»
Topic: Dabo vs. Danny
Replies: 35   Last Post: May 16, 2019 7:56 PM by: Aikitiger
[ Tiger Boards - Football ]
Start New Topic
Replies: 35  

Dabo vs. Danny

[8]
Posted: May 15, 2019 10:03 AM
    Reply

I grew up hearing about the exploits of Danny Ford's Tigers with tones of hushed reverence and remember thinking that I'd never get to witness an era of Clemson Football that great again. After winning his 2nd National Title, I think even the biggest Danny fan will admit Dabo is the greatest HC In Clemson history now, but I wanted to see how the two really stacked up.

Dabo is entering his 11th full season at Clemson, Danny coached 11. Obviously the ACC and CFB landscape are completely different now than they were in the 1980s as well so it's perhaps not an apples-to-apples comparison but I thought it'd be an interesting exercise to compare on some arbitrary criteria. These stats include interim-coached games.

Danny Ford
Overall Record: 96-29-4 (.744)
ACC Record: 56-16-1 (.767)
Bowl Record: 6-2 (.750)
National Titles: 1
ACC Titles: 6 (includes 1983 when we finished first in ACC but were on probation)
Top 25 Finishes: 8 (Including the 1978 season)
Top 10 Finishes: 4 (Including the 1978 season)
Record vs. Top 25 Teams*: 20-12-1 (.606)
Record vs. Top 10 Teams*: 5-4 (.556)
Record vs. USuCk: 7-3-1 (.636)
Head Coaching Tree: Jimmye Laycock, Chuck Reedy, Rick Stockstill, Tommy West

Dabo Swinney
Overall Record: 116-30 (.795)
ACC Record: 69-16 (.812)
Bowl Record: 9-5 (.643)
National Titles: 2
ACC Titles: 5
Top 25 Finishes: 9
Top 10 Finishes: 6
Record vs. Top 25 Teams*: 28-18 (.609)
Record vs. Top 10 Teams*: 14-6 (.700)
Record vs. USuCk: 6-5 (.545)
Head Coaching Tree: Chad Morris, Billy Napier

*Teams ranked at the time of the game

Some interesting takeaways: Danny has a better bowl record and obviously had a better record vs. USuCk. Dabo's record vs. ranked teams, especially top 10 teams is pretty staggering. In terms of coaching trees, right now it's a wash, but you have to assume Dabo's will ad Venables, Elliott, and Scott at some point in the (hopefully distant) future.

2019 white level member

Re: Dabo vs. Danny

[8]
Posted: May 15, 2019 10:09 AM
    Reply

If you include interim, Dabo is 6-5 against SC...

But yes, it would have been interesting to see what Danny would have done in the 90s at Clemson. I think the ACC would have greatly benefited from the Danny vs Bobby battles that would have been epic... but it wasnt meant to be. Danny won the first one... which is always the hardest, Dabo has taken us farther than we have ever dreamed. We dont have to compare them.. just be thankful they both came along when they did.


Good catch--fixed.***

[1]
Posted: May 15, 2019 10:09 AM
    Reply



2019 white level member

You also forgot another stat!


Posted: May 16, 2019 7:56 PM
    Reply

Danny has the stronger handshake grip. Night and day.


Dabo is 6-5 versus UofSC


Posted: May 15, 2019 10:10 AM
    Reply

As an interim in 2008, he beat the Coots. And has won the last 5 making him 6-5 versus the Coots versus 5-5.

But great analysis! Think Dabo is the greatest based on 2 national titles in a time when it's harder to win one.


Re: Dabo vs. Danny

[1]
Posted: May 15, 2019 10:19 AM
    Reply

That's like..

Michael Jordan(Dabo) vs Kevin McHale(Danny)

2019 white level member

Re: Dabo vs. Danny

[1]
Posted: May 15, 2019 10:19 AM
    Reply

Danny might have a better record against the coots, but in the end I think Dabo will have a better percentage. Also, the character of the two coaches is like night and day. We are much better today than when Danny was coaching.

2019 orange level memberbadge-donor-05yr.jpg

I love the Data and have always been a Huge Danny Fan!

[1]
Posted: May 15, 2019 10:30 AM
    Reply

There is absolutely no comparison between the total Positive impact Danny had on our University and the total Positive Impact Dabo has made.

Love and do Respect Danny. To date, Dabo has had the single biggest impact on Clemson university athletics of anyone that I can think of.

