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All-In [28802]
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The Tiger's predictably stupid response to Milo Yiannopolous
Oct 21, 2016, 11:40 AM
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http://www.thetigernews.com/outlook/the-last-thing-clemson-needs-is-milo/article_c13851c6-8e63-11e6-8329-271f46a9f089.html
This month, Milo Yiannopoulos is coming to campus. His visits to other universities have caused outrage, and some schools have even prohibited him from speaking on their campuses due to his misogynistic and racist rhetoric. He has taken his abusive speech and online harassment to such an extreme that he was banned from Twitter. He represents portions of the “alt-right” which has deep ties to white nationalism and mock movements towards racial equality and justice.
Unlike some of the universities who have banned Yiannopoulos, I agree with Clemson’s decision to let him speak. I think the bar of prohibiting individuals, even hateful and offensive individuals like Milo, should be very high for public institutions such as Clemson. If the university feels that it needs to ban someone on the far right, then it may not be too long until they carry out similar treatment to others with non-conventional political positions as well.
However, though Milo may have the “right” to come speak on campus, he is the last thing that Clemson University needs. If we were an extremely, leftist university then I could understand the desire to possibly bring in some right-wing ideologue to balance out the environment. However, we are not the bastion of liberalism. We are a primarily white, conservative university. We need speakers that will actually challenge student’s assumptions about race, class, and privilege– not merely parrot back to them their own societal views.
On a campus, where we still have a building named after one of the most notorious and violent racists in U.S. History, have bananas placed on African-American history banners and have racially offensive “Cripmas” parties, we don’t need someone coming to tell the students that white males are the ones being oppressed. In a state where many immigrant students cannot even attend higher education due to xenophobic policies, it is hard to feel too much sympathy for the followers of Milo who want to feign that they are the ones being discriminated against.
As a nation, we have seen the rise of the most racist and misogynistic presidential campaign in recent history. We have a candidate for president who has been openly praised by white supremacists and made attacks on immigrants and Muslims. Our nation is breaking apart at the seams. We need to come together and put the intolerance behind us. In this tense environment, people like Milo only serve to make the situation worse. What we need is for people of all backgrounds, but especially the often blinded white community, to open their eyes to the injustices all around them. Just like Trump will not make America great, Milo’s visit will not make Clemson a better place. He will simply allow for a portion of the student population to ignore their own privilege and grow in their misogynistic and racist views. I have met so many people of goodwill here at Clemson who are striving to create a more inclusive and compassionate campus environment. Let’s follow their lead and allow the calls for a more just society to drown out the hatred and bigotry of spoiled and bigoted children like Milo and his hero, Donald Trump.
You can listen to the actual talk at Clemson (about why the patriarchy isn't so bad after all) here: http://www.podcastone.com/the-milo-yiannopoulos-show. It's actually pretty funny.
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Heisman Winner [119842]
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Havent read or heard, but are his views
Oct 21, 2016, 12:02 PM
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rassist or bigoted or just discrimatory?
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All-In [28802]
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No, he just jokes around in non-PC ways
Oct 21, 2016, 12:05 PM
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He's very anti-feminist, which some interpret as misogynistic. But he's not racist, and he's not even alt-right.
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CU Guru [1606]
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Re: No, he just jokes around in non-PC ways
Oct 21, 2016, 11:20 PM
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Feminism is Cancer...
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Oculus Spirit [79454]
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I want the author to tell me who hung the bananas
Oct 21, 2016, 12:07 PM
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If they want to continue to bring that up, prove it was racially motivated. The university said it wasn't, I wonder why that was?
I'd be curious to know what xenophobic policies prohibit immigrants from attending college, too.
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All-In [28802]
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I'm surprised you didn't go to the talk
Oct 21, 2016, 12:12 PM
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The writer clearly meant illegal immigrants, but he didn't want to say that because it wouldn't make it sound xenophobic.
Message was edited by: camcgee®
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Oculus Spirit [79454]
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I usually don't get home until after 6:30, would have
Oct 21, 2016, 12:19 PM
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been difficult to make, especially since my fiance has taken up Zumba and abandoned any and all household chores recently.
Heaven forbid people who are in the country illegally not be able to go to college. I honestly do not understand how people can reconcile some of these beliefs....We need more people going to college, but lower tuition. We need higher wages, but don't mess with the illegals. We need more tolerance, but shouldn't have to tolerate your opinion...
