
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Eh, I'd rather not. That stuff disgusts me.
I wouldn't be surprised if there is some shadow funding/equipping/support. That makes sense. But without a real figurehead or figureheads to lead, it will only go so far.
Groups like the Proud Boys are front and center with who they are and they have a clear mission statement. That, IMO, makes them more dangerous.
But I definitely agree with your last two lines.
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All-In [49058]
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And they are also being directly spoken to by the President
Oct 1, 2020, 11:39 AM
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of the United States, the guy who has his kid asking for his army to show up at polling places. And what is he telling this armed militia group who is opposed to BLM? Stand back and stand by. Be ready.
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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well...
Oct 1, 2020, 11:54 AM
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I don't know about that, but I really do think (based on the few times in the past year that I have put Rush Limbaugh on the radio) that Trump is being coached by Rush.
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Oculus Spirit [79429]
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And BLM has full political/monetary support from Democrats
Oct 1, 2020, 12:06 PM
[ in reply to And they are also being directly spoken to by the President ] |
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Of all stripes across the country, despite the social unrest and destruction they’ve caused. Proud Boys and groups like them will be the natural result of that.
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All-In [49058]
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No they really don't...
Oct 1, 2020, 12:19 PM
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just because people say "black lives matter" doesn't mean they support Black Lives Matter. I don't know a single person who has donated any money to them and I know a lot of very liberal democrats.
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Oculus Spirit [79429]
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I guess that's why bail funds for rioters have collected
Oct 1, 2020, 12:45 PM
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millions of dollars and local Democrat politicians in affected areas have done little to nothing to contain the damage. Of course, the bail funds aren't always needed since rioters are often just released without charges.
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All-In [42197]
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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for my own conscious...
Oct 1, 2020, 11:52 AM
[ in reply to I really think you need to check out the riot/protest ] |
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I'm not aligning myself with the Proud Boys.
I'm looking for common sense and people letting go of labels.
If we can all take a deep breath and quit reacting to headlines and soundbites we might realize that we are being warped in our thinking. Other than the 5 to 10 percent on both extremes, the "other guy" might not really be our enemy.
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All-In [49058]
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The original website was put up in 2018
Oct 1, 2020, 12:17 PM
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https://proudboysusa.com/" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">https://web.archive.org/web/20180216205057/https://proudboysusa.com/
It did not really change much until June of this year when the narrative sections about how white men were getting heat for "some ###-bashing" 20 years ago were taken off the page.
The part you linked to was added August 19, 2020, or at least that's the first day that page was archived.
But yes, I'm sure that core philosophy you linked is really the heart and soul of the organization.
Since August of this year.
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All-In [49058]
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Just to finish this thought and agree with something you
Oct 1, 2020, 12:47 PM
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said.
I agree that you and I are in a group that should be able to speak respectfully and not throw stones. We probably agree in principle on many things that we might disagree on application to principle.
But the proud boys were started as a white male support group for white males that feel put upon by all the people who society now has decided get to have a voice. That they have adapted the message to be more appealing to other races and even gays is cool and all, but given the recency of this change and how vastly different it was from the sentiment on their website a few months ago, I still feel like they belong in the category of "you knew they were a snake when you picked them up, so don't act surprised if they bite you."
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Oculus Spirit [79429]
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Unfortunately, in today's climate it won't matter if you
Oct 1, 2020, 12:59 PM
[ in reply to for my own conscious... ] |
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align yourself with them or not, it will be done for you by virtue of you being a white conservative. The "other guy" might not be your enemy, but the onus will be on you to prove that to him.
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All-In [42197]
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But you can't say that here.
Oct 1, 2020, 2:17 PM
[ in reply to for my own conscious... ] |
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This isn't a careless labeling of a group as racist because they lean right. They are a self-proclaimed white supremacist and extremist right-wing group. This isn't about painting with a broad brush. We're rightfully calling the Proud Boys what they are, and it's shameful at best that the president dog whistled them.
So no, the labels apply here. THAT is the common sense move. If we start downplaying these groups for what they are because we're scared of labels, they become more dangerous.
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Hall of Famer [20542]
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Re: But you can't say that here.
Oct 1, 2020, 3:10 PM
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He didn't dog-whistle them. That was a straight-up: "Lassie, heel!"
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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That may or may not be true...
Oct 1, 2020, 11:29 AM
[ in reply to Honestly, let me add to that... ] |
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Because THIS is totally reasonable to me:
https://proudboysusa.com/pb-origins/
Let me tell you what I do remember. I remember McInnes used to be a regular on Fox News years and years ago. I think he might have been on Greg Gutfeld's show. I remember not being a huge fan then because I thought some of his statements were over the top. Can't give you specifics on statements because I cannot remember.
The first thing I want to push back on is me "being tied to Trump." I'm not tied to Trump. My vote is against the direction that many people want to take this country. I don't like suppression of speech. I believe in the classical liberal philosophy of the free exchange of ideas. Smart people should be able to talk. Dumb people should be able to talk. Socialists should be able to talk. Capitalists should be able to talk. Political correctness, shaming politics, cancel culture, and "safe zones" are terrible for our country.
