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Replies: 65
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Commissioner [932]
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Want to see what we are up against? (What aTm is now doing)
Jan 4, 2022, 3:30 PM
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Boosters now forming LLC’s with the sole purpose of funding NIL’s. Already happening at Texas A&M and even S.Car is putting this together.
This is going to become the norm.
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110%er [9675]
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Oh geez… we’ve been over this.
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Jan 4, 2022, 3:33 PM
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Losers are still gonna lose, and winners are still gonna win.
Some things will just look different, and there will be wilder stories like this crapp.
The results won’t change.
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Orange Blooded [2025]
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Re: Oh geez… we’ve been over this.
Jan 4, 2022, 3:35 PM
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That’s wishful thinking.
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Team Captain [462]
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well if money is the answer then why the hell haven;t the
Jan 4, 2022, 3:43 PM
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effin cowboys won every superbowl?
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110%er [5512]
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Re: well if money is the answer then why the hell haven;t the
Jan 4, 2022, 3:48 PM
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...because there's a salary cap
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Team Captain [462]
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you don't seriously believe these guys only get salary ?***
Jan 4, 2022, 4:10 PM
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110%er [5072]
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Re: you don't seriously believe these guys only get salary ?***
Jan 4, 2022, 4:20 PM
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What?
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MVP [533]
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Re: well if money is the answer then why the hell haven;t the
Jan 4, 2022, 3:57 PM
[ in reply to well if money is the answer then why the hell haven;t the ] |
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Cap & free agency & the draft & also their 3peat was achieved w/o the hindrance of a cap or free agency, as were the Steeler & 49er dynasties
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CU Medallion [53716]
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Herschel created their 3 peat.***
Jan 4, 2022, 4:19 PM
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Orange Blooded [4661]
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Re: Herschel created their 3 peat.***
Jan 4, 2022, 4:50 PM
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Calm down, you are going to lure in AFDAWG.
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110%er [5072]
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110%er [9675]
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All-TigerNet [10822]
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All-TigerNet [10354]
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110%er [7157]
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I guess it depends on what your version of success is...
Jan 4, 2022, 3:56 PM
[ in reply to Oh geez… we’ve been over this. ] |
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if its recruiting, wins and losses, and championship participation then we will probably need to participate in the booster thing at least to a degree.
Or maybe we feel its morally wrong and we refuse to participate. Then it could be considered a success b/c we do things the right way at Clemson. But is it morally wrong to fund our recruiting efforts?
Its one thing if its illegal. I agree with you there. But its not illegal anymore. Used to be. But now its sanctioned. So if you're not taking advantage then you're going to be left in the dust. Kids would be foolish not to cash in on legal NIL benefits.
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All-TigerNet [10354]
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that's what many don't understand......
Jan 4, 2022, 4:00 PM
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it "feels dirty" b/c it's been against the rules for so long and the NIL is so new, but IT'S ALL LEGAL........most through legal loopholes in the original NIL "rules", but loopholed or not it's legal AND nothing's being enforced anyways.
I despise it, hate it, but I'm not naïve enough to think "well if we just do it the right way we'll be fine"..........Clemson (much like Dabo & the portal) needs to ADAPT to the NIL and at least "go down swinging" and try to compete. Even though we all know we don't have the money to compete.
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110%er [9675]
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Wow!
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Jan 4, 2022, 5:01 PM
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You don’t even realize you’re trying to tell us that our only option is do something that we know we can’t be successful at.
I can’t even…
Just go back and read your own post.
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110%er [7157]
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So go down without swinging... got it.***
Jan 4, 2022, 5:10 PM
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All-TigerNet [10354]
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you have no clue what you're talking about.......
Jan 4, 2022, 5:14 PM
[ in reply to Wow! ] |
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that's exactly what I'm saying.
Go down swinging!........survive as long as you can.
Although I realize people like you aren't like that. That's fine to each their own. Stick your head in the sand while the tide rises.
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110%er [9675]
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Re: you have no clue what you're talking about.......
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Jan 4, 2022, 5:20 PM
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You literally said we NEED to do something that we cannot be successful at, instead of fighting a winning battle.
If you can’t understand what a loser comment that is, I can’t help you any further.
You’re not really being serious, are you?
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All-TigerNet [10354]
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I don't need to be "helped any further".........
Jan 4, 2022, 5:25 PM
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you're the one who can't see the big picture. I can't help you see any better..........you just don't GET IT!
just keep your head in the sand, you'll be safer there.
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110%er [9675]
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Maybe I’ll go buy a lottery ticket that I know has the wrong numbers.
