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110%er [7179]
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How to Build Championship Roster in Today's FBS?
Dec 5, 2022, 7:44 PM
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How do you do it?
Dabo likes to call Clemson a developmental program. Which is 100% accurate.
Players like:
James Skalski
Isiah Simmons
K'von Wallace
Grady Jarrett
Hunter Renfrow
Vic Beasley
Travis Etienne(rivals)
Nolan Turner
Tanner Muse
etc.
A ton of players who waited and developed behind higher ranked players. Stayed on campus and got bigger and stronger and better until they became household names.
How would you do it with the fluid nature of college football?
Can a program build that way in today's landscape? Can Clemson?
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All-TigerNet [10400]
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Re: How to Build Championship Roster in Today's FBS?
Dec 5, 2022, 7:45 PM
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Sadly I don’t think so anymore.
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110%er [7179]
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Re: How to Build Championship Roster in Today's FBS?
Dec 5, 2022, 7:50 PM
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Sadly I don’t think so anymore.
Hmmm! I think it can still be done. But, it's going to take a good talker and someone who can get people to believe > Dabo!
Now.
It will also take some NIL money. Perhaps some on field success that backs up the desire of transfers to want to come to your school. Will also need to have an open door policy toward transfers.
I believe Dabo when he says, "it depends on where we are and what we need and what the circustances are"! IF we lose players unexpectedly, I suspect we do look in the portal like everyone else"! By virtue of the fact, we were 1 of only like 5 schools not to lose a kid after spring to the portal - we didn't have a need.
But, to your point, I see why it may seem like we can't. Kind of weird now.
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Orange Blooded [2248]
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Re: How to Build Championship Roster in Today's FBS?
Dec 6, 2022, 6:17 AM
[ in reply to Re: How to Build Championship Roster in Today's FBS? ] |
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I believe that building a roster today is more nuanced, but it is still basically the same. Ruke would have been considered a project and still isn't a starter here if everybody is healthy. He will be drafted in the spring. Our only 100 yard receiving game came from Cole Turner who would be considered a project. Davis Allen would have been considered a project.
I would argue that it is not the projects that you have to worry about jumping ship as much as the high school stars that realize major college football is a different game. They come to town thinking they will dominate and take the easy way out and transfer rather than compete. Maybe that is unfair of me to say since I think Bentley and Pace competed but found themselves behind unusually good young talent. Sometimes I guess they just realize they are behind people that they will not surpass.
Anyhow, I think that today you can still find the projects, which more often than not is just undervalued talent from the G5 and FCS programs. I know that Dabo, to an extent, thinks that it shows lack of faith in recruits to bring somebody in from the outside, but we will not hesitate to try and bring in competition from the high school level. Hopefully, soon we will see some of our projects coming with a little college experience.
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Walk-On [128]
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Re: How to Build Championship Roster in Today's FBS?
Dec 5, 2022, 7:46 PM
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break out the Benji's.
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All-In [48334]
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Re: How to Build Championship Roster in Today's FBS?
Dec 5, 2022, 7:48 PM
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T A&M says not so fast my friend.
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110%er [7179]
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Re: How to Build Championship Roster in Today's FBS?
Dec 5, 2022, 7:55 PM
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T A&M says not so fast my friend.
A&M is proof positive that just having an assembly of talent does not guarantee wins. You also have to have a good "team"!
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Legend [19694]
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Said this same thing last year
Dec 5, 2022, 7:49 PM
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few wanted Cole Turner last year. We redshirted guys like Oliver, Griffin, Lawson, Sapp, Adams, McCleod. Developmental guys willing to put in the work for 2-3 years. Take some of these guys every year and hit on 2-4, you have the depth you need.
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110%er [7179]
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Re: Said this same thing last year
Dec 5, 2022, 7:54 PM
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few wanted Cole Turner last year. We redshirted guys like Oliver, Griffin, Lawson, Sapp, Adams, McCleod. Developmental guys willing to put in the work for 2-3 years. Take some of these guys every year and hit on 2-4, you have the depth you need.
striperfan I agree with you as long as they stay! I think the key will be having that voice that is constantly in their head countering what these players are hearing outside the program: "you have always been the man and they aren't playing you, you can start over ther, etc"! I think it's doable as long as people are very good at communicating "what's real"! Like - we are grooming you to be the man; but you aren't ready yet. Probably being said now, but you have to say it and mean it. I think we do that well!
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Orange Blooded [2861]
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Re: Said this same thing last year
Dec 5, 2022, 11:05 PM
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I want them to stay however everyone that has left so far makes sense for them and the program.
For example, Pace is good enough to start or be a good contributing split time back somewhere.
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110%er [7179]
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Re: Said this same thing last year
Dec 5, 2022, 11:15 PM
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I want them to stay however everyone that has left so far makes sense for them and the program.
For example, Pace is good enough to start or be a good contributing split time back somewhere.
I agree about Pace.
I think Swint needs to go to a smaller school or switch to LB. AT 239 lbs and not having elite speed at 6'3; can he be an impactful DE for a NC hopeful program like Clemson?
EJ Williams - we all know he has potential if he can stay healthy. He is the one I will be looking for the most to explode on the scene for a new team.
