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Legend [16051]
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Why do many fans want to see Chad Morris
Nov 17, 2014, 12:20 PM
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leave Clemson? Who would you want to replace him?
Based on what I have seen has had been a part of Clemson's success. I don't always agree with his play calling but this year I think the offense I been limited. We have good WR's but seem to be weak at RB and unfortunately the QB position has been tuff.
I would like some valid responses from fans with more football knowledge than I have to offer up their input.
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All-In [30593]
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I don't think he should be fired by any stretch... and
Nov 17, 2014, 12:23 PM
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he's done a lot of good for Clemson...
but, IMO, I think his scheme hurts us. The last 2-3 years, Clemson out talents 85% of our schedule, and we win those games. The other games coaching is at a premium, and we haven't done so well.
(please don't throw the 2 bowl games out to me... too much goes on there, IMO)
I think Morris has gotten away from what his base system is. Maybe b/c of our WR talent lately, idk. But there's a reason we can't get elite RBs to come here. I think it's b/c of how he used TB, and how is is now using DW.
He absolutely needs to use DW in the run game, there is no question. But you're not going to get the Dalvin Cook's, Mike Davis', Todd Gurley's, etc.... when your run game threat is all your QB, and when your run game scheme is all based on deception.
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Orange Blooded [2183]
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Re: I don't think he should be fired by any stretch... and
Nov 17, 2014, 3:51 PM
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York you think he deserves a pay cut correct? So you wouldn't fire him just cut his pay and tell him to change the scheme?
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All-In [30593]
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link?***
Nov 17, 2014, 4:17 PM
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Orange Blooded [2183]
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Re: link?***
Nov 17, 2014, 5:27 PM
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I'm just trying to figure out your position. I thought you felt he was overpaid and not good enough for Clemson and should be fired. But you've said that's not true. So is your position that Chad should stay, take a pay cut and change his offensive approach? Why would that need a link?
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Legend [19660]
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Chad's offenses sputter every year against SCAR and FSU.
Nov 17, 2014, 12:25 PM
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If you don't beat those guys you will not be liked here for very long.
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All-In [30593]
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I don't understand why this offends people so much
Nov 17, 2014, 12:28 PM
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Dabo beats the teams we're supposed to. He is not TB. I would argue we beat those teams b/c we out talent them so much.
I would argue we do not beat SCU and FSU b/c coaching is at a premium, b/c talent is relatively equal. Our injuries this year closed the talent gap against Cuse, BC, GT, etc... but we are still more talented.
We struggled, and even lost GT. I would argue b/c coaching was at a premium.
That's not a bash.
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Legend [16051]
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You made some great points so who would
Nov 17, 2014, 12:31 PM
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you like to see replace CM?
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All-In [30593]
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I'm not saying fire him at all....
Nov 17, 2014, 12:32 PM
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but I think he needs to re-think how we are doing some things scheme wise.
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Legend [16051]
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I totally agree with you on this point.
Nov 17, 2014, 12:37 PM
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There is no reason we should have lost to SC 5 consecutive years. It seems each of those 5 years CM got away from what lead to a lot of success during each of those five seasons.
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110%er [6614]
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Re: I totally agree with you on this point.
Nov 17, 2014, 4:07 PM
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He had to get away from it. In the face of equal talent and equal speed, his "trickeration" mis direction O does not work well.
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110%er [6614]
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Re: I'm not saying fire him at all....
Nov 17, 2014, 4:06 PM
[ in reply to I'm not saying fire him at all.... ] |
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The pro set dominates the pros for a reason. The flashy offenses have looked good in college for a while, but the proset will return to dominance. The D. coordinators are ahead of Chad and it is showing up.
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Hall of Famer [21877]
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110%er [6614]
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Re: You made some great points so who would
Nov 17, 2014, 4:05 PM
[ in reply to You made some great points so who would ] |
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Think out of the box. Saban hiring Kiffin was definitely out of the box and I believe Bama will light it up on O as soon as Kiffin gets his perfect pro set personnel there. Doing pretty dang good with what he inherited.
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Legend [19660]
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Who defines "Supposed to Beat"?
Nov 17, 2014, 12:34 PM
[ in reply to I don't understand why this offends people so much ] |
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In our conference beating the teams you are supposed to beat means you have to beat them all or you get penalized. When you do this and lose or lose badly to the good teams you get in the situation where we are now. A good butt kicking on SCAR, FSU and UGA at least half of the time would help immensely. Right now that's basically not happening.
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All-In [30593]
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c'mon... you know what I'm saying...
