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Orange Immortal [67936]
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Help me out here re: Gubmint shutdown.
Oct 14, 2025, 9:39 AM
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Is either side willing to simply fund a reopening of the federal government with no strings attached, no other requirements or demands . . . just reopen the government?
If not, what are the Dem's demands before reopening?
What are Pub's demands?
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Campus Hero [13678]
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Re: Help me out here re: Gubmint shutdown.
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Oct 14, 2025, 9:56 AM
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dems need the cash to buy illegals healthcare and votes
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TigerNet Icon [160506]
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Illegals don't get healthcare coverage and illegals can't vote.
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Oct 14, 2025, 9:58 AM
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You're as dumb as Kiwi.
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Campus Hero [13678]
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Re: Illegals don't get healthcare coverage and illegals can't vote.
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Oct 14, 2025, 10:00 AM
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they absolutely get medicare and vote in blue states
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TigerNet Icon [160506]
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They do NOT get federal Medicaid coverage, and they do NOT vote in federal
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Oct 14, 2025, 10:06 AM
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elections, in red OR blue states. And exceptions to those rules at state levels are pretty rare, but even if they weren't rare, they are wholly irrelevant to the federal government shutdown.
You're still dumb.
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Campus Hero [13678]
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Re: They do NOT get federal Medicaid coverage, and they do NOT vote in federal
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Oct 14, 2025, 10:11 AM
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TigerNet Icon [160506]
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I suppose this is the only response you can have when proven wrong.
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Oct 14, 2025, 10:13 AM
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Otherwise you might have provided some proof of your claims. Enjoy your juice box.
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Campus Hero [13678]
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Re: I suppose this is the only response you can have when proven wrong.
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Oct 14, 2025, 10:13 AM
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you are cute
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TigerNet Icon [160506]
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...and correct.
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Oct 14, 2025, 10:14 AM
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You're just dumb and wrong and posting pictures.
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Campus Hero [13678]
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Re: ...and correct.
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Oct 14, 2025, 10:18 AM
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cutie pie give me a hug
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Rival Killer [2998]
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Ring of Honor [21266]
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Campus Hero [13287]
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Solid Orange [1305]
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Re: Help me out here re: Gubmint shutdown.
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Oct 14, 2025, 10:01 AM
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Pubs passed a clean CR, so ball is on Dems side of the net.
Dems want Medicaid and temporary Covid enhanced ACA subsidy cuts to be funded.
Now we have Congress standing across a line in the sand sticking out their tongue at the opposition.
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Orange Immortal [67936]
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So pubs have no demands, no strings attached, just reopen the government,
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Oct 14, 2025, 10:03 AM
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while Dems have conditions and demands in order to reopen? Is that correct?
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Campus Hero [13678]
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Re: So pubs have no demands, no strings attached, just reopen the government,
Oct 14, 2025, 10:08 AM
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they want to extort 1.5 trillion
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Orange Immortal [67936]
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So, pubs have no demands or conditions? Just reopen?***
Oct 14, 2025, 10:11 AM
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Campus Hero [13678]
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Clemson Icon [24744]
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Orange Immortal [67936]
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How so? I'm just asking a simple question. Sounds like you are employing
Oct 14, 2025, 10:13 AM
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semantics in order to avoid answering.
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Clemson Icon [24744]
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The BBB avoided Senate filibuster rules and was passed 51-50.
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Oct 14, 2025, 10:39 AM
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The CR is subject to the filibuster in the Senate and requires 60 votes.
The BBB has significant changes to health insurance, Medicare and may eventually impact Medicare. The Senate Dems want to mitigate those changes that effectively would result in an estimated 10-12 mm people being unable to afford health care coverage.
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National Champion [7943]
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Re: The BBB avoided Senate filibuster rules and was passed 51-50.
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Oct 14, 2025, 11:13 AM
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This is where Smiling taps out. 😆
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Orange Immortal [67936]
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Clemson Icon [24744]
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Compromise and bipartisanship are a part of democracy
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Oct 14, 2025, 12:05 PM
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Sounds like you are a supporter of a single party authoritarian government run by oligarchs and corporations? The independence of courts, the DOJ, LE, and the US military are seemingly being systematically eroded. Voter rights are being challenged in various ways including redistricting. The potential of heading toward a single party autocracy ruling in conjunction with the ultra wealthy is becoming more likely.
The Senate filibuster is one speed bump that protects democracy through engagement of minority parties _ and thus ensuring greater consensus on legislation and government funding. There’s a simplistic view on the present government shutdown. Or there’s a view that takes into account the bigger picture including the affordable of healthcare for millions of Americans.
