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YOUR BALANCE
DOJ sends NC a nasty letter.....(link)
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DOJ sends NC a nasty letter.....(link)


May 4, 2016, 5:02 PM

(this is sports related only in that karma may wind up biting unc in the a$$ anyhow)



http://www.newsobserver.com/news/politics-government/state-politics/article75607477.html



also, another link to a Dennis Dodd column in CBS Sports:

http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/writer/dennis-dodd/25573979/uncs-academic-scandal-leaves-professors-university-in-peril


Message was edited by: tigrjm76®


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As a Clemson alum who has taught his


May 4, 2016, 5:12 PM

Kids that the Tarholes are 1b in the pecking order of teams they should despise, I have zero issues with the bill nor do I see how Mr Obama's justice department can call this civil rights discrimination.

As the father of a teenage daughter I have no problems with the law. Pee in the bathroom based on the apparatus you were born with.

Besides, 21 other states have similar laws in place. Why is NC being picked on?

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i agree as a dad to 3 daughters


May 4, 2016, 5:24 PM

the only problem I see with the bill is that the minority (LGBT community) has the biggest voice and is making this non-issue such a national headline.

There is nothing wrong with the bill. all it asks is for you to pee in a bathroom the corresponds to what your birth certificate states. If these people want to use the bathroom they identify with then they need to have surgery and remove or add to themselves. Then they can change their birth certificates. If they truly identity they way they say they identify why wont the go above and beyond to make this happen? Why? because they aren't ALL IN with their identity. sorry to use our slogan, but seriously if they aren't all in then they shouldn't even be considered to use a bathroom just because of a feeling.

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Re: i agree as a dad to 3 daughters


May 4, 2016, 5:53 PM

have you read the bill, cause there are all kinds of other goodies tucked into to it that have nothing to do with bathrooms. In fact it was never about bathrooms, that was just the smokescreen to get it slipped through the house.

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Do you use the little girl's restroom?


May 5, 2016, 8:21 PM

Sirius qweshun...

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if it's a non issue why did the "keep government out of your life" Republicans...


May 4, 2016, 6:20 PM [ in reply to i agree as a dad to 3 daughters ]

pass a law putting government into certain people's life

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Just a guess...


May 4, 2016, 6:23 PM

Maybe because the democratic council of Charlotte wanted to place government in everyone's life and this measure counteracts that?

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wrong, this Bill is putting the government in people's lives...


May 4, 2016, 6:33 PM

Can't wiggle your way out of this hypocrisy. Republicans claim they want government out of your life, yet they continue to pass laws which tell people how to live their life. Not only that most republicans want to institute a state religion

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Re: wrong, this Bill is putting the government in people's lives...


May 4, 2016, 6:39 PM

As do democrats my friend. It's the way things are now. Again, no compromise. I'm not wiggling from a dang thing. You don't have to be on one side or the other. That is just not the case even though our politicians and media would like you to believe that.

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You are wrong. The law lets businesses decide. The previous


May 5, 2016, 11:05 AM [ in reply to wrong, this Bill is putting the government in people's lives... ]

Charlotte law forced all businesses to comply.

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Tigerking79


May 4, 2016, 7:21 PM [ in reply to if it's a non issue why did the "keep government out of your life" Republicans... ]

> pass a law putting government into certain people's
> life

I always like your take on these issues. And to answer your question, in my view, Republican's have yet to figure out that "small government" and "social conservatism" are diametrically opposed to each other. You can't have both.

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Re: Tigerking79


May 4, 2016, 9:32 PM

Yea, it's sort of funny how Republicans preach small government yet totally want to invade the privacy of other people's lives because it doesn't jive with their religion.

Trying to reduce accessibility to guns for psychopaths? BOOOOO, KEEP GOVERNMENT OUT OF THIS!

Trying to allow two people who love each other to get married? BOOOOO, GOVERNMENT NEEDS TO STEP IN & STOP THIS!

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Re: Tigerking79


May 4, 2016, 9:33 PM

The thing is, I'd be a Republican in a heartbeat if they could cut out the phony moralist Christian B.S.

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Re: Tigerking79


May 5, 2016, 8:18 PM [ in reply to Tigerking79 ]

Please explain to me why I should be required by law to recognize a male as female and vice versa? Is that not an attack on my liberty?

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why do I have to be a republican?


May 4, 2016, 8:13 PM [ in reply to if it's a non issue why did the "keep government out of your life" Republicans... ]

I mean I am but what does that have to do with anything I said?

