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Topic: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks
Replies: 112   Last Post: Jan 3, 2016 12:48 PM by: deleted
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As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks

[48]
Posted: Dec 31, 2015 10:27 PM
 

I also applaud his leadership and courage to speak out.. The brotherhood and togetherness his faith brings to the program and the love they have for one another is a thing to behold. It is a big reason for our success and a true definition of family and team.

I will argue however that he is walking a fine line as a state employee, and it does make some believers and non believers alike uncomfortable in that it opens the man up to scrutiny to those looking for an avenue to criticize the program. But I also know that he and the team could care less about those voices. they are secure enough in their own faith to turn the other cheek. Some of you should take notice.

And what I am truly appalled at is the handful of you guys that made hate filled remarks, possibly you question your faith if you are not secure enough to let another express their own opinions. This also applies to the "I feel Sorry for you Crowd" We are all men of our upbringings and leaders of our own lives. Show some respect to the opinions of others and you will get that in return.

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Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks

[6]
Posted: Dec 31, 2015 10:29 PM
 

Read these two books and you want be an atheist anymore brother....

http://www.amazon.com/The-Case-Christ-Faith-books/dp/0310608821


Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks

[1]
Posted: Dec 31, 2015 10:30 PM
 

Won't* lol


Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks


Posted: Dec 31, 2015 10:39 PM
 

Yeah, keep that in the clost. Leave the rest of us alone. Pray how you prefer but don't use this as a chance to a"glory to god" Do you really think that the master of the whole universe is a Clemson fan? Get over yourself and worship the True God


Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks

[3]
Posted: Dec 31, 2015 10:47 PM
 

God cares about every aspect of our lives....

Being a football coach gives Dabo the ability to spread His word with hundreds of young men so yes God probably does pull for Clemson....


Give me a break.***


Posted: Jan 2, 2016 8:50 AM
 



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There's something in these hills.


Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks


Posted: Jan 2, 2016 9:59 AM
 

You are a Gamecock loser wtih multiple screen names.

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null


Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks

[5]
Posted: Dec 31, 2015 10:59 PM
 

I don't think Dabo is saying God is a Clemson fan. I think he's thanking him for making him the man he is. The trials and tough times as well as the success we experience can shape and mold us into the people God desires for us to be. It's all in what we choose to do...life can break us or make us.

Dabo gets the big picture and that's a very good thing! IMHO, be blessed my friend! :)


Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks

[2]
Posted: Dec 31, 2015 11:18 PM
 

I might not agree with you, but I gave you a thumbs up. I would love to feel that security from a diety but I cant. Aside from that GO TIGERS SMASH BAMA!


Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks


Posted: Dec 31, 2015 11:18 PM
 

I might not agree with you, but I gave you a thumbs up. I would love to feel that security from a diety but I cant. Aside from that GO TIGERS SMASH BAMA!


I doubt Tigerbalm wants your religious advice...***

[1]
Posted: Dec 31, 2015 11:01 PM
 




*Yawn*

[1]
Posted: Dec 31, 2015 11:04 PM
 

.

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The definition of awesome!


Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks

[4]
Posted: Jan 1, 2016 10:45 AM
 

Serious question: Shouldn't the Bible be able to stand on it's own? Why does a case have to be made for an all powerful being? Should it not be abundantly obvious?

Why do we see no physical evidence of the accounts we read about in the exodus?

Why does the Bible claim that the earth and man were created over a span of several days when the physical evidence couldn't be more clear that we evolved over billions of years?

Furthermore, Christianity is a relative new comer among religious and is certainly young compared to the human timescale.

Checkout the timelines of religions and their relation to human origins: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_religion


Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks

[1]
Posted: Jan 1, 2016 11:21 PM
 

Or maybe he would. And there is absolutely nothing wrong with that. The idea that there is only one true religion is pretty unlikely, given the many different versions of the truth there are in this world. Religion should be a personal choice for each person; the world would be a better place if everyone stopped feeling the need to convince others that their religion is the only right one.


Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks

[2]
Posted: Dec 31, 2015 10:31 PM
 

It's just your opinion. Everybody believes in something. God or no God there are things that can not be explained easily. Maybe you should search yourself as to why your an aetheist. Is it because your beliefs in science are so sure? That changes everyday. Some things are not what they always seem. It's better to believe in something than nothing.


Re: feel like chiming in on this one as a side note

[6]
Posted: Dec 31, 2015 10:48 PM
 

God and science are not mutually exclusive. I am a man of both. The deeper you get into the realities of science the more it enforces the presents of something more, something that science is good at, there is always more you don't understand. In my opinion there are two types of people who continue to use science as a reason there is no God. One, they are stubborn and their same drive in science makes them bullish against anything intangible. Two, they have so much faith that science will continue to uncover the universe that they can continue without the need of outside influences. Stubborn or just as faithful as Christians, only the faith is in a different direction. Far too many people using science as a push against God when they can easily exists at the same time and far too many Christians falling in that trap, blaming science.