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Orange Immortal [67936]
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Horse
Oct 14, 2025, 12:25 PM
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Sh!t.
Sounds like you are a supporter of a single party authoritarian government run by oligarchs and corporations?
Nope. I don't support any political party, and nothing I've said implies anything of the sort, It's nothing more than your extreme bias warping your ability to think objectively.
I have simply asked a basic question, and the answer to that question appears to be that in order to reopen the government, dems have a set of demands in order to reopen it, while pubs don't.
There's always a bigger picture, and I don't underestimate it's importance; but the answer to my question is that dems are indeed the ones keeping the government shut down; you are just justifying it by giving the bigger picture reasons why.
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National Champion [7943]
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Re: Horse
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Oct 14, 2025, 12:41 PM
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Our government is set up so that one party with a slim majority cannot run roughshod. So yes, the dems are using the leverage they have to get something. Tbis same thing happens when the dems control the WH and both houses with a slim majority. LOL at how MAGAts are acting outraged. 😆
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Orange Immortal [67936]
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And I'm not outraged at all, in fact, I haven't even kept up with the details,
Oct 14, 2025, 12:56 PM
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but it's on the news constantly, so I asked a simple question in here. The answer, as you just gave, is
Dems are the ones keeping the government shut down . . . but you (and many) believe they are doing it for good reasons.
Simple. See how easy that was.
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All-TigerNet [5882]
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I havent kept up with the details
Oct 14, 2025, 1:03 PM
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Well that explains why you keep getting it wrong that the Democrats are the reason the government is shut down.
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Clemson Sports Icon [52201]
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Why can't it be both?
Oct 14, 2025, 1:07 PM
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I don't see why both sides can't shoulder responsibility for the shutdown.
I think the narrative that's being lost is that the Trumpkin Pubs WANT the government shutdown. Foolishly so, but they don't see the real consequences of it.
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All-TigerNet [5882]
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Because only one party is refusing to negotiate
Oct 14, 2025, 1:15 PM
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And legislative bodies are built on cooperation.
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Clemson Sports Icon [52201]
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That still makes my statement true
Oct 14, 2025, 1:17 PM
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Both parties shoulder responsibility for how we got here; one is clearly wanting it to happen for sinister purposes.
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All-TigerNet [5882]
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It doesnt if youre being rational and reasonable
Oct 14, 2025, 1:27 PM
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Just because two people are involved doesn’t mean they’re both at fault. Sometimes the actions of the other party negates any action the other party can take.
If they were negotiating and just couldn’t come to an agreement, then you can blame both sides.
But there is no path the Democrats could take here other than capitulating. They’re not at fault when you’re arguing their only option is to agree to the first offer of Republicans.
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Solid Orange [1305]
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Re: Because only one party is refusing to negotiate
Oct 14, 2025, 2:30 PM
[ in reply to Because only one party is refusing to negotiate ] |
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I know responding to a black and white no shades of grey dufus is a bad idea but here goes: Tell me again who said "Elections have consequences"?
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All-TigerNet [5882]
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You really have to admire the lack of self awareness
Oct 14, 2025, 2:35 PM
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Of a guy arguing that someone else doesn’t understand nuance while arguing “elections have consequences.”
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Solid Orange [1305]
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Re: You really have to admire the lack of self awareness
Oct 14, 2025, 2:39 PM
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No dummy that was a direct quote from Barrack Hussein Obama.
SO maybe it is you that in clueless once again, just saying.
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Solid Orange [1305]
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Re: You really have to admire the lack of self awareness
Oct 14, 2025, 2:40 PM
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Made while addressing pubs on legislation.
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Orange Immortal [67936]
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What are pub demnds to reopen the government?
Oct 14, 2025, 1:14 PM
[ in reply to I havent kept up with the details ] |
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Didn't they submit a bill to reopen the government as is with no new additional spending? Just sign here and keep funding as before?
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All-TigerNet [5882]
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How is this any different than the bill
Oct 14, 2025, 1:19 PM
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The Democrats submitted to fund the government?
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Orange Immortal [67936]
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I don't know, and if they did submit a bill with no additiona commitments
Oct 14, 2025, 1:30 PM
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or new spending, just to keep the government open,and pubs refused to sign it, then it would be pubs who were shutting down the government.
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All-TigerNet [5882]
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If you dont know, maybe shouldnt be so confident in your
Oct 14, 2025, 1:33 PM
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argument.
A CR is an emergency extension of a budget. It’s not something that should be passed 6 years in a row.