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All-In [28802]
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I looked up the writer...
Oct 21, 2016, 12:24 PM
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He's not a Clemson undergrad. In fact he went to the second-tier Illinois State University (what is it with grad students like McCorkle and AD Carson from second-rate schools in Illinois coming to Clemson and trying to boss people around?). He's an instructor in the College of Education who's getting his PhD in "Curriculum and Instruction- Social Science" with a special emphasis in "Peace Studies." He's also "researching the issue of access to high education for undocumented students in the state of South Carolina." So basically this is just another left-winger... who's apparently wants to write the social studies curriculum for our students.
https://www.linkedin.com/in/william-mccorkle-b5448219
Message was edited by: camcgee®
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Orange Blooded [2013]
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Re: I looked up the writer...
Oct 21, 2016, 1:53 PM
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So a PhD candidate at Clemson doesn't have a valid opinion unless he also did his undergrad at Clemson? That's absolutely ridiculous.
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All-In [47835]
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that's not what he said.***
Oct 21, 2016, 1:56 PM
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All-In [28802]
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Yeah, you missed what I was saying
Oct 21, 2016, 2:16 PM
[ in reply to Re: I looked up the writer... ] |
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1. This is somebody who came to Clemson with left-wing interests. Fine and dandy, but that isn't someone who's representative of most Clemson students, and it isn't somebody without an agenda.
2. The grad student culture and mentality, especially in non-professional academic studies, is different from the undergraduate culture. Grad students are less immersed in Clemson's culture, and they often arrive on campus with a research agenda that shapes the way they interact with the culture. The only point I was trying to make about people like Carson and McCorkle is that they seem less interested in the culture of Clemson than in imposing their values. Heck, Carson acted like he was surprised that Clemson was on John C. Calhoun's former plantation. Anybody who's remotely curious about Clemson, and just about everybody in the south, knows that.
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All-In [42298]
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Re: Yeah, you missed what I was saying
Oct 21, 2016, 3:24 PM
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1. This is somebody who came to Clemson with left-wing interests. Fine and dandy, but that isn't someone who's representative of most Clemson students, and it isn't somebody without an agenda.
For one, you don't know he has an agenda. You have zero proof of that. You've made an assumption about the man. And it doesn't matter if he's representative of most Clemson students or not. Our school isn't rule by majority, and Clemson isn't a conservative institution (or a liberal one, for that matter), despite how badly some admin officials, Dave Woodard, and the like want it to be.
Second, you make this claim earlier:
He's also "researching the issue of access to high education for undocumented students in the state of South Carolina." So basically this is just another left-winger... who's apparently wants to write the social studies curriculum for our students.
So... huh? He says he wants to research the issue of access to higher education for undocumented students and you somehow interpret that as wanting to write the social studies curriculum for our students? That's an absurd leap of logic, and which students are you referring to? Clemson ones? I doubt he's writing the curriculum for them.
2. On the difference between grad and undergrad culture we can agree, but it's a stretch to say they're trying to impose their values. Having a different opinion than you doesn't mean someone is trying to impose their values. Hell, the man said he agrees Clemson should let Milo speak and that he just disagrees with the message. What's the problem?
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All-In [28802]
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Re: Yeah, you missed what I was saying
Oct 21, 2016, 5:20 PM
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1. It's pretty plain from his research interests, the program he's in, and from this article. Someone researching those topics who, in an article about how Milo Yiannopolous is apparently a big-gay-racist-misogynist, says that the state's policy of not allowing illegal immigrants to attend state universities is "xenophobic" is clearly left-wing. I mean, he imported his pet project into this opinion that wasn't even about immigration. And yet, you want us to believe he has no agenda.
As for the second part, you must've missed where I noted what he's actually studying for his PhD: "He's an instructor in the College of Education who's getting his PhD in "Curriculum and Instruction- Social Science." But why read carefully when you just really need to attack what I posted?
I can also tell you didn't really take the time to read much of this because you assert that "Clemson isn't a conservative institution" while the main point of what McCorkle wrote is that Clemson actually is a conservative institution, and that's why it's bad for people like Milo who don't challenge that conservatism to speak.
2. It's great that he's fine with allowing this totally awful guy to speak, but all of his reasons for why he's totally awful are silly. That's my problem.