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Re: feel like chiming in on this one as a side note


Posted: Dec 31, 2015 11:05 PM
 

You're trying to reason with ignorance.

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The definition of awesome!


Re: feel like chiming in on this one as a side note

[1]
Posted: Jan 1, 2016 10:14 AM
 

Usually people like you claim to believe in science but then ignore it when it contradicts your religious beliefs.

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"Smelley, Garcia, and Beecher are going to lead you to 4-8." - york_tiger


^^^^^Stereotype much???^^^^^

[1]
Posted: Jan 1, 2016 10:32 AM
 

"people like you"

That's it, put them all in a box so you know how to deal with them instead of treating everyone like an individual.

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Re: feel like chiming in on this one as a side note


Posted: Jan 2, 2016 10:03 AM
 

Great comment fully agree


Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks

[7]
Posted: Dec 31, 2015 10:31 PM
 

As a Christian I can appreciate your post and agree that this teams faith is the glue that holds them together. And you are also correct in that it is not Christ like to belittle any mans belief. I don't believe anyone was ever led to Christ by calling him names. God Bless you and wish you a happy new year and especially Go Tigers!


As a Jedi, neither do I***

[3]
Posted: Dec 31, 2015 10:32 PM
 



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As an atheist ...


Posted: Dec 31, 2015 10:41 PM
 

do you hope you are right?

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Re: As an atheist ...

[6]
Posted: Dec 31, 2015 10:44 PM
 

no, it is really not about being right to me.

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ok, so do you hope you are right?***


Posted: Dec 31, 2015 11:06 PM
 

I mean if you have an opinion, do you hope it's the right one?


Message was edited by: dw1959®


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the golden rule is lost on most Christians.


Posted: Dec 31, 2015 11:07 PM
 

No way unconditional love will come your way when you identify yourself as a "non-believer."

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The definition of awesome!


Re: the golden rule is lost on most Christians.


Posted: Jan 1, 2016 3:06 PM
 

That's just it, though. If you don't believe that heaven exists, there's almost certainly no motivation for seeking the sort of unconditional love you're referring to.

In essence, there doesn't have to be one right answer to the question.


If it's 'unconditional' you don't have to seek it.


Posted: Jan 2, 2016 3:59 AM
 

It just is.

God as defined by Christianity is actually quite incompatible with the idea of a God which loves human beings unconditionally. He has many conditions. Some of them pretty silly if we're being honest.

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Re: As an atheist ...

[1]
Posted: Dec 31, 2015 11:12 PM
 

But Tiger Balm, that 'stache and hairdo are a gift from God.


do you hope you are right?

[2]
Posted: Dec 31, 2015 10:47 PM
 

What if billions of Muslims are right?

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Re: do you hope you are right?

[1]
Posted: Dec 31, 2015 10:51 PM
 

There's far more proof for Christianity and Jesus....


Haha, this is awesome***


Posted: Dec 31, 2015 11:02 PM
 




that's not the question


Posted: Dec 31, 2015 11:05 PM
 

it's a simple yes or no...

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Re: that's not the question

[2]
Posted: Dec 31, 2015 11:48 PM
 

Rarely is an aetheist converted by debate. The vast majority of un-believers are converted by Christians demonstrating and showing the Love of Christ to the un-believer.


He is not treading the line though

[3]
Posted: Dec 31, 2015 10:46 PM
 

It is free speech to say what you want. He is not forcing that on someone else. If he said glory to the great spaghetti monster, that would be his right as well.

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Re: He is not treading the line though

[2]
Posted: Dec 31, 2015 10:49 PM
 

as a state employee he is walking a line. there will be those that will see him using his position to influence the religious beliefs of his players. I believe him when he says that he does nto use his position to influence those who are not believers on the team, nor that he exclusively recruits players that are.

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Re: He is not treading the line though


Posted: Dec 31, 2015 11:02 PM
 

I still think that the first amendment protects him from saying, "I give the glory to God". It is not even of question, if so, folks like the FFRF would be petitioning against that. I think Clemson's lawyers already shut them down once.

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Re: He is not treading the line though


Posted: Dec 31, 2015 11:04 PM
 

he can totally say that, I agree. But again, as a state employee, if it were to be proven he was using his position to influence the religious beliefs of the team, there would be problems. IE, kicking a player off the team for their beliefs, or using team meetings as a time to preach religeon. You and I know this is not the case.

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He is not barred from seeking to influence his players


Posted: Jan 2, 2016 12:27 AM
 

the barnacles of case law that have grown up around this topic are rootless jurisprudential fabrications grounded firmly in mid-air. There is no logical coexistence of the First Amendment and any system of case or administrative law that suggests he's barred from seeking to influence his players.


Impressed by your comments, often atheists just want to make

[3]
Posted: Dec 31, 2015 10:48 PM
 

fun of believers. To each his own.