There is no emergency right now that would prevent Congress from doing their job. Other than one party refusing to work with the other.
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Orange Immortal [67936]
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What exactly do you think my argument is?***
Oct 14, 2025, 2:18 PM
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All-TigerNet [5882]
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Your argument is that the Republicans are voting
Oct 14, 2025, 2:23 PM
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To keep the government open and the Democrats are the only ones voting to keep it closed.
When the reality is the Republicans are voting no on the Democrats proposal and the Democrats are voting on the Republican proposal.
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Solid Orange [1305]
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Re: Your argument is that the Republicans are voting
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Oct 14, 2025, 2:32 PM
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There is no bill from the DEM side to vote on, just demands to put back in the Covid enhancement and medicaid cuts. Cobble a bill together and put it up for a vote. It will be voted down.
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Orange Immortal [67936]
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All-TigerNet [5882]
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Re: What is the dem proposal?***
Oct 14, 2025, 3:37 PM
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You know what it includes, ACA subsidies and repealing Medicaid cuts.
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Clemson Sports Icon [52201]
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There's an argument to made that they're trying to keep the Pubs from...
Oct 14, 2025, 1:00 PM
[ in reply to Horse ] |
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Completely taking this thing off the rails. Look, we know the Dems have been weak and futile the last several years. But the Trump-era Pubs have become downright dishonest, anti-democratic, and sinister.
The plan under the BUB would cut healthcare benefits to legal immigrants. We can debate in a separate thread whether that should happen at all, but it would rip the rug right out from under them. And illegals don't get ACA benefits, which is a lie the GOP pushes.
We can't trust Trump-led GOP to do what's right for legal immigrants as they are currently targeting them and intimidating them in anyway possible. Targeting legal ones and making their healthcare unaffordable is another way to try to force them out of the country, which is ultimately the Trump goal.
So until they show they can be trusted and not target legal immigrants, well...
Does that sound a little out there and extreme? Yeah, maybe, but lemme show you some videos out of Chicago and Portland...
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Orange Immortal [67936]
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Clemson Sports Icon [52201]
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Pass a spending bill that complies with the stupidity of BUB.***
Oct 14, 2025, 1:02 PM
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Orange Immortal [67936]
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Pubs are demanding that in order to reopen the government?
Oct 14, 2025, 2:20 PM
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Or Dems are refusing to reopen the government in order to prevent pubs from passing such a bill?
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All-TigerNet [5882]
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Orange Immortal [67936]
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So dems are keeping the goverment shut down because pubs have a
Oct 14, 2025, 11:34 AM
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majority in congress? Is having a majority wrong?
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All-TigerNet [5882]
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Why are you being intellectually dishonest?
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Oct 14, 2025, 11:43 AM
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It has nothing to do with one side having a majority, it has everything to do with the majority refusing to work with the minority.
The filibuster exists to force co-operation.
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Orange Immortal [67936]
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Why can't you answer a simple question?
Oct 14, 2025, 12:39 PM
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Why can't you do that, THEN explain the reason why? Like this:
"Dems are keeping the government shut down, because pubs are evil!"
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All-TigerNet [5882]
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But you know the answer to your question was a no
Oct 14, 2025, 12:49 PM
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Did I really need to explicitly say no before explaining why your question was wrong?
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Orange Immortal [67936]
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LOL! You mean you don't LIKE the question, because in and of itself
Oct 14, 2025, 12:59 PM
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as it doesn't address the SEPARATE point you wish to argue.
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Orange Immortal [67936]
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ADD: Who is keeping the government shut down, and why they are doing it
Oct 14, 2025, 1:01 PM
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are two separate issues, dumba$$. Dumba$$es in their partisan outrage can't accept that.
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Orange Immortal [67936]
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It's like Q."Who is the best left fielder of all time?"
Oct 14, 2025, 1:08 PM
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A. Ted Williams
Outraged Willie Mays fan: Willie Mays was FAR superior, and a better all-around player!
Me: But he was a centerfielder.
Fan: Yeah, but it's an insult to not include all outfielders. Willie Mays was the best.
Me: But that wan't my question.
Fan: You are unfairly limiting the discussion.
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All-TigerNet [5882]
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Youre the only person being partisan here
Oct 14, 2025, 1:08 PM
[ in reply to ADD: Who is keeping the government shut down, and why they are doing it ] |
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If the Democrats are shutting down the government by not voting with the republicans.
How are the Republicans not also shutting down the government for refusing to vote for the Democrat proposed bills that fund the government?
