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Hall of Famer [22395]
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One fifth of Trump voters from 2016 are pro-choice.
Sep 25, 2020, 11:46 AM
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25 percent in Iowa, 24 percent in Florida, Michigan and Pennsylvania, 21 percent in Arizona and 20 percent in Ohio and Wisconsin.
Polling since the death of RBG is showing Trump support slipping in these states as Republicans push to confirm a new justice that would overturn Roe v. Wade and The Affordable Care Act.
https://cookpolitical.com/analysis/national/national-politics/impending-scotus-fight-could-split-trump-coalitionImpending SCOTUS Fight Could Split the Trump Coalition In the hours since Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg's passing, several analysts have speculated the new, colossal Supreme Court fight will help President Trump by rallying traditional GOP voters behind him and shifting the focus of 2020 from the mismanagement of COVID-19 to a more straightforward partisan cage match.
That's possible, but given the likelihood of the court to take a sharp right turn, a pre-election Supreme Court fight carries much bigger risks for Trump than the Brett Kavanaugh brawl in 2018. Impending SCOTUS Fight Could Split the Trump Coalition In the hours since Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg's passing, several analysts have speculated the new, colossal Supreme Court fight will help President Trump by rallying traditional GOP voters behind him and shifting the focus of 2020 from the mismanagement of COVID-19 to a more straightforward partisan cage match.
That's possible, but given the likelihood of the court to take a sharp right turn, a pre-election Supreme Court fight carries much bigger risks for Trump than the Brett Kavanaugh brawl in 2018.
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All-In [46834]
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Didn't you hear? Republicans have no interest in
Sep 25, 2020, 11:47 AM
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overturning Roe v. Wade but absolutely want to overturn Roe v. Wade
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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why do we (general) totally lose the nuance of...
Sep 25, 2020, 11:52 AM
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issues?
Is it possible to want Roe v. Wade overturned and believing that it won't be overturned?
The real crux of many issues we face deal with what the actual solutions are. If you believe everything is the responsibility of the government to fix than I can see how you get lost in the argument.
Killing babies, racism, murdering your neighbor, lying, etc. will never be fixed by passing laws.
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Oculus Spirit [81078]
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He has stated, in many different ways, that he would like
Sep 25, 2020, 11:57 AM
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himself, and apparently everyone else, to be a ward of the state.
And apparently to do that, more laws are a necessary thing.
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Oculus Spirit [81078]
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Why would Roe v Wade even be up for review?
Sep 25, 2020, 11:48 AM
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That's always struck me as an odd strawman.
And even if it is overturned, it won't make abortion illegal.
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All-In [46834]
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In theory no, in practice yes.
Sep 25, 2020, 11:49 AM
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for many many women in poverty across the country
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Oculus Spirit [81078]
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I was going to ask for your expert opinion on this
Sep 25, 2020, 11:50 AM
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But really, it's OK.
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All-In [46834]
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Many red states won't outright ban abortions
Sep 25, 2020, 12:00 PM
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(thanks to RvW) but do everything BUT ban it. Without federal judicial oversight and assurance, you now have a Georgia/Bama/Miss etc state Supreme Court upholding these asinine restrictions.
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Oculus Spirit [81078]
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More stuff that could happen, but hasn't.
Sep 25, 2020, 12:05 PM
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You should probably do some self examination about this.
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All-In [46834]
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I'm working within the framework that Pubs get what they
Sep 25, 2020, 12:07 PM
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are asking for. A complete repeal of Roe v Wade. I don't see that happening even with a 9 conservative justice court.
Just going off of what conservatives say they want.
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Oculus Spirit [81078]
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So you are being an alarmist-reactionist. Got it.
Sep 25, 2020, 12:15 PM
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Even "pubs" don't think they'll get what they are asking for. That's called "conditioning", and it's often used in negotiations. Asking for way more than you think you'll ever get, only to settle somewhere in the middle, in order to make it seem like a "win-win" for both parties.