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Re: Impressed by your comments, often atheists just want to make

[4]
Posted: Dec 31, 2015 10:50 PM
 

I make fun of everyone, including myself.

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Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks

[2]
Posted: Dec 31, 2015 10:52 PM
 

I'm a non believer as well but I have no problem with someone else's beliefs. My kids go to Catholic school.

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Wow. Catholic school by day

[1]
Posted: Dec 31, 2015 11:09 PM
 

and non-believer by night. What chance do your kids have????? ;)

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The definition of awesome!


Re: Wow. Catholic school by day


Posted: Jan 1, 2016 3:12 PM
 

Maybe that they'll seek knowledge for themselves in favor of indoctrination?

Some of the smug comments you've made in this thread is the type of attitude that is directly responsible for the rebellious, "it's cool to be atheist" tone in today's youth. People are tired of the passive-aggressive proselytizing, and I would say that the jury isn't even out on that.

Doing what you're doing doesn't help anyone.


Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks

[2]
Posted: Dec 31, 2015 10:53 PM
 

Are you really an Atheist or an Agnostic? Big difference.

Me myself, I believe in a higher power. Just not convinced just one religion has got it right.


Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks

[2]
Posted: Dec 31, 2015 10:58 PM
 

not something I can answer. i have my opinion on the purpose religion is intended to serve, and I will keep that to myself with exception to a select few. However I was raised Cathlic and have experienced the joy and security it can bring into a person's life. Where i have a problem is when it is used to define policies that affect everyone, and used to create fear of outside beliefs. Look no further than the persecution of Muslims in this country.

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Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks


Posted: Dec 31, 2015 11:11 PM
 

How about the persecution of Christians in this country and across the world???


No religion is actually persecuted in the United States.


Posted: Jan 2, 2016 4:03 AM
 

It's one of the many things which this country gets right.

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It's a shame that anyone thinks Dabo is walking a thin line


Posted: Dec 31, 2015 10:58 PM
 

because of his faith. People of no faith wants everything that Dabo represents to be suppressed because they feel threatened somehow by his expression of faith and feels like he should not have that freedom.

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Re: It's a shame that anyone thinks Dabo is walking a thin line


Posted: Dec 31, 2015 10:59 PM
 

only as a state employee. If religious institutions can be tax exempt, then my taxes should be exempt of religious institutions. The Supreme Court has already ruled on this.

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Tigerbalm, I feel your pain


Posted: Dec 31, 2015 11:11 PM
 

For the first twenty five years of me paying taxes, I had no kids in school, but a certain percentage of my taxes went to local education. My point is, our government makes us pay for a lot of things we do not want or agree with.

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You didn't want your fellow citizens to be educated?***


Posted: Jan 2, 2016 4:04 AM
 



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Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks

[3]
Posted: Dec 31, 2015 11:03 PM
 

People have no respect for the principles that this country are founded on. Freedom of speech and freedom of religion are the cornerstone of the foundation of our Country. You do not have a right to not be offended, but you do have a right to believe what you want and express that belief.

Nowhere in the Constitution does it restrict that right because you are a state of federal employee. The first amendment says "CONGRESS shall MAKE NO LAW respecting the ESTABLISHMENT of religion OR PROHIBITING the free exercise thereof..."

A college football coach giving glory to God is a far cry from Congress making a law requiring everyone to give glory to God.

It's a shame that the Constitution and real history are no longer taught in schools.

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Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks


Posted: Dec 31, 2015 11:50 PM
 

I fully agree.


Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks


Posted: Jan 1, 2016 10:58 AM
 

> People have no respect for the principles that this country are founded on. Freedom of speech and freedom of religion are the cornerstone of the foundation of our Country. You do not have a right to not be offended, but you do have a right to believe what you want and express that belief.

I agree, but freedom of religion includes the right to not be religious at all and your right to express those beliefs are equally protected. This seems to be lost on a lot of people.

> Nowhere in the Constitution does it restrict that right because you are a state of federal employee. The first amendment says "CONGRESS shall MAKE NO LAW respecting the ESTABLISHMENT of religion OR PROHIBITING the free exercise thereof..."

Agree

> A college football coach giving glory to God is a far cry from Congress making a law requiring everyone to give glory to God.

And I don't think most people have an issue with that. I know I personally don't. However, I think the issue some people have is that it appears that Dabo forces this on players. I don't think that's the case but it is a perception.

> It's a shame that the Constitution and real history are no longer taught in schools.

That's not the only thing we are lacking in schools today... I watched a high school senior struggle to fill out a check. It's literally fill in the blank people...


i'm all right with it. I just think it's a little silly to


Posted: Dec 31, 2015 11:05 PM
 

"give all the glory to God" over a football game. God couldn't give a Corso about football.


