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Oculus Spirit [93668]
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Trump announced that he's giving Mexico a year to clean up..
Apr 5, 2019, 8:31 AM
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their drug and immigration problems before he shuts the border. At first and out of impulse I was upset that he didn't shut the southern border. After sleeping on the issue I realized it's coordinated with his current policy on healthcare.
Obamacare is suffering. Many Americans are not happy with Obamacare. It's popularity is dropping despite the rhetoric pumped by the MSM and the threat to go full blown gov healthcare is furthering the issue. Trump is expecting the SCOTUS to overturn their previous deliberation on Ocare. That's another discussion but it's pretty obvious that's the conservative position. Dems are not abut to cooperate with pubs on heathcare for a variety of reason. Another conversation.
If the SCOTUS overturns Obamacare the coming election will be about giving voters a choice on no care or healthcare which is administered by the federal government. Trump has established a position from which to fight the dems on healthcare and it's on his terms, those very terms on which he was elected in 2016.
He's done the same thing with border control. Slowing the heavy flow of illegals now by shutting the border would give the dems ammo for 2020 on the issue. Illegals will continue the steady flow and the crisis can only get worse. More and more voters will consider the border a problem and that an open border isn't to America's best interest.
There's a practical side to both the above issues but imo, we will not see a solution to either until after the 2020. The situation indicates that if the dems get elected and control congress we'll get open borders and national healthcare. It also suggest that if Trump is reelected and pubs get congress we'll get border security and a healthcare bill which is now administrated by the federal gov. I don't believe it but that's the way the average voter will perceive it.
I don't like the means and I've never believed the ends justifies the means but I'd like to point out, that stupid, non politician, moron America elected in 2016 is learning to play politics. Now we're really up chitcreek without a paddle.
Message was edited by: ClemsonTiger1988®
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All-In [46825]
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I hesitatantly agree on some of your points
Apr 5, 2019, 8:40 AM
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with the exception of open borders. With the exception of 1 or 2 extreme left wing people that the conservative media has latched on to, neither side wants open borders.
The difference comes in HOW to secure the boarder. Dems want more man power, higher tech. Pubs want a wall.
Also, I don't think the pubs are ready for SCOTUS to over throw Ocare because they don't have a plan in place and can't agree on one. We have seen this for years now. The only play is to get rid of ObamaCare because it has Obama's name on it. If there is a consensus on a plan from the pubs side I would like to see it.
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CU Guru [1907]
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Re: Trump announced that he's giving Mexico a year to clean up..
Apr 5, 2019, 8:53 AM
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I respectfully disagree that Trump is learning to play politics . He ran off a twitter missive, told the press without speaking with smart people first as s his chosen method of operation. Once the smart people got him alone and off his phone sanity prevailed as they talked him off a cliff.Strike 1.
Repubs controlled both House of Congress, if they HAD a healthcare plan it could have been easily voted on in his 1st 2 years. So strike 2 now.
Trump had a deal for $25 billion on border security with Congress and then turned it down because of the amnesty involved with folks we are never gonna chuck back over the border. Strike 3 .
Trump wakes up in the morning as a tabula rasa in my opinion , fills his head with nonsense on tv and fires off tantrums on twitter. Best thinbg that could happen for him is to treat him like the child he is and take away his dang phone. That alone would do wonders for him and the party.
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All-In [38514]
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I agree 100% with TigerDad.
Apr 5, 2019, 2:39 PM
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And will only add that closing the border would not have just been for immigration, it would have also been for trade. The economic impact on the US would have been massive and hurt his base the most.
He says impulsive stuff like this and has to walk it back because he doesn't think before he speaks.
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Oculus Spirit [93668]
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I've been wrong before.
Apr 5, 2019, 2:56 PM
[ in reply to Re: Trump announced that he's giving Mexico a year to clean up.. ] |
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Perhaps I give more credit to Trump than his team deserve but some of the guys around him have been riding this bull for decades. If you weigh Trump's twitter against the judges he seated on the SCOTUS, 9th Circuit and other federal seat I think you'll see he's in pretty good shape now.
Meanwhile, the dems have talked themselves into a corner with full term abortion, the GND and socialized medicine for all.
Right now all the dems can do is say 'Hate Trump,' and complain about his twitter account. Everything else they say works against the party. They are hanging on to their last thread of hope that they can somehow convince Americans that Trump colluded with Russia.
