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110%er [5607]
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Joined: 10/3/03
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Show me
Oct 4, 2010, 2:45 PM
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I realize many of us (especially the younger guys) who post here get alittle emotional after a tough loss, venting happens (been there, done that). I'll probably get flamed for this, so flame away.
Over the past couple of years there have been quite a few posts calling some of our fans out for not being "real fans", etc... I'd like to carify that although being a "real fan" is a subjective point of view. I consider myself to be a Clemson Football fan. I graduated in 1996, love Clemson, and would rather see Clemson Football win another Football National Championship than almost anything in this world. As much as I try to say "I don't care" when we lose and that "it doesn't bother me", it does.
I didn't even watch the Miami game yesterday (gasp!). Prior committments, kids, sports, yard-work, all intervened to make it almost impossible. I had season tickets until 2004, but the long drive from Charleston, shelling out thousands of dollars, the time committment, and not enough winning became more than I was willing to deal with. Now, I still make the occasional game, but it ain't gonna be for a noon game...I like tailgating after 12pm when beer tastes better. Of course, if I lived within 2 hours of Clemson it would be easier and I would probably make more games, but still doubt I would make them all.
That being said, a big reason I'm no longer willing to shell out thousands of dollars for season tickets and don't consider not driving up to every game a must anymore is simple. When was the last time Clemson won 10 games, or lost less than 3? When was the last time that we beat the "best teams" on our schedule? It's been a while, since about 1991. Until we start winning 10+ games a year I'm in "show me" mode. Give me some tangible hope by winning 10+ games a year, and I'm probably going to enjoy watching Clemson Football a lot more. As it stands right now the program we have become makes me a little sick to my stomach. Watching Clemson play Football over the last 19 years had been painful. Clemson has failed to deliver for a long time, more then enough time has passed to know that something's perpetually wrong. Unfortunately I'm not prone to "delusions" and the kind of rationalizations that keep our buddies at South Carolina happy as clams and shouting "wait 'til next year", every year. I'm past being angry, etc...now I'm resigned to the fact that we're not that good and probably not going to be that good anytime in the near future (thus, the lack of continued interest to drive to games).
My Clemson Football slogan is simple, "show me". When Clemson wins 10+ games I'll be thrilled. Winning the ACC would be even better. Until then I'm just going to keep reminding myself that seeing is believing. Until then I'm just another frusterated Clemson fan waiting on Clemson's Administration to put action behind their empty promises to win Football Championships. I'll believe it when I see it. "Show me".
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All-TigerNet [10360]
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110%er [5607]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: preach it......
Oct 4, 2010, 2:54 PM
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Yep...you said it. I love Dabo, I really hope he's the guy. "Hey Clemson, want some $$$"? Sure thing "show me" some wins.
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CU Medallion [73569]
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Posts: 78044
Joined: 11/30/98
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your not alone in your frustration***
Oct 4, 2010, 2:53 PM
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Heisman Winner [119813]
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Pitiful, pouty, and p*sspoor.
Oct 4, 2010, 2:57 PM
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For someone who considers himself a fan, IMO.
Fans support their team thru thick and thin.
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All-TigerNet [12236]
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Re: Pitiful, pouty, and p*sspoor.
Oct 4, 2010, 3:00 PM
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You obviously are having trouble comprehending.
In a nutshell the guy cares more than you know and will not continue to support a program that could give two foot long turds about its fans
He obviously has stuck with Clemson through THICK AND THIN or otherwise he wouldn't have wasted his time posting this or even getting on tigernet.
Just because some fans are tired of getting beat down every Saturday doesn't make them less of a fan
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Heisman Winner [119813]
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You, sir, graduated in 2006
Oct 4, 2010, 3:04 PM
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Do not begin to tell me that i don't comprehend!
The author of this thread is a QUITTER!
Real fans don't quit on their team when things aren't gouing perfectly.
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Know-it-all [2004]
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Joined: 5/27/10
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The author of this thread is a SUCKER.
Oct 4, 2010, 3:08 PM
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That administration is robbing you blind. You are being duped. Plain and simple. I'm not anymore. What this all is is NOT Clemson. It's an administration stealing from a fan base.
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Amateur [34]
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Re: You, sir, graduated in 2006
Oct 4, 2010, 4:41 PM
[ in reply to You, sir, graduated in 2006 ] |
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He is a quitter??!!! Are you kidding me? He dares to write a couple of negative points and you call him a quitter? Wake up!!! He is passionate and voices his opinion.
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All-TigerNet [10360]
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fans also demand an ROI.........
Oct 4, 2010, 3:01 PM
[ in reply to Pitiful, pouty, and p*sspoor. ] |
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ask bama.....(not that we compare to bama) but i read an article a few years ago where there were boosters (BIG and small) that refuse to give anymore when shula was there........they demanded better (being bama they demanded perfection), but you get the point. You can't expect fans to continue to shell out money (keep in mind IPTAY goes up EVERY YEAR and the product is the same) when the outcome on the field is no different.