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Re: i agree as a dad to 3 daughters


May 4, 2016, 6:48 PM [ in reply to i agree as a dad to 3 daughters ]

This is Shawn and Pete, both were born female (medicine is a marvel isn't it).

Good luck explaining to your 3 daughters why they're watching them pee.





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I have a 14yo daughter. Does that qualify me


May 4, 2016, 5:37 PM [ in reply to As a Clemson alum who has taught his ]

to point out that simplifying the argument to beong about bathrooms misses the larger discriminatory point? I'm all about not having dudes in the ladies bathroom, but thats not the limited scope of this misguided bill.

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null


Misguided?


May 4, 2016, 5:42 PM

If so, why ask for a repeal instead of change? That's all I hear is repeal, repeal, repeal. Which part is misguided?

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Re: I have a 14yo daughter. Does that qualify me


May 9, 2016, 5:05 PM [ in reply to I have a 14yo daughter. Does that qualify me ]

Well tell about this misguided bill

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Re: As a Clemson alum who has taught his


May 4, 2016, 5:40 PM [ in reply to As a Clemson alum who has taught his ]

From someone living in NC, here is my 2 cents...

I see no problem with the law, as do most of the people I have spoken to. This is a political, special interest and media driven issue. The political left and the media keep driving the economic impact card, but are neglecting the reporting of employers expanding and relocating in NC. One, they intend smear McCrory enough to get Cooper elected governor. Two, they want to drive the economic storyline enough in hopes of scaring and changing people's views in case it goes to ballot.

Everyone wants to bring up the bathrooms. What about the locker rooms and showers? Forget the molestor storyline too. What about the high school boys, mischeivious frat boys, etc? If you can't prove your sexual identity in a court of law, what stops some dude from saying "I feel like a woman today?" Can they not go into the locker rooms, bring their cell phones and record stuff?

It's a crazy world we are living in today. Honestly, the justice department should stay out of state's issues and quit trying to strong arm via funding. If folks don't like the way it has always been in NC, then stay the #### where you came from. Lord knows too many people are moving here anyway. And if certain companies don't like the law and want to object, so be it.

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Re: As a Clemson alum who has taught his


May 4, 2016, 5:55 PM

maybe read the bill and get back to us. It was never about bathrooms.

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Re: As a Clemson alum who has taught his


May 4, 2016, 6:07 PM

Honest question. What else is in it that is bad? I don't have strong feelings on it either way and I can legitimacy in both sides.

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Re: As a Clemson alum who has taught his


May 4, 2016, 6:09 PM

they slipped in legislation making it impossible to raise the minimum wage in any city or country. They also made it illegal to pass any future legislation that protects against work place discrimination of any type.

the legislation doesn’t stop there, however. Tucked inside is language that strips North Carolina workers of the ability to sue under a state anti-discrimination law, a right that has been upheld in court since 1985. "If you were fired because of your race, fired because of your gender, fired because of your religion," said Allan Freyer, head of the Workers’ Rights Project at the North Carolina Justice Center in Raleigh, "you no longer have a basic remedy."

"The LGBT issues were a Trojan horse...people were so caught up in [the LGBT] part of the law that this snuck under the radar."
"The LGBT issues were a Trojan horse," added Erika Wilson, a law professor at the University of North Carolina who co-directs a legal clinic for low-income plaintiffs with job and housing discrimination claims. The broader change hasn't received much attention, she said, because "people were so caught up in [the LGBT] part of the law that this snuck under the radar."



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Thanks...


May 4, 2016, 6:12 PM

You answered my post below

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However...


May 4, 2016, 6:19 PM [ in reply to Re: As a Clemson alum who has taught his ]

The DOJ letter is specifically about the trans/bathroom issue and not about any of the other issues you mention. Maybe that is why there is so much hostility over the whole thing, because it always comes back to this issue.

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how could you ever prove someone was fired


May 4, 2016, 6:21 PM [ in reply to Re: As a Clemson alum who has taught his ]

because of race or gender. You got fired because you sucked and nothing more. Sure you can sue someone and claim they fired you because of gender or age or whatever and they laywers will win every time and both sides will pay to keep it from going to court because that's the way it works.

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Re: how could you ever prove someone was fired


May 4, 2016, 6:39 PM

A girlfriend of mine was let go because of religious discrimination, not because she sucked. it is hard to prove, but it does exist. If you want to just shrug your shoulders and pretend things like this don't exist, then it is probably better to not comment on it.

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Re: how could you ever prove someone was fired


May 4, 2016, 9:35 PM [ in reply to how could you ever prove someone was fired ]

You honestly think no one has ever been fired because of their religion or sexuality?

