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Replies: 128
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All-TigerNet [13888]
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School Shooting in California. 2 shot, gunman in custody
Jan 10, 2013, 1:04 PM
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Seems to always come in waves.
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All-TigerNet [10469]
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Re: School Shooting in California. 2 shot, gunman in custody
Jan 10, 2013, 1:13 PM
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I hope it's not any worse than that. Early reports are usually unreliable, and even the local Bakersfield newspaper doesn't have much information at this point.
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All-TigerNet [13888]
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Local TV news in Taft CA is reporting two wounded
Jan 10, 2013, 1:16 PM
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hopefully, nobody dead.
Only two ambulances were dispatched....so that's good.
MedEvac chopper too...and that's usually not good.
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Aficionado [167]
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Re: Local TV news in Taft CA is reporting two wounded
Jan 10, 2013, 1:20 PM
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worst possible state for this to happen....
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All-In [25014]
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why?***
Jan 10, 2013, 1:21 PM
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Aficionado [167]
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Re: why?***
Jan 10, 2013, 1:34 PM
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California is a state of gun hating democrats that's why, this is awful where ever it happened, but with the second amendment already falling under fire.....
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Orange Blooded [3422]
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Re: why?***
Jan 10, 2013, 1:40 PM
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People may be dead and the first thought you have is "oh my god, my guns!!"
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All-TigerNet [11478]
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Maybe
Jan 10, 2013, 1:41 PM
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people are getting shot and his first thought is "oh my protection".... Don't try to turn him into a bad guy for that comment.
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CU Guru [1236]
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Re: why?***
Jan 10, 2013, 1:45 PM
[ in reply to Re: why?*** ] |
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We can't do anything for those who were hurt or killed but offer our sympathies to their loved ones. There is nothing wrong with being concerned about what this may mean for our constitutional right to protect ourselves and our families.
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Orange Blooded [3422]
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Re: why?***
Jan 10, 2013, 1:50 PM
[ in reply to Re: why?*** ] |
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@ TigersO & BlackRiverTiger fair enough
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Orange Blooded [3422]
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Re: why?***
Jan 10, 2013, 1:52 PM
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However it's also a bit inaccurate to say California is filled with "gun hatin democrats". It's actually got some extremely conservative areas, though the Bay Area is obviously very liberal (along with a good portion of LA).
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Aficionado [167]
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Re: why?***
Jan 10, 2013, 1:57 PM
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i shall be more clear with my posts next time, i really do feel bad for the victims and their families but thats all i can do, and as for the protection thing i could live with a ban on "assault weapons" but an all out gun ban is my fear because then the only people with guns are the people the ban attempted to get the guns from in the first place, the criminals
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Legend [18069]
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If you really think there will be a total ban on guns
Jan 10, 2013, 2:01 PM
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or that "Obama gunna take my guns"...then you are probably too stupid to own one in the first place.
Ban assualt rifles and high capacity magazines yesterday and most people would be happy. These things have no place in a civilized society.
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Aficionado [167]
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Re: If you really think there will be a total ban on guns
Jan 10, 2013, 2:05 PM
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a complete ban on owning guns your right won't happen, a complete ban on selling them in the united states would not only feasible, but also within the constitution and as for my intelligence im a senior civil engineering student at Clemson so i think im above average
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110%er [5121]
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CE degrees must be much easier today, judging from your
Jan 10, 2013, 4:01 PM
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ability to write a proper sentence. Above average? Please...
Your idea of banning the sale of guns in the US would be a stretch since the Federal Government only has jurisdiction over "interstate" commerce. SC could allow the sale of weapons manufactured in SC to people in the state.
Would you also ban the manufacture of guns in the US? How about bullets? What would you do about the guns that are currently in the hands of law-abiding citizens?
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MVP [503]
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Re: CE degrees must be much easier today, judging from your
Jan 10, 2013, 8:28 PM
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SC has already passed a Sovereignty bill that allows for just that. I'm waiting on Texas to follow suit myself.
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110%er [5121]
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Hasn't passed yet. It's been filed the last couple years
Jan 11, 2013, 10:39 AM
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without being voted on.
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MVP [503]
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110%er [6781]
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All-TigerNet [12223]
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Re: If you believe there is such thing as a civilized society
Jan 10, 2013, 2:33 PM
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If you believe there is such thing as a civilized society
with out guns big enough to keep the government in check you are probably to stupid to vote
This is quite possibly the most idiotic post I have ever seen on Tnet. Let me get this right....you are going to keep the government "in check" with your AR-15 and 200 rounds of ammunition? Do you honestly believe that
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110%er [6781]
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Haha. People who don't learn from history are fools.
Jan 10, 2013, 2:45 PM
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Aka. Idiots like you. If I'm protecting myself my property and my family i want the maximum amount of firepower available. IF thats all i get my hands on so be it. but i would be going after more
“This year will go down in history. For the first time, a civilized nation has full gun registration. Our streets will be safer, our police more efficient, and the world will follow our lead into the future!” - Adolph Hitler, 1935, on The Weapons Act of Nazi Germany
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1st Rounder [603]
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Plus our country was founded on the right to bear arms
Jan 10, 2013, 2:51 PM
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so that all civilians could protect themselves and we had the ability to be armed to fight against the British to become an independent nation.