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Oculus Spirit [81249]
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I never understood the "cripmas" party anger
Oct 21, 2016, 1:34 PM
[ in reply to I want the author to tell me who hung the bananas ] |
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If that was something that you identified with or were part of, I would get it. But how many of Clemson students are gang members? And if so, are we worried about p!ssing off gang members now? How can that possibly be a part of one's "culture" and something to be proud of?
It would be the same as having a party that mocked slave overseeers and the KKK. Why would that bother me?
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All-In [28802]
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1. Blackface; 2. Associating black pp w/gangs***
Oct 21, 2016, 2:17 PM
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Oculus Spirit [81249]
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All-In [28802]
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Yeah, that doesn't seem too bad***
Oct 21, 2016, 2:38 PM
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All-In [42298]
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Ha ha...
Oct 21, 2016, 3:13 PM
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I love it when white people have parties making fun of negative black stereotypes and then other white people say, "What's the big deal?" when black people get upset.
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Oculus Spirit [81249]
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Do you identify with KKK members?
Oct 21, 2016, 3:33 PM
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or frat boys who wear paisley colored shirts with matching shorts? Or white men who wear wranglers and drive jacked up trucks and listen to Luke Bryan?
Would you care if someone threw a party that made fun of them?
Tell me, please, what makes the stereotype of someone dressed like a Crips gang member so off limits to be made fun of? Do we hold wannabe gangsters in some high regard that I just am not aware?
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All-In [42298]
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If black students at Clemson...
Oct 21, 2016, 3:39 PM
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Had a party where they tried to associate all white people with the KKK, y'all would scream and holler about how you're somehow oppressed.
But more importantly, white people have no room to say, "Wow, that's not that bad. What's the problem?"
You don't get to decide what is racially offensive to black students. Clemson is what, 6 percent black? And you think it's okay if a bunch of white kids have parties dressing in black face and making fun of them with negative stereotypes?
If they had a party pretending to be Republicans or Trump supporters and dressed in white sheets, y'all would lose your minds.
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Oculus Spirit [81249]
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A couple things...
Oct 21, 2016, 3:52 PM
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From what I can tell, white people ARE being associated as basically being the same as the KKK by members of BLM, and the Clemson oriented "See the stripes" http://seestripescu.org/
>>But more importantly, white people have no room to say, "Wow, that's not that bad. What's the problem?"
You don't get to decide what is racially offensive to black students.<<<
And see, I guess this where I have a pretty big problem. Who gives you, or anyone the right to say that I don't have the right (or ability) to have a judgement or opinion? How is one person, or groups opinion about what is right (or wrong) the default?
Do you see how this works both ways?
Sure, anything can be offensive to anyone. Maybe, I guess I'm offended by them being offended.
>>>Clemson is what, 6 percent black? And you think it's okay if a bunch of white kids have parties dressing in black face and making fun of them with negative stereotypes?<<<
I looked at the picture, posted in the link above (on a black oriented website) and didn't see anyone in black face. Did you?
>>If they had a party pretending to be Republicans or Trump supporters and dressed in white sheets, y'all would lose your minds. <<
Hardly. I'd find humor in it. I'd like to see it, actually.
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All-In [42298]
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Re: A couple things...
Oct 21, 2016, 8:24 PM
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Who gives you, or anyone the right to say that I don't have the right (or ability) to have a judgement or opinion? How is one person, or groups opinion about what is right (or wrong) the default?
Nothing. I wasn't saying you couldn't have that. I'm saying you don't get to decide what is racially offensive to black people.
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All-In [28802]
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Sure, nobody gets to decide what others are offended by
Oct 21, 2016, 5:33 PM
[ in reply to If black students at Clemson... ] |
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But that doesn't mean that we have to ratify their offense by punishing and prohibiting anybody who does anything that offends someone. This doesn't have to be an absolutist principle, either: clear racism ought to be punished and prohibited to the extent that prohibition is possible. I think the "Cripmas" party was on the borderline of something where the students who put on the party were at best oblivious and insensitive, and at worst putting on a kind of minstrel show. If we take them at their best, then we still ought to ask whether having a Crip-themed party and possibly pissing off a lot of black people is worth it. To me, it probably isn't. But that's not a heckler's veto, because I think we still ought to recognize the difference between politically significant speech or politically incorrect comedy (both of which could describe Milo's show) that might offend some black people, and completely unimportant party themes or controversial symbols that cause more pain than pride (like the Confederate battle flag).
