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Topic: Whether u love coach B or hate him, I have a question...
Replies: 35   Last Post: Feb 18, 2019 11:13 PM by: ClemsonGville
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Whether u love coach B or hate him, I have a question...

[17]
Posted: Feb 16, 2019 9:57 PM
 

Is it fair that EVERY SINGLE CLEMSON LOSS over the last several years seems to spark the debate that we should “fire brad”? This is just lunacy. Have we had bad losses? Oh yea. But, sometimes things just don’t go your way. As we have seen many times this year... heck, this month... sometimes the ball just doesn’t bounce in your favor.

If 2 shots at the buzzer clanked off the rim instead of going thru, we’d be talking about another contract extension. But here we sit.

I just think it’s crazy that EVERY loss sparks the same debate. And in baseball, the same guys, after every loss we get the “maybe monte won’t get us over the hump” posts.

It just gets old. Support our teams and our coaches until they give you a reason NOT to support them. I can guarantee you Brownell is doing everything he can right now to formulate a plan to right the ship against FSU. We should do our part to support the team.

Anyways, go tigers!


Message was edited by: easleytigr®


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Re: Whether u love coach B or hate him, I have a question...

[1]
Posted: Feb 16, 2019 10:00 PM
 

preach on, brother.. preach on. well said.

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Re: Whether u love coach B or hate him, I have a question...

[2]
Posted: Feb 16, 2019 10:07 PM
 

I think much of it comes from that we rarely make the tournament, so people see that brewing again. It's about the big picture. A single game is just a microcosm of so many failed seasons under his tenure. I see the talent getting better and I see potential, but it's always tournament or bust.

2019 white level member

well, that’s what’s weird...


Posted: Feb 16, 2019 10:12 PM
 

I am 32 years old, and in my life, we have been to the tourney 10 total times. 10 in 32 years. 2 of those have been under Brownell. So “tournament or bust” hasn’t been our forte much. Don’t take that as I don’t wanna go to the tourney, but it’s just so hard at this place.

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Its so "fgf-ish" for these "fans" to come on Tnet

[7]
Posted: Feb 16, 2019 10:49 PM
 

after each basketball loss and start screaming for Coach Brownell's job.....and the truly hypocritical aspect of their behavior is that they were NO WHERE TO BE FOUND during Clemson's 4 game ACC winning streak ......I mean, if Brownell's a bad coach, he's a bad coach during the victories as well...Right??

And if I NEVER have to read yet another pre-pubescent comparison of Coach Brownell and ex-football coach Tommy Bowden, it'll probably lengthen my mental stability for several years. I can only imagine its a 13 year old making all those idiotic "Brownell = Bowden" posts.....and evidence the football-centric fan base at Clemson generall doesn't have a good grasp on the finer points of playing D 1 hoops and aren't old enough to have a grip on Clemson basketball history---such as it is

A lot of the offenders are just chicken trolls stirring up dust and manure, but some of these posters may be misguided Tiger fans who think acting like the maroons on fgf is the way ALL posters should act and think and over-react.

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What’s FGF-ish about this

[1]
Posted: Feb 17, 2019 8:26 AM
 

Is the continued acceptance of mediocrity.

It’s gamecock like to continue to find moral victories in close losses. It’s why their football team is mediocre at best. They accept it and they justify it by crowing about losing by 21 points to us because they had a lot of yards.

I feel like that’s where we are with Basketball. We have all kinds of excuses throughout Brownell’s tenure
- ACC
- Who else are we going to get
- team is just unlucky
- we are young
- Refs

At some point the fans just need to decide if we don’t care that much about basketball and we’re fine with mediocre teams and results because we have a good guy to coach the team. or are we going to hold the basketball team to the same standard as the football team. I can assure you if the football team were producing at this level there would be a change in coaching.

I’m not suggesting which route fans personally take, but to compare fans that expect results to gamecock fans just isn’t accurate. UofSC is what it is because they are okay with being just okay and I don’t think its wrong for fans to have some higher aspirations than what our Basketball team has achieved.


I agree with your post 100%.


Posted: Feb 17, 2019 3:02 PM
 

I wasn’t going to post on CBB again but this is spot on assessment. Back to my cubby hole.

2019 purple level member

the Bowden thing comes from underachieving,the


Posted: Feb 17, 2019 9:06 AM
 

difference is Bowden had enough talent to win a NC, BB quite the opposite


Re: well, that’s what’s weird...

[1]
Posted: Feb 16, 2019 10:50 PM
 

For Brad it is. Yeah I was around for different years before you. I was around good years. Before Brad came to Clemson, we went to the tournament 6 out of 11 years with Barnes and OP. Barnes went to the tournament 3 out of 4 years. OP went to the tournament his last 3 years in a row.. Brad went to the tournament his first year with OP's players. So that means we went 7 out of 12 years for him to start off. After this season, Brad will have gone to 1 tournament in 8 years since then. Next year will likely be 1 tournament in the last 9 years for Brad. I like Brad and I don't want him fired, but we were going to the tournament before him. That's why people are frustrated.