If only those who are in power (the government) have the power to arm themselves, then would we be living in a militant society?
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110%er [6781]
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Re: Plus our country was founded on the right to bear arms
Jan 10, 2013, 2:55 PM
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“It is the duty of the patriot to protect his country from its government.” - Thomas Paine
“When governments fear the people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny. The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government.” - Thomas Jefferson
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All-TigerNet [12223]
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Re: Plus our country was founded on the right to bear arms
Jan 10, 2013, 4:06 PM
[ in reply to Plus our country was founded on the right to bear arms ] |
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Correct. We do have the right to bear arms. That does not mean you should be able to go pick up an AR-15 at the store, modify it, and turn it into a one man wrecking crew.
The real problem we have today does not involve owning a gun. Nobody is fighting that right. It is where the line is drawn in the sand. There is a difference between a 9mm for self defense used responsibly and some idiot shooting off his semi auto boom cannon in his buddies back yard while drinking a cold one.
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1st Rounder [603]
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agree***
Jan 10, 2013, 7:17 PM
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MVP [503]
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Re: Plus our country was founded on the right to bear arms
Jan 10, 2013, 7:43 PM
[ in reply to Re: Plus our country was founded on the right to bear arms ] |
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If by modifying an AR-15 you bought off the shelf to make it full auto, then you obviously don't know #### about those guns.
But by modifying it with a handle, new stock, optics, trigger, etc that really doesn't change much in the way of making yourself a "one man wrecking crew."
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All-TigerNet [12223]
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Re: Plus our country was founded on the right to bear arms
Jan 10, 2013, 8:18 PM
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There is no reason for anyone to own an assault rifle. Other than military or police.
Could care less about mods.
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MVP [503]
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Re: Plus our country was founded on the right to bear arms
Jan 10, 2013, 8:25 PM
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Well you are in luck because civilians don't own "assault" rifles. They own semi auto weapons that only look like its military brother.
I stand by my statement that you don't know #### about these guns.
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CU Guru [1218]
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His ignorance is typical of those....
Jan 10, 2013, 8:30 PM
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who don't understand this issue. Reminds me of those who are against hunting animals but have no problem with a woman killing an unborn child.
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MVP [503]
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Re: His ignorance is typical of those....
Jan 10, 2013, 8:32 PM
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Gun education is a major problem. Too many people just don't know enough about them, and instead of actually taking time to learn about them they just take what the mainstream media spoon feeds them because the media isn't allowed to lie (sarcasm)
Message was edited by: CBRtigeRR®
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CU Guru [1218]
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Spot-on, CBR!
Jan 10, 2013, 8:35 PM
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Some are not smart enough to see the facts.
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All-TigerNet [12223]
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Re: His ignorance is typical of those....
Jan 10, 2013, 8:38 PM
[ in reply to Re: His ignorance is typical of those.... ] |
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I own, I routinely made it to the range in Liberty when i was at Clemson. I do not get to shoot that often anymore.
I know all I need to know about the topic. Assault Rifles have no business being sold to citizens.
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MVP [503]
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Re: His ignorance is typical of those....
Jan 10, 2013, 8:44 PM
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Your Wikipedia article you posted as another reply shows how hard it is to obtain a legit assault rifle. Just because you know which end is the business end and you shot it on several occasions doesn't strengthen your side. You are giving a legitimately legal rifle an arbitrary name to fit your argument.
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All-TigerNet [12223]
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Re: Plus our country was founded on the right to bear arms
Jan 10, 2013, 8:34 PM
[ in reply to Re: Plus our country was founded on the right to bear arms ] |
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Really?
Contrary to popular belief, fully automatic weapons are NOT illegal. They are however HIGHLY regulated. Full auto weapons have been regulated with three different pieces of legislation. The first was the National Firearms Act of 1934, then the Gun Control Act of 1968, and finally the Hughes Amendment in 1986. In essence, what these three laws have done is to say respectfully that fully automatic firearms must be taxed and regulated, cannot be imported from outside the United States, and can no longer manufacture and/or register new/existing full auto weapons with the federal government (BATFE).
In order to legally own one, you must first find one that you wish to buy. For it to be legal, it must have been made and registered with the BATFE prior to 19 May 1986. These are what are known as transferrable NFA or Class III items.
Your next step will be to negotiate a price with the buyer. Most buyers have their prices set pretty firm and the going rate for a M16 varies by condition and model (M16A1, A2, AR-15 conversion, etc). A brand new, unfired, factory Colt M16A2 is going to run you about $18,000+ while a used AR-15 conversion will run you about $9,500-$13,000+. You will just have to shop around and look for the best deal out there.
Once you find one and negotiate a price you will need to pay the seller. Depending on if you are buying the item from out of state or not, you may also need to find a local Class III FFL/SOT to handle the transfer. NFA/Class III items CANNOT be shipped or carried across state lines without the proper prior approved paperwork. If buying out of state, you would need to have it transferred to a local seller who would then transfer it to you. Once you have found a FFL/SOT if needed, you will need to pay the seller. Unlike with other firearms where you can often do installment payments for years or put it on a credit card, most NFA sellers want full funds up front although some are willing to work with you and do half now, half when the paperwork comes back. At best, you are looking at half up front before he will even start the paperwork.
