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Climate Change Pact - Ok, libs, I'll bite
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Heisman Winner [120495]
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Climate Change Pact - Ok, libs, I'll bite
Dec 1, 2015, 3:53 PM
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http://www.tigernet.com/forums/message.jspa?messageID=18433419#18433419
Lets assume for a minute that MAN is causing climate change. The so-called facts I've heard say the US is Numero Uno Emitter, China second, and India third. Agree??
How many of you have traveled throughout China and India? Seen how filthy polluted those countries are? Air is unbreathable for all the industrial smog and the rivers are choked full of pollution and #####...
DO YOU REALLY BELIEVE the US is the Number One Emitter? I contend that we are the one who is accurately reporting and the others do not. If you have traveled to either China or india, you might just have a change of mind...
What is going on is EVERYONE else wants the US taxpayer to clean up their messes...and the libs are falling in line, because they want their cut.
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Heisman Winner [138625]
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Heh. Anecdotal evidence is always tried and true.
Dec 1, 2015, 4:00 PM
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Where have you traveled? Shanghai? Bangalore? Probably two of the dirtiest cities on the planet. But is your assumption that the rest of China and the rest of India are as industrialized and dirty? There are only about 2 billion poor people who don't even have tires to burn between the two countries.
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Heisman Winner [120495]
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Many cities in both countries; traveled by car, train
Dec 1, 2015, 4:08 PM
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and air between them. Sure there are remote areas where the air is not choked with smog, but are you saying either country can hold a candle to where the US is in clean air and water now?
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Heisman Winner [112386]
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Re: Many cities in both countries; traveled by car, train
Dec 1, 2015, 6:02 PM
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per capita, WE are far and away the biggest polluters. To reiterate 19b's point, China's population is what makes them the biggest polluters as a nation, and last I checked they are making our cheap disposable consumer goods, which is the problem in their cities. Their entire economy is based off selling us cheap crap that we throw out and buy over and over again. So again, it is all about changing our own culture to become more sustainable.
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CU Medallion [73570]
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LOL, good luck convincing any lib of this
Dec 1, 2015, 4:00 PM
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"What is going on is EVERYONE else wants the US taxpayer to clean up their messes...and the libs are falling in line, because they want their cut. "
you are just a wingnut crazy insane person who should be imprisoned for being a denier.
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Rock Defender [54]
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Re: LOL, good luck convincing any lib of this
Dec 1, 2015, 6:53 PM
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Well first things first, we have to admit there is a problem in order to fix it. 97% of scientists say that climate change is not only real, but that it's man-made.
Is that some giant conspiracy in your mind? Why would the GOP know more about the issue than scientists?
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CU Medallion [56380]
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Pollution and greenhouse gasses aren't the same thing.***
Dec 1, 2015, 4:02 PM
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CU Medallion [56380]
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*gases***
Dec 1, 2015, 4:04 PM
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All-TigerNet [13605]
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Re: *gases***
Dec 1, 2015, 4:18 PM
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Smog does contribute to climate change.
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Heisman Winner [112386]
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Re: *gases***
Dec 1, 2015, 6:04 PM
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Co2 is a component of smog, so you would be incorrect.
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All-TigerNet [13605]
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All-TigerNet [13605]
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Re: *gases***
Dec 1, 2015, 6:53 PM
[ in reply to Re: *gases*** ] |
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I know what smog is. Unless I misunderstood, the above poster said smog doesn't contribute to climate change.
Yes, it does.
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CU Medallion [73570]
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Walk-On [109]
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CU Medallion [73570]
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lutz***
Dec 1, 2015, 4:11 PM
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Walk-On [109]
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I think you missed my point.***
Dec 1, 2015, 4:20 PM
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Walk-On [109]
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I think the issue here is your "real" proof, which just
Dec 1, 2015, 4:14 PM
[ in reply to warming and man made global warming arent the same ] |
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allows you to disregard scientific proof that can be hypothesized, tested, demonstrated, and concluded. If you wanted scientific proof, then there's plenty out there. You just don't want that.
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CU Medallion [73570]
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warming has been stopped essentially for 16 yrs now
Dec 1, 2015, 4:34 PM
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and all the scientists keep ignoring that. Also, the ice caps are increasing. Ignored.