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All-In [31938]
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Wasn't the party specifically called "Cripmas"...
Oct 21, 2016, 3:36 PM
[ in reply to Ha ha... ] |
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meaning the Crips gang or rather a gang theme in general? All gangs aren't black gangs...heck, I don't even think the Crips are all black. For sure there are a heck of a lot of Latino gangs and white gangs.
So...honest question since I didn't follow the original story all that closely...how is this a racial stereotype?
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All-In [42298]
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The Crips are a black gang.***
Oct 21, 2016, 3:40 PM
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All-In [31938]
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Ok...thought they were predominantly black, but same thing..
Oct 21, 2016, 3:42 PM
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so how is it a stereotype then? Seems pretty specific to me.
Seems like it would have been a negative black stereotype if it was called "blackmas" and everyone dressed as gang members.
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Oculus Spirit [81249]
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I think predominantly black is correct.
Oct 21, 2016, 3:58 PM
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a 5 second google tells me that there are white "Crips".
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All-In [42298]
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There are people who think they are white Crips
Oct 21, 2016, 7:56 PM
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In smaller cities.
And they would die if they brought that #### into L.A. or Chicago, etc.
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All-In [28802]
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It's a stereotype of a black gang...
Oct 21, 2016, 5:23 PM
[ in reply to Ok...thought they were predominantly black, but same thing.. ] |
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which of course isn't the same thing as a stereotype of all black people. What I think some black people take offense to is a bunch of white people parodying a bad segment of black culture, and a bad segment that many black feel has become a stereotype of all black people.
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All-In [28802]
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Is it a negative stereotype of black people?
Oct 21, 2016, 5:09 PM
[ in reply to Ha ha... ] |
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Or is it a stereotype of gangs that happen to be made up of black people? Is it always racist for a white person to impersonate the style of black gang members?
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All-In [42298]
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It's a negative stereotype of black people.***
Oct 21, 2016, 7:56 PM
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110%er [5508]
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Re: 1. Blackface; 2. Associating black pp w/gangs***
Oct 21, 2016, 4:11 PM
[ in reply to 1. Blackface; 2. Associating black pp w/gangs*** ] |
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speaking of blackface; daughter wanted to be Simone Biles for Halloween...she was thinking of a USA gymnastics outfit with dark makeup...told her that we should probably just stick with the outfit
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All-In [47835]
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McCorkle is upset that Milo didnt pick him to be in the
Oct 21, 2016, 1:53 PM
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Twinks for Trump photoshoot.
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All-In [42298]
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It's kind of funny y'all champion this guy.
Oct 21, 2016, 3:35 PM
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This Milo clown. Of all the prominent conservatives out there to rally around, y'all choose this one?
Look, this writer said he doesn't think Milo should be banned from Clemson. You agree with that, right? Then he goes on to explain why he's a despicable person (which he is) and how those on the right should embrace better role models.
Which they ####### should. Really? This is the guy you want to be the face of conservatism?
So what's the beef with the author? He supports Milo's free speech at Clemson yet points out how much of an ignorant piece of garbage he is and that conservatives can do better?
Maybe y'all should listen to him.
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All-In [31938]
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I honestly had never heard of the guy until this thing...
Oct 21, 2016, 3:38 PM
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came up at Clemson.
I listened to the podcast Cam posted and I watched a few of a his video clips. Haven't seen anything yet that makes him "despicable" or "an ignorant piece of garbage"...in my book at least.
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All-In [42298]
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Dig a little deeper than just a Podcast.***
Oct 21, 2016, 3:40 PM
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All-In [28802]
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Oculus Spirit [81249]
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Maybe I missed anyone saying the hyperbole of wanting to
Oct 21, 2016, 3:40 PM
[ in reply to It's kind of funny y'all champion this guy. ] |
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see Milo Whateverhisnameis to be the "face of conservatism". Where was that stated?
I've seen a few of his college appearances on youtube, and I think he's funny because he plainly points out the idiocy and hypocrisy of the liberal "movement" on college campuses, from the inherently racist "safe spaces" to the riduculousness of "trigger warnings".
