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Paw Warrior [4917]
TigerPulse: 97%
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Brownell or Purnell?
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May 1, 2023, 1:03 PM
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Simple question, who you taking?
Not really giving my opinion here. Just really asking if you think we were better with Purnell before He Left Us. Don’t know anything, but I’m sure he would’ve continued as our coach and not been fired because of 3 straight NCAAT appearances. Don’t know what happened. Regardless, I believe Clemson was on its steady progression upwards.
In years 2006-2010, we were ranked at some point of the year. In a row with AP rankings highs being 17,15,10,17. Of course we didn’t win in the NCAAT, but we were beginning to be a usual program to make it. There were definitely differences with Purnell’s coaching style. More full court pressure was obvious.
We all know Brad’s successes. Making it to the Sweet 16 and getting into the tournament when he did. As well as some NIT years where we were respectable.
I don’t dislike Brad, I just think our program was still coming up with Purnell. And now 14 years later, I only feel worse about our program than I did then. Purnell then went and did awful at DePaul, so there’s no certainty anything good would’ve happened.
*Wrong Board again
Message was edited by: ROYBus10®
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Ultimate Tiger [33710]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Bownell is pretty big ... i would pick him
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May 1, 2023, 1:18 PM
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if i needed help in a fight. Purnell is kinda old.
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Orange Blooded [3066]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: Brownell or Purnell?
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May 1, 2023, 1:19 PM
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OP did not do right by Clemson. Remember his wife wanted the BIG CITY life or so it was rumored. OP should have been in high cotton in Chi-Town for recruiting guys to his style of play. Guess it did not.
Clemson's AD-[TDP]-was pretty irked to get OP's call from the NCAA tourney site where he was seeking a change as I recollect.
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Valley Legend [12880]
TigerPulse: 98%
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Re: Brownell or Purnell?
May 1, 2023, 1:27 PM
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Not much difference between the two (you take Sally and I will take Sue)...
Win percentage for both are within a game per season +/-
OP was better at getting to the dance but failed to win a single game
Fans were tired of getting there then losing often to a lower seeded team. Had he stayed as long as CBB I would imagine we would be in the same spot.
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Paw Master [16128]
TigerPulse: 97%
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Posts: 24632
Joined: 2002
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Same spot? LMAO…
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May 1, 2023, 1:55 PM
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Purnell had as many NCAAs in 6 years as Brownell has in 13! And they were his last 3 years at Clemson. Remember Purnell took over Shyatt’s sh!t show?
Compare Purnell’s last 3 years at Clemson vs Brownell’s last 3. There will be your answer.
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National Champion [8019]
TigerPulse: 100%
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eeny meeny mynee moe...
May 1, 2023, 1:45 PM
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they're about the same thing but i guess i'd go Purnell b/c he brought more high flyers. But they were all worn out by tourney time bC of the style of play, so.. nothing to write home about really.
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Paw Master [16128]
TigerPulse: 97%
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Purnell and it isn’t even CLOSE***
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May 1, 2023, 1:56 PM
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110%er [3688]
TigerPulse: 85%
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Re: Brownell or Purnell?
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May 1, 2023, 2:03 PM
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I would choose brownell
Purnell did a fine job at Clemson. He really hit on his first couple recruiting classes which helped him out a lot. His style was fun and helped us close the talent gap against more talented teams, but if the team could break the press, we had no chance. His style was similar to Paul Johnson's in football. If a team had time to prep for it, they could pick you apart. This is evidenced by Purnell not winning an ncaa tourney game in his entire career. I was happy with his time at Clemson. I'm wondering if he saw his last 2 recruiting classes not panning out so he left. His last 2 classes included 5 4* players and a 5*. Unfortunately nearly everyone of those recruits ended up being role players besides devin booker. Devin was solid, but not close to his brother!
Brownell had a tough job to come into. He made the tourney in the first year with OP talent, but after that year, there wasn't much talent in the team. To add to this, he didn't have a recruit in year one due to timing of OP departure. He also missed on a lot of recruits in his first 2 classes which really got his tenure off to a slow start. Brownell's last 6 years have been good. His winning percentage in the last 6 years is higher than any other basketball coach at Clemson. Aside from that, other accomplishments include making the sweet 16, beating unc at unc, set a record for most ACC wins in a season, beat a school record 7 ncaa tourney teams in the regular season, and have made post season tourneys 4 out of the las 6 years.
We could still do better, but we have been above average in the ACC over the last 6 years
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Team Captain [485]
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Re: Brownell or Purnell?