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I honestly think there is no way to prove it


May 4, 2016, 9:57 PM

the only ones to get paid are the lawyers

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Re: I honestly think there is no way to prove it


May 4, 2016, 10:11 PM

I do agree that it can be difficult to prove because no employee is perfect...people have flaws and make mistakes so that could always be referred to as the reason for termination. But do you honestly think nobody has been fired based on something like their sexuality or religion?

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Re: As a Clemson alum who has taught his


May 4, 2016, 6:22 PM [ in reply to Re: As a Clemson alum who has taught his ]

It's shocking to me but sadly not surprising after as long as HB2 has been in the news that people are still so ill-informed to think that this bill is solely about bathrooms.

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Re: As a Clemson alum who has taught his


May 4, 2016, 6:25 PM

Even if it isn't just about that...why is the DOJ specifically targeting this part of it?

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cause it violates the 14th amendment***


May 4, 2016, 6:33 PM



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Re: As a Clemson alum who has taught his


May 4, 2016, 6:34 PM [ in reply to Re: As a Clemson alum who has taught his ]

The letter says HB2, which pre-empted Charlotte’s anti-discrimination ordinance, violates Title IX, which bars discrimination in education based on sex, and Title VII of the Civil Rights Act, which bans employment discrimination.

seems title VII affects several pieces of the bill and most importantly employment discrimination, so I am not sure where you are getting this.

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Re: As a Clemson alum who has taught his


May 4, 2016, 6:42 PM

Sex is defined as male or female. That is what I am getting at. Not how one identifies as. Based on this line of rationale, no civil rights are being discrimated against.

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Re: As a Clemson alum who has taught his


May 4, 2016, 6:45 PM

employment discrimination based on anything, sex, race, religion, etc... title vii clearly deals with the c&p I provided in italics above.

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Re: As a Clemson alum who has taught his


May 4, 2016, 6:51 PM

By the way, I'm not intentionally trying to be an ###. I do not think that individuals should be discriminated from employment based on sex, race or religion. I agree with you there.

It just the interpretation of sex that I have an issue with where it relates to certain things. I really could care less if someone identifies of the opposite sex. However, their identification as such, does not make them privilege to certain entitlements. I emphasize this is just my opinion, because you are just as entitled to yours.

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Re: As a Clemson alum who has taught his


May 4, 2016, 7:04 PM

like I said below, It is probably best to prevent a situation where trans woman does not have to use a men's restroom at a rural truck stop.it is not like they are wanting special privileges to avoid what could be an embarrassing, and potential volatile situation for them.

besides, would you prefer explaining this to your son?



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why the hostility?


May 4, 2016, 6:10 PM [ in reply to Re: As a Clemson alum who has taught his ]

I read the bill a while back, but I will go back and read it again if it makes you happy. However, you could choose to elaborate a little more on your view that it was never about bathrooms. I've heard others say the same, but they too never want to elaborate on it. Not trying to be smart about either. If it has to do with workplace discrimination or legal rights with regard to law suits...I can see that. Maybe that should be revisited just as the governor has said.

If it was never about bathrooms, then why is there so much anger over trans being denied their preferred bathroom, shower or locker room choice?

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Re: why the hostility?


May 4, 2016, 6:13 PM

because that is all that is being talked about in the news.

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Re: why the hostility?


May 9, 2016, 5:10 PM

Maybe they are trying to take care of people that don't want to bake brownies for fudge packers


Message was edited by: armsb®


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Re: As a Clemson alum who has taught his


May 9, 2016, 5:08 PM [ in reply to Re: As a Clemson alum who has taught his ]

Tell us you know all about. #### libs

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Re: As a Clemson alum who has taught his


May 9, 2016, 5:32 PM [ in reply to Re: As a Clemson alum who has taught his ]

The state overreached too and should have stayed out of Charlotte,s business. As for people liking the bill you must live in the boonies in NC because all of the educated people in Charlotte disagree with all aspects of HB. As for if people don't like it they can leave I would suggest that you can go to Mississippi if you don't like it as NC ain't the redneck south anymore

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Read the 14th amendment, and that will explain why it's discrimination...


May 4, 2016, 6:28 PM [ in reply to As a Clemson alum who has taught his ]

"All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the state wherein they reside. No state shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws."

Did you read the part that stated "No state shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of the citizens of the United States"

You know the constitution that guarantees rights to all US citizens.

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Re: Read the 14th amendment, and that will explain why it's discrimination...


