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Athletic Dir [861]
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The Rivalry
Dec 1, 2012, 9:02 AM
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Our rivalry with SCar has always been one sided. We have dominated the series so much these past 20 years that I had almost stopped hating them. In the 80's it was a very good Clemson team beating up on a bad to mediocre Scar team. In the 90's it was a mediocre Clemson team beating up on a truly terrible Scar team. We beat them so consistently, for so long, my hatred had turned into pity. I didn't hate South Carolina. I pitied the fools.
But now... now a hate them with a white hot passion!!! I think that is what our program has been missing; a true rivalry between two very good teams. I think when you have that, it spurs both programs on to compete at a higher level. Look at great rivalries like Texas/Oklahoma, Notre Dame/USC, Florida/Georgia, FSU/Miami. Remember how Bobby Bowden's quest to overcome wide right ended with FSU winning multiple National Championships?
Now don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that losing to Scar is in anyway good for Clemson... but the fact that SCar is a good team is good for the rivalry. I think that the great teams over the years have always had a heated rivalry with another great team. It's like, how in racing, when one car drafts from another, though both cars want to beat the other, they are able to go faster than the rest of the field when they are racing together. For the last 4 years we have been in Scar's rear view mirror, and I hate that. But both programs have been pulling away from the rest of the pack...and I truly believe that it is only a matter of time before we slingshot around them and win another National Championship! Go Tigers!!!
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Associate AD [806]
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i disagree, SC is not large enough to support two top 10
Dec 1, 2012, 9:13 AM
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programs. Just from a recruiting standpoint, we need SC to be a doormat. Think about how good Clemson would be if we had all the athletes who went to SCar, but considered Clemson. We would be in the National Championship game this year if a few of their defensive players (Clowney for one) had chosen Clemson. No, we need Scar to be miserable, horrible, embarassing. Only then will we have the resources to build a top five program consistently.
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All-American [554]
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Re: i disagree, SC is not large enough to support two top 10
Dec 1, 2012, 9:18 AM
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Yep. If we are both above average, neither will be elite. One of us could possibly have an elite season but we cannot maintain it if both schools are good. In the 80s y'all got whoever you wanted instate and that was the only era either of us has had as a national power.
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Athletic Dir [861]
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Really good programs...
Dec 1, 2012, 9:20 AM
[ in reply to i disagree, SC is not large enough to support two top 10 ] |
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can recruit on a national scale. Illinois isn't big enough (talent wise) to support one 10 win team but Notre Dame is about to compete in the National Championship. Alabama has at times had two 10 win programs with Auburn and Alabama. Only thinking about splitting the state of South Carolina's recruits is small potatoes. If we want to become a nationally prominent program we need to think outside the box of SC.
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All-In [29036]
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All good points
Dec 1, 2012, 10:18 AM
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Except that Notre Dame isn't in Illinois. Your point is true that it recruits nationally, but it is in Indiana.
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Athletic Dir [861]
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Oops, my bad. I knew that.***
Dec 1, 2012, 1:38 PM
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CU Guru [1574]
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Re: The Rivalry
Dec 1, 2012, 9:24 AM
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Wholeheartedly agree. I gave been a Tiger fan for 50 years. Yet during that half a century, the game I most looked forward to was Georgia. In reality, Georgia is a bigger school with a bigger budget and, for the most part, better facilities. Yet it was always a competitive game. Such has not been the case with the gamecocks. The South Carolina game was viewed in much the same way the Virgina game was; we assumed we'd win those two every year. So the fact that the University of South Carolina has a quality team is good for the rivalry. Contrary to what some might say, there is plenty of talent in the state, and throughout the country, to enable both to be top 10 teams on a consistent basis. That's what I'd love to see happen. While I hate the yardbirds, I am a native South Carolinian and want our State to be well represented in every forum. We get so much negative publicity about being in the "deep South," it's nice to have that counteracted by quality football from the two most prominent Universities in the State. I'm ready to get back to beating the chickens every year, and firmly believe we're close. But I hope we'll be beating a respectable team. That will help our chances of maintaining national prominence. Go Tigers!
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Recruit [76]
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Re: The Rivalry
Dec 1, 2012, 9:34 AM
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BINGO !!!!! WILLY HAS IT !!!!! Clemson and South Carolina can both be in the top 10. Great for the State of South Carolina.
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110%er [7191]
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Re: The Rivalry
Dec 1, 2012, 9:25 AM
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You made a very compelling argument until you mentioned winning another National Championship.
How much do you really know about our program? Dabo has never mentioned winning a National Championship as his goal.
His four goals every year are to win the opener,win the division,win the conference and beat your rival.Show me anything about winning a NC.
The problem,imo,is that too many people on this site are consumed with our one NC 31 years ago.They don't realize just what it takes to play for a NC,let alone win one.They think we should be in it every year just because we are Clemson.