All the while they say man is causing warming, that isn't really happening anymore, but they still have no proof that man caused anything.
Oh and I won't even go into the fudged data over and over they keep getting caught with? Why fudge something?
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Walk-On [109]
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I think far too many people label you guys as crazy, when
Dec 2, 2015, 9:14 AM
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you're really just terribly wrong. Like everything you just wrote is completely wrong, but if that's the information that you have, then I can see why you believe what you believe.
data.giss.nasa.gov/gistemp/graphs_v3/
Can we all agree that NASA knows what they're doing?
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Heisman Winner [120495]
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CU Medallion [73570]
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they used to say co2 was in direct correlation to warming
Dec 1, 2015, 4:12 PM
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til warming stopped and co2 kept rising well above warming.
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CU Medallion [56380]
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Uh, next excuse for what?
Dec 1, 2015, 4:32 PM
[ in reply to Maybe not exactly, but there are connections... ] |
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Polluted rivers have nothing to do with global warming. Neither does nuclear waste or garbage. Smog is tangentially related, but still not necessarily a reflection of the amount of greenhouse gases being emitted. The fact that the US has less smog than developing nations is due to stiffer government regulations.
I understand you already have your conclusion – that climate change and international coalitions addressing it are actually a vast left wing hoax aimed at robbing trillions of dollars from the American taxpayer – and that's not going to change, but you ought to beef up your premises because the one you posted is borderline retarded.
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Oculus Spirit [79606]
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Want to delete this post and re-think it?
Dec 1, 2015, 4:36 PM
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Because border line retarded is the assertion that nuclear waste, polluted rivers, or garbage don't have anything to do with atmospheric conditions. It's all connected genius.
The garbage part is probably the stupidest part of your post, btw. They fuel phucking manufacturing facilities with gases produced by garbage.
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All-TigerNet [13605]
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Re: Want to delete this post and re-think it?
Dec 1, 2015, 4:39 PM
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Landfills(garbage) Is one of the leading producers of greenhouse gases. LOL
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All-TigerNet [13605]
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Re: Uh, next excuse for what?
Dec 1, 2015, 4:38 PM
[ in reply to Uh, next excuse for what? ] |
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Actually garbage does contribute to climate change.
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Heisman Winner [120495]
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Volcanoes emit more greenhouse gas than man could ever think
Dec 1, 2015, 5:00 PM
[ in reply to Uh, next excuse for what? ] |
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so stop your BS. You are just repeating what the MSM is telling you. You have no clue what you are spewing.
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Heisman Winner [112386]
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Re: Volcanoes emit more greenhouse gas than man could ever think
Dec 1, 2015, 6:07 PM
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there you go again, leaving fact at the curb
 "
Counter claims that volcanoes, especially submarine volcanoes, produce vastly greater amounts of CO2 than these estimates are not supported by any papers published by the scientists who study the subject.
so there is that
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Heisman Winner [112386]
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Re: Volcanoes emit more greenhouse gas than man could ever think
Dec 1, 2015, 6:07 PM
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All-TigerNet [11296]
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I'm not a climate change denier...there is no doubt
Dec 1, 2015, 4:18 PM
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it is changing. More CO2 in the atmosphere is bad, I get that, and we as humans emit alot of that stuff. We also destroy a lot of plants/forests/green space that consumes the stuff. But are we whole reason why climate change is happening...or are we just a contributing factor. And if we are merely a contributing factor....are we 1% of the reason? 20%? 50%? Scientifically, this is the question that is difficult to quantify and ultimately may not be quantifiable. So, what do?
I look at it from the perspective of being a good steward to the land. If governments were as good as individuals at stewardship, we'd be fine. However, China and India and many others like to cut corners on chit like this. So eff carbon taxes right in the beewhole, thats just an inelegant way to give money away to polluters and third world countries that don't want to pull their weight.
Seek alternative energy sources, but do it smartly. Ethanol wasn't so smart, but we did it anyway. Don't jump to a costly conclusions for the sake of just doing something. Do some real effin research on how to make alternative energies economically viable. If it's cheap, yer dang sure gonna be able to sell it to the China's and India's of the world. It's an economic solution, not an environmental solution. And plant a friggin' tree while yer at it...can't hurt.