If your steak comes out raw and you ordered well done do you pay deal with it or ask them to take back and make it right?.........same concept.
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Rock Defender [54]
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REEL FANS WOULD TAKE THE BLOODIE STEAK
Oct 4, 2010, 3:18 PM
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AND ENJOY IT LIKE IT WUZ THERE LAST MEEL ON EARTH BECAUSE THEY NEW IT WAS THE MOST SPESHUL STEAK TO EVER TOUCH A HOT GRILLE.
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Virtuoso [645]
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Point for using the English-to-Arkansas dictionary***
Oct 4, 2010, 8:46 PM
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Orange Blooded [4640]
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If we were discussing stock dividends and not supporing
Oct 4, 2010, 2:58 PM
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my university's student players, then I would agree. But we are not.
My kids and family go to Clemson games to root for our Tigers...and have a great day. The game is the instigator but the experience is the focus.
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Legend [15750]
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This. I am sooo tired of people confusing "fan" with
Oct 4, 2010, 3:07 PM
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"shareholder". "I have invested my hard earned dollar in this endeavor so as to see a return of wins."
If you think that way, start contributing to Alabama. You will get a better "return" for your dollar, since you think your return should be "wins". That is, until they fall from grace...then find the next big thing and "invest" there.
In the meantime, we actual Clemson fans will continue to support the team we love through the wins and losses, hope for the best, be disappointed when we fall short but get over it because we still have the best game day experience in the country, we still have coaches who are giving it their all and 85 or so players who chose to wear the Tiger Paw.
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Orange Blooded [4640]
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I believe you and I agreed, but you get the points!
Oct 4, 2010, 4:09 PM
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Now I have something to complain about! HA. 
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Expert [1190]
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I Love Clemson.
Oct 4, 2010, 2:59 PM
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I want to win as much as anybody, but CU doesn't have to "show me" anything.
Your point-of-view is extremely arrogant, in my opinion.
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All-TigerNet [12236]
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Re: I Love Clemson.
Oct 4, 2010, 3:04 PM
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You definitely took that the way you wanted to.
In terms of the "show me" attitude. He doesn't mean Clemson has to win 10 games every season or even go to a bowl game every season. He is stating that he wants the full support of this university for the football team. He is stating that slogans and cheezy one liners don't win championships. He is stating that it is been way too long to continue with a half ### effort not just from coaches but from administrators, players, trainers, and yes EVEN THE #### FANS
At some point it has to stop. At some point you have to draw a line in the sand and choose to either be great or get the **** off the field.
rant done
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110%er [5607]
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Re: I Love Clemson.
Oct 4, 2010, 3:10 PM
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Amen...you hit the nail on the head buddy!
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Legend [15750]
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Wow! YOU took that the way you wanted to.
Oct 4, 2010, 3:12 PM
[ in reply to Re: I Love Clemson. ] |
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The OP said he wanted wins. Period. Wins and championships. He didn't say word one about the administration. You're the one who read what he wanted to into it.
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All-TigerNet [12236]
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Re: Wow! YOU took that the way you wanted to.
Oct 4, 2010, 3:15 PM
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Really....look above you bud
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Legend [15750]
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Ha ha. Read the original post and read what you said he
Oct 4, 2010, 3:18 PM
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said. Just because he appreciates your support doesn't me he said anything close to what you interpretted it to be, and the fact that your interpretation is in a post where you chastise someone else for commenting on the original post as it was written makes it all the funnier.
But, you know...congrats for guessing right...or, writing things that you knew the OP would like. It's not what he wrote, though. Like I said, you read into it what you wanted to.
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110%er [5607]
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Re: I Love Clemson.
Oct 4, 2010, 3:09 PM
[ in reply to I Love Clemson. ] |
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Of course, you're entitled to your opinion. After 19 years I think I'm entiteled to mine. If you think that my opinion is "arrogant" then I submit that you believe that your opinion is the morally superior one. Your comment seems fairly arrogant to me.
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CU Guru [1446]
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Typical T-net arrogance
Oct 4, 2010, 7:59 PM
[ in reply to I Love Clemson. ] |
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MVP [548]
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I feel the same way, brother.***
Oct 4, 2010, 3:01 PM
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Know-it-all [2004]
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Right there with ya. I'm done.
Oct 4, 2010, 3:05 PM
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We used to be One Clemson. Now we're just an administration exploiting a fan base.
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Hall of Famer [21618]
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Whatever makes you feel better about jumping ship.