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All-In [38514]
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Appointing judges is something a president does...
Apr 5, 2019, 3:11 PM
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Not sure why Trump and his supporters believe he gets special credit for that.
And the dems being idiots probably leads to Trump's reelection, but it doesn't make him smart or a good president.
Still amazed that any sane, logical person can't see that the emperor is not wearing clothes.
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Oculus Spirit [93668]
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Yeah, Obama seated some real pearls.
Apr 5, 2019, 7:45 PM
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Trump has seated conservative constitutional fundamentalist. I wouldn't expect most of the people here to appreciate how much law has been legislated from the SCOTUS bench in the last 40 years.
There is a window of extreme political views. That window has shifted to the left for over 100 years. At times in the past our government rode the conservative limit and at times the liberal limit according to which party had the executive and legislative branch. The judicial has move much slower but just as surely to the left.
That shifting of the window in the judicial has stopped or moved to the right for the minute and it may be a while before it moves left again.
Maybe you don't like it. I understand, I have like it for a long time but I'm loving the constitutionalist judges Trump has seated. Mitch says the senate has time for to do more.
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All-In [47796]
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what makes you believe the SCOTUS is going to overturn
Apr 5, 2019, 9:05 AM
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obamacare?
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Heisman Winner [137949]
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He really really wants them to with all his heart?***
Apr 5, 2019, 9:07 AM
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Oculus Spirit [93668]
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According to what I've read Ocare was challenged...
Apr 5, 2019, 11:53 AM
[ in reply to what makes you believe the SCOTUS is going to overturn ] |
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and deemed constitutional saying the mandate to fund it, what we'd been calling a fine, was really a tax and the gov had the right to tax. When the mandate was removed Ocare, by reason, became unconstitutional.
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All-In [49046]
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It was challenged because of the mandate
Apr 5, 2019, 11:59 AM
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The mandate was found to be constitutional under the taxation power. I'm not clear that that translates to it was found constitutional because of the mandate.
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Oculus Spirit [93668]
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OK, I suck at details.
Apr 5, 2019, 12:18 PM
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IN the end the mandate which supported Ocare is gone and there's a couple new kids on SCOTUS who may kick their votes toward Trump's side.
If I mistakenly presented 'it,' as the mandate, I apologize. It was an error in composition not an intend to deceive. 'It,' is Obamacare.
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Orange Blooded [3389]
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Oculus Spirit [81061]
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My SIl is not happy with it.
Apr 5, 2019, 2:51 PM
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She had to get it last year for a bit to cover her and her son.
She got taxed on that and has to pay $8500 in taxes because of it. The penalty wouldn't have been half as much.
I hate she has to pay, but at least she understands it now.
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Standout [345]
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Re: Trump announced that he's giving Mexico a year to clean up..
Apr 5, 2019, 9:49 AM
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They failed to remove the ACA despite controlling all three branches of government for multiple years and have been chipping away at it ever since to try and make it implode and make it is unappealing as possible. The problem is that even if the ACA itself is polling less popular people consistently change their minds as soon as they are told protections for preexisting conditions will no longer be in place or children will no longer be guaranteed to be able to stay on parent’s insurance until 25.
In the end that is a major problem for the administration. Any mainstream support for killing this entails people either being ignorant of what the ACA actually does or people having enough faith in our government to go ahead and kill it now and trust them to put a replacement in place that keeps all the things people like. Well, you are going to #### off the first group once they figure out what happened and the second group is living in a fairy tale (at least in the current climate)
The admin and Pubs in congress need an actual replacement plan they agree on before they won’t end up taking a beating over this and at the moment they can’t even agree on basic ideas within the party. Without a coherent plan it isn’t going to get much traction outside of Trumps normal supporters.
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Oculus Spirit [93668]
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I didn't say the administration would kill Ocare.
Apr 5, 2019, 12:12 PM
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I said that's another conversation so I'll address those reference to my post which were your additions no further.
Trump indeed killed the mandate with. I think it was a exe order. That's why the Texas fed judge found Obamacare unconstitutional. It's going to be appealed to the SCOTUS who found Ocare constitutional because the mandate funded it. Now they won't have that excuse and the lower courts have explored the consideration.
