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Replies: 19
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Orange Blooded [4995]
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I would like to see some of these stats addressed
Dec 23, 2018, 6:23 AM
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“However, there are some statements made on the page that don’t line up with actual stats: “Too many Americans have been murdered by illegal aliens and too many illegals are taking advantage of the United States taxpayers with no means of ever contributing to our society.” Studies have repeatedly shown that immigrants—even ones that are undocumented—commit far less crime than native-born Americans.
An author of a study by the Cato Institute (a conservative think-tank founded by the Koch brothers) found “as a percentage of their respective populations, there were 56 percent fewer criminal convictions of illegal immigrants than of native-born Americans in Texas in 2015. The criminal conviction rate for legal immigrants was about 85 percent below the native-born rate.”
There has also been debate about the actual cost of illegal immigration to the American taxpayer. As Econofact explains, “Most immigrants are in their working ages and so, viewed as individuals, are average net taxpayers. Since they tend to arrive to the United States as adults, it means that the U.S. did not have to invest in their education, but will benefit from the taxes of their adult earnings.”
https://relevantmagazine.com/current/5-charities-you-can-give-money-to-this-christmas-instead-of-donating-to-build-the-border-wall/
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110%er [5508]
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All-TigerNet [12098]
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Until we allow hospitals to deny care to people
Dec 23, 2018, 7:59 AM
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that can’t pay, the uninsured are going to remain a tax burden no matter where they come from.
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Orange Blooded [2340]
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Re: I would like to see some of these stats addressed
Dec 23, 2018, 12:53 PM
[ in reply to Re: I would like to see some of these stats addressed ] |
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Not sure where that map came from, but Louisiana was a French territory up until 1803. Mexico's territory did include Texas, California, Arizona and New Mexico though.
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All-TigerNet [12098]
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All-TigerNet [13360]
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Good point
Dec 23, 2018, 7:54 AM
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Let em all in and get rid of the border!
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Oculus Spirit [97727]
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Sorry. I don't have any money to donate.
Dec 23, 2018, 8:36 AM
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An illegal immigrant took my job OR my wages have been flat for a decade+ for some reason.
But as soon as my job increases in value and my hourly wages go up I'll donate.
Sincerely,
Millions of Americans
PS. Might want to hit up upper management in my company. Their jobs have been safe for a while. They get the raises from the extra profit margins. Wealth inequality and all.
Tia
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All-In [42170]
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It's pretty sad and foolish...
Dec 23, 2018, 9:50 AM
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To donate to that border wall GoFundMe. At best, this guy is going to give the money to Congress and they'll spend it on something else. At worst, he'll pocket it. So donating to it is dumb right off the bat.
But the sad part is what you listed. There are so many other great causes people could donate to instead that actually helps others, like children in need.
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Oculus Spirit [93668]
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Ok, let start over without stats and build some which matter
Dec 23, 2018, 11:06 AM
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I'll start by asking...
How many murders of American citizens at the hands of people who are here illegally are acceptable?
How many deaths of illegals at the hands of other illegals are acceptable?
How many deaths of illegals at the hands of cartel coyotes are acceptable?
Would stopping illegals from crossing our border end any of these unnecessary deaths?
Should our goal be to accept any of the deaths or should we strive to make it impossible to cross our southern border, deter illegal immigration and thereby prevent most of these tragic deaths?
Should we tolerate the loss of precious life of any innocent?
Asking for a friend.
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Orange Blooded [4995]
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Re: Ok, let start over without stats and build some which matter
Dec 23, 2018, 12:17 PM
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I don’t think anybody is suggesting letting people flood across our borders as they please. Illegal immigration is a concern, but is it a concern worth spending billions of dollars on?
It’s telling that Trump has to use a false narrative that illegal immigrants are over here committing all the violent crimes.
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Oculus Spirit [93668]
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Hey, you started this thread wanting stats verified.
Dec 23, 2018, 1:02 PM
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I just asked some question none of which were not fair including the one suggesting how many innocent lives would be saved if we locked down the border.