Once the seller is satisfied with the payment plan and has his funds, he will begin the paperwork. This requires a little bit of work on your end. You will need to get a few things in order for the process to be complete. You will need to get two sets of fingerprint cards done, two passport photos, and fill out a Form 4 (to include the signature of the CLEO of the area you live in) and write a check to the Department of the Treasury for the $200 transfer tax. It is this special tax that will allow you to legally own the weapon. Once you have all this together along with the required paperwork from the seller, you will ship it all to the BATFE who will then have one of their 10 or so inspectors sit down and review it. Any little error will cause it to be rejected and sent back. This is where the frustration begins as the wait starts. It generally takes anywhere from 50-90 days for them to process an application. The main thing that they will be doing is running an extensive background check on you through the FBI criminal database using all your information as well as your fingerprints.
Once the paperwork finally comes back, the seller can then legally ship/transfer the weapon to you. You CANNOT take posession of it before this time or it will be the same as being in possession of an unregistered machine gun which carries a stiff penalty in federal prison.
And that is all there is to it. Once you receive the tax stamp, always makes sure you keep a COPY with the weapon at all times no matter where it goes. Also, remember to keep the original in a SAFE place where nothing will happen to it as the BATFE does not replace lost, stolen, or destroyed tax stamps.
The above advice assumes you are buying in state. If buying out of state, the process is the same, except that you will be required to do two to three transfers. One from the seller to a Class III FFL/SOT if he is not already one, then one from the FFL/SOT in his state to an FFL/SOT in your state, and then from your local FFL/SOT to you. There is no wait time or transfer tax between FFL/SOT's. This means that you will basically only be waiting on the time it takes for two transfers if buying out of state.
If you want to be able tp purchase new full auto weapons, you will need to apply for a FFL/SOT permit from the BATFE. Getting one isn't really all that difficult, except that you need to deal in NFA items and not just buy them. If you only buy and don't sell, then the BATFE can get you on tax evasion. You must also get requests from law enforcement agencies or military units before purchasing them even with an FFL/SOT. This is because FFL/SOT is not exactly a free license to purchase full auto weapons. It merely means that you are an authorized dealer to provide them to law enforcement agencies. However, there is nothing that says you cannot take them out for some fun when not demoing them for the police.
Finally, you are legally allowed to transport the weapons to places like a shooting range to use, but are not legally allowed to carry it on your person like you would a handgun. No permit in this country gives you that permission.
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MVP [503]
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Re: Plus our country was founded on the right to bear arms
Jan 10, 2013, 8:42 PM
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Your article is very informative and full of stuff I already knew. You see how hard and expensive it is to obtain a legal full auto.
you have to have a spotless record and submit to federal officials "checking in" on your weapon any time they want. Thank you for actually doing a basic google search on something that is contrary to what I said but is still a moot point. It may surprise you but there are VERY few people who own a full auto. You are twisting this to suit your argument but your argument isn't based on true assault weapons, you are arguing for the ban of faux assault weapons.
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All-TigerNet [12223]
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Re: Plus our country was founded on the right to bear arms
Jan 10, 2013, 9:12 PM
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Wooooooooooo now. Just 15 minutes ago you were telling me that citizens cannot get fully automatic weapons.
Back
Track
The article also goes deep into how to get one and be a dealer of one. I know of people who have gotten full autos simply by obtaining a license. Its not as hard as you make it out to be.
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MVP [503]
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Re: Plus our country was founded on the right to bear arms
Jan 10, 2013, 9:28 PM
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How many people do you know that are willing to drop $10000+ on a rifle? Not a lot of people are willing to do that let alone afford to do that.
And if you read I admitted to being wrong but it was a moot point because your argument has had nothing to do with full auto rifles, but everything to do with semi-auto replicas. I do know citizens can get full auto weapons, but it is almost impossible if you don't have very deep pockets.
You have just diverted your main argument that you couldn't defend to try and prove me wrong. I admit it, I should have been more clear about full auto ownership.
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CU Guru [1813]
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When that statement was written all we had was muskets.
Jan 10, 2013, 4:08 PM
[ in reply to Plus our country was founded on the right to bear arms ] |
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Do you really think the FF accounted for advancements in technology with regards to personal weaponry? There already plenty of things you can't have. Bazookas, tanks, surface-to-air anything, etc. It's good to have the discussion. I hate that there are certain people that are so close minded they won't even consider more stringent restrictions simply on account of some kind of hypothetical government tyranny scenario. It's ludicrous. I have a hard time believing a person needs a semi automatic assault rifle with a high capacity magazine. If enthusiasts still want to shoot these kinds of weapons then make them available only at ranges in a controlled environment. Seriously, some of these 'necks really need to let go of the conspiracy theories and realize that these shooting instances are happening all too often lately. At least make them have to reload more often before they blast another 30 innocents or something.
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110%er [6781]
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ask every nation on the the planet in the history of the
Jan 10, 2013, 4:54 PM
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world about that hypothetical tyranny. how did that work out for them.
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CU Guru [1218]
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Two incontrovertible facts:
Jan 10, 2013, 5:24 PM
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1. This nation was founded by men who knew that the only way to ensure freedom was for the people to have the right to bear arms. They were right.