Next time you want to buy a car, please tell me what kind so that I may sell it to you.
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All-In [46834]
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Ok then what is it that pubs really want***
Sep 25, 2020, 12:24 PM
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Oculus Spirit [81078]
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I would imagine they want abortion banned completely
Sep 25, 2020, 12:40 PM
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I would also think that most "pubs" also know that will never happen.
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All-In [26968]
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Right...it's not like someone will set an agenda
Sep 25, 2020, 11:53 AM
[ in reply to Why would Roe v Wade even be up for review? ] |
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that says "On March 8th, the Supreme Court will be looking again at Roe v. Wade". That's not how it works. If someone brings a lawsuit, and it advances up to SCOTUS, that challenges some aspect of Roe, then something may happen.
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Hall of Famer [22395]
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Which will happen, much like the attacks on the ACA that
Sep 25, 2020, 11:55 AM
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the Supreme Court will hear starting right after the election on Nov. 10th.
Let's not pretend it's no big whoop.
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Oculus Spirit [81078]
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It's not to me.
Sep 25, 2020, 11:56 AM
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Its nothing I'll ever have to deal with in my lifetime. And I would guess, you neither.
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All-In [26968]
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Every case I have ever seen in front of SCOTUS
Sep 25, 2020, 11:57 AM
[ in reply to Which will happen, much like the attacks on the ACA that ] |
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about the murder of the unborn is challenging whether a law is proper, within the framework that Roe set. I've never heard it challenging that the Roe framework is correct. It's assumed correct.
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Hall of Famer [22395]
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When the state can seize control of a woman's body is
Sep 25, 2020, 12:06 PM
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constantly up for review by the courts.
The process begins.
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Oculus Spirit [81078]
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"can seize control of a woman's body"
Sep 25, 2020, 12:08 PM
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Do you sit around and attempt to think of the most dramatic way to describe something, or do you already have that written down somewhere, waiting to use it?
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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that is common pro-abortion talking points...
Sep 25, 2020, 12:31 PM
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Chuckston isn't making this stuff up on his own.
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Hall of Famer [22395]
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All-In [26968]
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I don't use the "a" word.
Sep 25, 2020, 12:36 PM
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Disgusting euphemism
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All-In [49062]
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That's how it works though...
Sep 25, 2020, 12:07 PM
[ in reply to Every case I have ever seen in front of SCOTUS ] |
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and there are several lawsuits pending in federal courts around the country over heartbeat laws, etc., all of which would substantially overturn Roe if the court chose to do so.
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All-In [34114]
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Orange Blooded [4365]
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Re: Why would Roe v Wade even be up for review?
Sep 27, 2020, 12:18 PM
[ in reply to Why would Roe v Wade even be up for review? ] |
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Ineligible,
Republican state legislatures pass laws trying to restrict access to abortion every year.
when these laws are challenged in the courts, they each present an opportunity for the SC to essentially review the standards set by Roe v Wade.
As soon as they make a ruling that calls those standards into question further, Republican state legislatures will rush, en masse, to pass new laws making all abortions illegal.
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Orange Blooded [4616]
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I wish Republicans would just give up on the abortion issue
Sep 25, 2020, 11:53 AM
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I'm pro choice and vote for Trump. IMO, there's already too many people on this planet, why do you want to force people to have a child that they can't afford?
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All-In [48078]
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Re: One fifth of Trump voters from 2016 are pro-choice.
Sep 25, 2020, 11:58 AM
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I wonder how strongly they care though. I am pro choice, but the only reason I care is I think the less people the better for the planet. It's not a major issue for me at all even being pro choice.
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Rock Defender [54]
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Re: One fifth of Trump voters from 2016 are pro-choice.