Nov 17, 2014, 12:36 PM
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Clemson out talents everyone on our schedule, with the exception of FSU and SCU (and UGA, if they're on it)... and it's not even close.
Those are teams we are supposed to beat, hence the streak of not losing to an unranked opponent.
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Fan [72]
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All-In [30593]
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right
Nov 17, 2014, 12:49 PM
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that's so stupid it's actually hilarious
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Legend [16629]
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Fan [72]
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Not at all. Its absurd to suggest coaching lost all those
Nov 17, 2014, 12:56 PM
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games. You could at least try to say more than "wow". And don't waste time pointing out a play call or two that didn't go our way (in hindsight). That's not the way it works. Bad plays happen every single game to every single coach. 6 turnovers, for instance, are not on playcalling.
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All-In [30593]
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would you agree that Clemson "out talents" 85% of our
Nov 17, 2014, 1:00 PM
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schedule?
Would you agree that coaching is at a premium against teams we do not out talent?
If you do, (and there's no reason you shouldn't)... how do you explain being 4-14 against teams that win 10 games since 2009? We're 2-12 in the regular season.
that's 28% and 16% for a team that has won 10+ games 3 years in a row, and 9 games in 2009
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110%er [6614]
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Re: would you agree that Clemson "out talents" 85% of our
Nov 17, 2014, 4:13 PM
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We out talent all the ACC except FSU. Us and the Coots are usually about par on talent since the drunk has been there. About any other SEC team we put on the schedule in a particular year is about on par with us talent wise.
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Legend [16629]
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Ring of Honor [26353]
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Who?***
Nov 17, 2014, 1:25 PM
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All-In [30593]
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sorry.... he meant Stanley***
Nov 17, 2014, 3:22 PM
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110%er [6614]
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Re: sorry.... he meant Stanley***
Nov 17, 2014, 4:14 PM
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Morgan Stanley? Thats a stock broker. (lol)
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Oculus Spirit [97246]
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All-In [30593]
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thank you SHL and bob for opening my eyes to this***
Nov 17, 2014, 1:10 PM
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110%er [7831]
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Re: Not at all. Its absurd to suggest coaching lost all those
Nov 17, 2014, 3:47 PM
[ in reply to Not at all. Its absurd to suggest coaching lost all those ] |
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My 15 y/o son was calling off the plays he'd run..... Did ten in a row.
If it's that easy for him..... How easy is it for a DC that's been doing it for years?
Predictable as Spence.
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110%er [6614]
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Re: Not at all. Its absurd to suggest coaching lost all those
Nov 17, 2014, 4:10 PM
[ in reply to Not at all. Its absurd to suggest coaching lost all those ] |
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No, it is on the player development. It is on the ball security drills. It is on teaching the Q.B. how to read defenses. That is all part of coaching. Coaching does not just happen for a few hours on Saturday.
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Fan [72]
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Re: Coaching had nothing to do with losses to the c0cks in 2012
Nov 17, 2014, 12:53 PM
[ in reply to Coaching had nothing to do with losses to the c0cks in 2012 ] |
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We've beaten UGA, LSU, OSU who are much, much more talented than us. It's one of the reasons we finished in the top 10 for two years and we're one of the top 10 winningest programs in the world since 2011. And too, the 2013 loss to UGA wasn't on coaching.
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Oculus Spirit [97246]
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Those teams are not "much, much more talented" than us.
Nov 17, 2014, 12:59 PM
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That's ridiculous.
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Fan [72]
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No it s not at all. FSU, LSU, OSU, UGA - the many times the
Nov 17, 2014, 1:08 PM
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amount of 4 and 5 star players than we do. The c0cks have had one of the best defenses in America over the last few years, and even in spite of that 6 turnovers and coaching need to be separated. It's pointless to argue these things when you don't even understand the talent differences we're talking about.
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Legend [16051]
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You have to at least acknowledge lack of
Nov 17, 2014, 1:17 PM
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player execution has been a big factor as well. You and others who have had negative things to say about CM have yet to offer up some one who would be a great replacement should CM leave CU.
Who do you recommend?
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All-In [30593]
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who are you talking to?***
Nov 17, 2014, 1:40 PM
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Fan [72]
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Just for starters -
Nov 17, 2014, 1:11 PM
[ in reply to Those teams are not "much, much more talented" than us. ] |
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I'm betting FSU has 5x or more the amount of 5 star players than we do. Is that much much more or not? I think it's obvious. It's also obvious you haven't done your homework.
