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Rock Defender [53]
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Dabo has proven he will pull an ineffective or less effective QB
Oct 17, 2021, 8:58 AM
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Pulled Kyle Parker vs S Florida for Tajh, pulled Cole for DW4, played Trevor over KB/with KB because he was that good. The fact that he hasn’t pulled DJ should tell everyone all they need to know about the QB room we have and the capabilities of Taison, Hunter, etc.
Criticism is fair and a part of playing a publicly consumed sport, but all this craze over Dabo not benching DJ makes no sense. Criticize play calling, coaching, player performance, but the coaches know the depth chart inside and out, the only “untouchable” coaches on the staff are Dabo and Venables. Everyone wants the best player to play, I don’t understand it, this clamoring for a change is just so wild.
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Re: Dabo has proven he will pull an ineffective or less effective QB
Oct 17, 2021, 9:01 AM
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I would bet my house that Taison would have more TD passes and a better completion percentage through six games than DJ has. And if DJ truly is the best we have in that QB room then we have an evaluation and recruiting issue with our QBs. If all of them are worse than DJ has been we have major issues that run much deeper.
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Rock Defender [53]
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Re: Dabo has proven he will pull an ineffective or less effective QB
Oct 17, 2021, 9:09 AM
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It’s just like any other position, you have misses and hits. If not for transfers we would have a great QB room, but the more numbers you throw into a room that you have had success with evaluating, the more likely you are to throw a miss in there, just law of averages. We have had a great hit rate on evaluating QBs the last 10 years or so, also great depth and talent behind those hits. There is not some gaping hole or issue with the recruiting or evaluation process, we just finally hit our average, we can’t hit 100% of the time, no one does. It’s frustrating to watch, but it is what it is and it happens to every program.
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Re: Dabo has proven he will pull an ineffective or less effective QB
Oct 17, 2021, 9:27 AM
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But the point Tmitchell27 was making is that we must have missed on several QB's. Not just on DJ. If we don't have a QB on the roster that can play better than 110th rated QB In college then it's worse than just the law of averages rearing its ugly head.
It's my opinion Dabo just doesn't want to give up on DJ for some special reason. If this would have been anyone else he would have been benched after 3 or 4 games max. I understand his commitment to DJ, but looks what it has done to the rest of the team. The offense is pathetic with him as the field General. He's more like a field 2nd Lieutenant.
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Rock Defender [53]
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Re: Dabo has proven he will pull an ineffective or less effective QB
Oct 17, 2021, 10:09 AM
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Yeah I understood his point, mine was simply due to attrition, we have had to offer and take more QBs, had less time to build a relationship the way we do in recruiting. So we had a bunch of great/good QBs in that room and I’m guessing in the moment we didn’t expect to lose them the way we have and we just had to sort of manage the numbers, and so I *think* there is a combination of filling the room with “numbers” due to transfers, missing on a QB and it all kind of is a perfect storm for what we have going on this year. Imagine if Chase Brice was still here, or even Zerrick Cooper… I think this year, even before we knew what DJ was going to be, would have been a great year to add a proven back up in the portal (maybe there were none or none willing to come be a backup). But I say all this to say we should relax, I think this is a one off year with a perfect storm of issues, not some deep rooted issue evaluating and recruiting QBs. We’ve had almost 10 years of awesome QB play and recruiting (2014 I can see an argument wasn’t a great QB year with Cole and DW4 injury and being a freshman). We were simply “due” and it took a perfect storm to do so.
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Orange Blooded [2926]
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Re: Dabo has proven he will pull an ineffective or less effective QB
Oct 17, 2021, 9:29 AM
[ in reply to Re: Dabo has proven he will pull an ineffective or less effective QB ] |
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Would the receivers catch the ball better for the other QB’s . DJ has had his share of poorly thrown balls but he also has had more dropped balls that were on target than I have seen in many years at Clemson .
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All-Pro [663]
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Re: Dabo has proven he will pull an ineffective or less effective QB
Oct 17, 2021, 9:37 AM
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You know it's more than just DJ's inaccurate passing.. it's his lack of leadership, poor decisions, slow reaction time, staring down one receiver, holding on to the ball too long, slow runner. Ad infinitum.
