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Replies: 46
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Hall of Famer [24440]
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i keep waiting for the DOW to rebound. how long will the
Nov 14, 2012, 10:22 AM
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slide last?
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Rock Defender [54]
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Just think how much farther your DRIP money will go!***
Nov 14, 2012, 10:22 AM
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All-In [30522]
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DRIPing all the way to
Nov 14, 2012, 10:53 AM
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$0.00
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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depends on how quickly it drops...
Nov 14, 2012, 10:32 AM
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the DOW didn't react very favorably to Obama's first election.
But you remember how he rolled up his sleeves and fixed it?
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Oculus Spirit [97950]
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Yeah...the fed printed money
Nov 14, 2012, 10:38 AM
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Infused it into the financial sector, and all that money recapitalized what was lost. Here's what's interesting. When people sell their stock again, a good portion of the money they obtain will be money "printed". See, the fed put that money into the stock market basically, keeping it out of people's pockets, but propping up their retirement, etc. As a result, that money did not drain into people's pockets, so inflation was held low, despite trillions of dollars being "printed". It wasn't spent. It was simply recapitalization for companies about to go bankrupt that were "too big to fail". Those companies held on to that money with their dear lives to keep their books balanced.
When people sell their stock now, a very large percentage of that will be unearned fed money that was "printed". That money will go into circulation in the economy buying gold, and other non-stock assets, and especially commodities. That will trigger much higher inflation pressure in the coming year or two.
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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^^^remembers^^^***
Nov 14, 2012, 10:43 AM
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All-In [34145]
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Re: depends on how quickly it drops...
Nov 14, 2012, 10:39 AM
[ in reply to depends on how quickly it drops... ] |
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It turned around a mere two months after Barry's taking office, and proceeded to double in value. I'm not sure if that's unprecedented, but it sure is an unusual bit of skyrocketing.
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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like I said...
Nov 14, 2012, 10:40 AM
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he's awesome!
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All-In [34145]
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Re: like I said...
Nov 14, 2012, 10:43 AM
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We get it: you're going to b!tch about Barry regardless.
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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regardless?
Nov 14, 2012, 10:43 AM
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I think there is plenty of reason.
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All-In [34145]
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Re: regardless?
Nov 14, 2012, 10:49 AM
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Including the Dow going up 100%? You appeared to call that an "unfavorable" reaction to Barry's election in another post in this thread.
So, yes, regardless. Proceed to complain, regardless of the facts.
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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okay then....
Nov 14, 2012, 11:15 AM
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if you follow the logic and ignore my sarcastic joke, then in two months all will be fine.
Sorry I upset you.
But the facts are the only thing "robust" is a stock market.
If you believe there are no other criticisms for Obama and that he is a good money person, then you are not who I thought you are.
I have made no secret that I think people who voted for Obama are clueless and actually causing detriment to our economy. Thank goodness you voted third party I guess.
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All-In [34145]
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Re: okay then....
Nov 14, 2012, 11:21 AM
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Not upset, just noting that otherwise reasonable people seem to have an obsession with hating certain politicians. Some libs in here did it when Dubya was prez, and some conservatives are doing it with Barry now. It's some sort of irrational obsession. It's fascinating and silly.
I never said Obama was a good money person. You did, sarcastically, in response to facts I posted about the Dow.
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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Re: okay then....
Nov 14, 2012, 11:36 AM
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FTR....I find the clamoring about the stock market right now funny. My response to the original poster (about the reaction first election) was intended to be tongue-in-cheek, which is no fun when you have to explain it.
That was it until Donner party of five showed up. Then it became more fun.
Don't hate Obama. I think he's incompetent, but don't hate him.
I think you'll find that I rarely post any news stories or other c&p's touting the latest rumor, etc.
I do however, try take every opportunity to respond to those posts to criticize this POTUS. I have on the rare occasion defended him. But I find laughter is better than wringing one's hands.
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Know-it-all [2004]
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It sure is!
Nov 14, 2012, 10:50 AM
[ in reply to regardless? ] |
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And it's 40 degrees outside today too! Global warming schlobal schlarming...