May 1, 2023, 4:08 PM
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I would choose brownell
Purnell did a fine job at Clemson. He really hit on his first couple recruiting classes which helped him out a lot. His style was fun and helped us close the talent gap against more talented teams, but if the team could break the press, we had no chance. His style was similar to Paul Johnson's in football. If a team had time to prep for it, they could pick you apart. This is evidenced by Purnell not winning an ncaa tourney game in his entire career. I was happy with his time at Clemson. I'm wondering if he saw his last 2 recruiting classes not panning out so he left. His last 2 classes included 5 4* players and a 5*. Unfortunately nearly everyone of those recruits ended up being role players besides devin booker. Devin was solid, but not close to his brother!
Brownell had a tough job to come into. He made the tourney in the first year with OP talent, but after that year, there wasn't much talent in the team. To add to this, he didn't have a recruit in year one due to timing of OP departure. He also missed on a lot of recruits in his first 2 classes which really got his tenure off to a slow start. Brownell's last 6 years have been good. His winning percentage in the last 6 years is higher than any other basketball coach at Clemson. Aside from that, other accomplishments include making the sweet 16, beating unc at unc, set a record for most ACC wins in a season, beat a school record 7 ncaa tourney teams in the regular season, and have made post season tourneys 4 out of the las 6 years.
We could still do better, but we have been above average in the ACC over the last 6 years
Completely agree with "Clemson mountaineers" summary of both Coaching periods for both Coaches--Best comments (with supporting evidence) of all the posts of this issue!
For myself, I really enjoyed Coach Purnell's period at Clemson. He immediately turned the program around into a winning program following the disappointments of the Coach Shyatt years. We seemed to be getting steadily better with Coach Purnell. While I was greatly disappointed with not winning "any" NCAA Tournament games, I believed our steady progress would eventually result in good results at the NCAA Tournament. When he left, I was greatly disappointed. Furthermore, I was additionally disappointed that he gave no reasons why he was leaving!
I have supported Coach Brownell's years at Clemson. While I originally thought Coach Purnell' s last couple of recruiting classes were good on paper, I was greatly disappointed with their actual playing performance/potential. While Coach Purnell "may" have done a better job with them than Coach Brownell, we'll never know because of Coach Purnell's abrupt departure.
I thought Coach Brownell has done a reasonable job considering the lack of steady support from the Clemson Administration. And I emphasize that "not firing" Coach Brownell IS NOT SUPPPORT! We finally updated Littlejohn, but it was years late in coming and was not to the extent that I believed was necessary to success in the ACC. And the upgrade came early in Brownwell's term, and greatly hindered his recruiting efforts while we were playing in Greenville.
Additionally, our current Athletic Director confirmed what I had suspected for years--That is, the Basketball program's funding support ranked low compared to all the other ACC programs (not just Duke & UNC). AD Nerf immediately increased our support to Coach Brownell, particularly for hiring better coaching assistants and staff. He also put "improved results" as a condition of Coach Brownell's continued employment. I believe Coach Brownell's results this year were tentatively a move in the right direction even without an NCAA invite (Although I believe they definitely deserved it). However, it is still too early to determine whether Coach Brownell will finally be able to give us a winning program that is invited to the NCAA Tournament on a reliable basis--let alone progress deep into the Tournament.
Going back to the original question: Brownell or Purnell?
First, we (Clemson Administration & Fans) fully supported Coach Purnell. We chose him & supported him. He is the one who left us suddenly without warning!
Second, while Coach Brownell's stay has been up & down as far as results go, he has run a clean program that has not had any scandals, produced athletes who regularly do well in the classroom and perform well athletically. He has given us a winning percentage which ranks highly compared to the other Clemson basketball coaches, although our NCAA invitations have been low. All this while ranking low in financial support compared to other ACC schools.
Purnell clearly left us, while Coach Brownell has stayed with us. With AD Nerf, I believe are where we should be. We're giving Brownell a chance to produce with increased support. He'll either produce in the next couple of years, or AD Nerf will search elsewhere.
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Hall of Famer [8226]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Purnell Based purely on coaching ability
May 1, 2023, 2:08 PM
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Can't speak to OPs character, but can't speak to Brad's either. If Brad had any real character, he would've resigned by now.
For some reason, some Clemson fans don't understand that Purnell took over an absolutely broken program from Larry Shyatt , and turned it into a winner. Brad took over a winner and has done nothing with it.