We don't have another QB on the Roster that would do these things better or have better stats than DJ? I think we do. If we don't that is poor recruiting and evaluating. Or possibly coaching.
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110%er [8082]
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Re: Sounds like you would bet that you're better at picking a
Oct 17, 2021, 9:16 AM
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Anyone that knows football can see how bad DJ is. Why does everybody always throw the “do you coach” bullcrap around? You don’t have to be a D1 coach to see DJ is not productive. And yes, I have seen Taison play and he isn’t an all star. But he also isn’t worse than DJ at this point.
I guess I thought this was a football forum where people talk sports and give opinions. Didn’t realize you need college coaching experience to comment. Lol.
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Orange Blooded [2349]
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Re: Sounds like you would bet that you're better at picking a
Oct 17, 2021, 9:38 AM
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Well why can’t you TP isn’t good at quarterback either. People only see what they want to fit there narrative. I’ve watched him play in 4 games last year. He wasn’t good. He struggled against the citadel. Coming into this year he was 11 of 29 in passing attempts for 79 yards. 19 carries for 80 yards. Then he played against sc state this year and didn’t wow. The int dj had on a bad tunnel screen pass TP throw the exact same pass but worse. It just wasn’t picked off. I don’t know if you saw him the one play against Syracuse, but he looked slower than DJ and I didn’t think that was possible.
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110%er [8082]
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Dude, you said you'd "bet the house" about TP stats would be
Oct 17, 2021, 9:46 AM
[ in reply to Re: Sounds like you would bet that you're better at picking a ] |
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better. I was just curious how you came to this conclusion since there is no way in #### we could make this bet. Yes, you can have an opinion, but making a statement like that with NO way of proving it, is asinine.
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Might be true, but he hasn't shown any indication that he's
Oct 17, 2021, 11:41 AM
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on ANY team's sideline coaching football. So, for that reason, my money is on the present coaching staff that IS on the sidelines AND is in the team rooms AND sees the players almost daily. Most people wouldn't know TP if he was sitting next to them at the Esso Club.
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Orange Blooded [2205]
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Re: Dabo has proven he will pull an ineffective or less effective QB
Oct 17, 2021, 9:25 AM
[ in reply to Re: Dabo has proven he will pull an ineffective or less effective QB ] |
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You would bet your house that a QB that wasn't able to play most of the first 6 games would be better than DJ??
Have you ever thought about if TP was a turnover machine? That's the one thing we can't afford to do. Our defense makes us capable of winning low scoring games but they can't have bad field position all night.
Also if you watch the game it's not all on DJ. All our WR's are dropping passes and our OL has been bad in 3/6 games. You want a QB fresh off an injury behind our OL? OK bud.
Also in regards to the QB room. Have you not been paying attention to our QB recruitment? There are THREE Clemson QB's that have started at other schools this year and (2?) went to MLB. Though they've had mixed results it's still insane. In the transfer portal era it's impossible to keep every position fully stocked at all times. Those QB's left because they saw better talent on the roster. We saw DJ play at an elite level last year.
Stop acting like this is just a DJ issue and the solution is just chilling on the bench.
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Rock Defender [53]
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Re: Dabo has proven he will pull an ineffective or less effective QB
Oct 17, 2021, 10:13 AM
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And he is a TO machine based on every snap I’ve watched him take since his freshman year vs GT, dude turns it over 80% of possessions he’s played for 3 years.
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Re: Dabo has proven he will pull an ineffective or less effective QB
Oct 17, 2021, 9:53 AM
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There nothing wrong with admitting he has not lived up to his 5* assessment. He's more like a 2 star at this point. Almost every QB in College football is better.
Even if Taisun was a 4* and plays like a 3 star that would be better than what is going on now.. Even Hunter Helms might provide a spark. It's happened for other top teams and their freshman QB. Why continue with this insanity? That is why most fans are frustrated. Is there no solution to the obvious QB proems with DJ...... You are correct though. DJ doesn't throw interceptions. But you don't know that. Taisyn or Hunter would.
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Re: Dabo has proven he will pull an ineffective or less effective QB
Oct 17, 2021, 9:12 AM
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Actually, he only pulled Kyle Parker after he fractured ribs on the last play of 1st half in Charlotte...