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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Did Obama not issue you a coat?***
Nov 14, 2012, 10:51 AM
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All-In [30522]
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Coat? We get free coats?***
Nov 14, 2012, 10:53 AM
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Know-it-all [2004]
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I had free Gangham Style download. Thanks BO...***
Nov 14, 2012, 10:56 AM
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All-In [30522]
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with that sleeve rolling up thingy, too.***
Nov 14, 2012, 10:46 AM
[ in reply to like I said... ] |
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Oculus Spirit [97950]
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Given the economic numbers, yes, it is unprecedented
Nov 14, 2012, 10:45 AM
[ in reply to Re: depends on how quickly it drops... ] |
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However, given the trillions printed by the fed and injected into the jugular vein of Wall Street, it's not surprising at all.
Everyone ignores what the federal reserve did. One of the results of Dodd-Frank was not an audit of the fed, but an audit of QE1. That report was released but I can no longer find it anywhere on the internet. What's even more dubious is the claim that all those trillions have been paid back.
By the economic numbers the DJIA should be in the 8,000 range right now. It isn't.
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All-In [34145]
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Re: Given the economic numbers, yes, it is unprecedented
Nov 14, 2012, 10:50 AM
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This is one of those mysterious "Yes, the numbers look good but there are sinister reasons why they don't really count" arguments. Like how the unemployment rate isn't the REAL unemployment rate, and Barry's poll numbers leading up to the election weren't the REAL poll numbers.
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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so money was not printed?
Nov 14, 2012, 10:53 AM
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"sinister" is subjective. Depends on if you have a problem with it or not, I guess.
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Know-it-all [2004]
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Do you actually think that the printing presses were turned
Nov 14, 2012, 10:54 AM
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on and they physically took briefcases full of new Benjamins to Wall Street?
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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is this part of the discussion...
Nov 14, 2012, 10:58 AM
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or are you just posting nonsense?
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Know-it-all [2004]
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You just asked if money was printed.
Nov 14, 2012, 11:00 AM
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I don't think it was.
Now you answer the same question.
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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do you consider MSN unbiased?
Nov 14, 2012, 11:03 AM
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http://money.msn.com/investing/did-the-fed-just-re-elect-obama
of course this was just one-click searching. Lots more out there on it and the effects of the Fed continually printing money on the economy and the value of the dollar and inflation.
Not to say that the Fed should never print money, but now does not seem to be the time.
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Oculus Spirit [97950]
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Here's what happened
Nov 14, 2012, 11:05 AM
[ in reply to You just asked if money was printed. ] |
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http://www.gao.gov/assets/330/321506.pdf
I'm sure you will not take the time to read it, or digest it. Basically there was once an evil big corporation called Enron that did the exact same thing on an infinitely smaller scale. In Enron's case, it resulted in legislation requiring off balance sheet transactions to be reported to the SEC. Guess the Federal Reserve is above that law, including the existing ones Enron broke, and the new ones Enron helped create.
It took an act of Congress to get this released.
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All-In [34145]
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Re: Here's what happened
Nov 14, 2012, 11:17 AM
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I'm sure you will not take the time to read it, or digest it.
Did you read and digest all 266 pages? If so, can you direct those of us with less time on our hands to the pages that are central to whatever your point is?
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Oculus Spirit [97950]
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Page 131 will tell you most of what you need to know***
Nov 14, 2012, 11:33 AM
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All-In [34145]
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The chart of loans to the banks?
Nov 14, 2012, 11:37 AM
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Is that the p.131 you're talking about?
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All-In [34145]
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Re: so money was not printed?
Nov 14, 2012, 11:09 AM
[ in reply to so money was not printed? ] |
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"sinister" is subjective. Depends on if you have a problem with it or not, I guess.
That's the point I keep trying to make. Subjectively, you will always have a problem with Barry, and the facts will always look bad to you.
