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YOUR BALANCE
Consensus. Last March ... Brownell must make the NCAAs in
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Consensus. Last March ... Brownell must make the NCAAs in


Mar 13, 2021, 9:35 AM

2021 or he’s should be gone!

This week ... He’s in the tourney? Really?

Well, screw it. Brownell should be gone!

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Raising the bar ... a fan tradition since sports began!***


Mar 13, 2021, 10:34 AM



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I'm always amused by posts that insinuate that any one


Mar 13, 2021, 10:39 AM

individual poster here is somehow beholden to a "consensus" apparently previously established on the board, or even that if someone gave a criteria last year for keeping CBB, that they can't change their minds this year based on the way the season went.

Don't get me wrong...I don't really care if he stays or goes. But anyone can say he should be fired if they want to - the fact that you think a "consensus" was established last season isn't really relevant.

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null


TigerNet is here for your amusement.


Mar 13, 2021, 10:55 AM

That’s pretty much the consensus.

But that could change.

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Re: I'm always amused by posts that insinuate that any one


Mar 13, 2021, 12:10 PM [ in reply to I'm always amused by posts that insinuate that any one ]

People are free to change their opinions if they please. I am free to disagree with whoever I want.

The thing that kills me is there are quite a few posters on here that only show up after a loss. These are the same posters that complained last year about not making the tourney. Now that we have made the tourney, they choose to complain about something else. Just miserable people

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Re: Consensus. Last March ... Brownell must make the NCAAs in


Mar 13, 2021, 11:03 AM

I think many people were saying last March that the AD would finally let Brownell go if he did not make the tournament. I suspect that if he does indeed make the tournament (which it appears will likely happen), that is still the case and Brownell will be retained for a few more years. I think there is still a lot of frustration by fans however over our lack of success for the last 12 years though. One slightly better than average season probably is not going to erase all of those feelings. Add in a first round ACC tourney loss to a 13 seed and I’m not sure why anyone can’t understand why there might be continued frustration right now.

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Re: Consensus. Last March ... Brownell must make the NCAAs in


Mar 13, 2021, 11:29 AM

There was no with COVID interrupted the end of season and finally getting the 0 for at Chapel Hole lossing streak to end that he was going to be let go, and made it now this season.

Maybe next year if they fall a lot...

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Re: Consensus. Last March ... Brownell must make the NCAAs in


Mar 13, 2021, 12:59 PM

Although I have been frustrated at times and have called for his dismissal in years past, I personally expect he will get at least 2 more seasons after making the tournament this year, unless something drastic occurs. If you look at his teams the last 4 years alone the teams have been above average for Clemson. If he can make things just a little better once every 4 years without having any losing seasons in between he will be here forever.

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Re: Consensus. Last March ... Brownell must make the NCAAs in


Mar 13, 2021, 11:31 PM

Should he?

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You’re correct, the complaint has been that he doesn’t make the NCAA Tournament enough.


Mar 13, 2021, 1:02 PM

And that he had to make it this year.

Well, he made it this year. Easily. You would think people would be happy.

But they aren’t happy. Now they are complaining that “it’s been 11 years” and all that. They also complain that we are too inconsistent, even though we didn’t lose to a non-quad 1 team at all during the regular season.

The reality is that there is no pleasing this type of fan. I’ve decided that most of them are probably COVID deniers too who think that it’s just a way for the government to control us. In other words, they don’t deal in facts or reality, but made up problems and worries.

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"All those 'Fire Brownell' guys can kiss it." -Joseph Girard III

"Everybody needs to know that Coach Brownell is arguably the best coach to come through Clemson." -PJ Hall


Re: You’re correct, the complaint has been that he doesn’t make the NCAA Tournament enough.


Mar 13, 2021, 1:29 PM

They did make it, supposedly. So that is good, no great. It's just seeing the same issues year and year again, that is getting old. I also, wonder what we would have done if the Covid issue was not here? I think it helped us, even though it obviously hurt us at points this season. I think overall, it has hurt other worse. But again, with me and I'm sure others . .its the problem with the same issues, team issues, playing situation issues, that are continually happening. There's no reason to think they would stop . it's been too long. So you either accept them, or want to move on. I think our ceiling has been reached.

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So basically, there is nothing Brownell could have done this year


Mar 13, 2021, 2:40 PM

for you to change your mind about him.

Is that correct?

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"All those 'Fire Brownell' guys can kiss it." -Joseph Girard III

"Everybody needs to know that Coach Brownell is arguably the best coach to come through Clemson." -PJ Hall


Re: So basically, there is nothing Brownell could have done this year


Mar 13, 2021, 6:51 PM

I have come to the conclusion is and out ceiled have been found. I do not think we will get any better with Brad. So the decision is . . "is this good enough?"