2019 orange level memberbadge-donor-15yr.jpg


Completely agree. Nothing against Ford but what

[1]
Posted: May 15, 2019 12:17 PM
    Reply

Dabo has created is really unprecedented. Both are (or will be) Clemson legends but it’s the intangibles of Dabo that will make him a College Football legend.

null


Re: Completely agree. Nothing against Ford but what

[1]
Posted: May 16, 2019 10:45 AM
    Reply

Absolutely, I loved Danny Ford, and I still love Danny Ford, and I wish that he would have gotten the chance to stay at Clemson much longer than he did. I believe that Danny was a coach that could have won another NC at Clemson but, Dabo is the #1 all time HC IMO!!!

2019 white level memberbadge-donor-10yr.jpg

A little Perspective From One Who Lived Lived In The DF Era.

[8]
Posted: May 15, 2019 10:33 AM
    Reply

While Dabo's record speaks for itself and he's a good man, husband and father the Danny Ford ERA was very different.

Back then, Clemson was a "nobody" as far as the national stage was concerned. Before Charley Pell was hired, you had to have special love to support Clemson Football. We were terrible! This was before the Upper Decks were added. under Pell, Clemson Football took off on almost a vertical trajectory. This was when Steve Fuller, Jerry Butler, Dwight Clark just to name a few broke out. In 1978, we were gaining attention. The 1978 Clemson vs Maryland game for the ACC Tile IMO is still one of the greatest ACC games ever played......We Win and Pell takes the Florida Job leaving Danny Ford as the interim. He beats Woody Hayes and gets the Job. Of course we were still gut-punched over the Pell departarture. Ford did "ok" and in 1980 probably would have been fired had he not beat South Carolina in the first game where he broke out the Orange Pants for the first time. In 1981 nobody expected what happened. We were still a regional team where the fan base thought higher of itself than the rest of the nation. Beating UGA and Herschel Walker raised some eyebrows. Going down into the final week, Pittsburg was #1 with Dan Marino and had Penn State not beat them soundly we may not have had the chance to compete for the national title because of the way the bowl contracts were done. Playing for the National Title for the first time is an experience that can't be replicated. It was special, crazy, and all of the other adjective you can think of. The Orange Bowl had the highest ever ticket demand they ever had and that was probably the beginning of Clemson's reputation for traveling well...

Dabo's story is special and amazing. Both were interim coaches probably not expected to keep their jobs. The Danny Ford era was much more a David Vs Goliath story.

UPDATE: 1978 Clemson VS Maryland Game
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oe6zztnMM4s

2019 orange level memberbadge-donor-05yr.jpg

The Artist Formerly Known as "The FIGHTINGDABOS"


In 1977 Clemson made its first Bowl game since the 1950's

[2]
Posted: May 15, 2019 10:49 AM
    Reply

it was a LOOOOONG, terrible era for Clemson football.

5 years later it won the National Championship.


Go from no bowl game in 2 decades to a Natty in the span of one redshirt college player's career.
That's amazing stuff.

badge-donor-05yr.jpg

Re: A little Perspective From One Who Lived Lived In The DF Era.


Posted: May 15, 2019 10:55 AM
    Reply

Clemson's rep for traveling well started way before the Orange Bowl. We may have not gone to many bowl games back in the day but we always traveled well to away games. I'm sure our military background helped foster fan loyalty. There was a time when Clemson fans were seen as the most loyal in the nation. That could be argued today but back then there was little to no argument. It was fact.

2019 white level memberbadge-donor-10yr.jpg

Work hard. Rock hard. Eat hard. Sleep hard. Grow big. Wear glasses if you need 'em - The Webb Wilder credo


Re: we went to this game

[1]
Posted: May 15, 2019 11:30 AM
    Reply

it was one of the best ones I ever saw. I have searched in vain for a full copy and sadly cant find one. It had ever kind of play and was well played by both teams. Tix were my birthday present and had tto be bought from Md as Clemson sold their allotment

badge-donor-05yr.jpg

Re: we went to this game


Posted: May 15, 2019 12:58 PM
    Reply

Perhaps when the ACC Network launches this game will be shown. I remember the game being part of "Bonus Coverage" on ABC I believe as in those days we had 3 networks and a fuzzy PBS..No cable.