You think you have some “gotcha” that makes one side wrong here. But it’s only a “gotcha” if you lack the ability to critically think.
You’re saying one party is clearly wrong for doing the same thing the other party is doing. Except here, only one party has shown the willingness to compromise.
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Orange Immortal [67936]
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Dems are not voting with pubs to reopen the govt, which is the issue at hand.
Oct 14, 2025, 1:49 PM
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Two separate issues.
Issue #1. Can we vote to reopen the govt, as is?
Pubs: Yes
Dems: No
Issue #2. Can we vote on important healthcare issues?
Pubs: No
Dems: Yes
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All-TigerNet [5882]
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When you have to make up a lie to support your argument
Oct 14, 2025, 1:54 PM
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Shouldn’t that be the sign you’re wrong?
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Orange Immortal [67936]
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What lie?***
Oct 14, 2025, 2:20 PM
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Clemson Sports Icon [52201]
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I dunno, man
Oct 14, 2025, 12:09 PM
[ in reply to So dems are keeping the goverment shut down because pubs have a ] |
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Seems like this entire year, the majority party has been working slash government jobs without discretion and systematically working to erode checks and balances throughout government. And then they push propaganda on the people to blame the other guys for why a shutdown is happening that cuts jobs and weakens government.
I think it's becoming clear who is at fault and knows they are.
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National Champion [7943]
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Orange Immortal [67936]
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Of course not, and if you were half as clever as you thought you were,
Oct 14, 2025, 1:09 PM
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you'd understand that nothing I have said indicates otherwise.
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All-TigerNet [5882]
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I mean its exactly what youre arguing
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Oct 14, 2025, 1:14 PM
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You’re saying the Democrats are wrong for not voting for the Republican Bills but then saying the Republicans aren’t wrong for not voting for the Democratic bills.
What else could you be arguing other than the minority party doesn’t get to propose bills and must agree with the majority otherwise they’re the ones being difficult.
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Orange Immortal [67936]
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Where have I said anyone is wrong?
Oct 14, 2025, 2:00 PM
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Please, show me. If you think that's what I'm doing, you have completely misunderstood the whole thread. Unlike you, I don't have a side that I have to defend at all cost while demonizing the other side with everything I've got. All I have done is try to determine the facts, by asking a simple, straightforward question. All I have gotten is a string of warped partisan responses from people who don't like the question because it doesn't address the other issues they want to rail about, and may make their side look bad.
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All-TigerNet [5882]
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Do you really think you appear objective in this debate?
Oct 14, 2025, 2:08 PM
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You’re coming off as the most partisan person in the entire debate. You keep ignoring all the facts against your argument and twisting the facts into strawman to argue.
Your question isn’t honest or straightforward.
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Orange Immortal [67936]
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Again, where have I said either side is wrong?
Oct 14, 2025, 2:30 PM
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The answers I have gotten to my very honest, direct question indicate that Dems won't vote to reopen the government becuase not doing so is the only leverage they have to stop pubs for doing something they don't agree with. Pubs, since they have the majority, are perfectly ready and willing to reopen as is. Is that not true?
That is not an argument; it's an observation of the facts. Only in the mind of a warped hyper-partisan is that "partisan". Show me how it's wrong, bearing in mind that it's perfectly reasonable to discuss left fielders separately from right and centerfielders, or baseball players in general.
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All-TigerNet [5882]
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Youre wrong. We have two options
Oct 14, 2025, 2:44 PM
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So the undeniable facts are we have two options:
1) Reopen with ACA subsidies extended
Or
2) Reopen as is
Is that wrong?
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Orange Immortal [67936]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: I mean its exactly what youre arguing
Oct 14, 2025, 2:04 PM
[ in reply to I mean its exactly what youre arguing ] |
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What else could you be arguing other than the minority party doesn’t get to propose bills and must agree with the majority otherwise they’re the ones being difficult.
How is the minority party being prevented from proposing bills by opening the government?
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All-TigerNet [5882]
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This is precisely where your argument falls apart
Oct 14, 2025, 2:13 PM
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The Democrats are proposing them but the Republicans keep refusing to have a vote on those bills.
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Solid Orange [1305]
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Re: This is precisely where your argument falls apart
Oct 14, 2025, 2:33 PM
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No bill just demands on ACA/Medicaid, no bill.
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All-TigerNet [5882]
TigerPulse: 47%
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This is just wrong
Oct 14, 2025, 2:36 PM
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The Democrats have proposed bills the Republicans refuse to vote for.