2. No govt body, be it local, state, federal or the UN will ever be able to disarm Americans. Any attempt to do so would result in bloodshed that would make the WBTS look like a Sunday picnic.
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All-TigerNet [12223]
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Re: Two incontrovertible facts:
Jan 10, 2013, 5:46 PM
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You are one sick person. Now your talking about murdering people. This @@@@ is getting out of control.
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CU Guru [1218]
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I'm talking about defending myself and my family.....
Jan 10, 2013, 5:49 PM
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but you can call it murder if it makes you feel better.
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All-TigerNet [12223]
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Re: I'm talking about defending myself and my family.....
Jan 10, 2013, 5:55 PM
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You sai
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All-TigerNet [12223]
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Re: I'm talking about defending myself and my family.....
Jan 10, 2013, 5:58 PM
[ in reply to I'm talking about defending myself and my family..... ] |
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Setting up laws against owning military grade weapons to protect the citizens of the USA has nothing to do with your safety. Murdering people because you cannot carry an AK-47 anymore is pure bs. 100 percent bs
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110%er [6781]
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tisk tisk. you know as well as i do it is the "authorities"
Jan 10, 2013, 6:06 PM
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that would be doing the blood shed.
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MVP [503]
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Citizens don't own military grade weapons
Jan 10, 2013, 7:48 PM
[ in reply to Re: I'm talking about defending myself and my family..... ] |
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The only difference between an AR-15 and a semi auto "hunting" rifle is the exterior shell. Inside they work the exact same, only the "hunting" rifles typically use a higher caliber round. Even AK-47's available to us have the same internals as a "hunting" rifle. Just because it looks like a military weapon does not make it one.
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110%er [6781]
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Twisting his words does not make your arguement
Jan 10, 2013, 5:57 PM
[ in reply to Re: Two incontrovertible facts: ] |
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look good. it only reveals that you know you lost.
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All-TigerNet [12223]
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Re: Twisting his words does not make your arguement
Jan 10, 2013, 6:05 PM
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Dude said there would be bloodshed if someone tried to take his guns. I didnt twist anything. In fact what he said was even more mental than that.
Im not twisting anything
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110%er [6781]
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He said disarm Americans not him.
Jan 10, 2013, 6:08 PM
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the political fallout of murdering hundreds of thousands of Americans will not make it likely anytime soon.
Because yes Americans will fight for freedom as we have done throughout our history.
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All-TigerNet [12223]
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Re: He said disarm Americans not him.
Jan 10, 2013, 7:38 PM
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Dude....he is an American...and he was speaking as to what he would do. It is pretty obvious. I am an American and I completely understand the regulations being suggested. I am not going to try and kill the enforcement officer who seizes a weapon that is banned. That is exactly where he is going with that, and he knows it.
Your not comparing gun laws. You are creating a scenario for the end of the world as we know it. Yea....when the end of the world comes you don't have to worry about the gun law  Pretty sure you can use some common sense on that one.
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110%er [6781]
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Sure there will be shots on both sides
Jan 11, 2013, 11:48 AM
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but that doesn't mean the gun owner will necessarily be the one who fires first. What will the authorities do when he resists seizure and resists arrest along with millions of others. If the feds do something like this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JU_MpXRD2-E
to my house you had better believe they will have a revolution on their hands. If the education department does this what you think they will do to people who don't turn over their guns when they pass an illegal law.
and no Im not talking about doomsday I'm talking about the progression of every formerly free nation in history.
Get your head out the sand Francis
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CU Guru [1218]
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There will be bloodshed....
Jan 10, 2013, 6:12 PM
[ in reply to Re: Twisting his words does not make your arguement ] |
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lots of it...that's a guarantee. If someone is breaking down your door and firing on you is it "murder" if you defend your family? I cannot understand this type of thinking.
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All-TigerNet [12223]
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Re: There will be bloodshed....
Jan 10, 2013, 7:28 PM
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Nobody is going to break your door down, nobody is going to fire on you, nobody is going to attack your family. I honestly cannot bring myself to think that you do not understand this. Part of me thinks your just doing this to prove some kind of point. You will be asked to turn in your high powered military grade assault rifles. If you don't and they find you with one you will have it seized and probably face a fine.
Your family is going to be ok Cohiba. Obama isn't going to break down the door like the Kool Aid man, pin your family down and scream "GIVE ME THE GUNZ YOU MUTHA *******!!!
Now if you continue to say things like "their will be bloodshed" the SC ATF is probably going to pay you visit and do that.
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CU Guru [1218]
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Re: There will be bloodshed....
Jan 10, 2013, 7:40 PM
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Palmetto, there are Senators and Reps who would love nothing more than to send their jack booted thugs to every law-abiding citizen of the U.S. and seize every single firearm. If you don't believe that, then you are not bright enough to get out of a shower of rain. Today it is "assault" rifles, tomorrow it will be semiautomatic .22s and 1100s. Are you naive enough to think this wouldn't result in bloodshed? Listen to what people like Feinstein and Schumer are saying.....their ultimate goal is to disarm everyone not connected with the govt. Lemmings like you would gladly hand over your means to defend yourself. Thankfully, most Americans would not. Our founders (and esp. men like Jefferson and Mason) are rolling over in their graves seeing what has become of this country.
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Re: When that statement was written all we had was muskets.