Re: i'm all right with it. I just think it's a little silly to


Posted: Dec 31, 2015 11:06 PM
 

he was caught up in the moment, that is how i saw it.

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You right it is silly to be offended by Dabo giving thanks.


Posted: Dec 31, 2015 11:44 PM
 

Ever thought of just not watching post game?

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in the end, I think we all are going to be a bit surprised


Posted: Jan 1, 2016 10:49 AM
 

at the things God was interested in during our lives..

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Re: in the end, I think we all are going to be a bit surprised

[1]
Posted: Jan 1, 2016 10:53 AM
 

It will definitely be about clemson winning a national title and not starving kids in africa or genocidal atrocities happening across the globe...

/s


that's a silly statement...


Posted: Jan 1, 2016 10:55 AM
 

and an obvious retort.

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Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks

[2]
Posted: Dec 31, 2015 11:26 PM
 

Maybe you can shed some light on a question I have. I have only known one person that I would say is a true aetheist. I have know many who say they are. The one true Aetheist was not in the least offended by God, the mention of God, prayer, etc. etc. He would actually join us in prayer before our SWAT team executed raids or hostage rescues. He was not in the least bothered or offended by other people's exercise of their belief in God. His usual reply was "it does not bother me, yall waste your time praying and going to church; I waste my time playing golf and smoking cigarettes." Why is a person one truly does not believe in offensive to him? He also believed that the Supreme Court incorrectly interpreted the COTUS. He quite often said "The Bill of Rights guarantees freedom of religion, it plainly gives no guarantee of freedom from religion."
Why does someone that a person believes does not exist offend him?


Message was edited by: reynolds357®



Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks

[1]
Posted: Jan 1, 2016 10:28 AM
 

Just because your friend was willing to give up his constitutional rights doesn't mean all atheists should be willing to give up their constitutional rights.

It's an irrational argument.

I doubt you would be willing to give up your rights if your boss required you to attend mosque as part of your job even though you don't believe in the Islamic version of God.

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"Smelley, Garcia, and Beecher are going to lead you to 4-8." - york_tiger


Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks


Posted: Jan 1, 2016 10:32 AM
 

Shocking Classless09 is wrong about something else.

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null


Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks


Posted: Jan 1, 2016 11:11 PM
 

I would change jobs.


Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks


Posted: Jan 1, 2016 11:15 PM
 

If you want to know what The Constitution means, you should look at the actions of the founders, the men who signed The Constitution. They prayed before each daily session of the house. They prayed before each daily session of the Senate. They had church in the Rotunda. They put Christian images all over their buildings. They even used the armed services band to play in their church services they held at The Capital. You think the men who signed The Constitution did not know what it meant? Judges 200 years later know what it means and the men who wrote it did not?


Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks


Posted: Jan 2, 2016 9:47 AM
 

I don't think you understand societal pressure. The country was almost entirely a Protestant Christian nation. A lot of those actions were for show.

The same way a lot of leaders today profess their Christian faith but don't actually believe it.

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"Smelley, Garcia, and Beecher are going to lead you to 4-8." - york_tiger


Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks


Posted: Jan 2, 2016 9:54 AM
 

It's bad enough we have to argue about football with you but now religion? Don't you guys have enough to worry about with Muschamp recruiting all of these worldbeaters? If I were you I would direct my prayer effort toward Columbia and the lost souls at Willy B before I worried about a few Clemson fans who may not share your worldview.

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Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks


Posted: Jan 2, 2016 10:25 PM
 

This is in response to a thread. I did not start the thread. From its title, you know what the subject content will be. If you do not like it, don't read it.


Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks


Posted: Jan 2, 2016 10:24 PM
 

Whether they were or were not "for show" is not the point. The point is the men who ratified The Constitution did the very things that you and the fools who sit on the Supreme Court say The Constitution prohibited. Who do you think better knows what The Constitution means, the men who wrote it or men who read it 200+ years later?


Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks


Posted: Jan 2, 2016 10:27 PM
 

The people who wrote the constitution also owned slaves.

College Football would be pretty boring if we continued to follow those old guys who wrote the constitution.

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"Smelley, Garcia, and Beecher are going to lead you to 4-8." - york_tiger


Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks


Posted: Jan 2, 2016 11:08 PM
 

Slavery was specifically changed by an Amendment to The Constitution. Their actions were clear when it came to the exercise of religion. If activist courts can change The Constitution, then we have no true rights in this nation.


There is no freedom of religion without


Posted: Jan 2, 2016 4:07 AM
 

freedom from religion. To be free to exercise your beliefs, whatever they may be, you must be free from having another religion imposed upon you.

That is not the same as a freedom from ever hearing about religion or seeing other people practice theirs, which would be asinine.

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Sweetheart, turn the volume off if you are offended!!!!***


Posted: Dec 31, 2015 11:46 PM
 



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Ooh a condescending Christian... how surprising.