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All-In [30593]
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he's a coot.. everyone knows teams choose defense first***
Nov 17, 2014, 1:13 PM
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Fan [72]
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O ok***
Nov 17, 2014, 1:14 PM
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Fan [72]
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110%er [6614]
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Re: Coaching had nothing to do with losses to the c0cks in 2012
Nov 17, 2014, 4:09 PM
[ in reply to Coaching had nothing to do with losses to the c0cks in 2012 ] |
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Why not? They have more talent? If so, Coaching (lack of ability to recruit) led to the losses.
"The buck stops here." Not too many people believe that anymore doe they?
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CU Medallion [59208]
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Ed Zachary - So far, Dabo is a significant step up from TB.
Nov 17, 2014, 3:21 PM
[ in reply to I don't understand why this offends people so much ] |
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Still, the goal should be to get us to a point where we not only beat the unranked teams (the teams that we are supposed to beat), but we also where we can at least win half of the time against FSU and SCAR, and win the ACC on a semi-regular basis. For now, the program has stalled in that endeavor.
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110%er [6614]
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Re: I don't understand why this offends people so much
Nov 17, 2014, 4:04 PM
[ in reply to I don't understand why this offends people so much ] |
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Our players that lined up against G.T. were much more talented than the players tech had. Tech's Q.B. was a highly sought after line backer, but it is my understand Tech is the only major program that offered him the chance to play Q.B. We had the talent. Johnson just owned Dabo last Saturday.
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CU Guru [1512]
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110%er [8681]
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Re: Chad's offenses sputter every year against SCAR and FSU.
Nov 17, 2014, 12:38 PM
[ in reply to Chad's offenses sputter every year against SCAR and FSU. ] |
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the only time it really sputtered against FSU was 2013, and we moved the ball well last year in columbia despite some questionable play calls (sammy pass and not running Mcdowell more)
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Fan [72]
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It hasn't sputtered against them every year, and it didn't
Nov 17, 2014, 12:47 PM
[ in reply to Chad's offenses sputter every year against SCAR and FSU. ] |
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sputter while beating MANY good teams since he got here, in addition to being one of the top 10 winningest programs in the country.
15-3 turnovers against the c0cks the last 3 games are the primary reason we've lost to them, especially the 6 last year. Had nothing at all to do with Morris.
FSU has been one of the most dominant defenses in the country, but even still a couple of those losses had nothing to do with Morris' offense.
What about all the huge wins? Again, we're one of the top 10 programs in the country in wins since Morris got here. He is a major reason why.
Some dummies expect him to take a minimal talent QB, freshmen running backs, and a less than stellar oline and turn us into the top 10 offense of the last 2 years. In truth it doesn't matter what OC you are, that ain't happening. Some of these people pushing their disappointment and playing the blame-game have no idea what they're talking about.
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All-In [30593]
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I'm not gonna get in an argument with you on this...
Nov 17, 2014, 12:49 PM
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primarily b/c I am a Chad Morris fan...
but would you pleas point out the huge wins for me?
LSU
OSU
VTx2
others? (UGA was 8-5 last year, btw)
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Fan [72]
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There is no argument.
Nov 17, 2014, 12:59 PM
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And UGA has a ton more talent than us.
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Oculus Spirit [97246]
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Oh my gosh.
Nov 17, 2014, 1:00 PM
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Please tell me you're just joking?
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Rock Defender [54]
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Re: It hasn't sputtered against them every year, and it didn't
Nov 17, 2014, 12:55 PM
[ in reply to It hasn't sputtered against them every year, and it didn't ] |
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When you're paying what we do for an OC, YES, there should be a reasonable expectation of minimal dropoff from year to year. I don't care who you lose. That should be the difference when you're paying more than a million for a coordinator.
This seems to be an issue many people are missing. If he can't get us up to a level just slightly above "sorry" when he doesn't have NFL talent, then what the hail are we paying him for?
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Fan [72]
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Have you seen our offense when Watson runs it? It works real
Nov 17, 2014, 1:04 PM
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good. Did you notice that Choice guy before he got hurt? Our current starter was well down on the depth chart before being forced into action and even so is getting better behind on oline that most often doesn't give him anywhere to go.
Again, there isn't an OC in the country who could have lost what we did coming in and what we lost in the midst of the season who could be doing better. Cole wouldn't be starting for Wake Forest right now. Its just as simple as that. What we saw when Watson went out has EVERYTHING to do with personnel. Nobody is missing anything except those who expect the same ol same ol with what we're dealing with.
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Legend [16629]
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I couldn't disagree with this more.
Nov 17, 2014, 1:10 PM
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Chad's had over a month without DW to develop something remotely resembling an offense. Hasn't happened. Stop with the injuries, thin OL, lack of talent, etc crap. This is year four of this offense. It wasn't installed yesterday.