May 4, 2016, 6:36 PM

No privileges are being denied. This is more about extending privileges above and beyond to a certain group of citizens. The privilege to use a bathroom, locker room or public shower is still available to everyone. The same argument can be made that the city of Charlotte engaged in discriminatory practices by segmenting a special group to give them greater freedoms than that of the ordinary citizen.

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Re: Read the 14th amendment, and that will explain why it's discrimination...


May 4, 2016, 6:56 PM

the transgender part of the bill was completely unnecessary as there were already laws in place making it illegal for man to enter a women's restroom. Again, it was just a smoke screen.

to your point, I do not think it is allowing special privileges to allow a person the choice to not be harassed while taking a leak. Imagine a transvestite using a men's restroom in a rural truck stop, nothing good could come of that.

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Re: Read the 14th amendment, and that will explain why it's discrimination...


May 4, 2016, 7:01 PM

I totally get that. Do you think Charlotte should have left it alone too?

Assuming nothing was even brought about from Charlotte or the state. No problems. This would have been the best scenario.

Since Charlotte did pass this though and if other municipalities followed suit, what happens then? Primarily as it relates to schools? That is my biggest gripe and from the hundred other NC citizens I have spoken with about it.

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Re: Read the 14th amendment, and that will explain why it's discrimination...


May 4, 2016, 7:08 PM [ in reply to Re: Read the 14th amendment, and that will explain why it's discrimination... ]

Your point is exactly on point.

Should we also explain to them that while they're being fed all of this "social conservatism" they're paying the highest insurance rates in the country, the highest power bills, NC school teachers have in the last decade endured, adjusted for inflation, a 17% decrease in salaries. And the public universities are among the most expensive in the country....not to mention they're working longer for less money.

Or do we let them continue to be upset over bathrooms?

Your call.

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Re: Read the 14th amendment, and that will explain why it's discrimination...


May 4, 2016, 7:15 PM

Don't buy into the argument that all conservatives are blind to everything. I am conservative, but I agree with every shortcoming you spoke to with regards to the state of NC. Not everyone views themselves as a flag waiving Republican. That's the media stirring the pot.

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Re: Read the 14th amendment, and that will explain why it's discrimination...


May 4, 2016, 7:24 PM

> Don't buy into the argument that all conservatives
> are blind to everything. I am conservative, but I
> agree with every shortcoming you spoke to with
> regards to the state of NC. Not everyone views
> themselves as a flag waiving Republican. That's the
> media stirring the pot.

Most people are fiscally conservative. Where it gets confusing is the cross-over into Christianism and social issues.

Government is the last entity on earth that should be used to tell people what "their" happiness should consist of or what 'morale code' they should adhere to. Gov't should just pave the roads and keep the water running... ;)

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Re: Read the 14th amendment, and that will explain why it's discrimination...


May 4, 2016, 7:29 PM

We agree!!

Even if their only responsibility were roads and water, they would probably muck it up somehow ??

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You know...


May 4, 2016, 7:09 PM [ in reply to Re: Read the 14th amendment, and that will explain why it's discrimination... ]

We could talk this all night long, but probably shouldn't. I appreciate your back and forth on it and hope I didn't make you mad. I enjoy the point/counterpoint when it is civil in nature. Speaking of privileges, I'm sure we can agree that it is nice we are entitled to our differing views. No hard feelings sir. Thanks for the enjoyable discussion.

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Re: You know...


May 4, 2016, 7:12 PM

Well put, people can disagree on difficult subjects and still be friends. :)

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Lots of stuff in this thread


May 4, 2016, 8:44 PM

This caught my eye, talking about NC...."the highest power bills"

NC ranks 19th among the states in the cost of power for consumers. You can look it up.

https://wallethub.com/edu/most-least-energy-expensive-states/4833/

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Re: You know...


May 4, 2016, 7:29 PM [ in reply to You know... ]

I dont get mad on the internet, but I have been known to get people fuming in the PnR. It is kind of a gift

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Re: You know...


May 4, 2016, 7:31 PM

I'll be sure to avoid that and stick to the sports boards ??

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Re: Read the 14th amendment, and that will explain why it's discrimination...


May 5, 2016, 8:14 PM [ in reply to Re: Read the 14th amendment, and that will explain why it's discrimination... ]

How about the transvestite weighs the consequences of its actions like most other living beings?

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Re: Read the 14th amendment, and that will explain why it's discrimination...


May 4, 2016, 9:05 PM [ in reply to Read the 14th amendment, and that will explain why it's discrimination... ]

The govt isn't telling them they can't use a public bathroom. They have equal opportunity to pee.

As much as liberals / progressives purport to create "equality", the fact is that every single person is different and that's a wonderful thing.