Posted: Jan 1, 2016 10:46 AM
 

I'm sure you would say the exact same thing if Dabo was preaching another religion.


Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks

[1]
Posted: Jan 1, 2016 12:04 AM
 

Tigerbalm1, Thank You for your understanding in this issue. Your post was a Blessing to read and I applaud you in your Wisdom and Knowledge that you expressed in your opinion in the matter at hand. Everyone has his or her own beliefs and is entitled to them. I am a True Believer in God and not afraid to express my Faith. I am not trying to push my beliefs on anyone. I just wish more people had the understanding that you showed and allow a man to give Thanks to God when he so chooses. As for me, I Thank God for giving Our Clemson Tigers Every Win They Have This Season.
I hope that I have not Offended You by my post and I wish you the Very Best in 2016, Happy New Year Friend!!!


Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks


Posted: Jan 1, 2016 10:31 AM
 

You have no idea what Freedom of Religion means.

Him believing in god and expressing that belief in no way shape or form is him establishing it as a state religion.

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Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks

[2]
Posted: Jan 1, 2016 10:34 AM
 

As a believer I am grateful for your remarks and I'm disappointed that someone used the opportunity to hit you over the head with books.

Thanks for being open minded and accepting.


I totallyyyyy SUPPORT DABO's remarks


Posted: Jan 1, 2016 10:36 AM
 

to GOD..."GOD" !!!
Be the glory.

#21


Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks


Posted: Jan 1, 2016 10:45 AM
 

I was raised in a very religious environment, and have always believed that one should not seek personal glory. When Dabo said something like "To God be the glory" - that's how I have lived my entire life and totally agree with Dabo.

That said - I can understand that many do not believe in the teachings in The Bible as some things are pretty far-fetched. However, even if you don't believe everything, if everyone followed the teachings in The Bible, it would be amazing how few policemen, military, lawyers, etc that we would need. There would be no stealing, lying, adultery, etc - and we would all just get along. :)

Simple - huh? I have given you the secret to life, but it's like leading a horse to water. Good luck with that. :)


Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks


Posted: Jan 1, 2016 10:52 AM
 

> However, even if you don't believe everything, if everyone followed the teachings in The Bible, it would be amazing how few policemen, military, lawyers, etc that we would need.

If you are referring to the ten-commands as the teaching in the Bible then sure, the world would be a better place. But those aren't the only teachings in the bible.

Furthermore God himself commanded military engagements all of the time. Seems to me that if he wanted peace that would be an easy thing for him to accomplish.

Before the "but free will" arguments come in, let me ask a simple question. Will heaven be peaceful? If so, how is that accomplishable without trouncing free will and yet it's not possible here on earth? Why was the violent nature of earth necessary at all? That makes zero sense.

Also, seems like things aren't perfect their either if the greatest angel of all became the devil...

What does make sense out of the violence is that were are simply in a natural environment where the fittest survive and unfortunately that requires a lot of violence. No silly stories needed to explain that.


Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks


Posted: Jan 1, 2016 11:02 AM
 

'For my thoughts are not your thoughts,
neither are your ways my ways,”
declares the Lord.
“As the heavens are higher than the earth,
so are my ways higher than your ways
and my thoughts than your thought.'

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Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks

[2]
Posted: Jan 1, 2016 11:07 AM
 

"Don't question me"

Of course a religious document would say something like that no?

Skepticism is a good thing. Are you telling me we should believe the Bible simply because it says to do so? How do we know it's true?


you are certainly welcome to judge the good Lord....


Posted: Jan 1, 2016 11:10 AM
 

we got that ability a long time ago.

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Re: you are certainly welcome to judge the good Lord....

[2]
Posted: Jan 1, 2016 11:18 AM
 

I'm not "judging the good lord" any more than you are "judging Allah" or "judging buddah". You easily dismiss those religious ideologies on the basis of what I assume is a lack of evidence. Why is it incorrect for me to do the same with the Bible?

You are claiming that the words of the Bible are true, I'm simply being skeptical and asking you why you think they are?

To be clear, I have no problem at all with you or your religious beliefs. If you want to believe it simply because it says you should that is your prerogative. Just don't me out to be a bad person because it's hard to believe such incredible stories that don't have any evidence that they actually occurred.


where did i ever say you were a bad person...?


Posted: Jan 1, 2016 3:09 PM
 

> I'm not "judging the good lord" any more than you are
> "judging Allah" or "judging buddah". You easily
> dismiss those religious ideologies on the basis of
> what I assume is a lack of evidence. Why is it
> incorrect for me to do the same with the Bible?
>
> You are claiming that the words of the Bible are
> true, I'm simply being skeptical and asking you why
> you think they are?
>
> To be clear, I have no problem at all with you or
> your religious beliefs. If you want to believe it
> simply because it says you should that is your
> prerogative. Just don't me out to be a bad person
> because it's hard to believe such incredible stories
> that don't have any evidence that they actually
> occurred.

and I never said anything negative about you either. And you reading into my statement that I'm dismissing other religions, that's a stretch and knee jerk response.