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Orange Immortal [67936]
TigerPulse: 100%
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All-TigerNet [5882]
TigerPulse: 47%
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Joined: 2005
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Re: So the minority party DOES get to propose bills.
Oct 14, 2025, 2:48 PM
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Is the minority party required to vote for the majority’s bills?
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Campus Hero [13228]
TigerPulse: 100%
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As far as I know, that is correct...
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Oct 14, 2025, 10:17 AM
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The House passed a clean CR.
Senate Dems are holding it up because they want to undo parts of the "One Big Beautiful Bill Act" that was signed into law in July.
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Campus Hero [13678]
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Valley Legend [12427]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Given the complete lockstep partisanship that exists in Congress, the Dems are
2
Oct 14, 2025, 10:25 AM
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playing the only card they have to play (until 2026).
And yes - the Pubs are only saying - let's keep all of the policy that has been legally voted upon by Congress to this point.
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TigerNet Champion [113069]
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I honestly don't think there is a plan.
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Oct 14, 2025, 10:31 AM
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Raise the retirement age to 78, cut medicaid and medicare by 50%, let people starve by cutting food stamps, and let the military decline, that's a plan. No one who makes a career and living on being elected to office, will ever vote for this. So the plan?
I think it's in......default. Like a real one. Expect Treasuries to get DUMPED, and very soon.
The plan?
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Orange Immortal [67936]
TigerPulse: 100%
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I wasn't asking about a plan, just what demands each side has in order
Oct 14, 2025, 10:34 AM
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to reopen the government.
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Campus Hero [13678]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: I wasn't asking about a plan, just what demands each side has in order
Oct 14, 2025, 10:45 AM
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1.5 trillion to keep the gubmint open until nov 21st does not look like a good deal
wasnt long ago lefties were cryin that we are spending too much lol
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TigerNet Champion [113069]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Again, I honestly think one side will eventually be willing to default.
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Oct 14, 2025, 11:26 AM
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We may be there right now.
The problem we have is systemic. Our legislative branch is beyond broke, and broken. We don't have a pub or dem problem. We have a human nature problem. Spending goes up under both dems and pubs, they just BOTH prefer to overspend on different things. Even Trump's wonderful plan, INCREASES spending. On what he likes.
NO ONE CUTS. NO DEM, NO PUB. NO ONE.
So yeah, why not default? It's going to happen eventually, barring quality leadership that demands states take responsibility and fix Congress.
There was a time, LOOOOONG ago now, when Congress would actually cut spending. The ONE time in my life when we ever had a balanced budget, was when Clinton had (brief) use of the line item veto. That was shut down by the Supreme Court, and the stage has been set. Without the president having that authority, there's only two options left. Article V and term limits on Congress, or a default.
If we default, it won't matter if you're a dem or a pub, you will be a broke dem or a broke pub. And likely no longer free to be either.
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Orange Immortal [67936]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Agree 100% about irresponsible spending for political reasons.
Oct 14, 2025, 11:37 AM
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at some point, somebody has to be the adult and say "NO!".
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TigerNet Champion [113069]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Joined: 2002
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It's the mandatory spending that is killing us.
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Oct 14, 2025, 11:53 AM
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Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, SNAP/Food Stamps, Welfare, Retirement benefits, and recently entering the picture, coming in at #2 or 3, I forget, INTEREST PAYMENTS ON OUR DEBT.
You can add the military as well, we never scaled down after the Cold War. Just kept going.
Cut ANYTHING in the first sentence, and that's a reelection lost in Congress.
We are witnessing a decades long, systemic exploitation of the biggest weakness in our Constitution. It isn't political. We controlled the "factions" pretty well. "Factions" are not our problem.
Let me put it this way, I'd vote for a dem President, if that meant 2 term limits in Congress, and everyone there on a 2nd or longer term MUST LEAVE at the conclusion of their present term, from all parties, with new elections, and then continuing with the 2-term limits in perpetuity. And that dem President would have better bills cross his/her desk in just a few short years. Spending would be cut. Immigration laws, would be reformed. Social Security retirement age would go up. No more spending to get reelected. No more CAREER in Congress. NO MORE INSIDER TRADING opportunities. I think Pelosi is up $100 million over her years trading based on insider info. Lobbyists would be aghast, having to constantly court new faces and people. That influence would wane. So much benefit in term limits.
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Clemson Sports Icon [52201]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Joined: 1998
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Re: It's the mandatory spending that is killing us.