Oct 4, 2010, 3:12 PM
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Clemson is always bigger than any administration. If you want to use them as a scapegoat so you don't have to suffer the frustration with the rest of us... go ahead. But you are not fooling anyone.
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Know-it-all [2004]
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Keep thinking that. We're not bigger. Not right now.
Oct 4, 2010, 3:16 PM
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That administration is doing whatever they want to do, fanbase be ######. And until they stop getting away with it, I'm not going to enable it. I'm with Clemson when Clemson is Clemson. What we're dealing with is NOT Clemson. It's a bunch of criminals exploiting a fan base for profit. That's not Clemson.
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Rock Defender [54]
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Well, not to mention a President bastardizing the University
Oct 4, 2010, 3:23 PM
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in his myopic pipe dream chase of one magazine's praise and accolades.
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Know-it-all [2004]
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We gave up Dwight Jones in the name of that magazine.
Oct 4, 2010, 3:28 PM
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Sure is looking like we could use him now. Too bad he's at a University that ranked higher than us in the same magazine.
Good call guys.
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Rock Defender [54]
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Probably a thread for another board, but it bugs me more
Oct 4, 2010, 3:30 PM
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than any football issue when it comes to issues I see at CU.
I've seen 3 different 2nd/3rd generation legacies with 3.5+ GPA's and good SAT's turned down in the past 3 years and have to go to USC as a plan B.....it's getting ridiculous.
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Know-it-all [2004]
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Boy, they wouldn't be able to get me out of Sikes if those
Oct 4, 2010, 3:33 PM
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were my kids.
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Hall of Famer [21618]
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Your whole argument is flawed from the foundation.
Oct 4, 2010, 3:24 PM
[ in reply to Keep thinking that. We're not bigger. Not right now. ] |
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Even if you are mad at the administration, you can't use that as an excuse to stop supporting Clemson altogether.
The players don't choose the administration. Clemson's tradition exists beyond anyone on payroll. Your fellow alums are still part of Clemson family. The students don't choose the administration.
You are never going to games to support the administration. They are one part of a huge machine. If you turn your back on the whole machine just for one part, then you can't claim that when other people still support Clemson they are really only supporting the administration.
I love Clemson, and no administration can kill that. If you turn on Clemson, it is because you are frustrated, not because Clemson IS the administration.
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Know-it-all [2004]
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That administration IS the machine.
Oct 4, 2010, 3:32 PM
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The games on Saturday, the stadium, the fans, the players, it's all just a charade that he needs to stay alive. We're all just the waste product. Terry Don Phillips is feeding on Clemson for his own good. I'm not going to be a part of that. I'm more Clemson than ever for not supporting it.
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Hall of Famer [21618]
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So you can't comprehend the possibility of cheering
Oct 4, 2010, 3:35 PM
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for the team but working actively against the administration at the same time? Try explaining to the football team in the locker room that you gave up on them because they are really instruments of the administration. That is actually comically ridiculous.
I mean... when you don't like a particular president, do you automatically become a terrorist against the whole country? Seems a bit harsh.
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Know-it-all [2004]
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We DID complain last week. Dabo commented on it.
Oct 4, 2010, 3:43 PM
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Does it look like they care? I wrote another email today. Do you think they care? I can guarantee you one thing, they don't give a crap about fans or anything we say, they don't give a crap about wins either. They care about the dollar. So I'm making my statement in the only language they speak, and they're still probably not going to hear it. I just hope other fans join me.
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Hall of Famer [21618]
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What if you are wrong though?
Oct 4, 2010, 3:45 PM
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What if what you want would make things worse? You can't even admit that you may not be qualified to make important decisions about which you are not well informed?
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Know-it-all [2004]
TigerPulse: 82%
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Joined: 5/27/10
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Does it really surprise you that the $800k coach gets beat
Oct 4, 2010, 4:06 PM
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by the coaches that make more money than him? I knew he would. The salesman that makes $150k/year selling widgets probably regularly gets his widgets in over his competitor's sales guy that makes $50k/year. That's just how it works. That shouldn't surprise anyone.
This is all not to mention the fact that TDP ran off the one good thing he had done, which was Oliver Purnell. I hope you ra-ra guys haven't become basketball fans in the past few years. You're going to be sorely disappointed.
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Hall of Famer [21618]
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Oh.... now I know the blueprint of your whole argument.
Oct 4, 2010, 4:10 PM
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Whoever gets paid more is a better coach. Don't ever let anyone accuse you of oversimplifying an issue. If only our stupid administration could understand greater-than less-than logic. It's all so clear now.
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Letterman [298]
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Where were you in 2002?
Oct 4, 2010, 11:44 PM
[ in reply to Right there with ya. I'm done. ] |
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That's when we needed to push the administration to dump Bowden, but there were precious few of us making the push.
