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Replies: 33
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Paw Master [16128]
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The huddle play had absolutely nothing to do with the fumble
Nov 30, 2022, 10:19 AM
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He'd run 20 yards down the field after the huddle. Just fumble prone on receiving kicks apparently.
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Paw Master [17117]
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Re: The huddle play had absolutely nothing to do with the fumble
Nov 30, 2022, 10:21 AM
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You are correct. I do agree with some posters though that stated we have time in practice for creative special teams plays but none for the offense.
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Paw Master [16128]
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We can agree on that. Of course if we don't have 4 TOs...
Nov 30, 2022, 10:23 AM
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None of that matters.
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Paw Master [17117]
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That is true
Nov 30, 2022, 10:33 AM
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without turnovers our last few games are won handily, and even ND would have been close. Our defense gave up 14 points in that game even with all of their rushing yards. Pick 6, fumble for TD, and interception inside the 10yrd line gave them 21.
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Tiger Spirit [9353]
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110%er [3713]
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Trainer [27]
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Re: The huddle play had absolutely nothing to do with the fumble
Nov 30, 2022, 10:28 AM
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No way to absolutely know for sure, but I have to disagree. What they were doing was some elaborate stuff. Instead of simply catching the ball and running, they were concentrating on orchestrating this "trick play". In doing this, Mafah neglected the fundamentals of kick returns. In short, he was so distracted with that spectacle he forgot to hold on to the ball. For what you are arguing you would have to assume that Mafah would've likely done the same thing if the kick sailed directly to him which is improbable. Again, no way to know for sure. You are entitled to your opinion, but I find it to be unlikely.
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Paw Master [16128]
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You've obviously never played football...
Nov 30, 2022, 10:30 AM
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You don't "forget" to hold on to the ball after any play...Especially a RB! Come on man.
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Trainer [27]
TigerPulse: 97%
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Re: You've obviously never played football...
Nov 30, 2022, 11:23 AM
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Never played football, but I know a thing or two about cognitive load. Yes, orchestrating a trick play where you have to coordinate a shell game among several people then running with the expectation that you could score a touchdown through misdirection can be distracting. As a result, you could be prone to ignore fundamentals like securing the ball. That's just common sense. Again, do you think it likely that he would've not secured the ball if it went straight to him?
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CU Medallion [18437]
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Re: You've obviously never played football...
Dec 1, 2022, 7:53 AM
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Ball security is pure muscle memory for running backs at this level. If it was something less innate, I’d find your argument more convincing. By and large most sports statisticians regard fumbles as mostly random and their recovery is purely random. We’re on the wrong side of chance this season. Hopefully we see some reversion to the mean in the next games.
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Team Captain [473]
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Re: The huddle play had absolutely nothing to do with the fumble
Nov 30, 2022, 10:32 AM
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I totally agree that you have to exclude the fumble aspect from this because thats hind sight. My gripe is that I hated the call from the jump. You just got a safety, they cant stop your running game, time to stomp on their necks. Take the kickoff and get whatever yardage you can. You have ALL the momentum.
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Paw Master [16128]
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They were trying to "put it away"...If not for the fumble...
Nov 30, 2022, 10:35 AM
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We probably do.
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Orange Blooded [2102]
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If we're talking "probablies," I think we would have
Dec 1, 2022, 7:46 AM
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probably put it away by going conservative, fair catching the ball, running the ball three times, punt, and let the defense hold them to a FG on the next drive. That would have kept 4 points off the board and we'd have won by three.
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All-TigerNet [5854]
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Stupid plays usually have stupid endings!**
Nov 30, 2022, 10:36 AM
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ship might have taken that ko to the house
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Ultimate Tiger [33440]
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Re: Stupid plays usually have stupid endings!**
Nov 30, 2022, 10:42 AM
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Like he has so many others this year?
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Paw Master [16128]
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Valley Legend [12587]
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Re: The huddle play had absolutely nothing to do with the fumble
Nov 30, 2022, 10:39 AM
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Agree totally! It is preposterous to think that Mafah "forget" to hod on to the ball because of the play. You can certainly disagree that we should have tried it in the first place, but it had nothing to do with the fumble.
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All-TigerNet [5706]
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It didn’t pop because it was a directional kick down the right side of the field
Nov 30, 2022, 10:39 AM
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I liked the call. If that ball gets kicked to the middle 20 yards of the field it was a TD
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Paw Master [16128]
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EXACTLY!***
Nov 30, 2022, 10:48 AM
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Hall of Famer [8258]
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Re: The huddle play had absolutely nothing to do with the fumble
Nov 30, 2022, 11:00 AM
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IF not mistaken that was Mafah's first KO return of the season, so that may have had an effect. But I don't think the huddle had anything to do with it. I have no problem with the play call, we were trying to seize the moment. Instead we did not execute and it backfired on us.