We threw for 65 yards against the 97th ranked defense in the nation against the pass. There's no excuse for that.
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Fan [72]
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It's not "crap" at all.
Nov 17, 2014, 1:14 PM
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Cole Stoudt would not be starting at Wake Forest. That lack of QB talent and the injuries etc etc are EVERYTHING. Silly to suggest it isn't. Again, it looks like a well-oiled machine only by replacing one guy.
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Legend [16629]
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15 posts since March of 2013?
Nov 17, 2014, 1:18 PM
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I bet you point a lot though, amirite?
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Rock Defender [54]
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Re: 15 posts since March of 2013?
Nov 17, 2014, 1:30 PM
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643 votes cast? That's a mighty curious proportion.
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CU Guru [1512]
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Re: I couldn't disagree with this more.
Nov 17, 2014, 5:03 PM
[ in reply to I couldn't disagree with this more. ] |
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Spiller: WOW!Couldn't have said it better. BTW, I'd prefer he stay but only after he gets it thjat he must learn to adapt!
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Orange Blooded [3507]
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Re: It hasn't sputtered against them every year, and it didn't
Nov 17, 2014, 1:04 PM
[ in reply to It hasn't sputtered against them every year, and it didn't ] |
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I agree with everything you just said. My biggest thing is this though...if Watson(or anybody) goes under center in Tallahassee when we were on the goal line, I sincerely believe the odds are in out favor to beat FSU that night. That's really the only gripe I've had with Morris all year. And even that is just speculation. Other than that, he's done pretty dang well with the hand he's been dealt. We're lucky to be over .500 with all the injuries.
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110%er [6614]
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Starter [397]
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Re: Why do many fans want to see Chad Morris
Nov 17, 2014, 12:29 PM
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> leave Clemson? Who would you want to replace him?
>
> Based on what I have seen has had been a part of
> Clemson's success. I don't always agree with his play
> calling but this year I think the offense I been
> limited. We have good WR's but seem to be weak at RB
> and unfortunately the QB position has been tuff.
>
> I would like some valid responses from fans with
> more football knowledge than I have to offer up their
> input.
He is a smoke and mirrors coach who does not coach up the QB's behind the starter. I would hire the Indiana HC who will be fired in the next two weeks as OC, he is a great OC just not HC material.
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All-In [30593]
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he was very good at OU***
Nov 17, 2014, 3:51 PM
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Orange Blooded [2668]
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many fans don't. a select few on tiger net do.
Nov 17, 2014, 12:37 PM
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Those of us who aren't insane or stupid think he's done one phenomenal job, considering what we had beforehand.
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Fan [72]
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See the guys above. Some guys really are clueless.***
Nov 17, 2014, 1:05 PM
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Legend [16629]
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Hmmmm.
Nov 17, 2014, 1:15 PM
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12 posts since March of 2013.
I bet you've done a lot of pointing some shane_morgan posts though, amirite?
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Orange Blooded [3507]
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All-TigerNet [12506]
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Here are the two answers
Nov 17, 2014, 12:39 PM
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1. His offense hasn't been very good this year
2. Jeff Scott
Sorry to disappoint in advance out loud.
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110%er [6757]
TigerPulse: 98%
Posts: 9801
Joined: 9/22/11
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Chad's "20 plays" for Stoudt backfired - Tech had them down
Nov 17, 2014, 12:55 PM
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pat! Also, that third down in red zone is predictable. I don't want him fired unless he does not correct his mistakes by being more unpredictable. Those interceptions were his fault! I hope he turns it around and helps Cole be more unpredictable and especially put him under center more! Cole is more of a pro-style qb and Chad should have more pro-style plays for him PLEASE!
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CU Guru [1250]
TigerPulse: 90%
Posts: 2645
Joined: 11/30/98
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Because
Nov 17, 2014, 1:57 PM
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they're idiots.
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110%er [6614]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 10227
Joined: 11/2/03
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Re: Why do many fans want to see Chad Morris
Nov 17, 2014, 4:00 PM
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Dabo gets paid the big bucks to line up a replacement. Looks like Nick Saban hiring Kiffin is going to turn out very well. There are plenty of seasoned coordinators out there.
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CU Guru [1512]
TigerPulse: 69%
Posts: 3475
Joined: 7/4/13
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Re: Why do many fans want to see Chad Morris
Nov 17, 2014, 5:06 PM
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wueagle: If he agreed to be more flexible and concentrate on learning to adapt he'd stay. Short of that, I'd fire him end of season. He's had 4 years and injuries not withstanding what he put on the field foe an offense the last 4-5 games is not acceptable IF Clemson wants to advance much further.
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