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Hall of Famer [21618]
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So... thanks for informing us all you are a fair weather fan
Oct 4, 2010, 3:11 PM
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I'm pretty sure though that you could have done it more succinctly.
You could have simply said,
"My attatchment to Clemson is superficial. I am more of a consumer than a supporter and I have no interest in being part of "Clemson family"... whatever that is. I am better suited to be an NFL fan and I care more about my own entertainment than I do about Clemson."
Thanks for your light, convenvient contributions, when you have the time to make them, and please stay home more often. Just be thankful you are unwittingly a part of something special.
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Expert [1190]
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Joined: 7/22/07
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Game. Set. Match.***
Oct 4, 2010, 3:13 PM
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Know-it-all [2004]
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You're confusing Clemson with the abortion of an
Oct 4, 2010, 3:21 PM
[ in reply to So... thanks for informing us all you are a fair weather fan ] |
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administration that is over there right now. They are NOT Clemson. I'll still pull for the Tiger Paw. That's Clemson. Terry Don Phillips is not Clemson. He's the guy who is ruining an athletic department to make a quick buck and move on to retirement. He is NOT Clemson. I'll be there for Clemson when I get Clemson back.
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Hall of Famer [21618]
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Is the administration on the field? Is the administration in
Oct 4, 2010, 3:25 PM
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the student section? Is the administration the reason you cared about Clemson in the first place? No... not even close. You cant just say that Clemson is now, somehow ONLY the administration and it magically be true. Your simply making that up.
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Know-it-all [2004]
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If the fans had their say, do you really think we would've
Oct 4, 2010, 3:36 PM
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spent $800k on a coach if we were really trying to compete? We had plenty more money, but TDP didn't spend it, because he's not serious about winning. Maybe you got a refund check. I don't know.
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Hall of Famer [21618]
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You go ahead and try to collect a paycheck from Clemson.
Oct 4, 2010, 3:38 PM
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I think you just proved my point. Please though... keep considering yourself a real fan. Have fun and take care. 
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Know-it-all [2004]
TigerPulse: 82%
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Either you're a sucker or you're getting a check.
Oct 4, 2010, 3:44 PM
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I've got my guess.
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Hall of Famer [21618]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Joined: 8/16/03
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Well that makes sense, I guess. Just make up more stuff.
Oct 4, 2010, 3:48 PM
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Creating reality in your head is a great strategy for being correct... in your head.
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Know-it-all [2004]
TigerPulse: 82%
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You're creating a fantasy in your head in thinking we might
Oct 4, 2010, 4:08 PM
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be wrong. He hired a $800k coach in $3mil dollar market. No one should be surprised by anything that's happening on the field.
If I bought a $800k racecar, and got beat by a $3mil racecar, I wouldn't be surprised. Maybe you would be.
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Hall of Famer [21618]
TigerPulse: 100%
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haha
Oct 4, 2010, 4:12 PM
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That's a pretty flawless argument there. I think you covered all your bases.
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All-TigerNet [10402]
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Re: Show me
Oct 4, 2010, 3:11 PM
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You are 100% right,With the money i spend every year on this mess of a football program it gets old.
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Know-it-all [2004]
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Joined: 5/27/10
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It's not even the money for me, but also it is.
Oct 4, 2010, 3:25 PM
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In the same year that TDP asked for more money, he spent less and pocketed our money so he could build his resume, and then blame the crappy football team on Dabo. Had we gone out and spent $4million on a football coach and we were 2-2, I don't think I would've said a word. But TDP stole from us for his gain.
That's why I'm keeping my money.
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Heisman Winner [119813]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Joined: 6/24/09
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Good, IF you were an IPTAY member, then
Oct 4, 2010, 3:35 PM
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someone will move up and get your seats. THAT GOES FOR RECKLESS96 also.
But i bet you weren't in IPTAY....
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Know-it-all [2004]
TigerPulse: 82%
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Joined: 5/27/10
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I'm a $2100 level member. I dropped from $2800 last year
Oct 4, 2010, 3:39 PM
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because I saw this nightmare coming. I've been giving since I started at Clemson in 1997. I've been to every ACC stadium in the past ten years. I went to Auburn, I went to Tampa, I've been to four bowl games. I went to Boise for god's sakes.
I know it's an uphill road for you to defend anything thats going on, but using that argument isn't going to work for you with me.
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Heisman Winner [119813]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 54529
Joined: 6/24/09
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Re: I'm a $2100 level member. I dropped from $2800 last year
Oct 4, 2010, 3:47 PM
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72,same, auburn, , more away games than u can prob count, 10 bowl games including Jan 1, 82.
Never once have i defended the administration, i choose to work from within, not beatch about a team/coaches that real fans SUPPORT no matter what.