There's a full copy of this game hidden on some shelf. It would be a great one to show in its entirety. Maryland and Clemson traded leads several times and was a classic.

2019 orange level memberbadge-donor-05yr.jpg

The Artist Formerly Known as "The FIGHTINGDABOS"


Thank you for that post! Good read!***


Posted: May 15, 2019 11:39 AM
    Reply




For us old timers I noticed at the 42 second mark

[1]
Posted: May 15, 2019 11:48 AM
    Reply

Col Robbins catching the return of the football and pitching it to the punter. For you youngsters Col Robbins was an Army ROTC instructor in the 1960s and did a staff study creating the position of Academic Advisor for the Athletic Department. This evolved into Vickery Hall. He also functioned as the unofficial Track and Cross Country assistant coach. He told me one time I was so slow he didn't need a stop watch, he needed a calendar to time me.

military_donation.jpg

Re: A little Perspective From One Who Lived Lived In The DF Era.


Posted: May 16, 2019 12:44 PM
    Reply

One correction in your narrative ; Danny was named head coach before we went to the Gator Bowl.

Something like 45 players went to the AD office and said they wanted DF for HC .

Frank Howard said Danny should be the one .

He was never an interim coach .

2019 purple level memberbadge-donor-05yr.jpg

Re: Dabo vs. Danny

[3]
Posted: May 15, 2019 10:37 AM
    Reply

I just think it's awesome that we have National Championship coaches to compare.

2019 white level memberbadge-donor-10yr.jpg

Coaching Tree?


Posted: May 15, 2019 10:58 AM
    Reply

Would BV be considered a branch under Bill Snyder, Bob Stoops or Dabo's Coaching Tree?
our would they just consider him a branch under all three?


He’s his own tree. Transplanted. ***

[1]
Posted: May 16, 2019 12:28 PM
    Reply



2019 orange level memberbadge-donor-10yr.jpg

Photobucket is holding my sig pic hostage. Screw them.


Re: Dabo vs. Danny

[1]
Posted: May 15, 2019 10:59 AM
    Reply

Everything that you researched seems to be ### for tat and incredibly close Coach to Coach with the exception that Danny was our DC and Dabo was our WR coach. I give Danny a Superior edge in coaching experience over Dabo at their beginning. With that said, I believe that Dabo is the most intelligent HC that we've ever had at Clemson. And I think that when looking at the steps and progress that Dabo has made as soon as he got his feet planted firmly into the plans he had for building and keeping Clemson at the top with the Elite's without any signs that our program is about to take a dip in performance on or off the field in every category that is required to remain at the top. IMO, Dabo is and has been for a few years the best HC to ever walk on the field in Clemson Death Valley. And the best is yet to come for our FB program, and I believe that Dabo has run the Cleanest FB program ever at Clemson University.

2019 white level memberbadge-donor-10yr.jpg

Coach Ford was not DC, Mickey Andrews was. Coach Ford

[2]
Posted: May 15, 2019 11:08 AM
    Reply

was OL coach. When Charley Pell bolted literally in the middle of the night, after telling Jim Phillips he wasn't interested in the Florida job, the players got together and told admin they wanted Danny Ford as HC. The rest is history.


Re: Coach Ford was not DC, Mickey Andrews was. Coach Ford


Posted: May 16, 2019 12:54 PM
    Reply

Yes Danny was an OL coach but I believe his title was Associate Head Coach .

No big deal on the correction and I may be wrong .

2019 purple level memberbadge-donor-05yr.jpg

Re: Dabo vs. Danny

[1]
Posted: May 15, 2019 11:01 AM
    Reply

Dont know how much differnece it would make with W/L vs ranked teams, but AP used to only rank top 20 until expanding to top 25 in 1989.


Re: Dabo vs. Danny


Posted: May 15, 2019 11:01 AM
    Reply

Dont know how much difference it would make with W/L vs ranked teams, but AP used to only rank top 20 until expanding to top 25 in 1989.


I was there for the back end of Danny's career

[2]
Posted: May 15, 2019 11:31 AM
    Reply

and the style and times were very different. Danny was cut from the SEC mold, and we basically out-SEC'd the SEC. Tough, nasty defenses and grinding option offenses. That shortened the games considerably and tended to make them closer as well. My friends and I used to joke that Danny's perfect game would be 28-0. We got the ball twice for 2 15-minute drives in a half, and the opposition got the ball once for a 3 and out each half. Dabo's high flying offense makes for much more comfortable games. We had quite a few high-stress last drive wins under Ford.