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Solid Orange [1391]
TigerPulse: 93%
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If he had character he'd have resigned? That's ridiculous
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May 1, 2023, 2:15 PM
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I'd love to know how many Tigernet posters, when doing their job to the satisfaction of their boss who keeps them employed, ever wakes up and says "I think I am underperforming, so it might be time to turn in my resignation today?!".
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CU Medallion [18465]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: If he had character he'd have resigned? That's ridiculous
May 1, 2023, 2:20 PM
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I would think most people wouldn’t need 14 years to realize their talents might be better suited for a different environment. I think you’d be surprised (based on the snark of your comment) how many people make lateral or backwards seeming career moves to set themselves up for real success. When Brownell moves on he will be completely forgotten by his current supporters and those of us have long tired of him will hold our disdain. His name will be spoken of closer to Shyatt than any other Clemson basketball coach.
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Solid Orange [1391]
TigerPulse: 93%
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You're right, I would be highly surprised if some
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May 1, 2023, 7:34 PM
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significant number of people who had good bosses (seemingly here at Clemson), great lifestyle, high pay and really at the highest earning potential of their lives and at the pinnacle of their chosen career would make a lateral or backward move at the same stage.
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CU Medallion [18465]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: You're right, I would be highly surprised if some
May 1, 2023, 2:37 PM
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He has the freedom afforded by walking away money and has embraced a stagnant career as a mediocre basketball coach. It’s actually more indefensible than those living paycheck to paycheck who actually have to gamble something to move on with their lives. And yes, it happens every day across every profession.
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Hall of Famer [8226]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: If he had character he'd have resigned? That's ridiculous
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May 1, 2023, 2:29 PM
[ in reply to If he had character he'd have resigned? That's ridiculous ] |
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Is it? I walked away from a good-paying job once that was not a good fit for me. I know many others who've done the same thing. If you have an education and employable, you're not afraid to do such things....
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Solid Orange [1391]
TigerPulse: 93%
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I just dont make the leap that its a judgement on his
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May 1, 2023, 2:45 PM
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character that he hasn't come to the conclusion to walk away, as you did. If he sees this as a good career position for him, and his bosses agree, it doesn't mean he has a lack of character. There's nothing publicly out there to indicate he's unhappy, so he has every right to be a good guy and still stay in his current role.
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110%er [3688]
TigerPulse: 85%
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Re: Purnell Based purely on coaching ability
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May 1, 2023, 2:26 PM
[ in reply to Purnell Based purely on coaching ability ] |
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Lol. This is why browbell's job was difficult. Fans thought brownell was given a Ferrari BY OP.
There was still some talent on the team in brownell's first year, but after that, there was a huge dropoff. From a talent comparison , the leftovers OP inherited in year 2 were very comparable to the talent level that BB inherited in year 2.
Other than that, we still had some of the worst facilities in the ACC, bottom tier funding, and the worst history in the ACC. I'm not sure how much of a positive making the ncaa tourney and losing to a lower seeded team 3 years in a row is.
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CU Medallion [18465]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: Purnell Based purely on coaching ability
May 1, 2023, 3:04 PM
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Simp
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110%er [3688]
TigerPulse: 85%
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Re: Purnell Based purely on coaching ability
May 1, 2023, 3:20 PM
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Can't dispute facts, so you call people names in lingo that middle schoolers use. You seem very cool!
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CU Medallion [18465]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: Purnell Based purely on coaching ability
May 1, 2023, 3:41 PM
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Why do you know middle school talk? That’s creepy.
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Solid Orange [1391]
TigerPulse: 93%
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You can't say Im not really giving my opinion followed
May 1, 2023, 2:12 PM
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by all your opinions and leanings. Haha.
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Ring of Honor [23792]
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Oh he can and he did!***
May 1, 2023, 2:16 PM
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CU Medallion [20860]
TigerPulse: 100%
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I would take Nell Carter over Brad at this point.
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May 1, 2023, 2:15 PM
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All-TigerNet [6067]
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Gimme a Break!***
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May 1, 2023, 2:58 PM
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Heisman Winner [86128]
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Paw Warrior [4847]
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Re: Brownell or Purnell?
May 1, 2023, 3:01 PM
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Purnell.
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Paw Warrior [5061]
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OP for sure. Record and exciting play.
May 1, 2023, 5:39 PM
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His teams could not make free throws, but were exciting to watch. Athletic, fast, rim protectors, enjoyed watching them.
Brad, not so much.
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Dynasty Maker [3548]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: Brownell or Purnell?
May 1, 2023, 7:26 PM
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Here is a real interesting question. Mary Ann or Ginger?
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Replies: 27
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