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110%er [6851]
TigerPulse: 100%
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I have never heard anyone be more proud of being a fair
Oct 4, 2010, 3:14 PM
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weather supporter. Bubba, come hell or high water, 0 wins or 0 loses, rain or shine, 12 noon game or 12 midnight,I am going to have my aged #### in my seat pulling for my Tigers. That is what a real fan does (and I chose that word "real" for a reason).
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All-TigerNet [10360]
TigerPulse: 84%
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Joined: 11/9/04
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cram the mushy sentimental crap.........
Oct 4, 2010, 3:27 PM
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Ws & Ls, PAYING fans, administration, etc.... run a football program if all arent clicking then changes will be made.
i'm tired of the "real fan/fake fan" name calling.
DEMANDING better out of a program that you KNOW can be better and that you've grown up watching and dropped THOUSANDS of dollars year after year does not make you a "fair weather/fake fan"
all the clemson's one of a kind and beautiful and the family is sunshine and flowers is all well and good, but SHOW ME THE WINS and CHAMPIONSHIPS..........we are arguably the top 3 program (talent, facilities, fan base, money, etc......) in the ACC and we haven't won it in 20 years
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Hall of Famer [21618]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Joined: 8/16/03
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It really is this simple...
Oct 4, 2010, 3:30 PM
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1. You love Clemson no matter what and support the school and sports programs regardless of wins and losses. (Under this umbrella, for example, are fans who want Dabo fired right now but still go to games and still support the team)
2. Your support for Clemson is contingent on wins and losses and you can actually stop caring about Clemson if they don't please you enough. Those are fake fans. Deal with it.
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All-TigerNet [10360]
TigerPulse: 84%
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Joined: 11/9/04
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the ones who stop caring about clemson .........
Oct 4, 2010, 3:35 PM
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i'd argue are very few and far between..............or else they wouldn't care enough to be TICKED off at the product on the field.....or even post the frustrations on here
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110%er [5607]
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Re: the ones who stop caring about clemson .........
Oct 4, 2010, 3:37 PM
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You're on it Pheebo.
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Hall of Famer [21618]
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Um... everyone is ticked about the loss.
Oct 4, 2010, 3:44 PM
[ in reply to the ones who stop caring about clemson ......... ] |
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The guy who started this thread just declared he doesn't really care. I would argue that fair weather fans are not few and far between because all teams have them. The more successful teams have more than others. We are always having to deal with ours because we can't even win a championship so they jump on and off the wagon like it's a stairmaster.
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All-TigerNet [10360]
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if somebody TRULY does not care about clemson.......
Oct 4, 2010, 3:49 PM
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then losing would not phase them one way or the other..............ie trigger a post on tigernet
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Hall of Famer [21618]
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Joined: 8/16/03
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UNLESS... they were a fair weather fan and they could care
Oct 4, 2010, 3:51 PM
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when it was tolerable and just throw Clemson away when things got tough. It's not like that doesn't happen. People can "shut off" all kinds of things.
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CU Guru [1446]
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All of this bickering because we lost at Auburn and to a
Oct 4, 2010, 8:20 PM
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good Miami team.Chill people,you do realize that these are by far the two best teams on our schedule right?Unless you were expecting a MNC,what's the problem?Reading some of this crap,you would think we got throttled by Wofford and Elon.I agree we are at a critical point in the season,but no way am I quitting on the team I love.
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110%er [5607]
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Re: Um... everyone is ticked about the loss.
Oct 4, 2010, 3:51 PM
[ in reply to Um... everyone is ticked about the loss. ] |
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The guy who started this thread said he doubts Clemson is going to be winning Championhsips anytime soon, but if we do he'd be thrilled.
Your reaction is completely absurd.
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Hall of Famer [21618]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Joined: 8/16/03
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You said that the amount of support you give Clemson
Oct 4, 2010, 4:03 PM
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is contingent on the amount of wins the school produces.
That makes you a consumer instead of a supporter. The reason you are unable to really get where I am coming from with my reaction to your post is because we have a fundamentally different outlook on what our role in the Clemson family is.
I am a humble part of something greater than myself, from which I expect nothing to give all of my support. I am an unconditional fan.
You are a consumer who demands something for added support. You are a conditional fan.
In your world, people like me are suckers. In my world, people like you are arrogant, fair weather, half-fans who you can't count on.
I take issue with conditional fans. If you don't like that, then there is nothing I can do for you.
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110%er [5607]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Re: You said that the amount of support you give Clemson
Oct 4, 2010, 4:35 PM
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Nope, that's what you said. You're still absurd.
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Hall of Famer [21618]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Learn how to read your own posts then.
Oct 4, 2010, 8:09 PM
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Here are your words. Let me explain to you what they mean.