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Well, if you don’t think he can improve the program


Mar 14, 2021, 1:16 PM

then it makes sense that you want a new coach.

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"All those 'Fire Brownell' guys can kiss it." -Joseph Girard III

"Everybody needs to know that Coach Brownell is arguably the best coach to come through Clemson." -PJ Hall


Re: Well, if you don’t think he can improve the program


Mar 14, 2021, 5:25 PM

We often spar - hopefully in fun.
I do think CBBhelped Clemson, maybe even a lot. While I enjoyed seeing the athletic teams that OP had, I had terrors when we went to the line or tried to get the ball in. Very undisciplined.
I am tired of repeating things (not so much to you - but In general). If I really thought CBB could get us there, sign me up. I don’t pull for coaches, I pull for Clemson.
I did not tie my goal to one thing for CBB to be retained. One data point is NCAA. But also, how team looks, (best team he has had in my mind), winning tough games, winning the games we should win, etc. but I also cannot totally discount the past and what do I think of the future.
Maybe bad example, but I played golf Friday with my regular group. One player (9 handicap), parred 1, and had a hole in 1 on #2. I am a 3 handicap. If you simply looked at him after 2, you would say he was great. Well, he ended up shooting 83, so in the long run, he went back to his norm.
What you and I may disagree with, is his “norm” or potential. We disagree on the size of the snapshot in which to make. A decision.
I enjoy much of what you write - don’t enjoy the snarky part - and unfortunately- when someone (not you) calls me an idiot, I snark back and wish I had not.
We all want to win. You have your beliefs, facts, data, as do I. It does not really matter in the end. The athletic director will make a decision and not consult either of us (lol, no matter how much I have given to iptay).
We can have fun with this and still all be pulling for a win in the first round, then on to the second.
Enjoy life, I’m old and tired of arguing.
Be safe.

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Re: You’re correct, the complaint has been that he doesn’t make the NCAA Tournament enough.


Mar 13, 2021, 2:23 PM [ in reply to You’re correct, the complaint has been that he doesn’t make the NCAA Tournament enough. ]

What is the feeling on the season if we lose the opener in the ACC and the NCAA tournaments? I think he actually needs to advance for this year to not be a disappointment.

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Re: You’re correct, the complaint has been that he doesn’t make the NCAA Tournament enough.


Mar 14, 2021, 12:48 PM



It’s just a flesh wound. Walk it off.

~JKB

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Re: You’re correct, the complaint has been that he doesn’t make the NCAA Tournament enough.


Mar 13, 2021, 2:31 PM [ in reply to You’re correct, the complaint has been that he doesn’t make the NCAA Tournament enough. ]

Covid deniers line is just a political cop-out & has nothing to do with our trends in basketball unless you want to mask that too! ????

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We keep getting better & better everyday, in every way!
“The only disability is a bad Attitude” Dabo Swinney!!
Let’s Go Tigers!


Re: You’re correct, the complaint has been that he doesn’t make the NCAA Tournament enough.


Mar 14, 2021, 12:28 AM [ in reply to You’re correct, the complaint has been that he doesn’t make the NCAA Tournament enough. ]

Pastner just got G Tech to ACC Championship in 5 years. After 11 years Brownell has not even come close. They made a change after previous coach could not do it after 5 years. Thats about the time I was calling for a change. We will be lucky to win a game next week. If we want to get to the next level its time for the change. Just saying. MIKE DROP!!!!!!!!!

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Oh so now you’re defining things by one good year?


Mar 14, 2021, 1:19 PM

Funny how when we made the Sweet 16 a few years ago, it was “just one good year” and “doesn’t mean anything” but Pastner catching lightning in a bottle once is the be all end all?

You guys really do need to stop moving the goalposts so much.

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"All those 'Fire Brownell' guys can kiss it." -Joseph Girard III

"Everybody needs to know that Coach Brownell is arguably the best coach to come through Clemson." -PJ Hall


Correct and he made it


Mar 13, 2021, 1:08 PM

So it would be asinine to fire him after this season.

The point is, I don’t think many of us believe this is a magical change in fortune for the program or change in direction.

After the sweet 16 performance , we followed it up with a very disappointing NIT season the next year. A season which people were expecting big things going into it. I remember a certain afternoon WCCP host even making suggestions of final four potential for that year,
But in the end we crashed out in the NIT at home to Wichita.

Last year was more of the same. So yes this year was the make or break year and props to Brownell, he made it.

However it is likely we will revert back to a disappointing season or two following this year, which has been the pattern under Brownell.

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Re: Correct and he made it


Mar 14, 2021, 12:36 PM

T_I_P said:

So it would be asinine to fire him after this season.

The point is, I don’t think many of us believe this is a magical change in fortune for the program or change in direction.