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Jan 4, 2022, 5:27 PM
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Gonna use your philosophy, and see how it works out.
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110%er [7459]
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it is illegal - violates state law in Texas, violates state
Jan 4, 2022, 5:15 PM
[ in reply to I guess it depends on what your version of success is... ] |
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law in SC - those laws are similar. Not sure about other states as I haven't looked those up. Not sure there is clear guidelines on enforcement though or penalties to discourage.
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110%er [7459]
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also, because it violates state law, it breaks NCAA rules
Jan 4, 2022, 5:37 PM
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whether the state is lax in enforcing their own laws or not. A federal statute is needed and I believe one is coming. The Texas state law basically even calls for the feds to act and create a law. It actually might not be a bad thing to see how these are being done illegally so the correct legislation and penalties can be put in place.
I also would like to see more done with discouraging transfers. The sit one year thing was a good thing. Covid broke that as did the challenges and soft underbelly of the NCAA. It requires some rethought. They argue that you can't prevent a student athlete from transferring like when a regular student can. But it seems to me you could make a rule that a kid has to have 30 credit hours at a school before he is eligible. There are plenty of rules in place at schools that require standards to be eligible to participate in a variety of activities. The sooner stuff like that gets put in place, the sooner a pro minor league/club will have to be the answer for these guys that don't want to go to college anyway. The colleges have never wanted a pro minor league to develop as it would take away the talent that was growing their sport, but the reality is the path they are headed down will destroy the college game and the $ and interest will dry up. The vast majority of college fans are drawn to the game by the passion and love for their school and beating their friends schools etc. They are not in love with these highest bidder players or give a crap about watching them in some pro/semi-pro league. There are people who will support and go see them play that aren't affiliated or care about a school, they can have each other. The NFL may have to fund it because I don't think the boosters currently doing this will do so once it's no longer associated with their college.
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MVP [533]
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All-TigerNet [12536]
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We will not still be a winner if we
Jan 4, 2022, 4:05 PM
[ in reply to Oh geez… we’ve been over this. ] |
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Don't get with it. Right now we are getting left at the starting blocks.
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110%er [9675]
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Re: We will not still be a winner if we
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Jan 4, 2022, 5:29 PM
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Problem with that is…
You don’t know what “get with it” is.
Do you mean just be a copycat and follow all the losers?
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110%er [5927]
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you're blind
Jan 4, 2022, 5:28 PM
[ in reply to Oh geez… we’ve been over this. ] |
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if you dont think this is going to help them. I guess we will just have to watch the coots rake in 4-5 stars while we are content with our "culture" guys. maybe we can win one every now and then against them.....
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Hall of Famer [24862]
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Re: Want to see what we are up against? (What aTm is now doing)
Jan 4, 2022, 3:47 PM
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NIP it in the bud. AD's can nip it in the bud. Will take a few with balls to do it. Just refuse to take any players who are getting paid. They are student athletes, supposedly. Causes division among team members. Either that or any player getting NIL money must share with all players on team. Put it in the pot and divvy it up equally. As part of being on a team, all team members voluntarily sign the agreement when they commit to Clemson. Don't want to sign agreement, commit to some other team.
There are ways to nip this in the bud. Somebody just has to have the balls to do it and take the heat. If the top 5 team coaches, took the lead, this could be stopped. No one is entitled to a spot on any FB team in America. Coaches and AD's accepted this NIL BS w/o putting limits on it from an individual team aspect. Some idiot led them to believe they had no control over it. They have total control over who is on a team and who is not. There is no law saying they even have to have a team. A player can only cash in on NIL if he is on a FB team. So, the team holds all the cards. Not on a team, so NIL money. What is so hard to understand about that?
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110%er [5512]
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Re: Want to see what we are up against? (What aTm is now doing)
Jan 4, 2022, 3:49 PM
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Not sure if you've ever been out in the real world...sounds like you have spent a lot of time in fantasy land. None of what you are stating is remotely realistic.
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Hall of Famer [24862]
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Re: Want to see what we are up against? (What aTm is now doing)
Jan 4, 2022, 3:57 PM
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It is only remotely unrealistic if we accept greed and unethical behavior by everyone involved in College FB as normal. If that is the case, then let it die a quick death.
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All-TigerNet [10354]
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Texas A&M is spending THIRTY MILLION on a recruiting class..
Jan 4, 2022, 3:55 PM
[ in reply to Re: Want to see what we are up against? (What aTm is now doing) ] |
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do you honestly think ANY of the "top programs" are going to refuse to "play the game" and opt out of the NIL game being played????..............He!! no, WHY?........because they know ADAPT or DIE.......PLAY THE GAME or LOSE.
at the current rate assuming NOTHING changes w/ NIL/portal/etc.... there will be 10-12ish teams that will "survive" and be at the top of college football......the remaining will essentially become irrelevant and unable to compete. It will kill the fan interest at those schools and really suffocate football programs...........only the RICH programs can survive this.