And it's an incontrovertible fact that the sexes are PHYSICALLY different.

What if I "feel" i need to pee outside? That pesky public exposure law keeps me from doing so. Discrimination!@!!

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Re: Read the 14th amendment, and that will explain why it's discrimination...


May 5, 2016, 8:09 PM [ in reply to Read the 14th amendment, and that will explain why it's discrimination... ]

Just because a male or female identifies as a member of the opposite sex does not mean other persons are obligated to agree with them. If a citizen is notrequired by law to call a male a female is that not abuse of that citizen rights?

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Re: Read the 14th amendment, and that will explain why it's discrimination...


May 5, 2016, 8:15 PM

**required**

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Re: Read the 14th amendment, and that will explain why it's discrimination...


May 9, 2016, 5:17 PM [ in reply to Read the 14th amendment, and that will explain why it's discrimination... ]

No privilege has been taken. Look down if it's hanging go to the little boys room.

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BURN.......BABY........BURN.


May 4, 2016, 5:35 PM

That's all I got to say about that.

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it was a smokescreen


May 4, 2016, 6:16 PM

And shows how redneck my home state is at current. Want to track pedophiles? Think they are dressing up as chicks in ladies bathrooms? Bullcrap. What about the men checking out boys in locker rooms and make bathrooms?! Monitor that ####. McCrory is a windbag and a ##### and needs to be out of office

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I for one am glad you are stopping. You are one of the most ignorant posters ever. You obviously think very highly of your own opinion, unlike the rest of us - RockHillTiger


Re: it was a smokescreen


May 4, 2016, 6:51 PM

he is just fulfilling his campaign promises to the likes of Duke energy and Koch industries that funded his campaign. If he wants to get re elected, he will need them to finance his next campaign, so the timing of this bill makes complete sense.

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Does anyone actually know the law?


May 5, 2016, 11:01 AM

The controversial law does not force any business to comply. Businesses get to decide.
The ordinance in Charlotte that it was meant to replace forced all businesses to let anyone in whatever bathroom they wanted.

Only state-owned bathrooms are set in stone. And it is not about the gender you were born as. NC law accepts any gender change surgery too. The law is meant to prevent men with penises from being allowed to go in female restrooms that are government maintained and it is also meant to allow businesses to regulate their bathrooms as they see fit.

This whole debate is retarded. I'm pro-gay marriage and I think the bill is fine.

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Re: Does anyone actually know the law?


May 9, 2016, 4:59 PM

I'm in the same boat.

The argument seems to be that transgendered individuals will feel more comfortable and less likely to be victim of abuse using the bathroom of the sex they identify

My issue is why does their comfort and safety supersede the comfort and safety of the non transgendered individual? Seems to be an unequal distribution of rights.

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"Smelley, Garcia, and Beecher are going to lead you to 4-8." - york_tiger


Ideas so good they have to be MANDATORY...


May 5, 2016, 8:23 PM

Communists - whadda ya expect...

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Re: DOJ sends NC a nasty letter.....(link)


May 9, 2016, 12:41 PM

Any straight women posters on here? I would be interested in your point of view on being comfortable with sharing your bathrooms with persons with male equipment.

I don't think the men have to worry so much about the reverse, although it would be a neat trick if a person with female equipment could stand up and hit a urinal with accuracy.

If you have discerned that I consider this whole thing much ado about nothing, you would be kerrect.

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Re: DOJ sends NC a nasty letter.....(link)


Sep 1, 2013, 5:55 PM

Straight woman and I have two daughters.

If it looks like a woman and acts like a woman, I don't care. What I am against is a person with a full beard and chest hair, who is dressed like a man and by all accounts looks like a man, using the bathroom with my daughters because he/she has girl equipment.

Yes, I know someone who has girl parts, but identifies as a man. She/he has had her breasts removed and is taking hormones. Looks like a man, acts like a man, has girl parts. I don't want him in the bathroom with my girls or me. It would make all of us uncomfortable, including this man with girl parts. He wants to use the men's room and I'm ok with that.

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Re: DOJ sends NC a nasty letter.....(link)


May 9, 2016, 2:56 PM

Thank you so much for your reply. I suspect that most of the straight sisterhood is in agreement with you. But, it is ok for you (or your daughters) to be uncomfortable or offended, you are only in the majority of the world that is straight, therefore, your opinion on this matter, does not matter, to the politicians.

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The DOJ is completely out of line***


May 9, 2016, 4:37 PM



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Meanwhile in the Middle East/N. Africa


May 11, 2016, 10:57 AM

more important problems are still not addressed... priorities.



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