That being said, a big reason I'm no longer willing to shell out thousands of dollars for season tickets and don't consider not driving up to every game a must anymore is simple. When was the last time Clemson won 10 games, or lost less than 3? When was the last time that we beat the "best teams" on our schedule? It's been a while, since about 1991. Until we start winning 10+ games a year I'm in "show me" mode.
By your own statement, you are "no longer willing to shell out thousands of dollars" presumably for tickets, gas and all the other expenses that are involved when it comes to supporting Clemson at home games. Now, what is the reason you are doing this? You said it was "simple." The answer you gave was "When was the last time Clemson won 10 games, or lost less than 3?"
Call me crazy, but by saying that you are implying that you WOULD shell out the money if Clemson won more games. That is exactly what I said that you said. So if you deny it you are either confused or lying.
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110%er [5607]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Joined: 10/3/03
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Re: Learn how to read your own posts then.
Oct 5, 2010, 4:16 PM
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You can take it and spin it anyway you want to.
Everybody is entitled to their opinion. I respect how you feel, I just don't subscribe to you're point of view. Contrary to what you believe you think you're doing to "help" Clemson Football you're actually part of the problem. I don't fault your loyalty, just your version of it. Make no mistake, you are part of Clemson's problem.
The problem with "blind" loyalty is that it doesn't hold the Administration accountable, and it rarely produces Championships. I admitt that people like me are not always the most popular guy at local "sunshine-pumper" convention, but we are good at causing desired results (in this case, wins). The Gamecocks and the Chicago Cubs have the same thing in common, hoards of blindly loyal fans. Their misguided fan's support their team's without question, no matter the result. They never hold the Administration/Owners accountable for the poor job they do managing the resources they're entrusted with.
I wasn't in favor of hiring Tommy West, or Tommy Bowden, or Dabo Swinney(great guy who I hope gets things turned around). Further, you don't hire inexperienced coaches without any head coaching background if you're serious about winning Championships. You hire somebody like Nick Saban, Urban Myer, etc...and you pay through the nose to get them knowing full well that you'll get plenty of ROI down the road. You also give the coaches everything they request in terms of support (level admissions policies with their peers, indoor practice facilities, training rooms, salaries, etc....). Clemson's Administration has been dragging their collective feet in support of the Football Program for years. Add the stupid Head Coaching hires to the equation, blindly loyal fans, and you have the recipe for 19 years without a single ACC Football Championship.
The problem with being a "blindy loyal" fan is that they let their emotions overide logical reasoning. Emotions may help you feel better about yourself, but they aren't very useful problem solving strategies. Loyal fans are the ones who force Alabama to hire coaches like Nick Saban, they threaten to pull back some financial support if he's not given strong consideration. Blindly loyal fans support the Administration's policies/decions no matter how detremental they are to the long-term health of the football program. If Clemson had more fans like me, and less "blindy loyal" fans like yourself we wouldn't all be sitting here wondering if another 19 years are going to slip by before we win win another Championship.
You're entitled to your opnion, of course. But if you care about Clemson Football as much as you profess to you'll start holding the people responsible for Clemson's football championship drought accountable. How? With your wallett. Until then, enjoy the predicatble results.
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All-TigerNet [14479]
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Re: You said that the amount of support you give Clemson
Oct 4, 2010, 4:41 PM
[ in reply to You said that the amount of support you give Clemson ] |
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great post. really, except for a small window when danny was here when have we ever been world beaters in football. and danny even had several mediocre years, those being years of not winning 10 or losing less than 3 that seem to be the only way to have success to some of you. imo we are as close to the danny years as we ever have been. and i could really care less what a bunch of whining glass half empty people think.
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CU Guru [1298]
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Joined: 2/26/02
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Re: You said that the amount of support you give Clemson
Oct 5, 2010, 10:44 AM
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DeR I would agree close to Danny and in some ways ahead as I beleive thre is greater depth at the skill postions however we still have a ways to go on the line. Until we fix this problem we will not get to the 10 we all would like to to see IMO
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Rock Defender [54]
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Letterman [294]
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Joined: 2/25/08
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Re: Show me
Oct 4, 2010, 3:18 PM
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What Clemson showed me on Saturday was the same that's been shown since I graduated 10 years ago(and the 10 before that). Dabo, Bowden, etc, the various assistants come and gone, the great talented players.
Cliché it may be, good/great/championship teams find ways to win. Clemson started 2-3 last year and finished 8-4, I suspect it will probably do the same this year, and the next, and the next.
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All-TigerNet [14479]
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Joined: 11/30/98
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Re: Show me
Oct 4, 2010, 3:48 PM
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and yet no one twists your arm or puts a gun to your head to go to the games or even watch them for that matter. why dont all you people who are so frustrated and mad about the product on the field just find a new hobby like old reckless who gave up his tickets years ago. if you people dont see the difference in attitude and toughness since dabo took over then you really do find another hobby. is it going to happen overnight, obviously not. was bowden given to long, probably. but i can see a very small light at the end of the tunnel already and with this years and nexts years class i think that light will get much better. but hey that is just me. why dont the rest of you spend your saturdays shopping with the wife.