I'm just speaking for myself, but guarantee I'm not the only one who thinks this, but if this continues and there's no chance Clemson can keep up what's the point in dropping TONS of money to go to games, tailgate, etc.... when the interest dies.????
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Hall of Famer [24862]
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Re: Texas A&M is spending THIRTY MILLION on a recruiting class..
Jan 4, 2022, 4:06 PM
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That's why it MUST be nipped in the bud. It should have been done immediately before it got to this point. AS soon as this hit the news, many sports fans, and many here predicted exactly what we now see, and even worse. If we could see it, why didn't those in charge see it and do something about it. All they did was to encourage it by setting up programs to help players cash in. They should have been setting up programs to control it or eliminate it. So, who is at fault?
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All-TigerNet [10354]
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Well, I don't know the detailed timeline of events, BUT....
Jan 4, 2022, 4:11 PM
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short answer: Players got Lawyers involved
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Hall of Famer [24862]
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Re: Well, I don't know the detailed timeline of events, BUT....
Jan 4, 2022, 4:20 PM
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They got lawyers involved to get some of the loot and that led to the court saying they could cash in on NIL, but the court nor the lawyers said how the teams had to respond or what the rules were. I think it was left up to individual states. The big donors with urging from AD's and coaches could have lobbied the state legislatures on how to control it. But, no AD or coach wanted to alienate any future recruits by taking a stand on regulating it.
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CU Guru [1129]
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Orange Blooded [2860]
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Re: Texas A&M is spending THIRTY MILLION on a recruiting class..
Jan 6, 2022, 9:14 PM
[ in reply to Texas A&M is spending THIRTY MILLION on a recruiting class.. ] |
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And this is Clemson fans like you and I that feel this way. Imagine other schools that do not have deep pockets. I don’t mind giving IPTAY money, but setting up a company to directly pay players is simply just unethical and not in the spirit of the NIL. I cannot be involved with that. I am all for players getting endorsements. I am not for the money laundering from boosters to players we all knew would take place.
Unethical conduct is not necessarily illegal but I can sure lose my job for unethical conduct. This is how the NCAA needs to approach this if they want the bell cow of college football to survive and thus other collegiate sports that it funds. Create a STRICT code of ethics that prohibits this with severe fines up to and including the death penalty.
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Orange Blooded [2860]
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Re: Texas A&M is spending THIRTY MILLION on a recruiting class..
Jan 6, 2022, 9:14 PM
[ in reply to Texas A&M is spending THIRTY MILLION on a recruiting class.. ] |
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And this is Clemson fans like you and I that feel this way. Imagine other schools that do not have deep pockets. I don’t mind giving IPTAY money, but setting up a company to directly pay players is simply just unethical and not in the spirit of the NIL. I cannot be involved with that. I am all for players getting endorsements. I am not for the money laundering from boosters to players we all knew would take place.
Unethical conduct is not necessarily illegal but I can sure lose my job for unethical conduct. This is how the NCAA needs to approach this if they want the bell cow of college football to survive and thus other collegiate sports that it funds. Create a STRICT code of ethics that prohibits this with severe fines up to and including the death penalty.
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All-TigerNet [13421]
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Re: Want to see what we are up against? (What aTm is now doing)
Jan 4, 2022, 4:00 PM
[ in reply to Re: Want to see what we are up against? (What aTm is now doing) ] |
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There is no incentive for the bigger programs to want to "nip it in the bud" because it is a huge recruiting advantage for those programs that have the dollars and resources to incentivize recruits to come to their programs. This was exactly what Dabo warned about when he said it would ruin college football and make smaller programs less competitive. He took a lot of heat for that but the reality is coming to roost and now that the horse is out of the barn, you ain't getting him back.
This is also why the SEC did what it did in trying to lock up the better programs in the country. They recognized what would happen and tried to get out in front of it before others figured it out, forcing the hand of other programs and conferences to respond. With ad revenue and TV contracts as big as they are, we are in an arms race in college football and the landscape is now forever changed.
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All-TigerNet [10354]
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exactly***
Jan 4, 2022, 4:02 PM
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Hall of Famer [24862]
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Re: Want to see what we are up against? (What aTm is now doing)
Jan 4, 2022, 4:12 PM
[ in reply to Re: Want to see what we are up against? (What aTm is now doing) ] |
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I'm not ready to throw in the towel. It cannot continue down this path w/o destroying CFB as we know it. If it does, then CFB will become NFL lite with no more than 20 teams or less being competitive. Looks like I may need to buy a new set of golf clubs because I won't be giving a hoot about NFL lite CFB.