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All-In [42298]
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Eh. He sucks and he's a racist troll.
Oct 21, 2016, 3:42 PM
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But if that's someone's cup of tea, whatever. No one's forcing anyone to listen to him.
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Oculus Spirit [81249]
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So noone actually said that they want him to be the "face
Oct 21, 2016, 3:57 PM
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of conservtism", correct?
Can we agree on that?
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Lot o points [156093]
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It's called projection.
Oct 21, 2016, 4:36 PM
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I think the problem might be that Cata's internalized him as the face of conservatism.
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Oculus Spirit [81249]
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Cata is often quick to point out the strawman and over
Oct 21, 2016, 5:04 PM
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usage of the hyperbole in here.
I just wanted to make sure I wasn't missing it, and erroneously pointing out that he was doing the exact. same. thing.
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All-In [42298]
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Look at all ya kids thinking you know what I'm about.
Oct 21, 2016, 8:02 PM
[ in reply to It's called projection. ] |
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(Don't care how old ya are, still little kids) pretending to know what you think I'm about.
Listen. This Milo #### biscuit is a piece of #### and his comments show it. And y'all the ones fallin' all over yourselves to defend it.
The article Cam posted is a guy saying he supports Milo's right to speak at Clemson and how he shouldn't be banned, but he disagrees with his message.
Shouldn't be any discussion beyond that. Yet the butt
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All-In [42298]
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Yet the butt hurt...
Oct 21, 2016, 8:13 PM
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Sorry for the poor posting skills in responding to y'all's butt hurt.
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All-In [39020]
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All-In [28802]
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According to Cata, some black people are upset about him
Oct 21, 2016, 5:42 PM
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That must mean he's racist.
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All-In [39020]
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The lack of reply is convincing.
Oct 21, 2016, 7:19 PM
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Pretty sure he's just regurgitating talking points meant to discredit Milo. Anyone who stands up against the cultural Marxists gets tarred with the racist/sexist brush. It's why it hardly means anything to be called racist anymore.
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All-In [42298]
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The lack of reply means Cata...
Oct 21, 2016, 8:01 PM
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Was out at happy hour with coworkers, ya #### biscuit.
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MVP [533]
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Oh, good. Cata is drunk.
Oct 21, 2016, 10:34 PM
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Yay.
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All-In [39020]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 51623
Joined: 11/20/04
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All-In [42298]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 38371
Joined: 11/30/98
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Re: According to Cata, some black people are upset about him
Oct 21, 2016, 8:22 PM
[ in reply to According to Cata, some black people are upset about him ] |
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"I’ve worked out why there are so many Black girls here… cause I ###### their brother."
“I give it 20 minutes; the statistics of Black incarceration are about to go up.”
-Attacking Leslie Jones for standing up against racist statements made against her. Also threw racist statements at her.
Thanks for playing, Cam. Although I know YOU won't think these comments are racist. And that's not a surprise.
Milo is a little ##### troll but apparently some of y'all's heroes.
If not, stop defending him.
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All-In [39020]
TigerPulse: 100%
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The first one is not remotely racist...
Oct 22, 2016, 3:41 AM
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Milo just has a taste for BBC.
The second is, sadly, a statement of fact.
And Leslie Jones has made a (pathetic) career out of a black stereotype, so excuse me if I don't cry for her when it's thrown in her face.
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All-In [31938]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 37222
Joined: 11/22/03
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STOP...cata said it's racist...if you don't agree...
Oct 22, 2016, 7:32 AM
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You're a racist.
Sorry, that's just how it works.
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All-In [28802]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 58393
Joined: 11/14/03
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He made fun of Leslie Jones, a black comedian
Oct 22, 2016, 11:46 AM
[ in reply to The first one is not remotely racist... ] |
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They means he's s racist, and that he coordinated racist attacks on her. Obvi.
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All-In [28802]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 58393
Joined: 11/14/03
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The guy is hilarious
Oct 21, 2016, 5:37 PM
[ in reply to It's kind of funny y'all champion this guy. ] |
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And he has some salient things to say about free speech, feminism, and culture. I don't want him to be the face of serious conservatism, but then, he doesn't claim to want to be the face of serious conservatism. He just wants to lampoon campus liberals and to suggest that there's another, better way of thinking available. To me, that's somebody I can, at least, mostly support.
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