As far as ambassadorship Dabo has truly made us a national brand. Ford had a great down home public persona, but Dabo has gone out and pushed Clemson nationally much more i think. The playoffs have had a HUGE impact as well. Someone asked Ford just a few years ago if he thought Clemson could ever win a NC again, and he said "No, it's just too hard" I don't think he meant talent or facilities wise, because he knew the fan base we have, but the "Blue Blood Bias" was just too strong. OSU, OU, Nebraska, USC (the real one), Bama...all those guys were ALWAYS going to get they hype, the pre-season jump start in the rankings, and the benefit of the doubt. Thank goodness we can prove it ON THE FIELD today. We have crashed the party and it's our party now.


Excellent take. My fandom goes back to '75 so I remember

[2]
Posted: May 15, 2019 11:49 AM
    Reply

well coach Ford getting the job and his entire time at Clemson. I went to his camps and have talked to him on several occasions. Comparing Dabo and Danny is apples and oranges only in the sense of how much college football has changed. But the point you make about Clemson out-SECing the SEC is a great one. That's exactly what coach Ford did because that's where he came from, and the rest of the ACC was butthurt as #### about it. Coach Ford was loved, admired, and especially respected by almost everyone, unless they were and opposing coach or fan, or an idiot cut-your-nose-off-to-spite-your-face university president (say 'Hey' Max Lennon) and he was a master motivator and recruiter. No question FSU would never have dominated the '90s if coach Ford hadn't been forced out. His '90 team would probably have won the NC.


Yep. We were so loaded in 89-90-91

[1]
Posted: May 15, 2019 12:06 PM
    Reply

it was insane. I remember reading about Hatfield's first recruiting class and how the star of the class was a kicker. I thought...that doesn't sound too good. Now, he was pretty good kicker, Gardocki I think, but still, a kicker is your class gem? Hahahaha.


On second thought, maybe it was Nelson Welch***

[1]
Posted: May 15, 2019 12:07 PM
    Reply




Yeah, it was Welch. Gardocki was recruited by coach Ford.

[1]
Posted: May 15, 2019 12:15 PM
    Reply

We always had great kickers under DF.


Re: Excellent take. My fandom goes back to '75 so I remember


Posted: May 16, 2019 1:09 PM
    Reply

As for your "Max Lennon" comment: That is on Ford 100%.

Ford made the cardinal sin of thinking football was bigger than the University and then had the lack of awareness to drop some items(like the dorm... at least stop going behind admin to boosters to also air his laundry). I support football but the University comes first. Ford was a champion for football but he could not understand to let it drop and focus on what he could contribute to as the HC. Think about what would have happened if he just waited a few years for admin to cycle through.

That being said, the gap between Clemson and FSU would not have been as much... but Bowden's monster would have dominated none the less and keep in mind that Bowden was doing all of this while Spurrier was at Florida, and Miami was still cheating.


Re: Dabo vs. Danny

[1]
Posted: May 15, 2019 12:57 PM
    Reply

They play more games now than then


NO!


Posted: May 16, 2019 12:21 PM
    Reply

You can't compare a man like Danny who won with what he had to a man like Dabo who gets what he wants. I'm not saying Danny is better or ignoring that Dabo earned the right to draft players nor am I dismissing the tremendous efforts Dabo puts into recruiting.

It's just apples to oranges and any comparison of the two is suspected of being dismissive to one or the other. Imo, that's something we don't need or want. It's not my intent to argues this for nothing anyone can say will change my opinion of either of our NC winning coaches.

Although a loaf bread only cost 9 cents during the depression doesn't mean it was less precious then than it now at ~$3,00 a loaf. People were starving back then, body fat was a measure of wealth.


Message was edited by: ClemsonTiger1988®


2019 orange level memberbadge-donor-05yr.jpg

Re: Dabo vs. Danny


Posted: May 16, 2019 12:49 PM
    Reply

NCAA Sanctions for Recruiting Violations: Danny 1 - Dabo 0.


Danny coached during a time when UGA was relevant

[2]
Posted: May 16, 2019 3:55 PM
    Reply

Dabo hasn't.

2019 white level memberbadge-donor-05yr.jpg

Replies: 35  
[ Tiger Boards - Football ]
Start New Topic
1865 people have read this post