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All-TigerNet [13421]
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Re: Want to see what we are up against? (What aTm is now doing)
Jan 4, 2022, 4:16 PM
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If I were you, I would go ahead over to the driving range 
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Hall of Famer [24862]
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Re: Want to see what we are up against? (What aTm is now doing)
Jan 4, 2022, 4:23 PM
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I think you are correct.
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All-TigerNet [13421]
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Re: Want to see what we are up against? (What aTm is now doing)
Jan 4, 2022, 4:15 PM
[ in reply to Re: Want to see what we are up against? (What aTm is now doing) ] |
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I will add one more thing to this discussion. If you don't figure out a way to help your recruits with NIL opportunities and do it aggressively, not only are you going to get left behind but you are going to wind up with a bunch of 3* players on your roster and no matter how good you think your coaching is, you won't generate the kind of success we have enjoyed over the last decade. Just look down to Columbia and you will see your future without 4*/5* players on your roster.
To me, this is a far greater risk to our program than coaching continuity because not only do you have to incentivize recruits to come to your program, you also have to figure out how to keep incentivizing them to stay out of the portal. If we take a conservative approach to this, we will get left behind very quickly. Dabo has done a great job but he will be the first to tell you that our success in recruiting was the lynchpin that started the ball rolling. You see a dropoff there and you will see a commensurate dropoff in results.
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All-In [48121]
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Re: Want to see what we are up against? (What aTm is now doing)
Jan 4, 2022, 5:16 PM
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Yeah, I see someone TD the post already but you are correct. It's that simple. It's all about the Jimmy and Joes. I'll assume your quip about the coots brought the TD... I wouldn't go that far but this past season will be our peak.
Are there kids out there that would come to Clemson to be under Dabo's tutelage, of course. But not enough. Everyone hates it, but right now, it is what it is. We already do have staff that helps student atheletes navigate NIL... But what's happening now, that conservative approach won't work.
I'm confident that Dabo and AD are doing something. We just don't know about it.
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All-TigerNet [13421]
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Re: Want to see what we are up against? (What aTm is now doing)
Jan 4, 2022, 6:16 PM
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Probably didn't like the shot at Columbia
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All-TigerNet [13421]
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Re: Want to see what we are up against? (What aTm is now doing)
Jan 4, 2022, 6:21 PM
[ in reply to Re: Want to see what we are up against? (What aTm is now doing) ] |
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It is certainly going to be a challenge. In a lot of these recruit homes, we will be there talking about making them better men, the PAW Journey, and graduation rates while the other guys will be talking about how much money they are going to help them make while they are in school. A lot of these top-tier kids come from homes in financial need so you know the money situation certainly changes the dynamic and the conversation. If we don't fight fire with fire, I just don't see how we keep from falling behind in recruiting these kids.
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CU Guru [1134]
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Re: Want to see what we are up against? (What aTm is now doing)
Jan 4, 2022, 4:22 PM
[ in reply to Re: Want to see what we are up against? (What aTm is now doing) ] |
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you said " If the top 5 team coaches, took the lead, this could be stopped."... and, assuming clemson/dabo is in that top 5, what do you do when the other 4 go the way of the whole NIL thing? do you stand your ground, anyway, and burn to that very ground?... or, do you adapt to the new norm?
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Hall of Famer [24862]
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Re: Want to see what we are up against? (What aTm is now doing)
Jan 4, 2022, 4:32 PM
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Well, one coach probably can't stop it. If I was Dabo, I would ask my AD and President of the Univ. how committed are they to buying players and do they want Clemson playing with the BIG boys for natties. And I would explain that is the way of the future of CFB. If they say buy the players, then he can decide if that is how he wants to be involved as a coach or not.
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CU Guru [1061]
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CU Guru [1134]
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Re: Want to see what we are up against? (What aTm is now doing)
Jan 6, 2022, 2:44 PM
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then what is it that we're doing, right now?
and, if dabo and clemson aren't "even in the discussion of" the top 5 programs... then i have to ask "why"? name another program, besides bama, that can have a "down year" w/ 10 wins. you're either a hater, or you're not thinking clearly. which is it?
tell ya what.. you tell me your top 5 programs and compare their accomplishments for the past 6 years vs clemson's and let me know if you still have the same opinion.