2019 white level member

Tourney wins by Pernell... zero, by Brownell...three!***


Posted: Feb 17, 2019 7:12 AM
 



2019 white level member

Re: Tourney wins by Pernell... zero, by Brownell...three!***


Posted: Feb 17, 2019 7:15 AM
 

Neat, but he doesn't go enough. That means too many bad seasons as a whole.

2019 white level member

I don't disagree, Carlsbad. Just tired of the love for Purnell


Posted: Feb 18, 2019 11:08 AM
 

when he never won a single NCAA tourney game!

2019 white level member

Re: well, that’s what’s weird...


Posted: Feb 16, 2019 11:10 PM
 

We have gone 12 times. Moreover, right before Brad we went quite often.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clemson_Tigers_men%27s_basketball

2019 white level member

and that was with a coach with chronic halitosis.***

[1]
Posted: Feb 16, 2019 11:14 PM
 



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Re: and that was with a coach with chronic halitosis.***


Posted: Feb 16, 2019 11:17 PM
 

That's probably why his players generally played so well. They were avoiding getting yelled at at all costs.

2019 white level member

Re: and that was with a coach with chronic halitosis.***


Posted: Feb 17, 2019 3:07 PM
 

Purnell meet ORBIT and you should next leave home without it.

Met him once BRIEFLY and didn’t notice his bad breath.

2019 purple level member

It's like carbon monoxide


Posted: Feb 17, 2019 5:51 PM
 

you sometimes can't smell it, but it's slowly killing you.

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Yup***


Posted: Feb 17, 2019 3:11 PM
 




Having that debate after every loss is a little over the top

[2]
Posted: Feb 16, 2019 11:19 PM
 

but I think it's fair and understandable for a fan base to be having that conversation after 9 years and less than stellar results.

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Re: Having that debate after every loss is a little over the top


Posted: Feb 16, 2019 11:29 PM
 

Yeah 9 years. I had to adjust my numbers.

2019 white level member

I think Clemson is one of the toughest jobs in

[4]
Posted: Feb 16, 2019 11:34 PM
 

the country. Two years ago I thought Brad had run his course, but understood giving him the last chance with the improved facilities. Last years run and the optimism with the 4 seniors all deciding to return this year had me hoping that maybe this was the time a real foundation for sustained success could be built. Sadly, this team has underachieved, much like JB's senior year, with high expectations. Next year will be a clear rebuild.

2 years ago I thought the best thing for all involved would be for Brad to seek another job. He'd get one, all our ex-coaches do. I just don't think a major rebuild in year 9 is good for us, or Brad, off such a disappointing season. Sometimes things just run there course. I think we're there barring a major run these last 6 games. It could happen. He hasn't lost the team as they're still busting their behinds. 2 straight tourneys makes a rebuild under the same coach at Clemson acceptable. But unless that happens, all the talk next year will be about his job again, and it's likely to be a struggle on the court.

With a new coach that's OK. Off 2 straight tourneys with Brad that's OK. But if the under achieving continues, it will not be pretty next year with Brad as coach


Unfortunately, Brownell has to own everything about the pro


Posted: Feb 17, 2019 12:48 AM
 

because he has been on the job 8 years... Unfortunately, the program is not better off because he has not achieved the same level of success of his predecessors except Shyatt. The goal of any coach hire is to maintain and improve; Brownell has not even maintained. My assessment is based off his tenure, not just a single loss.
All of the good, bad and ugly belongs to Brownell... unfortunately, there is more bad and ugly than good in his tenure...


Message was edited by: Knuck®


2019 white level member

If football & basketball have shown us anything -

[2]
Posted: Feb 17, 2019 2:03 AM
 

- (not just CU football but successful basketball programs nationwide) - it's that stability in the coaching area is a huge key to ongoing success. Players/recruits need to believe coaches are not about to get canned every 2 or 3 years.

In some cases, coaches have lost the desire to keep up the pace. That's not the situation with Brad.

Another point is - it's never been in doubt that, so far, CU has never been a "basketball school." A few good runs here & there, but not a Duke, UNC, Kansas, Kentucky, etc. Clemson's a football school first - just like Duke's a basketball school first.

That can change & maybe CU CAN become a football AND basketball school. The best way to achieve that is sticking with a dedicated coach. If Brad can reach the Final Four, Nat'l Champ Game or even win one at some point - he won't be leaving for another job. He'll stay like Dabo & keep building.