Having Ocare stopped in a major benefit to Trump. He has a healthcare plan which he has not and will not reveal until the primaries decide a dem candidate. Right now all of them are running on gov controlled healthcare. Many consider that a dangerous step toward socialism since it fits the definition perfectly.
He hasn't revealed it yet because it gives the dems a chance to spend the next two years pounding on it and get it mixed in the confusion of 20+ candidates running for the nomination.
If what he unveils after the primary is reasonable the people who like Ocare will be much more likely to back him since their Ocare is dead. Yes, I believe the POTUS is expecting the SCOTUS to kill Ocare when they meet next. From this summer until dems take over the Whitehouse is a long time to go without healthcare.
I know it's a cold view of the practical way to get a decent healthcare bill passed and a cheap cold hearted way to win an election but we're talking about Trump.
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Heisman Winner [111617]
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Re: Trump announced that he's giving Mexico a year to clean up..
Apr 5, 2019, 10:02 AM
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there you go, blame the US drug Problem on Mexico. . This is supply side brilliance on display here.
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Oculus Spirit [93668]
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Where do I say Mexico was totally to blame?
Apr 5, 2019, 12:23 PM
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You're suggesting that there's a way to solve America's drug problem without slowing or nearly stopping the smuggling of drugs. Your words indicate smugglers aren't part of the problem. That's foolishness.
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CU Guru [1907]
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Re: Where do I say Mexico was totally to blame?
Apr 5, 2019, 12:47 PM
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The fallacy lies in thinking that other countries supplying drugs are the root problem. In truth it is in the demand for their products here in the USA that is the root problem. Once we get past that maybe a solution can be found, like making some things legal and enacting penalties on harder drugs that stop the distribution here on street levels. You know like mandatory life sentences for dealing? Sounds harsh but until we address our part of the problem the other is not going away. As long as there is serious money to be made on our need for drugs then you will never stop smuggling.
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Oculus Spirit [93668]
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When and where did I say supply was the problems.
Apr 5, 2019, 2:20 PM
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No one here talks about the supply/demand curve more than me. I'm a Tigerdad too. I also graduated Clemson in three years from the College of Art and Architecture with a BS in Construction science. I spent my electives on Economics. I got through several coursed including a soph course called Labor Economics.
How dare you condescend to me as if I've over looked one side of the drug problem while addressing the other!
If you want to discuss demand for dope then make your comments and I'll reply without condescending to your minor contributions to my understanding of the demand side of America's drug problem.
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CU Guru [1907]
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Re: When and where did I say supply was the problems.
Apr 5, 2019, 2:40 PM
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Panties bunch much ? Good grief old man one would think you would have grown a bit with all that education and life experiences huh? Your post only touched on the supply sides and I responded to that post, now go pee up a rope. You speak a lot on supply/demand on wages but never have I seen it on the drug issues.
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Oculus Spirit [93668]
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We haven't discussed the drug problem other than agreeing...
Apr 5, 2019, 2:48 PM
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that pot being illegal is a problem. 
Stop insulting and discuss the drug problem with me.
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CU Guru [1907]
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Re: We haven't discussed the drug problem other than agreeing...
Apr 5, 2019, 3:21 PM
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I already did in a small part but you took it VERY personally and fired off a RANT when it was an attempt to discuss that very issue.
Heroin- Make Big Pharma( ones that caused the opiod problem) pay dearly for substance abuse centers to heal the people they screwed over. In patient/out patient on their dime. That or sue them till the cows come home, take all their assets(CEO's, owners and BOD too) and fund it. Either way they gotta pay. Heroin is largely the street fix for those prescibed pills once they no longer can get them.SC alone had 4.5 million prescriptions with a population of what 6 million or so last year? Somebody needs to frigging hang over this pill pushing.
Pot- make it legal. Waste of taxpayer funding to police, jail over what is essentially a nothing burger. If we allow alcohol and cigarettes wwhich statistically are far more harmful then it is either old school thinking or dollars. Either make weed legal or get rid of those items, oh wait too much tax revenue as there is not a desire to slow those down but make money off them by the Govt.
Major importers of coke, heroin,fentanyl etc. should get the death penalty and street level dealers should get life. Want to stop the flow of drugs then do something that will actually cause them to think it over. Failing to put in major penalties for selling drugs will never stop the flow to our streets. All the dollars wasted on eradication in South America was foolish, head in the sand to the real problem of drug demand here. As long as someone can become vastly wealthy in supplying the demand there will be ways to get in on the streets.