Now you're ready asking if money is worth more than those innocent lives? You accused me of being without Christian compassion last week. Trump is a hyperbole queen. Anyone who entertains his hyperbole is distracted from the real problems of immigration.
As individuals, American are as smart as any one on this planet. When we gather within a political party we are the most ignorant. We begin to see things which aren't there and lose all though of what is most important. I can't believe you put a dollar value on all those lost lives.
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Orange Blooded [4995]
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Re: Hey, you started this thread wanting stats verified.
Dec 23, 2018, 1:45 PM
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No I didn’t ask for the stats to be verified....they already are. I asked for them to be addressed and they still haven’t been. Support for this border wall hinges on the false narrative that people coming into this country from Mexico are terrible people, yet a person who is born and raised in the good old USA is more likely to commit a crime....
So why is it a good idea for Americans to fork out billions to build and maintain this structure? Seems like we should focus within....
It’s kinda like the church goers who point at all the sin in the world and ignore the stuff that goes on within the congregation. Ironically it is mostly the same people who are in support of this wall.
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Oculus Spirit [93668]
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You are a subject jumper.
Dec 23, 2018, 3:41 PM
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If you find a church without people then you've found the perfect congregation. Until you do you should expect congregation inside or outside the church. I'll remind you, God loved us when we were yet sinners. There is just one difference between the lost and the saved. One group is saved.
Hop, you put a dollar value on the loss of innocent lives. I firmly believe that a wall will prevent most illegal immigration and help free the border patrol and courts to do their jobs by dealing with the rest.
So what's your plan for 'focusing within,' our borders to solve the problem with illegal immigration since it happens as soon as an illegal steps on our soil?
You can end the double talk and distraction from the subject you initiated but it's making you look petty and without substance when you fail to address issues that you bring up.
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Orange Blooded [4995]
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Re: You are a subject jumper.
Dec 23, 2018, 8:03 PM
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I’m a subject jumper but you still haven’t addressed the statistics in the OP and the false narrative that Trump has been able to push despite them.
His entire wall campaign has been built on the notion that gang members, rapists, and murderers are flooding across our border but the statistics paint a different picture.
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Oculus Spirit [93668]
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No, I didn't address those stats.
Dec 23, 2018, 10:04 PM
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Nobody believes Trump's BS. I figured while you're distracted by the BS you'd be interested in the only stat which matter, human live. Now answer, how many innocent lives has to end until you feel there's been enough to pay for a border wall. How many American citizens and how many immigrants will have to die because dems want to lay their thing down and win a political argument?
Don't hand me that '32,' ladder chit either.
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Orange Blooded [4995]
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Re: No, I didn't address those stats.
Dec 24, 2018, 9:44 AM
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“Nobody believes Trumps BS”
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110%er [7207]
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All-TigerNet [12098]
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The problem with this is that a large number of those
Dec 23, 2018, 5:00 PM
[ in reply to Ok, let start over without stats and build some which matter ] |
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risking death from all the things you listed are doing so because they genuinely feel that the risk of death is much higher if they stay where they are, so how many innocent lives will be lost if the wall is built and it somehow turns out to be effective.
If we spend all that money on the wall and the cartels, machismos, and gangs still kill innocents then all that money has been for nothing except to keep the funny talking brown people out of ‘Murica yeehaw!
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Oculus Spirit [93668]
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You don't believe that.
Dec 23, 2018, 10:08 PM
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If you did then you'd admit that Mexico is the first safest place to ask for asylum. Why do they refuse the Mexican's extension for asylum?
How about the American citizens which have been murdered by illegals? Just how many of deaths of you fellow citizens are acceptable?
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All-In [48078]
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Re: I would like to see some of these stats addressed
Dec 24, 2018, 7:02 PM
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On the other hand, people can donate for the wall if they choose, as well as donate to other charities. I don't worry about illegal immigrants, nor do I care either way about the wall, but if people want to donate money for border security I don't see anything wrong with that.
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