What I meant by the statement you are free to judge the Good Lord simply means you can believe or not believe, Him and His word, that's all.

So, I'm going to let it go at this because faith can be a very difficult thing to explain to a nonbeliever...especially on a sports board.

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Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks


Posted: Jan 1, 2016 11:20 PM
 

Free will on earth and free will in Heaven have nothing to do with each other. Man's free will in this life allows him to choose to be in Heaven with Jesus. There is no tempter in Heaven. There is no sin in Heaven. There is no sin nature in man's perfected state in Heaven.


Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks


Posted: Jan 2, 2016 9:08 AM
 

Then how do you explain lucifer leaving heaven if all was so perfect?


Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks


Posted: Jan 2, 2016 10:26 PM
 

You must lack understanding of dispensations.


I didn't know there was a controversy is


Posted: Jan 1, 2016 10:52 AM
 

Soemthing going on?


Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks

[1]
Posted: Jan 1, 2016 11:00 AM
 

Wow, I applaud your understanding and acceptance, particularly about this topic. Growing up in a devoted Christian family, I find your comments to be very fair. I have no problems with atheists unless my beliefs are being attacked. It's a shame that in this day and time people have to hide their beliefs in a closet. As far as Dabo, he's real about who he is and that's why we are playing for the NC. We don't get one without the other so, If they want Dabo to shove his beliefs in a closet then make room for the trophy too.

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Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks


Posted: Jan 1, 2016 11:11 AM
 

"It's a shame that in this day and time people have to hide their beliefs in a closet. "

I'm consistently shocked that this idea is brought up. Most of this country is religious and our leaders openly acknowledge their Christianity. Christianity has a HUGE influence on our society and politics.

Not only that, it is socially acceptable for candidates to denounce whole religious groups that aren't christians and you won't see an openly atheist candidate get elected any time soon.

Who says Dabo has to "shove his beliefs in a closet"? A few people on a message forum? Last I checked, the school or government hasn't shut him down. If you want to bring up the FFRF that's fine but they are by far in the minority.

What is the source of this persecution complex that runs amok among Christians? You are arguable the most powerful entity in the country.


Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks

[1]
Posted: Jan 1, 2016 2:06 PM
 

If he's not expected to conceal his beliefs, then why are Clemson fans complaining at a time like this? Yes this country has a strong christian presence..no different than other nations based on their founders or conquerors. This is rapidly changing if you haven't noticed. Happy holidays is the politically correct greeting these days. Btw, how was your Christmas? Nativity scenes are banned from public property and the ten commandments are being removed from courthouses. Yes, some politicians are open about their religion.They are also held to a standard than their detractors. Watch John Stewart rip and ridicule Christians because of their beliefs or inability to live by them daily. Watch the National Organization for Women attack chauvinist Christian men while remaining silent about the treatment of women by Islamist. Atheists are vocal about their beliefs however arbitrary those might be. If you are bothered about one's recognition of God then shouldn't we be offended by your lack of faith. We are taught not to judge for there is only one judge who is in heaven above. On what basis are you not to judge others?

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Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks

[1]
Posted: Jan 1, 2016 2:57 PM
 

> If he's not expected to conceal his beliefs, then why are Clemson fans complaining at a time like this?

Some people simply don't like someone with his position of authority bring religion into the mix. I don't know what to tell you.

I don't have any problem with someone professing their beliefs. As long as he's not making it a requirement or alienating people with it, I couldn't care less.

> Yes this country has a strong christian presence..no different than other nations based on their founders or conquerors. This is rapidly changing if you haven't noticed.

I mean, I have seen statistics showing that people are becoming less religious. That comes with the territory as we have more access to information via the internet. I fail to see where people's religious rights are being stifled though.

> Nativity scenes are banned from public property and the ten commandments are being removed from courthouses.

Would you have a problem with a buddhist statue, the flying spaghetti monster or even a satanic symbol of some kind right next to it? Other religions are just a free to practice in this country as you are. So it really should be all or nothing. Also, it says there should be no establishment of religion so why should religious items be displayed in our courthouses at all?

> Watch John Stewart rip and ridicule Christians because of their beliefs or inability to live by them daily.

So? I thought freedom of speech was a good thing. Let me know when John Stewart starts advocating for the removal of religious rights and you'll have my attention.

> Watch the National Organization for Women attack chauvinist Christian men while remaining silent about the treatment of women by Islamist.

Now here you may have a point. I am not familiar with that situation but if there is a double standard there then that needs to be addressed.

> Atheists are vocal about their beliefs however arbitrary those might be. If you are bothered about one's recognition of God then shouldn't we be offended by your lack of faith.

This goes both ways. There are jerks on both sides.

> We are taught not to judge for there is only one judge who is in heaven above. On what basis are you not to judge others?