Jan 10, 2013, 8:14 PM
[ in reply to When that statement was written all we had was muskets. ] |
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Couldn't resist blaming gun totin necks could you. Just love a keyboard warrior showing his ignorance.
Do you think violence stops when you ban some scary looking rifle or hi-cap mag. It is not an assault weapon by the way.
Law-abiding people are not the problem. As for the Founding Fathers intent go read about it. They clearly talk about protecting the citizens from a tyrannical government.
Pres.Kennedy was killed with a bolt action rifle so do we ban those too. Cowards will find a way to kill unarmed people.
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All-TigerNet [12223]
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Re: Haha. People who don't learn from history are fools.
Jan 10, 2013, 4:01 PM
[ in reply to Haha. People who don't learn from history are fools. ] |
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Haha. People who don't learn from history are fools.
Posted: Jan 10, 2013 2:45 PM
Aka. Idiots like you. If I'm protecting myself my property and my family i want the maximum amount of firepower available. IF thats all i get my hands on so be it. but i would be going after more
“This year will go down in history. For the first time, a civilized nation has full gun registration. Our streets will be safer, our police more efficient, and the world will follow our lead into the future!” - Adolph Hitler, 1935, on The Weapons Act of Nazi Germany
1. What does protecting your home have to do with keeping the government in check. Your changing your argument
2. The ability to protect your family and house does not involve owning a AR with extended banana clips. If you need that to protect your home.....your dead already.
3. LMFAO...do you even read up on the stuff you post. The 1938 Germany Weapons act had nothing to do with banning the ownership of guns (unless you were Jewish which is a completely different discussion on one of the most evil dictators this world has ever seen). Just some quick research that literally took me 5 minutes shows the law you suggest has something to do with our situation is the exact opposite.
Here is the law. (what your suggesting as a law that took guns away from Germany actually states the exact opposite)
Gun restriction laws applied only to handguns, not to long guns or ammunition. Writes Prof. Bernard Harcourt of the University of Chicago, "The 1938 revisions completely deregulated the acquisition and transfer of rifles and shotguns, as well as ammunition."[4]
The groups of people who were exempt from the acquisition permit requirement expanded. Holders of annual hunting permits, government workers, and NSDAP party members were no longer subject to gun ownership restrictions. Prior to the 1938 law, only officials of the central government, the states, and employees of the German Reichsbahn Railways were exempted.[5]
The age at which persons could own guns was lowered from 20 to 18.[5]
The firearms carry permit was valid for three years instead of one year.[5]
Idiots like me understand that idiots like yourself come up with some of the dumbest s*** on the planet to justify you owning a semi automatic cannon. This is coming from a guy who owns a handgun and supports gun ownership.
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110%er [6781]
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Here is what idiots like you don't understand since that
Jan 10, 2013, 5:19 PM
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seems to be our new found friend greating
1. What does protecting your home have to do with keeping the government in check. Your changing your argument
Protecting your home against the government. Same argument.
2. The ability to protect your family and house does not involve owning a AR with extended banana clips. If you need that to protect your home.....your dead already.
As in this video. Dr. Gratia examples the riot in LA as a domestic example. giving my family as much time as possible to receive help would be my desire. Giving up a fight because I'm already dead? how courageous of you. I bet your wife feels real safe with you around.
http://youtu.be/awjxvMRdF-U
3. LMFAO...do you even read up on the stuff you post. The 1938 Germany Weapons act had nothing to do with banning the ownership of guns (unless you were Jewish which is a completely different discussion on one of the most evil dictators this world has ever seen). Just some quick research that literally took me 5 minutes shows the law you suggest has something to do with our situation is the exact opposite.
Here is the law. (what your suggesting as a law that took guns away from Germany actually states the exact opposite)
Gun restriction laws applied only to handguns, not to long guns or ammunition. Writes Prof. Bernard Harcourt of the University of Chicago, "The 1938 revisions completely deregulated the acquisition and transfer of rifles and shotguns, as well as ammunition."[4]
The groups of people who were exempt from the acquisition permit requirement expanded. Holders of annual hunting permits, government workers, and NSDAP party members were no longer subject to gun ownership restrictions. Prior to the 1938 law, only officials of the central government, the states, and employees of the German Reichsbahn Railways were exempted.[5]
The age at which persons could own guns was lowered from 20 to 18.[5]
The firearms carry permit was valid for three years instead of one year.[5]
Idiots like me understand that idiots like yourself come up with some of the dumbest s*** on the planet to justify you owning a semi automatic cannon. This is coming from a guy who owns a handgun and supports gun ownership.
This law you did such amazingly intelligent extensive research on is EXACTLY the issue at hand. TO CONQUER PEOPLE YOU DISARM THEM. To try to separate these issues is asinine. What intelligent people understand that idiots like you don't is that evil exists and it is not just crazy high school kids. It exists at very level of government and in every human heart. And idiots like yourself will sit around and sing kum-ba-ya thinking that just because a country has been free for a couple of generations means it will always be that way. Pleas go take 10th history. BTW nice Wiki. It's on the internet so it must be true.