After the sweet 16 performance , we followed it up with a very disappointing NIT season the next year. A season which people were expecting big things going into it. I remember a certain afternoon WCCP host even making suggestions of final four potential for that year,
But in the end we crashed out in the NIT at home to Wichita.

Last year was more of the same. So yes this year was the make or break year and props to Brownell, he made it.

However it is likely we will revert back to a disappointing season or two following this year, which has been the pattern under Brownell.



That year after the sweet 16 was the first time I was expecting us back in the dance. Final 4 potential would've been a stretch but I did feel good about going dancing at the least...

But anyone who remembers that year should also remember us getting hit with the injury bug and never getting close to the previous year's form too.

Our team chemistry wasn't as solid despite having Elijah Thomas, David Skara, Marcquise Reed, and Shelton Mitchell (both of the last 2 guys were playing injured all year sadly and they were good to have when healthy).

Expectedly, this was an upperclassmen led team so the expectations were rightfully there. However, I remember that season as something that could have been good but injuries and lack of depth/experience at the time hurt.

For example, we had Simms, Jonathan Baehre (tore his ACL in the preseason), Trapp, and Tyson but they were young pups who just needed more time and experience.

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My goal for Clemson basketball: Have a program that


Mar 13, 2021, 2:23 PM

realizes it is a clear failure any time we don't make the NCAA tournament, and treats that as an unacceptable temporary situation that must be corrected right away, and that making the tournament alone is no reason for a circle jerk.

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"Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard."
- H. L. Mencken


Absolutely, the goal is to make it every year.


Mar 13, 2021, 2:43 PM

We made it this year. No need to whine and complain about previous years. THIS year, we are a bona fide NCAA Tournament team. Let’s cheer the team on for success in this year’s tournament, and see if we can make it again next year.

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"All those 'Fire Brownell' guys can kiss it." -Joseph Girard III

"Everybody needs to know that Coach Brownell is arguably the best coach to come through Clemson." -PJ Hall


But that's not THE goal, Judge, not by a long stretch.


Mar 13, 2021, 4:41 PM

Let's not blow our load with our dinks still in our pants. We still need to win two or three more games before we apply for a parade permit and start tuning up the marching band. If we get bumped in the first round, it's still a disappointment and the season as a whole is decent, but comes up short.

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- H. L. Mencken


Re: But that's not THE goal, Judge, not by a long stretch.


Mar 14, 2021, 12:48 PM


Let's not blow our load with our dinks still in our pants. We still need to win two or three more games before we apply for a parade permit and start tuning up the marching band. If we get bumped in the first round, it's still a disappointment and the season as a whole is decent, but comes up short.



Idk how you can call this season a disappointment for what these athletes have faced in just trying to make a season out of these times we are in.

People wanted to crap all over Clemson losing to Ga Tech who just won the ACC Championship against FSU. Before Duke was cancelled out of the tourney they were turning the corner and competing like we expect them too.

Yes, I'm disappointed that we were downed in the opening game to a team we should have beaten but, just to point how crazy tournament games have been...even Georgetown, a sub .500 team before the conference tournies, just won their conference in a beatdown fashion against Creighton...they won by 30 against the no. 17 ranked team. If Clemson lost in a similar way in the Championship game posters would be losing their mind calling for Brownell to be fired just like those blowouts we endured after the COVID pause.

This season has been crazy and I'm proud of this team. No, it hasn't always been sunny skies and elite performances but for what these kids have had to deal with in sacrifice to make this season happen so I applaud them.

They had every reason to quit after those COVID pause blowouts but kept chugging and did well enough to preserve a ticket to the dance. We can debate about the good and the bad but let's give credit where it's due and stop acting like this was a normal year.

We made the tourney. I hope we go further than the first round but if not so be it. Much respect to this Clemson team.

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When was the tournament selection show?

1

Mar 13, 2021, 4:43 PM

I was thinking it wasn’t until tomorrow.

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Since the ACC Tournament doesn’t count/matter, I guess everything is super peachy!!!


Mar 14, 2021, 12:41 PM

I’m just curious what happens if we lose our first round game by double digits. Will everybody be so happy and cheerful then?

~JKB

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Re: Since the ACC Tournament doesn’t count/matter, I guess everything is super peachy!!!


Mar 14, 2021, 1:02 PM

We have a really weak class coming in next year which concerns me the most. Then again, we may add transfers? Who knows? The class have coming in is extremely weak though.

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Re: Consensus. Last March ... Brownell must make the NCAAs in


Mar 14, 2021, 1:01 PM

I think people like Brad. They just want to see if we can do better. We are the Applebees of basketball. Big deal. Brad has made millions. He will be fine, but we want to see if there is hope to be even better. Should we just give up on that?

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