Maybe a bigger question is - fire Brad & get whom? If using a football example, was GaTech or Louisville able to snag Urban, Dabo, Saban, Jimbo, etc.? Not even close. And if CU fires Brad B. - it's not going to snag Roy W., Coach K. & doubtful Barnes would come back for less than $100-million. Even then, would he stay? Of course not.

Best plan is to get behind Brad, let him stay & build it - then we'll have something with consistency.

2019 orange level member


Re: Whether u love coach B or hate him, I have a question...


Posted: Feb 17, 2019 8:16 AM
 

No, it's not fair, but is it fair to keep watching a team that plays well for 39 minutes, but seems to forget it's a 40-minute game?
How many of these last second loses does it take? We have lost 6 road games this year, and 3 of those have come in the last minute.
You talk about shots at the buzzer clinking off the rim:
How about talking about missing 4 consecutive free throws, or a missed layup, or letting an opposing guard drive to the basket for a last-second winning lay-up?
That is where your debate should lay?
Sure teams lose games, but name me one ACC team that loses games like we do.
You say sometimes the ball doesn't bounce your way. Well, sometimes it does.
The problem is the good teams get the ball bouncing their way a lot more than the mediocre teams do.


Ok I’ll answer your questions with this...


Posted: Feb 17, 2019 9:23 AM
 

Missed free throws at the end of the game...
do you not think Brownell works on free throws and pressure situations in practice?

A missed layup...
don’t you think we should know how to make layups at this level of basketball?

Losing on a last second layup...
tell me when this has happened?

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You're missing the big picture.***


Posted: Feb 17, 2019 3:13 PM
 




The snakebit deal ("If 2 shots at the buzzer clanked off..")


Posted: Feb 17, 2019 3:11 PM
 

has reared it's ugly head for most all of 9 years.

I agree, we should all support Brad. No doubt. We shouldn't be childish and come on this public forum bashing him and demanding for him to be fired everyday. However, 9 years is enough. If he cannot overcome the "snakebit" issue THIS year and make the tournament, then it is time to make a change. Period.

We can support Brad Brownell and at the same time also realize THIS season is enough to make the call. Make the tournament and another year is warranted. Do not make the tournament, then another year is not warranted. That would be basically insanity, i.e., doing the same thing over and over but expecting different results.

Agreed?


To extend your "insanity" line of thinking...


Posted: Feb 17, 2019 3:42 PM
 

If Clemson does decide to fire Brad, it is insane for Clemson basketball to continue to approach basketball the way it always has, hoping that an unproven coach at the major college basketball level will be successful at Clemson and want to stay for the long term. We have to figure out why it is hard to attract great coaches, much less keep them happy. If we can't fix those issues, I'd rather keep Brad and hope he continues to improve.

2019 white level member

We aren't firing him and you know that


Posted: Feb 17, 2019 8:08 PM
 

That doesn't mean it's not time for a fresh start, especially with a huge rebuild next year and probably the next. Brad could find a good job this off season if he chose to do so. The only coach we've fired in the last 40 years was Shyatt. The rest resigned and took other jobs. I was at this point with Brad two years ago, and am here again.


I don't think that's what we've done, at all


Posted: Feb 18, 2019 7:54 AM
 

"hoping that an unproven coach at the major college basketball level will be successful at Clemson..."

I don't think that's been a repeated process, therefore, the "insane" notion is thrown out the window.


Re: To extend your "insanity" line of thinking...


Posted: Feb 18, 2019 8:06 PM
 

Agreed.

2019 white level member

I don't get it...


Posted: Feb 18, 2019 11:13 PM
 

Out of the last 5 coaches, how many fall under thus description?

"...hoping an unproven coach at the major college basketball level will be successful at Clemson"

Judge said that's what we do. You agree with that?


In the first five years of...


Posted: Feb 17, 2019 6:27 PM
 

Dabo's head coaching career he established that Clemson Football would be a respectable program.

What, you ask, does that have to do with Brownell? Not a cotdang thing, obviously.

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Exactly, because it’s a lot easier to resurrect a once respectable program.


Posted: Feb 18, 2019 8:13 PM
 

Especially when that program is the school’s priority, is coming off a top 5 recruiting class, and has the enthusiastic support of the administration and fans.

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Why do so many posters on TNet think (and say) that anyone

[3]
Posted: Feb 18, 2019 8:02 AM
 

who believes that a certain coach is not performing to their expectations and/or desires must be "hated."

It really says more about the poster than it does about the coach, or his criticizer.


In year 2 or 3, you'd have a point

[1]
Posted: Feb 18, 2019 10:30 AM
 

but by year 9, when the song has been sounding the same for several years, you no longer have a point.

I'd might buy it if this were Brownell's first head gig. But it ain't.

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