Oct 14, 2025, 11:57 AM
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Let me put it this way, I'd vote for a dem President, if that meant 2 term limits in Congress, and everyone there on a 2nd or longer term MUST LEAVE at the conclusion of their present term, from all parties, with new elections, and then continuing with the 2-term limits in perpetuity. And that dem President would have better bills cross his/her desk in just a few short years. Spending would be cut. Immigration laws, would be reformed. Social Security retirement age would go up. No more spending to get reelected. No more CAREER in Congress. NO MORE INSIDER TRADING opportunities. I think Pelosi is up $100 million over her years trading based on insider info. Lobbyists would be aghast, having to constantly court new faces and people. That influence would wane. So much benefit in term limits.
Sadly, this is likely a pipe dream as the clowns who have to make it happen control the vote. And as a result, people have turned to an idiot who wants to burn it all down because they don't know what else to do.
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TigerNet Champion [113069]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Joined: 2002
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Article V. It's there. Don't listen to the detractors. It was designed for
Oct 14, 2025, 12:15 PM
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states to have the ability to place limits on Congress in the event Congress should ever have a problem it could not fix itself. Congress is the weakest link in our system of checks and balances, and Article V was perhaps the ONLY balance for Congress, and it's never been used. Go figure.
At this point, this should be the #1 priority of ANYONE running for any office IMHO. Dem, pub, whatever. There would be a massive effort against this, but the most powerful people around, but it must be done. First, you'd have states lobbied to include a partisan wish list in their votes, which kills any hope. This is a time-tested approach. Another would to be to threaten funding to states, and threatening state legislators. This has also been done/threatened. The effort would have to be carefully coordinated and CONTROLLED. Term limits and/or a balanced budget (NOTHING more). More Americans, of both parties, approve of this than Born Again Christians who voted for Bush. Almost to the level of the African-American vote Obama got. But this is EVERYONE. 86%+ in some polls.
You only need 35 states. I'd wager, properly done, you could get 40+ states.
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Clemson Sports Icon [52201]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Joined: 1998
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Yeah, it's there, but I'm less optimistic...
Oct 14, 2025, 12:20 PM
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That you could get red and blue states to play nice enough to come together unless you truly referendum this. If one party supports it, the other will oppose it. And every single senator will be working their ### off to fight it.
Let's look at Lindsey Graham, for example. People wonder how often he gets reelected considering how bad he sucks as a senator. That's because he's very, very good at taking care of people within our state and getting them to vote in his favor. He's been a huge ally of the ports, SC's largest employer. So while people in Missouri may not get why he keeps getting put in office, the people in South Carolina whom he takes care of will make sure it happens.
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TigerNet Champion [113069]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Joined: 2002
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I have voted against Graham every election, except his first.
Oct 14, 2025, 1:48 PM
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I'm a republican, btw.
And honestly, I can take care of myself. The day I need a Senator or whatever to take care of me, bury me. He's only still around because he's been spending my grandkids money for decades, now pandering to adults with their children's future tax dollars. And I can say the same about any democrat as well.
If you have children, there's no way in good conscious that you should ever vote for anyone based on how much money they can throw your way, when we're $40T in debt.
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Clemson Sports Icon [52201]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Joined: 1998
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People want what the government can give them
Oct 14, 2025, 2:04 PM
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No matter how big they talk or dress it up. Graham does a lot for people in SC and gives them what they want. They keep him in power as a result.
I bet even port guys ###### by tariffs would still vote Graham.
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Orange Immortal [67936]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Joined: 2000
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Re: It's the mandatory spending that is killing us.
Oct 14, 2025, 12:48 PM
[ in reply to It's the mandatory spending that is killing us. ] |
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Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, SNAP/Food Stamps, Welfare, Retirement benefits, and recently entering the picture, coming in at #2 or 3, I forget, INTEREST PAYMENTS ON OUR DEBT. Cut ANYTHING in the first sentence, and that's a reelection lost in Congress.
Government dependency and/or the idea that government should take care of us (socialism) is and always has been a bad idea. Helping those who are truly in need and simply can't take care of themselves is a noble and worthy cause; but we have gone far, far beyond that,
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Solid Orange [1305]
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Re: It's the mandatory spending that is killing us.
Oct 14, 2025, 1:34 PM
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Winner winner chicken dinner. I have no problem helping those physically/mentally unable but poor life choices do not matter to me. You live your choices by your own merits.
The ACA COVID ENHANCEMENT is/was way too much and as such needs to go.
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Solid Orange [1343]
TigerPulse: 83%
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Re: It's the mandatory spending that is killing us.