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Varsity [114]
TigerPulse: 42%
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Re: Dabo aka $1mill/game gaslighting con man youth pastor
Nov 30, 2022, 11:07 AM
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Some folks say that he was clearly trying to shuffle it off. It seems that the only sane man on the team is Mr. Shipley - when you are the best player you have immunity and can speak freely. Oh wait...when you are the worst player you also have immunity no matter how bad you get. The coach thinks he is the great OZ by threatening everyone not to look behind the curtain. Go figure...
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Paw Master [16128]
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2 time NC winning, 7 time ACC Champion Gaslighting Con man?
Nov 30, 2022, 12:01 PM
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Get lost coot. You are fooling NO ONE.
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Varsity [114]
TigerPulse: 42%
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Re: 2 time NC winning, 7 time ACC Champion Gaslighting Con man?
Nov 30, 2022, 3:29 PM
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Why call someone you disagree with a coot? That's a sign that you may agree with me and don't care to face reality that Dabo does not perform to his own standard. I do hope that Dabo improves or comes to his senses soon.
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Paw Master [16128]
TigerPulse: 97%
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Joined: 2002
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If you are a Tiger that thinks Dabo is a gaslighting conman
Nov 30, 2022, 4:01 PM
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you obviously have a learning disability and there's no need to disagree with you. I don't argue with special needs.
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Varsity [114]
TigerPulse: 42%
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Re: If you are a Tiger that thinks Dabo is a gaslighting conman
Nov 30, 2022, 11:02 PM
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Well I got your attention with just a few written words. My work is done.
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Paw Master [16128]
TigerPulse: 97%
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Congrats idiot coot***
Dec 1, 2022, 12:01 AM
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Dynasty Maker [3347]
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Re: The huddle play had absolutely nothing to do with the fumble
Nov 30, 2022, 11:07 PM
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I disagree. Will is our best offensive player. He has had some nice returns this season. Why not keep the ball in your best playmakers hands.
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Orange Blooded [2597]
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Re: The huddle play had absolutely nothing to do with the fumble
Dec 1, 2022, 7:04 AM
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Both fumbles were unforced. Their arm nor the ball was touched.
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Clemson Conqueror [11396]
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Mafah lost the ball because he was trying to get one extra
Dec 1, 2022, 8:21 AM
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yard, instead of securing the ball with two hands and going down!
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Head Coach [994]
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Re: The huddle play had absolutely nothing to do with the fumble
Dec 1, 2022, 8:15 AM
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It is another example of overcoaching. Just take the ball in good field position and run the football enough to score again.
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CU Medallion [20843]
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Disagree. Phil Mafah is not a special teams returner
Dec 1, 2022, 8:51 AM
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like Shipley or Williams. We put him out of his element there and paid a price for it. Special teams coverage is a different beast than a defense. That wasn't the moment to introduce a new set of hands to the equation, IMO.
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Oculus Spirit [44289]
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Re: The huddle play had absolutely nothing to do with the fumble
Dec 1, 2022, 9:05 AM
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I have just become accustomed to winning the TO battle and we are currently -1 for the year. Not sure what has happened on securing the football. Mafah is one of my favorite players but SC did not even touch the ball. About like DJ dropping the ball when bringing his arm up to throw a pass. Bad technique as far as holding the ball apparently.
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Orange Phenom [14559]
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I think thats mostly true, but i do wonder if the
Dec 1, 2022, 9:20 AM
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trick play kind of messed with his mindset there. He was running VERY loose with the football and really appeared to be trying, or at least considering, pitching the ball when it was knocked loose. Sometimes you see that happen with college players running trick plays. They kind of get lost in the moment, forget the fundamentals, and start playing back yard football.
The biggest problem i have with that whole play is that the risk vs reward just wasn't there. We were up 16-7 and they were kicking off from their own 20 after a safety. We were basically guaranteed to get decent to good field position just returning the kick with Shipley. A lot of things could've potentially gone wrong with that play when you have several players with their backs completely turned to the oncoming coverage team. We could've fumbled the the exchange between Ship and Mafah, we could've gotten blown up by a coverage man that got down the field quickly before the play fully developed, etc.
And what was the best outcome there really? Mafah isn't a speed burner so, even if you fool the defense (which we basically did), he's probably not going to make it too far downfield before somebody catches him. It's not like we were giving the ball to Spiller or Etienne there.
It was ultimately a fairly high risk play that, absolute best case scenario, gains an extra 20 or so yards vs just letting Ship return the kick. And lets also not forget that Ship has had some good returns this year without doing anything fancy.
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Oculus Spirit [44289]
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Re: I think thats mostly true, but i do wonder if the
Dec 1, 2022, 9:31 AM
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Besides Potter I have no confidence in the other parts of our special teams. Waiting on Swanson to kick one up our long snappers butt. That killed us on one of those line drives where they had a big return.
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