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Associate AD [844]
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If DJ is the “best”……
Oct 17, 2021, 9:21 AM
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Anyone can see he has problems processing what is happening, cant run the read-option, is slow as a glacier and frankly, doesn’t seem to be an alpha dog for his team mates and the offense for some reason this year. But other than that - “he’s the best”.
Seriously, couldn’t do any worse playing TP. So, why not? Bruise his ego? Pi$$ his dad off? Lose the chance for his brother’s recruitment? IDK
That said, his passing improved somewhat against SU, and maybe
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110%er [5086]
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Re: Dabo has proven he will pull an ineffective or less effective QB
Oct 17, 2021, 9:26 AM
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Agreed. Dabo would have given one of the backups a series or 2 if he thought they were capable. DJ is the best Clemson has for now. DJ will look like a superstar with average line play.
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All-Pro [663]
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Re: Dabo has proven he will pull an ineffective or less effective QB
Oct 17, 2021, 9:30 AM
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The reason it makes no sense is that all those QB's you mentioned that hit benched played better than DJ. DJ is playing much worse than Kelly Bryant.
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Orange Blooded [2695]
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Here's the thing...
Oct 17, 2021, 9:38 AM
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Pulled Kyle Parker vs S Florida for Tajh, pulled Cole for DW4, played Trevor over KB/with KB because he was that good. The fact that he hasn’t pulled DJ should tell everyone all they need to know about the QB room we have and the capabilities of Taison, Hunter, etc.
Criticism is fair and a part of playing a publicly consumed sport, but all this craze over Dabo not benching DJ makes no sense. Criticize play calling, coaching, player performance, but the coaches know the depth chart inside and out, the only “untouchable” coaches on the staff are Dabo and Venables. Everyone wants the best player to play, I don’t understand it, this clamoring for a change is just so wild.
In most of the scenarios above, the up and coming star was brought along and received waaaay more playing time than TP7 has seen so far.
Against TA&M, TL16 got almost an entire quarter when KB2 was struggling to move the ball.
DW4 my memory is hazy but I remember him getting drives to show off before being handed the reins.
TP7 has gotten 2 plays since SCST....it'd be one thing is DJU was playing at least on KB2s level, but atm he's mostly 1-dimensional that can sometimes scramble if the opposing defense doesn't touch him first.
IMO we're getting to the point that I originally thought we'd see TP7 back on the early side. FWIW the coaching staff could have been jus keeping TP7 as a emergency option til they felt more comfortable with running him out there.
Maybe this last game was them starting to ease TP7 back in and if DJ struggles they'll be more prone to pull him. I'd love to see a drive or 2 where TP7 gets in - if healthy, I think he presents a different look we could use to spark the offense.
Of course, whether we see this is another thing. I'm all for making sure DJ gets experience but at some point you can (or should) only accept so much before trying something different.
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110%er [7191]
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Re: Dabo has proven he will pull an ineffective or less effective QB
Oct 17, 2021, 9:41 AM
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Ok so if you think this clamoring for a quarterback change is just so wild, or that not pulling DJ should tell everyone all we need to know about the quarterback room, or the capabilities of Taisun, (not Taison) , or Hunter, and Dabo refuses to bring in another quarterback trough the portal ,then this is the only advice I can pass along for this year; quit with all the post game excuses, just say I, not we, suck and play out the rest of the season and hope you can get a bid to the Papa John Toilet Bowl or the Meinkie Car Crap Bowl and then pray some of your highly sought after recruits don't have a change of heart and want to go play for Georgia.
Or he could let our punter play quarterback. He did just as much to beat Syracuse as did DJ.
How is that for "criticism"?
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Orange Blooded [2349]
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Re: Dabo has proven he will pull an ineffective or less effective QB
Oct 17, 2021, 9:47 AM
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Pretty good for someone who seems like they close their dresser girl with there hip. You want to cry anymore?
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Orange Blooded [2349]
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Re: Dabo has proven he will pull an ineffective or less effective QB
Oct 17, 2021, 9:53 AM
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Dresser draw
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CU Guru [1321]
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I think the reason TP hasn’t played..
Oct 17, 2021, 9:41 AM
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Is because of the injury, at least that’s what I hope, because otherwise we’ve got issues beyond on field performance.