You are referencing a biblical command to not judge another person's heart; i.e. you don't know if they really know Jesus or not. It does not state that you can't judge another's character or actions.

I don't have a written set of rules to live by if that's what you are asking. Morality exists outside of religion.


Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks


Posted: Jan 1, 2016 3:52 PM
 

>Also, it says there should be no establishment of religion so why should religious items be displayed in our courthouses at all?

That's correct. The Government is not allowed to discriminate based on religious beliefs. Symbols of Christian faith on public property is not infringing on rights. By the way,all men are created equal; that they are endowed by their Creator with inherent and inalienable rights. This was the greatest event in human rights and civil liberties to date. Rights were no longer based on race and privilege. The intent of "no establishment of religion" was to prevent the theocracy that many suffered under before coming to America. The men who signed this very amendment were the same who put the ten commandments in the courts, in God we trust on money, and the commandments in the courts. I think they understood the intent. This is a Judaeo Christian country that allows all people to worship freely. Why are the ten commandments specifically in the courts? How do you determine what's right and wrong? Based on what? You may think that my stealing from you should be illegal, while I think that I'm providing for my family. Be thankful for the Christian nation in which you live. Complain about the fornication by government and religion in the middle east.

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Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks

[1]
Posted: Jan 1, 2016 9:23 PM
 

> The intent of "no establishment of religion" was to prevent the theocracy that many suffered under before coming to America. The men who signed this very amendment were the same who put the ten commandments in the courts, in God we trust on money, and the commandments in the courts.

The bill of rights, which includes the first amendment you are referring to was adopted back in 1791. "In God We Trust" first appeared on coins in the 1860s. They were certainly not the same people.

Furthermore, the founding fathers did not found this country on the basis of Christianity as is so often mis-stated.

"The government of the United States is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion."
--John Adams

You may also not be aware that "under God" was not even always part of our pledge of allegiance that people keep fighting over. That was added in the 1950's.

> The intent of "no establishment of religion" was to prevent the theocracy that many suffered under before coming to America.

Indeed it was.

> This is a Judaeo Christian country that allows all people to worship freely.

No, it's not. It's a secular country that allows you to practice whichever religion you wish. No establishment of religion means exactly that.

> Why are the ten commandments specifically in the courts? How do you determine what's right and wrong? Based on what?

You are trying to state that there is no morality apart from religion which is simply not true. Are you telling me the only reason you don't murder is because the bible says so? Of course not.


Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks

[1]
Posted: Jan 1, 2016 9:56 PM
 

I usually don't comment on religion because it's a fools argument either way. It's a matter of the heart and it's like calling the woman a man loves fat. My personal beliefs I will keep just that as personal but since this really is about our head ball coach and not our beliefs here goes;
Part and Parcel to the system that Dabo has in place is rooted in a strong faith based system. He is taking a diverse group of young men from many different backgrounds. Some have strong families and personal beliefs some not at all. He brings them in and gives them a strong sense of belonging, belief and family away from home. It's working and that is a fact. Not saying it is the only way but it is a valid way and is defying the odds. That said I support not only Dabo the man, but his entire system and it is another form of disrespect by ESPN, ABC, CBS and anyone else to cut off anything he thinks is important.

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Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks


Posted: Jan 2, 2016 9:10 AM
 

To be clear, I don't have any problems with Dabo or his methods. As long as he's not making it a requirement or forcing it on others, which I don't believe he is, then that is fine with me.

The results speak for themselves.


Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks


Posted: Jan 2, 2016 11:13 PM
 

Let's just end this, we live in a country were people can say and feel whatever they want. Move on, your beliefs can not be forced on anyone; in fact the opposite will probably result with that thinking with even trying. Go tigers! Nuff said

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Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks


Posted: Jan 2, 2016 12:16 AM
 

ok. At the Constitutional conference they were unable to come to an agreement, so they convened in order to go home and pray. They then returned and signed the second greatest writings in history. You've absent mindlessly forgotten to address the fact that they gave human rights to classes of people never before recognized or protected. The very equality and freedom that you express dates back to the rights every soul possesses from being created. Ignore the significance if you must but that was a landmark opinion worldwide.

Not Judaeo Christian? Then what belief system? Why all the historical references? Why swear upon a bible? If you can't understand religious persecution then you haven't studied your history. Wait, history isn't needed only to look at atrocities committed over seas. Do you turn a blind eye to the 300 school girls made into sex slaves and raped mothers? Who comes to the rescue? Impressive who you choose to battle with, considering the plight around the world. God forbid that someone mention God. The evidence is too great to argue over a forum. Secular? I suggest you read the Constitution and tour Washington with someone who can point out the obvious references that you apparently miss.

Absolutely, there is no morality without God. Who decides the terms? you? A consensus? I can think of a few countries that the opinion of the masses probably wouldn't set well with you. There are people that want to slaughter you...hello sympathizing reporter for Islam Daniel Pearl.