So what are your ideas? Some may say make it all legal, if the fools want to take poison let them but supply no medical help to revive them.
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Hall of Famer [24777]
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You might want to add that our troops are guarding the
Apr 5, 2019, 6:46 PM
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opium fields in Afghanistan where the percentage of world supply has risen from ~10% to ~90% pre-invasion to present... (Golden Triangle, Colombia via Panama, Kandahar) CIA stays busy....
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Oculus Spirit [93668]
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You jacked the thread.
Apr 5, 2019, 7:35 PM
[ in reply to Re: We haven't discussed the drug problem other than agreeing... ] |
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Not that I don't love a good tangent.
I agree on big pharma paying for clinics to treat the heroin addiction but there's another culpable player. Our doctors. If doctors didn't pass out oxy and other synthetics like candy a great percentage of those who are treated by suboxone and methadone wouldn't be addicted. With some it probably wouldn't matter. The patients at those clinics are slaves.
Addicts start methadone programs by going everyday and being randomly drug tested. It takes about three months to get a 'take home,' dose of one day and will take between one and three years to get the visits cut to once per month. That's depend on how they behave. The positive is that they don't overdose though they may complicate the conditions by combining other drugs with methadone. Xanax is most popular because the methadone has a way of twisting a person real tight.
Doctors should be paying for some of the treatments and some should be in prison for over prescribing. My oldest son was addicted to lortab before he was 10. An Easley doctor misdiagnosed an ear issue which eventually lead to my son being deaf in one ear and having between 40 and 50% hearing loss. The ear canals are tiny and difficult to see with a GP's instruments. The pain of the infection was the doctor's focus. Pill passers.
I doubt stricter laws will deter drug dealers. I don't think most people here understand criminals. They don't consider what happens if they get caught, they think about how not to get caught. Perhaps legalizing all drugs is the only real solution. It's quite distasteful because some of those who wouldn't break the law, might.
Good conversation here but we still need to bear down on the cartels for their drug smuggling and human traffic and stop people from crossing out border illegally.
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Heisman Winner [111617]
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Re: Where do I say Mexico was totally to blame?
Apr 5, 2019, 4:52 PM
[ in reply to Where do I say Mexico was totally to blame? ] |
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There will be suppliers as long as there are addicts, you are playing waco-mole taking one down.. Do you not understand how the free market works?
And For trump to say the Buck stops with Mexico is typical of this administration. Not only will they not address the issue itself, instead pass off America's drug Problem onto someone else and hope that it goes away. This is sad really.
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Oculus Spirit [97727]
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Here's my beef. I'm all for single payer.
Apr 5, 2019, 10:14 AM
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Single payer, free healthcare to anyone who wants crappy VA-style government health care.
THEN, let private healthcare flourish. It will be cheaper and better because the non-payers are out of the system. I have seen how this works in Australia and it's great. Dad had emergency open heary surgery at a private hospital that was nicer than any in Columbia at the time with BETTER nursing care, we paid for it on the Amex card, got back and insurance paid the bill and learned it cost HALF as much as if he had the same thing done in SC. Australian doctor got his degree from Emory fwiw.
Problem: This will never be allowed to happen in the US.
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Legend [15749]
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Which Mexico?***
Apr 5, 2019, 2:01 PM
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Oculus Spirit [93668]
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That's a dumb question.
Apr 5, 2019, 2:21 PM
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Of course we'll crack down on all three.
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All-In [48078]
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Re: Trump announced that he's giving Mexico a year to clean up..
Apr 5, 2019, 5:57 PM
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Hilarious. More.meaningless words from Trump.
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Oculus Spirit [93668]
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That's quite a thoughtful and respectful response there.***
Apr 5, 2019, 7:46 PM
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All-In [48078]
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Re: That's quite a thoughtful and respectful response there.***
Apr 6, 2019, 8:31 AM
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Yep...what else is there to such idiotic meaningless remarks.
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110%er [6101]
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He’s giving Mexico’s AUTOMOTIVE INDUSTRY a year
Apr 5, 2019, 7:56 PM
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He’s not stupid, he’ll hit them where it hurts most.
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