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CU Guru [1907]
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AOC versus Amazon
Feb 15, 2019, 10:31 AM
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While no State or City should give Amazom a $3 billion incentive, same as giving billionaires a stadium there is much left out in those victory cries. For one, that $3B they say should be spent on housing, trasportation etc. does not exist,It is predicated on future tax breaks and power/water breaks. It is not like they were writing Amazon a $3b check, you would think elected officaials would be smarter than this?SO Amazon is not coming and they still do not have that $3 billion.
Also if on does the math on 25k jobs at $100k it comes up to $2.5B a year in wages which would be taxed,spent and poured back in to the local economy. So in truth there is not much to cheer on any side of this thing. One can have a basic opposition to incentives for a Company like Amazon but to say they would not provide a substantial economic gain that would far outstrip any incentives is just ludicrous.
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Lot o points [155984]
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If only there were already a thread on this topic....***
Feb 15, 2019, 10:32 AM
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Hall of Famer [21614]
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I like this guy so I prefer his thread.***
Feb 15, 2019, 11:34 AM
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CU Guru [1907]
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Re: If only there were already a thread on this topic....***
Feb 15, 2019, 1:57 PM
[ in reply to If only there were already a thread on this topic....*** ] |
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Honestly I did read it but that is why I posted another. The other was populated with posts from ideologues and worse people like CU17 that are unable to do simple math. So there is that Obed.
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CU Guru [1405]
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Re: If only there were already a thread on this topic....***
Feb 15, 2019, 2:44 PM
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Explain my math in the other thread
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CU Guru [1907]
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Re: If only there were already a thread on this topic....***
Feb 15, 2019, 2:59 PM
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No, I already did the math here, you claims on cost per job were off and factored in only 1 year at 25k jobs at $100k. You must amortize it over the long term
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CU Guru [1405]
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Re: If only there were already a thread on this topic....***
Feb 15, 2019, 3:09 PM
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What in tarnation are you talking about?
Are you talking about ATLOrange's post?
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Hall of Famer [21614]
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I think is this one of the few GOOD debates right now.
Feb 15, 2019, 11:32 AM
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The long-term implications that massive, monopolies have on our system is very obviously negative. But there are clear good sides to it as well.
For instance, large monopolies can do things more efficiently and offer lower prices, but their influence on our government becomes severe. Also, our founding fathers intended for states to regulate and limit the size of corporations but with holding companies, trusts and the millions of maneuvers since, huge business DOMINATES our economy our foreign policy and our society.
So, when is it appropriate to push back? How should we?
We know what happens when private business has unchecked power. Child labor, 14 hour workdays, unsafe working conditions, vertical integration, etc etc.
So is sacrificing jobs in the short term potentially contributive to a long-term positive? It's not an obvious answer.
Sometimes a job creator is bad for the long-term and sometimes a job destroyer is good for the long-term.
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CU Guru [1907]
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Re: I think is this one of the few GOOD debates right now.
Feb 15, 2019, 2:30 PM
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Companies such as Amazon are net destroyers of jobs at a retail level and will worsen as they move to complete robotic warehouses. Other aspects of different areas inside the Company are job creators in robotics,AI and automation but I seriously doubt they balance out in the end. Vast potion of population are not working nor hold advanced degrees in those areas. So in my opinion left to it’s own means Amazon will destroy Main Street and employment opportunities for lower skill set individuals.
My other concern would be if they succeeded in being the only place to buy things from will they then cease to be price sensitive on products. Past business practices and human nature says they will not. I can also say that States need to actively pursue sales tax on items purchased over the net as the sales tax losses do affect and limit the ability to provide services to it’s citizens. The only recourse left by letting that revenue escape is to either raise income/property taxes or let services,roads,schools erode.
As to push back and how I do try to buy things locally for a variety of reasons. I do tend to want to actually see, touch and feel a product before purchasing. I avoid buying electronics over the net as if they are damaged in shipping or fail soon after it tends to be harder to gain an outcome for return. Plus I do think keeping people employed is something everyone should be concerned with from an economic view.
In the bigger picture I think no Company should be too big to fail. Same as during the 2007-2008 financial meltdown no financial company or bank should have been deemed worth saving. They actually caused the failure then held a gun to their own head as a form of hostage taking so the govt. would bail them out, we should have let them pull the trigger. We could have backstopped IRA’s,checking and savings along with whatever could be gotten from selling anything of value left in Companies. I have also argued that the housing crisis then was extended by those banks by repossessing and trying to sell houses at market value. Why? Well most loans are required to carry mortgage insurance that covers 80% of loan value, once that was paid those homes should have been scrapped off the lot,sold for scrap and only the lot should be sold. Building a new home is an economic stimulus in materials,labor versus selling to a speculator.
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Oculus Spirit [81078]
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meh
Feb 15, 2019, 2:38 PM
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Local mom and pop stores aren't going anywhere if they offer value. Protip: Value isn't always the cheapest price.
Example: I buy A/C filters at Ace hardware down the street. They certainly aren't cheaper there than Amazon is, but they have them when I remember I need them, and the folks in the store are nice to talk to about with about a million other things. They also have a place outside to grab one the best ham biscuits or hot dogs in town.
Them, and Haddrell's point tackle store next door have an intrinsic value that assure they will be in business as long as they care to be. Neither has the cheapest prices, but they do offer value that Amazon or mass retailers can't match.
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