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Legend [17522]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 14120
Joined: 10/24/10
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NIL will age fast (Ref: Jimmy Page)
Jan 4, 2022, 3:57 PM
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2021 NIL
2031 NIL
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MVP [533]
TigerPulse: 84%
Posts: 6210
Joined: 8/30/14
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Re: NIL will age fast (Ref: Jimmy Page)
Jan 4, 2022, 4:07 PM
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Zeppelin > rolling stones & the overrated boy band
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Orange Blooded [2336]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 2023
Joined: 6/3/18
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Re: Want to see what we are up against? (What aTm is now doing)
Jan 4, 2022, 4:11 PM
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Just asking fir a friend. How many games did A&M win this year?
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All-TigerNet [13421]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 8897
Joined: 8/30/18
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Re: Want to see what we are up against? (What aTm is now doing)
Jan 4, 2022, 4:19 PM
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Tell your friend they beat Alabama with a roster that is going to be a whole lot better next year.
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Orange Blooded [4745]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 8641
Joined: 2/7/02
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110%er [5512]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 4986
Joined: 10/21/15
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CU Guru [1852]
TigerPulse: 97%
Posts: 1548
Joined: 10/3/19
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Re: Want to see what we are up against? (What aTm is now doing)
Jan 4, 2022, 4:17 PM
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I am shocked it took this long to come to fruition. Once I read the first state NIL statute (Calf.), I thought to myself that you can drive a fleet of Mack trucks filled with $$$ right through that sucker and it is perfectly legal. Donors will be shrouded in anonymity depending on state of incorporation. Coaches just need to release their wish list recruiting board to donors and let them take it from there. It is that simple and that is what TA&M just did. It may not lead to a natty, but it sure will not hurt. The two teams in the natty each year usually have the best rosters of talent. It is a Jimmy and Joe biz and Dabo said the same in the past week. Finally, the only possible solution is a Federal law that supercedes the patchwork quilt of state laws. Don't hold your breath on that. I won't even mention the NCAA, b/c they are irrelevant and powerless.
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All-TigerNet [10354]
TigerPulse: 84%
Posts: 14025
Joined: 11/9/04
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TAMU may have not guaranteed a national title, but.....
Jan 4, 2022, 4:25 PM
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what it does is eliminates all but about 10-12 Power 5 programs from title contention in the long run.
Texas
Texas A&M
Bama
Oklahoma
Georgia
Ohio State
Michigan
Notre Dame
SoCal
Miami
Maybe a few more that could swing the big bucks to compete
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Orange Blooded [4661]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 2180
Joined: 4/21/21
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Re: Want to see what we are up against? (What aTm is now doing)
Jan 4, 2022, 4:52 PM
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The optimist in me is hoping that at some point an advisory board pops up to regulate some of the corruption. I wish they would change the name away from Name, Image, Likeness. Its a ruse.
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All-TigerNet [13421]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 8897
Joined: 8/30/18
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Re: Want to see what we are up against? (What aTm is now doing)
Jan 4, 2022, 4:57 PM
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I'd like to think that could happen but the reality is policy follows the money trail. College football just gets bigger and bigger because of the dollars involved and the NCAA will go where the money is.
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All-Pro [658]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 664
Joined: 12/7/11
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The money is going to be spent but it still takes...
Jan 4, 2022, 4:55 PM
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...putting the team together. If you get enough overpaid 19-20 year olds and can't get them to focus, you will get beat along the way by someone with decent talent and true discipline.
It certainly will be interesting because the donors gonna don(ate).
Schools with rich alumni are gonna try it all. Much of it will fail (I think) but something will click somewhere.
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Orange Blooded [4036]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 5409
Joined: 1/3/14
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Re: Want to see what we are up against? (What aTm is now doing)
Jan 4, 2022, 5:18 PM
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If you want to fix it, file a class action against the NFL and NFL Players Association for age discrimination and get the age requirement lifted. That is the only solution now. Anything else has no chance of success without Federal legislation.
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Associate AD [839]
TigerPulse: 67%
Posts: 1077
Joined: 10/19/21
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Re: Want to see what we are up against? (What aTm is now doing)
Jan 4, 2022, 5:29 PM
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What do they pay the athletes to do? Advertise for an LLC that’s only business is to raise money and pay them? They are required to do “something” for the money.
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CU Medallion [51981]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 22973
Joined: 10/10/11
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Re: Want to see what we are up against? (What aTm is now doing)
Jan 6, 2022, 9:35 PM
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I love Clemson and will continue to support the Tigers, but I am quickly getting sick of college football. The NFL is the big beneficiary. They need to bear most of the monetary load for training their players or allow them to be drafted out of high school. Universities are for getting an education not maintaining professional teams.
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