Oct 14, 2025, 7:44 PM
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It is mostly used by lower-income people in red states where Medicaid wasn't expanded. That's the vast majority. The benefit we all get from a majority of people being on health insurance, whether private insurance, subsidized private insurance, or medicare/medicaid is overall lower costs per capita. Critically-ill people get treated by emergency rooms whether or not they have insurance. When they don't have insurance, the cost gets shouldered by the government under a special program and by the rest of us through higher medical costs and then higher insurance. I can refer you to somebody who can explain the benefits of preventive care.
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All-Time Great [91597]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Joined: 2012
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If the Gubmit resumes, a representative gets sworn in who has the deciding
Oct 14, 2025, 12:44 PM
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vote on releasing the Epstein files.
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Paw Master [16901]
TigerPulse: 100%
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There are no more Republicans just MAGA devotees***
Oct 14, 2025, 1:06 PM
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Rival Killer [2998]
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Re: Help me out here re: Gubmint shutdown.
Oct 14, 2025, 1:24 PM
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You guys are talking about dems and GOP in the legislative branch like this is their game and they are going fix this next week.
Has anyone been paying attention? Do you have any clue what Donald Trump is doing?
trump has 100% control of the executive branch.
Republicans control Congress and they are weak spineless sheep 100% controlled by Trump. Not one of them has had independent thought since 2016.
Trump controls the executive branch and Congress.
With this, we have a government shut down.
Trump is perfectly happy with the government shut down.
He has divided us. He is intent on paving the groundwork for Americans to physically fight against each other. Maybe even Civil War. It appears he would like to see institutions collapse. Once there’s a vacuum, he will attempt to fill the void. He will claim we cannot hold elections during a time of war or civil unrest.
Buckle up you morons.
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Orange Immortal [67936]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Trump has been extremely devisive, no doubt.***
Oct 14, 2025, 2:43 PM
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Paw Master [17536]
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Jeh Johnson ain't MAGA, ain't GOP
Oct 14, 2025, 1:35 PM
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but he sounds like a rational person. It is childish to shut down the government for political reasons regardless of who initiates it.
This time, it's the Dems.
I also don't see any role for the taxpayers to be propping up NPR, which is another one of the Dems demands. Make it or break it without taxpayer support-NPR.
https://www.aol.com/news/m-going-break-party-line-032636633.html
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National Champion [7943]
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Re: Jeh Johnson ain't MAGA, ain't GOP
Oct 14, 2025, 1:46 PM
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What would you consider an affordable health insurance premium for a family of 4?
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Solid Orange [1305]
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Re: Jeh Johnson ain't MAGA, ain't GOP
Oct 14, 2025, 2:35 PM
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Whatever the going rate is without govt. subsidies. You do not like that answer but that is the grownup answer. Currently right at 1/3 of the entire population is on Medicaid or an ACA plan.
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All-TigerNet [5882]
TigerPulse: 47%
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Re: Jeh Johnson ain't MAGA, ain't GOP
Oct 14, 2025, 3:38 PM
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So what do you propose people who can’t afford that do?
Just go without healthcare?
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Solid Orange [1305]
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Re: Jeh Johnson ain't MAGA, ain't GOP
Oct 14, 2025, 4:02 PM
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I am not mommy/daddy, as such if they are able bodied and mentally fit they need to do what we all did. Get a job with decent benefits, suck it up and pay premiums and maybe not have 30 tats, latest cell phone with unlimited GB's, basic cable, no new whips, eat at home etc. You know ,just be an adult. It is not asking too much.
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All-TigerNet [5882]
TigerPulse: 47%
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Really have to admire your hatred of people
Oct 14, 2025, 4:10 PM
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By calling a small business owner who makes 60-80k a year working 50+ hours a week a child and you’re his daddy.
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Solid Orange [1305]
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Re: Really have to admire your hatred of people
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Oct 14, 2025, 4:13 PM
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As in govt/taxpayers taking care of them. Simply is not taxpayers or the govt.'s job.
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All-TigerNet [5882]
TigerPulse: 47%
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Re: Really have to admire your hatred of people
Oct 14, 2025, 4:16 PM
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Hey man if you hate small business owners just come out and say it.
You just want everyone working in the coal mine, you don’t want any of those guys to be middle class.
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Solid Orange [1305]
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Re: Really have to admire your hatred of people
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Oct 14, 2025, 5:34 PM
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Life choices, you want to be a small business owner more power to you. Thing is the taxpayers are not involved in you life choice so they are not responsible to cover your shortages on funds. Liberals always think they get freedom of consequences, sigh , it is silly really.