"No civilian is to have a firearm without a permit and permits will not be issued to [persons] suspected of acting against the state. For Jews this permission will not be granted. Those people who do not require permission to purchase or carry weapons [include] the whole SS and SA, including the Death's Head group and officers of the Hitler Youth." -German Firearms Act of 1937
"The most foolish mistake we could possibly make would be to permit the conquered Eastern peoples to have arms. History teaches that all conquerors who have allowed their subject races to carry arms have prepared their own downfall by doing so." - Adolph Hitler April 11, 1942
"Germans who wish to use firearms should join the SS or the SA-- ordinary citizens don't need guns, as their having guns doesn't serve the State." -Heinrich Himmler
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All-TigerNet [12223]
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Re: Here is what idiots like you don't understand since that
Jan 10, 2013, 5:51 PM
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You obviously are willing to make stuff up and word it the way you want . Your mind is fried on the task at hand. You will not listen or look at the facts i put forward. You simply see what you want to see.
I cannot help you
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CU Guru [1218]
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Palmettoson, I sincerely hope you never have to defend....
Jan 10, 2013, 5:54 PM
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your loved ones with your debating skills. They would come in as handy as a pair of butter knives.
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All-TigerNet [12223]
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Re: Palmettoson, I sincerely hope you never have to defend....
Jan 10, 2013, 5:59 PM
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Someones mad because they got called out for being a complete mental case
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110%er [6781]
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someone is mad because they are helpless and
Jan 10, 2013, 6:04 PM
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defenseless in debate and in life (aka Palmettoson)
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All-TigerNet [12223]
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Re: someone is mad because they are helpless and
Jan 10, 2013, 6:08 PM
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Derp derp derp. Your like a @@@@@@@ 4 year old.
Done with this thread
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110%er [6781]
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Palmetto son listen man,
Jan 10, 2013, 5:59 PM
[ in reply to Re: Here is what idiots like you don't understand since that ] |
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You obviously are willing to make stuff up and word it the way you want . Your mind is fried on the task at hand. You will not listen or look at the facts i put forward. You simply see what you want to see.
I cannot help you
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110%er [5121]
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All-TigerNet [12223]
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Re: 1 person with 200 rounds won't. 10 million people
Jan 10, 2013, 4:14 PM
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We should also prepare ourselves for the impending alien invasion as well.
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110%er [6781]
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Just stay in Neverland tinkerbell it'll be safe there.***
Jan 10, 2013, 5:22 PM
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All-TigerNet [12223]
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Re: Just stay in Neverland tinkerbell it'll be safe there.***
Jan 10, 2013, 5:54 PM
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Gotcha. Your hilarious.
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110%er [6781]
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You're sad***
Jan 10, 2013, 5:59 PM
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110%er [5121]
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Orange Blooded [3422]
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Re: why?***
Jan 10, 2013, 2:06 PM
[ in reply to Re: why?*** ] |
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Well then we have similar beliefs. I'm not for an all-out ban (I don't believe most are), but I'm definitely in favor of banning assault weapons (or at least creating extremely stringent licensing for them). The problem with the massacres in Newtown & Aurora is that everything was acquired 100% legally. That has to change.
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110%er [6781]
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Re: why?***
Jan 10, 2013, 2:30 PM
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Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of chains or slavery? Forbid it, Almighty God! I know not what course others may take but as for me; give me liberty or give me death! - Patrick Henry
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Orange Blooded [3422]
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Re: why?***
Jan 10, 2013, 9:46 PM
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So liberty can only be found in the form of an assault rifle?
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110%er [6781]
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Liberty can only be found with the power to defend it.***
Jan 11, 2013, 11:52 AM
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110%er [5121]
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Define "assault weapon".
Jan 10, 2013, 3:50 PM
[ in reply to Re: why?*** ] |
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I can assault you with my pocket knife, hammer, fists, etc...are they assult weapons? All guns are capable of being used in an assault...should we ban them all? How about bow-and-arrow?
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110%er [6781]
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Re: Define "assault weapon".
Jan 10, 2013, 3:57 PM
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 Like This
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Orange Blooded [3422]
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110%er [6781]
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and unarmed people unable to fight back account for
Jan 11, 2013, 12:02 PM
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100% of all tyrannies
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Legend [18069]
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Pretty simple...a weapon that is rapid fire
Jan 10, 2013, 4:21 PM
[ in reply to Define "assault weapon". ] |
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that can gun down 20 6 years olds in a matter of seconds.
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110%er [6781]
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CU Guru [1218]
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MS, I've been arguing w/ gun control nutjobs for years......
Jan 10, 2013, 5:33 PM
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Their arguments are based on emotion, rather than fact or logic. This is why they always lose these debates...
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110%er [6781]
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Alas... you are right. I'm not going to change their minds
Jan 10, 2013, 5:45 PM
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but i hope passing readers will take in the arguments and be enlightened since they are not personally defensive about the issue.
oh and i recently had a Cohiba while on vacation. Tasted the same as a Dominican to me but i felt free. lol
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110%er [5121]
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110%er [5121]
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I'm sure a motivated individual with a machette could
Jan 10, 2013, 5:52 PM
[ in reply to Pretty simple...a weapon that is rapid fire ] |
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manage that. Or maybe a baseball bat.
It's not the weapon that's the problem. The problem is crazy people.