If you are right and TP and Hunter aren’t capable, then coaches need to be let go. Hunter I can understand he was a walk on, so maybe he isn’t as talented, but Taison been on campus 3 years, he should be able to run the offense. If we have two “busts” then you have to wonder about talent evaluation and development.
Unfortunately this will not be fixed this year, and maybe not next year either. As fans it’s hard, but given what Dabo has done he deserves our patience while he fixes this. Doesn’t mean we can’t sit here and complain though. However, he does need to remember the biggest reason he has this job is because his former boss either couldn’t or wouldn’t fix the issues with the team.
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Rock Defender [60]
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Re: Dabo has proven he will pull an ineffective or less effective QB
Oct 17, 2021, 9:43 AM
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All those QB changes were to insert the presumed next starter. This is the first time the next starter has, well let’s call it what the numbers do, sucked. That’s a different thing. Evaluating the QB’s in real games is part of coaching/evaluating. Not saying TP is better, but doing their job is looking at it when your offense sucks. Give him a few series that matter and we all shut up. Then they evaluated.
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Orange Blooded [2349]
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Re: Dabo has proven he will pull an ineffective or less effective QB
Oct 17, 2021, 9:51 AM
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The problem is if you give TP one series you aren’t going to shut up. He can go 3 and out and you are going to have people say he looked better. He completes his first pass and misses on the next 5. He was better. He runs for a 6 yard gain he was better. People have soo much hate for dj that’s just what it is. He had a terrific throw to ngata and soon as the spiers throws one fake punt it was the best throw of the season.
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All-TigerNet [13036]
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If we're being honest here, TP has never shown much
Oct 17, 2021, 9:54 AM
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Now you could argue that we are to the point where it's just worth it to throw him out there and see what happens because we are simply that bad right now. But, there's also no reason to expect TP to be good based on what we've seen from him in the past. He would've needed to make very large strides.
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All-In [27367]
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Re: If we're being honest here, TP has never shown much
Oct 17, 2021, 10:03 AM
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Big Dave is calling the shots!
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Orange Blooded [4447]
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Re: Dabo has proven he will pull an ineffective or less effective QB
Oct 17, 2021, 10:05 AM
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You are 100% correct No one wants to win more than Dabo He knows everyone’s capabilitiy in that QB room and knows who gives us the best chance to win All these people that don’t know the difference between a soccer ball and football and have never been to a practice are trying to tell Dabo who is the best QB LOL ??
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All-TigerNet [10354]
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this is NOT on DJ........
Oct 17, 2021, 10:06 AM
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2010 was a combo of Napier & Parker......pulling parker was warranted.
2014 Stoudt should've never sniffed the field while DW4 was healthy
2017 KB was never the best option
2021 Our offensive issues run so much deeper than "DJ's not doing good"...........and they're all issues that CAN'T be solved this season..........unfortunately. Dabo can ride with DJ or bench him, but the outcome will be the EXACT same, if not worse. Dabo's roster & asst coach management the last 3 years has led us here.........Hopefully he makes the tough calls that will get us out of this mess.......it's not too late as long as he acts at the end of this season.
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Rock Defender [60]
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Re: this is NOT on DJ........
Oct 17, 2021, 10:25 AM
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What calls are you saying he makes at the end of the season?
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110%er [6224]
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I think for the better part you are dead on
Oct 17, 2021, 10:38 AM
[ in reply to this is NOT on DJ........ ] |
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The only thing we could possibly gain by a change to Phommachahn is a shift in the offense as a whole. We would really need to be an 80/20 run pass offense. TP, IMHO, is the better runner but cannot throw effectively. So maybe our run offense would get a little better? Consider this...how would that look to the recruits who are considering a commitment to "WRU"? Or QB's looking for that matter?
I don't post on here much anymore and was hesitant to do it here but I liked the opinion. To me, this season is where it is. Personally the "waiting for the switch to go off"? Thats not happening. I don't understand what has gone awry this year but I think its a combination of several things. I think after the season ends we are going to see some staff changes for sure. I think there is a chance we also see some transfers. Its been flabbergasting to say the least but those in the fanbase and in the media throwing dirt on the grave of Clemson football are kidding themselves if they think this ride ends here.
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