Fortunately, it will be decades before you people destroy this country. By then, I won't care about the medical advances to extended to me.

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Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks


Posted: Jan 2, 2016 9:20 AM
 

>Absolutely, there is no morality without God. Who decides the terms? you? A consensus? I can think of a few countries that the opinion of the masses probably wouldn't set well with you. There are people that want to slaughter you...hello sympathizing reporter for Islam Daniel Pearl.

You realize people existed long before christianity came into the picture right? Our morality evolved as we did. It's a scary thought that you have to be told that killing or stealing from others is wrong. When you live in a society, it is not beneficial to kill or steal from others (for the most part, people obviously still do for selfish reasons). Is it really so hard to image that a set of rules like this organically game into place?

The bible also gave explicit rules on how to treat your slaves or to that you have to marry a woman you have raped. That doesn't sound like a supernatural judge of morality to me.

Let me ask you this, if God told you to kill me, would you do it?

>Fortunately, it will be decades before you people destroy this country. By then, I won't care about the medical advances to extended to me.

This saddens me, it truly does. There was no fairy-tale perfect christian nation that the "atheist liberals" destroyed. The ultra-conservative thing tanks are obviously doing a phenomenal job.


Love a balm post i can TU!


Posted: Jan 1, 2016 11:09 AM
 

Go Tigers!


As a non-Christian, I say anyone who had a problem with

[3]
Posted: Jan 1, 2016 11:16 AM
 

what Dabo said is being a little b***h.

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Sums it up.**


Posted: Jan 2, 2016 6:31 AM
 

nm

2020 white level member

The avenue to criticize should be

[5]
Posted: Jan 1, 2016 11:20 AM
 

Wide open AND flow both ways. That is how a country as large and diverse as ours survives. It's called freedom. He can thank Allah or Mars. Doesn't matter. We won the game.

All in!

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- MauldinT
"Tiggi­ty is like finding a high-motor, Dabo five star heart guy. Underrated by the recruiting services, sort of like a Dorian O'Daniel."


Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks

[1]
Posted: Jan 1, 2016 2:27 PM
 

I am one as well. I have no problem with anything Dabo does.

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Re: As an aetheist, I have no problem with Swinney's remarks


Posted: Jan 1, 2016 9:54 PM
 

I applaud him for giving glory to God. As a Christian....we need more of that in this country.

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He's not walking a fine line at all

[1]
Posted: Jan 2, 2016 12:23 AM
 

There is no law, nor should there be, obliging those in government to keep their religion to themselves. The Establishment Clause, the Jeffersonian-worded reference to it ("Separation of church and state"), never did any such thing and were never intended to. Any rendering that suggests otherwise is fabricated from whole cloth.

Swinney isn't walking a fine line. Not at all.


I agree completely

[2]
Posted: Jan 2, 2016 1:29 AM
 

Free speech has nothing to do with this situation. I guess I'm not sure when you have a problem when a coach/professor/public employee starts promoting a certain religion. Taxpayers don't pay for that. Again, that doesn't mean Dabo did something wrong.

As far as religious beliefs go: Religion plays a huge role in people's lives; I recognize that. It creates camaraderie and is a consistent reminder of how to be a decent person. As a non-believer, I appreciate that.

With that said, the condescending tone from religious people gets completely old. I don't know how anyone can think their beliefs are more founded than someone else's. No one knows anything. Christianity is a young religion with similar stories to older belief systems. Get over it. The idea that you're persecuted is laughable. You have a better chance of being elected president as a hat black woman than an atheist


I an atheist and I love Dabo's faith.


Posted: Jan 2, 2016 6:28 AM
 

I am happy for him. I love seeing people happy. The joy that comes from that guy is so inspiring. I wouldn't change a thing about Dabo.

2020 white level member

If they were "uncomfortable"

[2]
Posted: Jan 2, 2016 8:40 AM
 

then they are uncomfortable living here at all, going anywhere, doing anything, because people talk, pray, gather in all kinds of places, celebrate holidays like Christmas, go to church, and every form of (Christian) expression imaginable in this country, in very possible venue, yes, state and government venues as well, even on TV and politics. So they either would have to live in complete isolation, or put up with "uncomfortableness" everywhere. And there are UMPTEEN occasions where athletes and coaches give "glory to God" in interviews, celebrations after touchdowns, etc. It goes on an on. I suggest move out of the country and go live in a Muslim country if a person truly is that discomfortingly "uncomfortable."


Re: If they were "uncomfortable"


Posted: Jan 3, 2016 12:48 PM
 

If Dabo was a muslim or had any other religious affiliation, would you be making the same remarks?

I highly doubt it. In fact, i suspect there would be a lot of backlash if he were quoting the quran.


With all the cussing and swearing on tv


Posted: Jan 3, 2016 11:12 AM
 

But that's not offensive?


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