Sep 25, 2020, 12:03 PM
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Oculus Spirit [81078]
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Well, it does tend to affect women more than men.***
Sep 25, 2020, 12:04 PM
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All-In [48078]
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Re: Well, it does tend to affect women more than men.***
Sep 25, 2020, 12:11 PM
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My buddy who I went to Clemson with got wasted a few years after graduation and hooked up with some lady maybe 15 years older than him. She looked very heavy and very rough. It was just a drunken thing. He has twin kids now and had to pay child support for 18 years and the lady was a huge pain in the butt. He seems to like those kids, but man that's where an abortion would be good imo. 2 for 1 deal too.
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Oculus Spirit [81078]
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Men's rights aren't really a thing, unfortunately.
Sep 25, 2020, 12:17 PM
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The courts don't seem to give men much leeway on what they want.
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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well most of these decisions (as evidenced by this thread)
Sep 25, 2020, 12:08 PM
[ in reply to Re: One fifth of Trump voters from 2016 are pro-choice. ] |
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take a very myopic, dare I say self-centered view. Hey, we don't need so many people! I'm not going to kill myself though.
Things like this, especially when they don't touch home can be viewed very flippantly. No need to do the hard thinking and soul-searching needed to determine why we should rightfully be making god-sized decisions about a life that has no choice in the matter. Out of sight out of mind.
So be pro-choice, but be intellectually honest enough to admit that you are making that choice for somebody who has no say in the decision.
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Oculus Spirit [81078]
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VHEMT.org***
Sep 25, 2020, 12:10 PM
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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I'm hoping you view this as...
Sep 25, 2020, 12:15 PM
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more psychobabble
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Oculus Spirit [81078]
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Not really.
Sep 25, 2020, 12:17 PM
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Personally, I don't have kids for a multitude of reasons.
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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seems a little alarmist
Sep 25, 2020, 12:21 PM
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but I can understand that point when Earth is viewed as the final destination.
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Oculus Spirit [81078]
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Nobody has come back to tell us different.***
Sep 25, 2020, 12:41 PM
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Hall of Famer [22395]
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He addressed that in the article. He rated the importance
Sep 25, 2020, 12:22 PM
[ in reply to Re: One fifth of Trump voters from 2016 are pro-choice. ] |
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of the issue based upon the survey results.
Regardless, when 20-25 people out of hundred that voted for Trump in the states of Pennsylvania, Ohio, Michigan, Iowa, Wisconsin and Arizona consider themselves pro choice there will be a portion of that group that will react negatively to the push for a right wing judge that will tilt the balance of the court. Given the closeness of the last election in those states, that does not bode well for Trump.
Now add to that to the latest polling shows Trump slipping in each of those battleground states since the death of RBG.
This demonstrates the danger to Trump and Senate Republicans pushing a right wing judge onto the Supreme Court.
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All-In [26516]
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And a majority of Dems are pro Police
Sep 25, 2020, 12:14 PM
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Unlike what uncle Joe thinks, there is more than one issue being voted on
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110%er [9036]
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Re: One fifth of Trump voters from 2016 are pro-choice.
Sep 25, 2020, 12:19 PM
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trump has a bigger tent than democrats
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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very true...
Sep 25, 2020, 12:22 PM
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a lot more diversity (in every way) on that side. The monolithic groups are voting for Biden.
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Orange Blooded [4365]
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Re: very true...
Sep 27, 2020, 12:23 PM
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Franc and Ranger,
Could you expound on that ? How are the Republican voters more diverse than the Dems ??
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Heisman Winner [111736]
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Re: One fifth of Trump voters from 2016 are pro-choice.
Sep 27, 2020, 12:47 PM
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I dare them, strike that ruling down with Obama Care and see if Republicans EVER gets elected to the senate or whitehouse AGAIN.
they know better, but now it seems they officially have a court STUPID enough to rule in favor of their own personal, religious beliefs over the Will of the People.
the Backlash will be like nothing we have seen in this country, in a long long time.
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Replies: 42
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