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Orange Blooded [2533]
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Joined: 10/10/08
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I think you should move to Missouri myself
Oct 4, 2010, 3:22 PM
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Letterman [294]
TigerPulse: 78%
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Re: I think you should move to Missouri myself
Oct 4, 2010, 3:29 PM
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They have Tigers there too!
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CU Guru [1636]
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Joined: 8/21/01
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The only way I agree
Oct 4, 2010, 3:39 PM
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Is if I know 100% without a doubt that our administration really does not care, and I do have major doubts about that at times. I already posted my thoughts on the TDP hiring of Dabo within the past day or two, so I am not going to retype all of that. If you have kids, a lot of responsibilities, etc, then you should be excused from not supporting the team IF that is your only option. If you still have the time, and the financial resources to support the team, then you should. The only way I will ever stop going to games, is if we have players that do not care, or if I have major proof that our administration is not doing everything they can to put a winner on the field. There are accusations/assumptions/doubts, from A LOT of people about that, but I have never seen anyone, not Chris Ard, not Mickey Plyler, nor Roy Philpott, prove that as a fact.
Trust me, it does wear on you, all of the "so close" over and over and over and over again. The night we went to Auburn, we had a place booked that we did not have to give any debit/credit card information too. We didn't bother looking for it before the game, because we were too anxious to explore Auburn. After the game, I could not get out of Alabama fast enough. Not because of Auburn, or their fans, they were great, I just needed a long drive, some music with the windows rolled down, the cool night air, and the skyline of Atlanta around 1 in the morning, to try to take my mind off of my broken heart. It seems like we made it from Auburn back home in 30 minutes. We were all silent, except for a little music after the Auburn radio network got out of range. None of us needed to say anything, or do any analyzing, because an ending like we had at Auburn, was something that a Clemson fan, and a Clemson fan only, can truly understand.
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CU Guru [1716]
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Joined: 9/3/10
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sooner or later I am going to have to adopt your
Oct 4, 2010, 3:42 PM
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attitude, that or go dead broke
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CU Medallion [58492]
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Joined: 4/23/00
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I share in your frustration, respect your opinion,
Oct 4, 2010, 3:47 PM
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and do not judge your loyalty. However, I and I'm sure many others, feel differently. I have always and will continue to support Clemson regardless of winning or losing. I have been at it so long it is just part of who and what I am. I want to win as bad as anybody, but I'm pretty much gonna be here thru thick and thin.
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CU Guru [1053]
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Posts: 2897
Joined: 12/6/01
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Billy D said it best a couple years ago in an interview
Oct 4, 2010, 3:53 PM
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published in either the O&W or the Charleston P&C newspaper...
He said, "The thing about loyalty is, it just doesn't pay the bills."
He said that with respect to the "Seat Equity Program," and his comments hit exactly on the University's view towards IPTAY members.
Some of you should read that quote a couple more times and think about what he meant when he said it.
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CU Guru [1716]
TigerPulse: 90%
Posts: 2189
Joined: 9/3/10
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unfortunately that works both ways....right now, I am
Oct 4, 2010, 3:56 PM
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giving at the Heisman level and driving to home games from Charleston, meaning two nights in a hotel plus gas, plus food and drinks, etc...that's a lot of coin even if I decided to drop back to a lower level of giving
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Legend [15750]
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CU Guru [1053]
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I think it is pretty obvious..."SHOW ME THE MONEY!!!"***
Oct 4, 2010, 4:11 PM
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CU Guru [1053]
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110%er [5607]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 4070
Joined: 10/3/03
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Re: Billy D said it best a couple years ago in an interview
Oct 5, 2010, 5:04 PM
[ in reply to Billy D said it best a couple years ago in an interview ] |
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You sure do post here a lot "Mr". Don't you have some numbers to crunch?
This ex-roomate appreciates your thoughtful response.
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CU Guru [1944]
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Posts: 740
Joined: 12/30/07
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Clemson (long)
Oct 4, 2010, 3:54 PM
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I agree with most of what you say and because of some of the same issues you mention I gave up season tickets and stepped away from IPTAY several years ago.