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CU Medallion [73570]
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I'm not a climate change denier either
Dec 1, 2015, 4:39 PM
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It's constantly is changing. All the time. Just not b/c of humans.
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Rock Defender [54]
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Oculus Spirit [79606]
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I just think it's hilarious that these fools actually think
Dec 1, 2015, 4:25 PM
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these ultra rich "leaders" are going to accomplish anything that positively affects the environment with some nonsense pact. And then on top of that, presumably to rub it in our faces how stupid we are, they fly around the world in jumbo jets and arrive with a convoy of SUV's to congregate and talk about it. Really? You asssholes want me to believe you're worried about this ##### as you ride away in your fleet of Suburbans? Don't try to bullshite a bullshiter.
Anyone who thinks these people's intentions are to actually save the environment are, for lack of a better word, stupid. They are the people who send money to Nigerian princes after exchanging two emails.
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Heisman Winner [120495]
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Totally agree. In my OP
Dec 1, 2015, 4:40 PM
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i was trying to point out that if they believe China and India (especially China) are accurately reporting current state emissions, they are more foolish than I thought.
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Oculus Spirit [79606]
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I don't think any of that matters though
Dec 1, 2015, 4:44 PM
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All that matters is we do something. Anything. Gotta feel good about ourselves again.
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All-TigerNet [13605]
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Re: I don't think any of that matters though
Dec 1, 2015, 5:07 PM
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People should recycle, etc to help the environment. We do as much as we can.
(I posted a few weeks ago about our new home, well new to us.) It's actually an older home that we've restored and everything is energy efficient, we use less water and have made the home as energy efficient as possible.
And we recycle everything that we can.
I do believe climate change is real. (I'm a meteorologist by education and 12+ years experience) but I don't believe we humans are anywhere near 100% responsible.
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Oculus Spirit [98171]
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I am skeptical of any "crisis" that can only be solved
Dec 1, 2015, 6:07 PM
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by taxes and increased regulations.
I still think humanity will be wiped out by a flu pandemic or something LONG before we change the climate enough to wipe out humanity (if that's even happening).
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Heisman Winner [112386]
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Re: I am skeptical of any "crisis" that can only be solved
Dec 1, 2015, 6:22 PM
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I do not think any one is saying climate change is going to wipe out our species, just that is will be a terrible burden on future generations and will become an increasingly more expensive problem down the road.
and your argument is about as valid as saying I am going slam heroin because I will more likely die of aides before I overdose.
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Rock Defender [54]
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Re: I am skeptical of any "crisis" that can only be solved
Dec 1, 2015, 6:54 PM
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To be fair, yes some people are saying this could end our species.
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Heisman Winner [112386]
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Re: I am skeptical of any "crisis" that can only be solved
Dec 1, 2015, 7:20 PM
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maybe if you live in a 3rd world country, but not life threatening on a massive scale in developed nations.
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Oculus Spirit [98171]
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The next flu pandemic (which is long overdue)
Dec 2, 2015, 9:44 AM
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will do more to cut greenhouse gasses than all the taxes and regulations our dear leader can come up with. Or Ebola goes airborne. Or who knows what.
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Heisman Winner [112386]
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Re: The next flu pandemic (which is long overdue)
Dec 2, 2015, 7:17 PM
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welp, mosquitoes are certainly living a few months longer, you may get your wish.
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Orange Blooded [3590]
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China pollutes double the US. So lets give Obama control
Dec 1, 2015, 7:18 PM
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of the energy companies. What could possibly go wrong?
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Rock Defender [54]
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Re: China pollutes double the US. So lets give Obama control
Dec 1, 2015, 7:50 PM
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Obama isn't getting control of the energy companies. Why do you insist on saying really stupid sh*t?
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Heisman Winner [112386]
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Re: China pollutes double the US. So lets give Obama control
Dec 1, 2015, 7:55 PM
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I think Murc already illustrated this, conservatives react emotionally to issues, while liberals are rational...
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