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All-TigerNet [12223]
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Re: I'm sure a motivated individual with a machette could
Jan 10, 2013, 8:24 PM
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Example A: guy with bat in school. Everyone has a fighting chance in that school
Example B: guy with AR-15 in school. Prepare to meet your maker
Do you really want me to keep going? I mean honestly....you can't possibly believe that a machete, knife, baseball bat etc are on the same level
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MVP [503]
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Re: I'm sure a motivated individual with a machette could
Jan 10, 2013, 8:27 PM
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Well more people are killed each year with hammers and clubs than rifles. I guess those folks who were bludgeoned to death with a blunt object didn't stand as much of a chance as you thought.
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110%er [5121]
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110%er [5121]
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Why stop at AR15's? How about my .22 pistol?
Jan 11, 2013, 10:51 AM
[ in reply to Re: I'm sure a motivated individual with a machette could ] |
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All the things I mentioned are weapons that can be used to assault someone...they aren't necessarily as effective as an AR, but they are still "assault weapons".
You can't honestly think that the weapon is the problem. I could run my truck through the wall of a school and kill an entire classroom of kids in an instant...should my truck be banned?
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110%er [6781]
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dude you are clueless.
Jan 11, 2013, 11:58 AM
[ in reply to Re: I'm sure a motivated individual with a machette could ] |
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Lets make more gun free zones so their will be less deaths!!
Dur da Dur.
have you ever heard the term "unintended consequences"?
pass all the laws you want. you know what the bad guys still have guns. but only now the good guys don't.
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MVP [503]
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All-In [49613]
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I can tell you hadn't spent much time around Taft....
Jan 10, 2013, 6:02 PM
[ in reply to Re: why?*** ] |
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I have. Great people in a wretched landscape. Taft has a lot more in common with West Texas than it does with what you think is "California."
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1st Rounder [603]
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1st Rounder [603]
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You're right about early reports - I received my first email
Jan 10, 2013, 1:22 PM
[ in reply to Re: School Shooting in California. 2 shot, gunman in custody ] |
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about our tragedy at 10:06 am about a "yet unconfirmed" report of a shooting and all schools were in lockdown for the district. That was 30 minutes after the entire event had taken place.
Two and a half to three hours later it came out about the extent of the scene and those lost. It is an extremely difficult thing to go through.
Our Prayers are with the Bakersfield community.
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All-TigerNet [10469]
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Re: You're right about early reports - I received my first email
Jan 10, 2013, 1:26 PM
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I didn't realize we had any poster here from that area. I hope that no one close to you was injured in any way.
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1st Rounder [603]
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Not directly.
Jan 10, 2013, 1:55 PM
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3 of my kids go to another elementary school less than 3 miles away from Sandy Hook.
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CU Guru [1236]
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Re: You're right about early reports - I received my first email
Jan 10, 2013, 1:49 PM
[ in reply to You're right about early reports - I received my first email ] |
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We have spent alot of time thinking about and praying for everyone in your town. I hope your loved ones were not directly involved and that your community is beginning to heal.
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1st Rounder [603]
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It's hard to say not directly, because each of my little
Jan 10, 2013, 2:12 PM
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ones had a friend/acquaintance that they knew from sports that was a victim. My daughter rides horses with several friends from Sandy Hook and is real close to one friend. Fortunately she was okay, but another friend was not.
There is only 25,000 people here in the whole town and so it is very small, very welcoming and very close. When I go into the grocery store or pizza place, they now my name and everyone says hi. It is a typical, quaint New England picturesque town with a lot of southern style hospitality in it. Everyone really cares about one another and everyone is willing to help each other. It is the best place to live and raise a family.
The town is strong and supporting one another is paramount. The community is working towards healing.
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110%er [9070]
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Another copycat killing - what can be done.....
Jan 10, 2013, 1:29 PM
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to stop them? I don't think gun control is the answer - the problem is what makes these nuts want to do this, not the fact that they can get a hold of a gun.
They all seem to be the same - social outcasts, nerds - whatever you want to call them - want to "get even" by cowardly killing innocent people.
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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gun control won't work?
Jan 10, 2013, 1:35 PM
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Works for drugs
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1st Rounder [603]
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gun control won't work. They're already out there.
Jan 10, 2013, 1:51 PM
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The downfall is the lack of mental health facilities and help for those that need it. All of the institutions were shut down when funding was cut and so now the prison system is the route for certain individuals like this and that is not a place for them and they have to commit some kind of crime to placed there which is.....sadly....after the fact that they hurt someone.
We are human. If one set of means is not available to us to do what we wish, then we will devise another plan to accomplish our goals. Timothy McViegh (sp?) did his work with fertilizer and diesel fuel. Anybody can get that down the road.
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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agreed***
Jan 10, 2013, 2:02 PM
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Legend [18069]
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110%er [6781]
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People will always find new ways to kill people in mass
Jan 10, 2013, 2:34 PM
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quantity. all the law can do is react.
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Legend [18069]
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So is that a reason to stop making laws?***
Jan 10, 2013, 3:03 PM
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110%er [6781]
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Its a reason for us to recognise that the most effective way
Jan 10, 2013, 3:34 PM
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to defend the country as a whole is for the citizens to be armed in defense of themselves.
More laws only make it more likely that criminals are unopposed. The ideas that we make enough laws to eradicate evil just isn't reality.
Teachers or anyone else do not have to check their 2nd amendment unalienable right to self defense at the door.