I grew up near Clemson during the glory years and graduated from Clemson in 1994 (I actually worked a few years and transferred in so I'm a little older than the typical '94 graduate). I experienced the 10+ win seasons, the ACC championships and the MNC but more than that I experienced Clemson. I have lived near Columbia for the last 15 years, a move I made due to marriage but a move I will regret until I die. There is no place like Clemson and I miss being near it every day. Now my two daughters have reached ages where they are interested in Clemson and Clemson sports. I have rejoined IPTAY and we attend as many of the Clemson games, home and away, in the three main sports as we can. Win or lose we support the teams and we were there Saturday for another heartbreak. But for me and hopefully my two girls, Clemson is much more than football or athletics. It is a lifestyle, a state of mind, for me it is very special. As Joe Sherman wrote, there is “Something in These Hills” and he explains it very eloquently. Clemson has changed over the last twenty years, it feels more corporate and not as intimate but it is still Clemson and more than that for me and I believe most of the alumni it will always be HOME.
I want to win, I want more ACC championships and ten win seasons and I want to contend for BCS bowls and the MNC but I cherish the opportunity to visit Clemson every chance I get even if we lose. I apologize for being so long but that’s my opinion…
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CU Guru [1298]
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Re: Clemson (long)
Oct 4, 2010, 5:24 PM
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Well I have been going to death valley for over 40 years. I have seen bad, good better and best sitting on the 40 yd line in the orange bowl, sitting maybe 20 yards from when Woody Hayes hit C. B in the gator Bowl, the great Game Day night game when CJ left two yellow jackets in their tracks. The decade of field goals and the misery of puntarouski. Catch 1, catch 2, the push. Yes many great moments of Clemson Football of which one of my favorites was watching us spike Vick in the end zone tight up to Harper's great stretch out catch in Auburn. Yes we lost but O did we play. We laid it out there and that's all I ask. Yes we missed a filed goal. yes we got a call seldom made. Yes I wanted to beat Auburn but what a true clemson fan wants to see is being competitive. We want to see good football that happens on the line. Skill players and touchdowns are fun but it is the effort, the Tiger Pride that counts. Do I want a 10 win season - sure. Do I want an ACC championship - sure,. Do I want a BCS bowl (WIN) - sure. What I don't want is what I say at the Miami Sat. total confusion in the defensive secondary. A tem where coaches did not get plays in and D was not ready for upbeat passe. Be ready. Play 4 quarters. Celebrate after the game is won not just a good play where you are not concentrating on the next play. A well coached, well disciplined and well played game. Go Tigers - Fight. BTW anyone else notice the old "Fighting Tigers" flag in the Miami Game. Really great - even looked old
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All-American [564]
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well put!!***
Oct 4, 2010, 4:21 PM
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Aficionado [100]
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Re: Show me
Oct 4, 2010, 6:49 PM
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Ah, great post! Two thumbs up!
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Orange Blooded [3820]
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please stay away...oh yeah; don't even write....
Oct 4, 2010, 7:49 PM
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you're not missed.
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Letterman [266]
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Your Loss bro.***
Oct 4, 2010, 9:01 PM
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Rock Defender [54]
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Joined: 11/30/98
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That and you can't smoke in the stands
Oct 4, 2010, 9:29 PM
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That was the straw that broke my Camel's back. Pun intended!!
Oh well, I have the best seat!! 42" LCD, Bose sound system, great recliner, bathroom is close, frig is close and I can smoke, drink, cuss, yell, spit, stand up without someone bitchin' at me to sit down!!
The fun police have done their jobs!!
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Legend [18069]
TigerPulse: 100%
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Joined: 7/7/03
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You serious Clark?
Oct 4, 2010, 9:33 PM
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No smoking in the stands keeps you away?
Wow, just wow.
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Letterman [266]
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Agreed, sad state of affairs there.***
Oct 4, 2010, 9:39 PM
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Rock Defender [54]
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Have to draw the line somewhere!!
Oct 4, 2010, 9:53 PM
[ in reply to You serious Clark? ] |
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That and I work Saturdays. 
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Orange Blooded [2073]
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CU Guru [1636]
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Joined: 8/21/01
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There was no problem smoking vs FSU
Oct 5, 2010, 10:57 AM
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My friend and I had separate tickets to that game last year, so we decided to sit at the top of Death Valley, yes, the very top, in the clouds, LOL. My friend is a heavy smoker, me, I smoke moderately. The only time I really ever crave a cigarette is when I first get up in the mornings. There is nothing that wakes me up faster than a cig, and a strong cup of coffee. I had not smoked in ten years, until last year during the GT game, when we went down 24-0. I was unable to attend that game due to a work training trip. There was a gamecock on the trip with my group, and he asked if I needed a cig, and I took him up on it. Wish I hadn't of, because now I haven't quit since. But to be truthful, I really only smoke about two or three a day, believe it or not. One when I wake up in the morning, one after lunch, and one after dinner. Anyway, enough of the ramble, the point is, I smoke a little more on game days at Clemson. If you are at the top of Death Valley, for those that have never been up there, you may not realize how much room there is between the last row of seats and the top wall. There were numerous people at the top last year smoking, drinking, etc, and it was done with ease.
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