The Dow is a great example, considering the turnaround it has experienced from 2009 to now. The theory that injecting liquidity into the market invalidates stock values is absurd, as is the idea that when the Fed "prints money" it is somehow illegitimate. The Fed has always printed money, and only fools who hate Barry at all cost are acting like it's a scary thing.
P.S. Those same fools used to predict catastrophic inflation as a result of QE. Now those same fools are telling us that the inflation rate isn't the REAL inflation rate (just like the Dow, unemployment, and Barry's poll numbers). As Megan Kelly said to Karl Rove on election night, this is "just math you do as a Republican to make yourself feel better."
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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not entirely true...
Nov 14, 2012, 11:20 AM
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that I think everything about Obama is bad. I will say the majority of it is, but not all.
Here's two thing:
1)I like having a black President.
2) The VA seems to be doing abetter job the last four years than previously.
As far as inflation goes, not sure about the numbers, but paying nearly double in groceries as four years ago, gas is up, utilities have gone through the roof (a promise Obama indeed made), etc. This does not seem to be any normal rise in cost of living as I remember.
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All-In [34145]
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Re: not entirely true...
Nov 14, 2012, 11:36 AM
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I also like getting rid of bin Laden, getting us out of Iraq, ending torture policies, stopping the fall of the Dow and sending it skyrocketing, stopping the loss of jobs and sending it into job gains (but, notably, not fast enough to bring down unemployment with any speed), rescuing the car companies (with an assist from Bush), preventing deflation (with a huge assist from Bush), ending Don't Ask Don't Tell, enacting Barrycare (which, for all its faults, is better than no reform--a fact even Romney admitted), and got rid of Qaddafi without a stupid go-it-alone policy (and as a result, no American lives were lost).
But I don't like his overregulation of banks, his government's lack of transparency (a big broken promise), the increased use of drones, his failure to close Gitmo, his failure to bring KSM to trial in New York, his general failure to change the tone in Washington, and his failure of leadership of the do-nothing idiots in Congress.
As for inflation, the numbers are what they are, despite your purported anecdotal evidence to the contrary. Personally I haven't seen my grocery bills or utility bills go up (also anecdotal evidence, and therefore meaningless). Gas is more expensive than a year or so ago, but it was higher some years before that. (Also anecdotal.)
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Oculus Spirit [97950]
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Know-it-all [2004]
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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no I remember...
Nov 14, 2012, 10:41 AM
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he is a very shrewd money man
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Know-it-all [2004]
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That's about the response I expected.***
Nov 14, 2012, 10:43 AM
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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of course you did...
Nov 14, 2012, 10:44 AM
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hard to match wits with the witless.
I apologize
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Know-it-all [2004]
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Re: of course you did...
Nov 14, 2012, 10:47 AM
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So you say the Dow is never going to stop dropping because of our president, I show you that it's doubled while he was president, and I'm the witless.
Got it.
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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link?
Nov 14, 2012, 10:51 AM
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not sure I said that.
What factors caused the Dow to go up before?
Here's a history of the Dow. The "doubling" claim, while it did in fact double is a little misleading just like the job creation claim. When things are down, hopefully, the only place to go is up.
History of the Dow since 2000.
http://stockcharts.com/freecharts/historical/djia2000.html
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Know-it-all [2004]
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So, since it went so low, there's no credit for it going
Nov 14, 2012, 10:58 AM
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back up? That's your argument?
Buddy, you've got to stop. Go back to the Petraeus thing.
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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if that is what you gathered....
Nov 14, 2012, 11:00 AM
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I don't expect you to understand it anyway.
Oh, and hey, link to my Petraeus posts?
kthx
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Know-it-all [2004]
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It'll probably never ever ever come back up.
Nov 14, 2012, 10:36 AM
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Where are your mason jars and shovels?
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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don't be so negative...
Nov 14, 2012, 10:39 AM
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Dubya's not here to hurt us anymore
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Rock Defender [54]
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All-In [34145]
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The Dow will hit 14,000 by 2014.***
Nov 14, 2012, 11:22 AM
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Rock Defender [54]
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FOUR MORE YEARS!***
Nov 14, 2012, 10:58 AM
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Replies: 46
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JI