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All-TigerNet [5882]
TigerPulse: 47%
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The irony of telling people who pay taxes
Oct 14, 2025, 5:51 PM
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that their tax dollars shouldn’t be used to help them.
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Solid Orange [1305]
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Re: The irony of telling people who pay taxes
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Oct 14, 2025, 6:12 PM
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No skippy, the irony is you thinking that people who pay taxes should be forced to subsidize others life choices. So tell me, since I have insurance not on the ACA just what benefit I would get from paying my taxes while paying their insurance? I'll be waiting. Seems kinda one sided right?
Your line of thinking is exactly why we are heading to $40T debt and running $1.5T-$2T deficits annually.
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All-TigerNet [5882]
TigerPulse: 47%
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Joined: 2005
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Why do you need a benefit for every tax dollar spent?
Oct 14, 2025, 6:27 PM
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Your post just shows how miserable and selfish you are as a person.
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National Champion [7943]
TigerPulse: 89%
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National Champion [7943]
TigerPulse: 89%
42
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Joined: 2001
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Re: Jeh Johnson ain't MAGA, ain't GOP
Oct 14, 2025, 4:01 PM
[ in reply to Re: Jeh Johnson ain't MAGA, ain't GOP ] |
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The current average of Healthcare costs for a family of 4 with unsubsidized health insurance (premiums + out of pocket costs) is $25000. I'm sure the average middle class family has no problem with 2k per month average. 😆
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Solid Orange [1305]
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Re: Jeh Johnson ain't MAGA, ain't GOP
Oct 14, 2025, 4:03 PM
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Maybe find a job that has decent benefits, I know I always looked at that when looking for work. You know it is called being an adult.
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Solid Orange [1305]
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Re: Jeh Johnson ain't MAGA, ain't GOP
Oct 14, 2025, 4:04 PM
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Or hey how about the EU model for spending that takes an average of 63% of each unit of currency earned to pay for that free stuff?
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Solid Orange [1343]
TigerPulse: 83%
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Re: Jeh Johnson ain't MAGA, ain't GOP
Oct 14, 2025, 7:55 PM
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They do live longer, are happier, and don't typically have people shooting up schools (it happens, but very rarely).
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Solid Orange [1305]
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Re: Jeh Johnson ain't MAGA, ain't GOP
Oct 14, 2025, 8:08 PM
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It is a different lifestyle , lots of walking and bicycling. Food is totally different too, leading to better health outcomes.
Happier, maybe in some countries and at certain ages.
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National Champion [7943]
TigerPulse: 89%
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Re: Jeh Johnson ain't MAGA, ain't GOP
Oct 14, 2025, 5:20 PM
[ in reply to Re: Jeh Johnson ain't MAGA, ain't GOP ] |
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To hell with small business and independent contractors? 😆 How American of you. 😆
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Solid Orange [1305]
TigerPulse: 97%
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Re: Jeh Johnson ain't MAGA, ain't GOP
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Oct 14, 2025, 5:25 PM
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That would fall under life choices, you make them and must live with them.
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Solid Orange [1343]
TigerPulse: 83%
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Re: Jeh Johnson ain't MAGA, ain't GOP
Oct 14, 2025, 7:48 PM
[ in reply to Re: Jeh Johnson ain't MAGA, ain't GOP ] |
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It's a lot more than a third. My employer-provided plan is ACA compliant, similar to a plan I could buy from the same provider on the marketplace. Everyone with insurance in the US is bascially on medicare, medicaid, or an "ACA plan." Even USAA has to follow the ACA.
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Solid Orange [1305]
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Re: Jeh Johnson ain't MAGA, ain't GOP
Oct 14, 2025, 8:04 PM
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Yes the ACA mandated coverages for all plans but they are not all subsidized by the government.
Pure subsidized plan participants are around 22m, Medicaid is another roughly 80m. So roughly 1/3 of population.
Medicare was paid in to over working lifetime by both employer and employee. One may try to make a case for it being subsidized but most folks pay in for 40-45 years .
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Solid Orange [1343]
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Re: Jeh Johnson ain't MAGA, ain't GOP
Oct 15, 2025, 12:34 AM
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The subsidy isn’t direct, it’s a tax credit for the customer. But the 22m number (now 25m) is just the number of people buying policies through the marketplace, whether they get the credit or not. Then some more people buy the same exact policies direct from the insurance companies.
Medicare is definitely subsidized. It’s for a population for which the private insurance model doesn’t work.
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National Champion [7527]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Joined: 2003
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Re: Help me out here re: Gubmint shutdown.
Oct 14, 2025, 7:53 PM
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Republicans passed current level of spending CR.
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