Vonta Bentley too could be a impact player in the right defense.
I am not upset or think bad about any of the players who transferred personally. We just need to figure out how to continue being among the best with the current landscape of college football.
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Legend [19694]
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Of the guys we've had leave this year
Dec 6, 2022, 6:39 AM
[ in reply to Re: Said this same thing last year ] |
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the only 3 star guys or less when they were recruited I believe were Pace and Wiles. DJ and Davis were 5 stars. The 4-5 star who winds up not playing seems more likely to leave to me than the 3 star or less who understands they have some work to do. The guys you listed fit this profile' as do many, many more. It's why I didn't list Story as he is a 4 star redshirting.
I may be wrong, but I think there are more 3 stars in the NFL than 4 and 5 combined. It's just where the bulk of recruits fall. We know there are great players in that mix, along with solid contributors.
If you are going to have 8-10-12 guys transfer out every year, signing classes will be larger on average. This is where seeing a guy's potential that 2-3 years down the road comes in. We've historically been very good at that. These are your program guys who by and large really love Clemson and really want to be here and no where else
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Standout [342]
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Re: Said this same thing last year
Dec 5, 2022, 8:18 PM
[ in reply to Said this same thing last year ] |
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the problem is the guys in the portal most likely aren't going to be as good as the guys transferring from Clemson. They want to play, that is why they are leaving us and the others in the portal most likely aren't as good or they would be playing for the school they are transferring from
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110%er [7179]
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Re: Said this same thing last year
Dec 5, 2022, 9:02 PM
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the problem is the guys in the portal most likely aren't going to be as good as the guys transferring from Clemson. They want to play, that is why they are leaving us and the others in the portal most likely aren't as good or they would be playing for the school they are transferring from
Some of the players entering the portal; I think are trying to step up in competition. I would take a chance on a highly productive FCS player; If I had a need for example.
And, some of these players were starters for there respective schools. Which is why it's kind of weird to me.
But, seems it's likely related to NIL money. Which begs the question of; "what are they being told before they leave"?
These contracts to my knowledge aren't guaranteed. If that's the case; what is stopping someone from promising a kid they will sign them, only to "sign someone else"? While making their schools roster stronger and weakening the roster of the school they came from.
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All-In [48334]
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Re: How to Build Championship Roster in Today's FBS?
Dec 5, 2022, 7:57 PM
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All about recruiting and having an aggressive portal team. Not just some guy that comes in at noon. Uga is, Bama is, osu does.
You've got to have immediate impact guys. Day 1 starters. What's up with Leigh? He's been here 2 years and doesn't sniff the field. Perhaps our highest rated olineman we've inked. No development? Another bust? What then?
You've got to find those diamonds.
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110%er [7179]
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Re: How to Build Championship Roster in Today's FBS?
Dec 5, 2022, 8:07 PM
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All about recruiting and having an aggressive portal team. Not just some guy that comes in at noon. Uga is, Bama is, osu does.
You've got to have immediate impact guys. Day 1 starters. What's up with Leigh? He's been here 2 years and doesn't sniff the field. Perhaps our highest rated olineman we've inked. No development? Another bust? What then?
You've got to find those diamonds.
Agreed.
All 5-star players don't make immediate impacts. Some kids get it immediately and others have to mature. Taking a player, to your point, who has matured does seem like the way to go.
I truly believe Dabo will soon be forced to look into the portal; whether he wants to or not. But, Dabo has name and brand recognition. Kids will want to come to Clemson left and right; especially those who want to play big time CFB.
I think Dabo uses the portal for kids looking to move up to "the big boys" so to speak. It would have to be a special situation for a kid coming from a p5 to get a look. A kid who was maybe under-recruited who has blossomed and wants to step up in competition is who I can see Dabo targeting for sure. Especially if they handle themselves well off the field. And class room.
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Legend [19694]
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110%er [8538]
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Re: How to Build Championship Roster in Today's FBS?
Dec 5, 2022, 8:12 PM
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Unless they lose one of the next 2 games, that question should be directed to Kirby Smart since he will have done the impossible and won 2 in a row. It is hard to win and takes a ton of luck especially with injuries.
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Standout [342]
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Re: How to Build Championship Roster in Today's FBS?
Dec 5, 2022, 8:15 PM
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I don't think you can anymore. You develop guys for a few years and they leave. You don't have the luxury anymore to teach and grow the kids. They are instant recognition.
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110%er [7179]
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Varsity [223]
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Re: How to Build Championship Roster in Today's FBS?
Dec 6, 2022, 5:41 AM
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That’s pretty eye opening on the amount of exploitation going on in HS sports. I hope we don’t have to play in the cess pool of agents for HS athletes.
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Orange Blooded [2248]
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Re: How to Build Championship Roster in Today's FBS?
Dec 6, 2022, 6:26 AM
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How many of these were developmental versus undervalued? Renfrow, though a walk on, started as a freshman. Etienne started as a freshman. Most of the others saw significant playing time early in their careers, here at Clemson. I understand your point, but I think that sometimes we forget that sometimes lightly recruited players are not necessarily projects.
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