Our rival down the road(the one in Athens,not Columbia) has a shot at it's "second" NC if they can win 2 more games.No small matter except those two small teams are Bama ,and Notre Dame.
You can slingshot around Carolina anytime you want,but you still have to go no worse than 11-1 in the weak ACC(slingshot around that problem)and win the conference title to even be in the mix.
Try winning a NC coming off mediocre seasons like we had under Tommy Bowden.Sure he had a 7-2 record against the coots.Yea,really great when he spent some of those same years explaining how we lost to Virgina,or Maryland,or State.Get the picture?
Look our 10-2 (regular season) record this year was the best record we had since our NC,and for the most part it was a good season.However even a win over the coots would not have gotten us into the NC title game.
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Athletic Dir [861]
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Isn't that the ultimate goal?
Dec 1, 2012, 9:53 AM
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I'm am not saying we will compete for a national title every year, and yes, in order to get there right now, we would have to go undefeated. The same way we did it the last time. FSU played in a weak ACC too but the fact that they dominated them and beat every other worthy opponent too made that a non issue. I don't expect another one but if you continually have a good program it may happen. So I want to win them all! That is what I want every year.
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110%er [7191]
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Re: Isn't that the ultimate goal?
Dec 1, 2012, 3:08 PM
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Yes,the ultimate goal is the National Championship,but unless you play in the SEC,or are a Notre Dame,the real USC or the occassional Texas or Ohio State program,it is highly unlikely that you will make the NC game under the current BCS format.
My take with your initial post was this:
"...and I truly believe that it is only a matter of time before we slingshot around them and win another National Championship".
Slingshoting around a team that's best season is 10 wins and has been eliminated from it's own shot at the NC isn't going to get you to a National Championship game.
Clemson needs to focus on becoming the best team they can.They need to start scheduling better OOC opponents like UGA,but they also need to win any bowl game they appear in.
Clemson will get it shots when they end the season with a quality over the Gamecocks,but they also need to finish seasons with dominating wins against even lesser opponents.
I can almost assure you Spurrier was salavating watching our win against N.C.State.Yes,it was a win, but in the eyes of the pollesters,it was not impressive enough for a move upward in the polls,which is vital to a teams chances of competing in a BCS bowl.
Sorry if I was long,but Clemson's best chance of becoming a contender is to begin dominating it's opponents.Granted,Clemson needs to win,but they won't do it with unimpressive wins against the State's,the Turtles or the Eagles of college football.
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Athletic Dir [861]
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Our best chance is to win all of our games.
Dec 1, 2012, 6:57 PM
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I believe that goal is within reach.
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Enthusiast [108]
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Re: The Rivalry
Dec 1, 2012, 9:54 AM
[ in reply to Re: The Rivalry ] |
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I think it's good that both teams are doing very well. FL, GA, & NC produce enough talent for both teams, so neither needs to rely on in state players.
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Associate AD [810]
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Re: The Rivalry
Dec 1, 2012, 10:02 AM
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While both being a top 10 program is certainly possible - it was the case for awhile this year I think - it would be a lot easier on either program if the other did not exist. Think LSU. Louisianna is about the same size as SC population wise and they benefit from being the only BCS program in the state. If there was another legitimate football power in that state to compete for recruits then Les Miles would have to learn how to make play calls that didn't confound everyone watching.
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Enthusiast [108]
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Re: The Rivalry
Dec 1, 2012, 10:08 AM
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What about Alabama though? Also about the same population as SC and both of there teams have recently won titles (though admittedly Auburn did so in a super shady way). It would be interesting to see how good one team would be in this state without the other, but right now both teams are still pulling in top 15 recruiting classes on a yearly basis so the talent is there.
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Associate AD [810]
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Re: The Rivalry
Dec 1, 2012, 10:11 AM
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Yeah, I don't really have an explanation for Alabama except that those people in that state are crazy when it comes to college football and there is such an emphasis on winning that the two schools are forced to do whatever it takes to produce good teams. All the NCAA infractions and firing a coach 2 years removed from a national championship are just two examples.
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Walk-On [102]
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Sorry to rain on your parade , but.....
Dec 1, 2012, 1:49 PM
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In five years the ACC will not exist. Where will we be? Who knows.
Look at today's games: a sellout at scalped ticket prices for the sec, an empty stadium for the ACCcg. What a discrepancy in money. Without question eeccg will triple the ratings v. Any other game. Alabama / LSU drew 9MM viewers. Second place was Oregon/USC that day with less than 2MM viewers. There is no making up that gap. So, great recruits are not going to the ACC. Our recruiting will soon begin dropping off. Life as we know it is done. We better act quickly or we will be playing Furman et al. There will be no Rivalry with the coots. Sorry, that's reality.
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Athletic Dir [861]
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I believe this conference crap...
Dec 1, 2012, 6:54 PM
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will take care of it's self. If Clemson is a good team we will end up in a viable conference if there is a major shake up. In the meantime we will continue to recruit top 15 classes like we have for the last 3 years.
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