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110%er [6781]
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All-TigerNet [12223]
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Re: Dr. Susan Gratia on the 2nd ammendment after her parents
Jan 10, 2013, 7:45 PM
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With all due respect to "Dr" Susan Gratia she goes full blown moron at the 4:20 mark.
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Legend [18069]
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110%er [6781]
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No Reason? oh thank you all seeing grand prophet.
Jan 10, 2013, 5:24 PM
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I will worship you in your infinite wisdom and future telling. Chicks dig future telling.
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110%er [5121]
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You said you would like an assault weapons ban,
Jan 10, 2013, 5:59 PM
[ in reply to You only hear what you want to hear... ] |
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and you defined assault weapons as something that can gun down 20 kids in a matter of seconds...my handgun can do that and it doesn't even have a hi-capacity magazine (I bought it during the last ban).
My shotgun could also do the same, though it would take longer to reload.
For the record, I don't own a semi-auto rifle except my .22, which most (except for you) would never consider an "assault" weapon.
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Orange Blooded [3422]
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Re: Another copycat killing - what can be done.....
Jan 10, 2013, 1:49 PM
[ in reply to Another copycat killing - what can be done..... ] |
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Well yes, part of the problem is definitely "why do they want to do this?"...but the fact that they can get hold of a gun is just as big of a problem, if not bigger, since it gives them the power to carry out whatever sick thoughts are going through their head.
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110%er [9070]
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I'm just saying that attention needs to be paid to what.....
Jan 10, 2013, 2:20 PM
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makes people do things like this - I agree that responsible selling of guns is necessary and also the kinds of guns sold.
I'm no NRA guy by any means but I just think that more focus needs to be put on what's causing these nuts to do what they do.
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Legend [16207]
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110%er [6781]
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We could start by getting the FDA out of approving all kinds
Jan 10, 2013, 2:37 PM
[ in reply to Another copycat killing - what can be done..... ] |
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of Psychotropic drugs as safe for our kids. All of these ADD meds come with the side effects of bottoming out in depression etc. add that to an already disturbed kid and this kind of thing is what you have the potential to get.
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All-TigerNet [12223]
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Re: We could start by getting the FDA out of approving all kinds
Jan 10, 2013, 7:49 PM
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Yes. That is the answer. Get rid of medication for people with attention deficit disorder. If your arguing against prescription drug abuse...fine, but don't spew bs.
You honestly sound like that guy with the big fat dip in his mouth, talking about black helicopters, talking about how it used to be back in your day. Just so freaking ignorant on all of your takes.
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Scout Team [153]
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Re: We could start by getting the FDA out of approving all kinds
Jan 10, 2013, 9:18 PM
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Sounds as though you didn't take your meds today. Prolly wet your pants too.
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All-TigerNet [12223]
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Re: Another copycat killing - what can be done.....
Jan 10, 2013, 1:37 PM
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Hidden right to own gun post. Nice work concealing that. A plus effort
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All-TigerNet [10901]
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Ban California!***
Jan 10, 2013, 1:57 PM
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All-TigerNet [13888]
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Update: One victim refused medical treatment
Jan 10, 2013, 2:07 PM
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the other was taken to the hospital. It appears this was a non-fatal event.
Maybe he was shooting a bb gun.
As for CA....Northern CA is full of people very much like South Carolinians.
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110%er [7831]
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No people wouldn't be happy
Jan 10, 2013, 2:38 PM
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Let them take a little and they'll want to take more. That is the way they work.
The ole.... Give an inch. They'll take a mile
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110%er [6861]
TigerPulse: 95%
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Joined: 10/7/07
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ARMED GUARDS, how F****** hard is this people!?!?!?***
Jan 10, 2013, 2:39 PM
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110%er [6781]
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or armed citizens. Oh wait that worked too well for to long***
Jan 10, 2013, 2:50 PM
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110%er [8142]
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Lol.***
Jan 10, 2013, 4:14 PM
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MVP [503]
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CU Guru [1123]
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Banning magazines with capacities above some arbitrary limit make no sense. Here is one reason why
Jan 10, 2013, 2:58 PM
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NxzrahUUTi8
And though the title says fastest, there are very likely faster mag changes done each week in IPSC / USPSA competition.
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All-In [49613]
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Orange Blooded [3422]
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Re: School Shooting in California. 2 shot, gunman in custody
Jan 10, 2013, 10:09 PM
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This thread is incredibly depressing, and sort of scary. The fact that people actually think they're keeping the government in check by owning a gun is ludicrous.
Also, this whole "we'll Hitler took the guns away" thing needs to stop. It didn't matter that if the Nazis took the guns away. That changed absolutely nothing about the way things went down. In hindsight, obviously people would have done things differently...but at the time of the rise of the Third Reich, the Nazis were considered to be a good thing. Nobody was going to try to stop the Nazis because for the most part Germany was uniform in their support of the Nazis (with the exception of the SA and college students).
To sort of touch on what Jon Stewart mentioned the other night....people who are so vehemently screaming "YOU CAN'T CHANGE GUN LAWS" are scared of some hypothetical future where a tyrannical overlord has destroyed democracy....but they're so paranoid about that future that they're willing to overlook the horrible, fixable problems that this country is facing right now.
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