Second, and I get ridiculed for this, but when our press becomes a propaganda arm for one party and encourages the suppression of free speech, we have a huge issue. My vote is primarily against the desire of our press. We'll get the "poor Trump" and "the media is just reporting on what Trump is doing." I'm not arguing that the media lies or misrepresents the facts (although I have demonstrated that a number of times). I'm arguing that everything is framed in a way to support the progressive agenda. I would hope that if the media was propping up Trump and demonizing Biden, I would complain just the same. The main reason I quit watching Fox News and listening to talk radio is I got tired of being lied to.
Now maybe the Proud Boys and McInnes have changed their tune. I cannot support anything McInnes said in the clips of robertn's tweet. I can condemn it. But I have little problem with the message they are putting forth on their website on October 1, 2020.
Again, today, I can go to the BLM website and they still haven't replaced the "What We Believe" that they took down last week. Why did they take it down? Why haven't they replaced it? Is their "upgrading" simply "modifying their message to give it just enough defensibility that they can get aligned with a cause you do support?"
I just wish all this politically charged division would stop and objectivity and common sense would prevail.
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All-In [49058]
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yes, that is exactly why they have taken down the old
Oct 1, 2020, 11:36 AM
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website. But the only thing I've ever defended about BLM is that the statement itself, not the organization, is a perfectly fine thing to say and that the one snip from their website that everyone gets jacked up over is actually a misinterpreted but poorly written statement about people not having to feel ashamed if they didn't have mommy and daddy and 1.2 siblings at home.
I'm certainly not going to come on here and suggest that their new website is proof that the entire thought process and philosophy of the organization has changed since it was started less than a decade ago and they really seem innocuous now.
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CU Medallion [73569]
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All-In [42197]
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Perhaps someone needs to...
Oct 1, 2020, 10:52 AM
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Share the quotes and philosophies from the founder with them. Especially where he calls them the n-word.
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All-In [49058]
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I mean, there is a black confederate...
Oct 1, 2020, 10:54 AM
[ in reply to moor black proud "token" boys ] |
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flag supporter that shows up at all the SC flag rallies.
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All-In [42197]
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How about Reuben Greenberg?
Oct 1, 2020, 11:14 AM
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The late black Jewish police chief of Charleston? He lined his office with Confederate flags and memorabilia.
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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Walk-On [149]
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Re: That's a cute, clever move by them...
Oct 1, 2020, 9:02 AM
[ in reply to That's a cute, clever move by them... ] |
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People who are racist in the true sense of the word, not the hi jacked liberal version, don’t try to hide it.
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All-In [42197]
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False.
Oct 1, 2020, 9:04 AM
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Most people who are racist don't even realize they are. But some do and openly embrace it.
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Walk-On [149]
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Re: False.
Oct 1, 2020, 9:12 AM
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What are some examples of ways people are racist but don’t know it?
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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Re: False.
Oct 1, 2020, 9:39 AM
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Do you think America is fundamentally good and you might argue that it is the greatest nation in history?
Do you think that a biblical model for the family (father with a p3n1s and mother with a v4g1n4) is the best way to ensure a stable society?
Do you vote for Republicans more often than Democrats?
If you answered "yes" to any of these, you're a racist.
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All-In [49058]
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Disagree...
Oct 1, 2020, 12:23 PM
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Because I would answer your questions:
Yes.
Yes, but that ship has sailed and we can't let the ideal be the enemy of the good by holding that up in a way that makes it as much a sword for people who don't have it as a shield for people who do.
And No. I don't. But I don't think that voting for Reagan, Bush, Bush, McCain, Romney or even Trump makes you a racist. But I do think Trump is one.
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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admittedly....
Oct 1, 2020, 3:05 PM
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I was being a little facetious - a little.
And seriously, I appreciate the fact you don't think I am racist. There would be others on here who would disagree with you on that.
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All-In [31520]
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CU Medallion [73569]
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All-In [42197]
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CU Medallion [73569]
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splc??? lol.***
Oct 1, 2020, 10:34 AM
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All-In [42197]
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Disprove a single quote or fact in there...
Oct 1, 2020, 11:15 AM
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Go ahead. You can't do it. And you're still embarrassingly defending a white supremacist organization. You should be ashamed.
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110%er [9667]
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My only knowledge of the Proud Boys is that they seem to
Oct 1, 2020, 9:17 AM
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have become fed up with the riots in Portland (where law and order had been told to stand down) - so they showed up to protest that themselves (and likely as a show of force against the rioters).
Have they actually shown up during peaceful protests?
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All-In [42197]
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See the Charlottesville incident.
Oct 1, 2020, 9:37 AM
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They were one of the primary organizers.
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Rock Defender [54]
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All-In [49058]
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Well these are NOTHING like the videos on
Oct 1, 2020, 10:30 AM
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their website. It's almost as if their website was designed to hide their true intentions.
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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Orange Blooded [2693]
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Orange Blooded [2693]
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apparently I can't spell***
Oct 1, 2020, 11:39 AM
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Replies: 87
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