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All-In [48078]
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Myth about Dabo playing seniority over the better player.
Jan 2, 2018, 10:49 AM
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Why do people believe that nonsense? ETN started in the playoff. He didn't start game one because he wasn't ready. He was barely ready yesterday looking at that missed block. D Watson took over for Stoudt. Everyone will have a shot as starter next year. It's a myth about Dabo and seniority being the final decision. QB will be the same. If someone is ready they will work themselves into the starter spot. TL will start some games next year.
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CU Medallion [58415]
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Because people are dumb.***
Jan 2, 2018, 10:58 AM
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Legend [18407]
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Re: Because people are dumb.***
Jan 2, 2018, 11:00 AM
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Nah, wouldn’t call them dumb... just confused.
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CU Medallion [58415]
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That's a nice way to put it.***
Jan 2, 2018, 11:02 AM
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Legend [18407]
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Re: Myth about Dabo playing seniority over the better player.
Jan 2, 2018, 10:59 AM
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Yeah I agree. He’s far and gives everyone a chance. And as he’s explained before they have a grading system. But he is still loyal and he won’t have a knee jerk reaction if something goes south.
The only thing I can disagree with a little is you can grade based on practice but sometimes you don’t know what a kid can do until they get meaningful snaps.
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Hall of Famer [23112]
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They seem to forget DW4's broken collar bone
Jan 2, 2018, 11:00 AM
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his first spring that had him behind the 8 Ball.
TL will be here soon
ZC will be a RS Sophomore
HJ will be a Sophomore
CB will be a RS Freshman
KB will be a Seniors
The best will start.
People that have actually seen practices will tell ZC lights it up in practice, but anyone with a hal;f a brain can see he's lost(at this point) in a game. The same goes for HJ,except for 5 plays against WF,he's looked like a freshman every other time.
I've been a KB fan since the beginning, if those other guys do what we think they can, he won't be the starter. It's up to them to take it.
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Orange Blooded [2984]
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Re: Myth about Dabo playing seniority over the better player.
Jan 2, 2018, 11:01 AM
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Riddle me this:
Cole Stoudt named starter against UGA in 2014. After two series, DW4 comes in and on his first collegiate play from scrimmage, he throws a 40 yard dart for a TD and then doesn’t see the field again until the game is well out of reach. By the FSU game, it was obvious Watson was the better player but Stoudt started that game too missing a wide open TD to a TE. Watson comes in a finished the game remarakably well and then from that point starts the remainder of the season.
You cannot tell me with what Watson did his freshman season, he wasn’t ready to play game 1. That’s where the myth comes from
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All-In [48078]
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Question is answered above*****
Jan 2, 2018, 11:02 AM
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110%er [6692]
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Re: Myth about Dabo playing seniority over the better player.
Jan 2, 2018, 11:06 AM
[ in reply to Re: Myth about Dabo playing seniority over the better player. ] |
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You know the drive after DW4's 30 yard (not 40) TD that Stoudt came in and we scored another TD right, and had a 21-14 lead?
After that Gurley returned the kick and momentum swung 100% to UGA's side. In the second half they pinned their ears back on defense and even DW4 would have not won that game for us.
DW4 is the greatest QB to put on the paw, but taking that as an example of Dabo playing the seniority card is asinine.
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Orange Blooded [2984]
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Re: Myth about Dabo playing seniority over the better player.
Jan 2, 2018, 11:14 AM
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DW4 was more than capable of winning that game, as well as Stoudt. Watson wasn’t given more opportunities until the game was out of reach. He brought an addition to the game that Stoudt could not and that was the running ability.
Though that season is long gone, I’d say that if Watson starts from game 1, or at least was left in the UGA game longer and started the FSU game, we would’ve had a great chance at winning both.
I love Stoudt as a player and as a dude but it was obvious who was better.
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Team Captain [499]
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Re: Myth about Dabo playing seniority over the better player.
Jan 2, 2018, 1:06 PM
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The one thing I know I've not considered until now is who the OC/QB coach was at the time. There's a possibility that Chad was the one that limited DW4 starting.
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Legend [17612]
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Not sure asinine is applicable
Jan 3, 2018, 12:58 AM
[ in reply to Re: Myth about Dabo playing seniority over the better player. ] |
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And not sure Watson was not capable of winning a game with a hurt collar bone and limited knowledge of playbook. He beat SC with a torn ACL that season to allow Dabo to break SC streak.
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110%er [6692]
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Re: Not sure asinine is applicable
Jan 3, 2018, 11:07 AM
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The asinine comment was in reference to basing the fact that Dabo plays the seniority card because Stoudt started the UGA game.
Not sure comparing that game against UGA on the road and DW4 playing at home at the end of the season against USuCk is applicable. Completely different situations/scenarios/injuries.
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Hall of Famer [23112]
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Orange Blooded [2984]
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Re: So ,by the 3rd series of the 3rd game
Jan 2, 2018, 11:10 AM
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According to the coaches he did because he started the next game over Stoudt.
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Walk-On [149]
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Re: So ,by the 3rd series of the 3rd game
Jan 2, 2018, 3:19 PM
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Deshaun took over because Cole underthrew a wide open WR in the endzone against FSU, which led to a missed FG. Dabo let Cole have all of his chances to prove that he can play at a high level, and win games. He wasn’t able to accomplish that. Then Dabo put in the better player. Kelly just never cost Clemson any games. That’s the only reason he remained the starter.
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Legend [17612]
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KB, Dabo and TE cost Clemson the SYR game
Jan 3, 2018, 1:00 AM
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But agree that was on Dabo not KB who should not have been on field.
Message was edited by: SocMan2®
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Oculus Spirit [83127]
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Orange Blooded [2984]
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Re: TD didn't happen on his first play.***
Jan 2, 2018, 11:17 AM
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Pardon me, it was his 2nd pass attempt, a play after his first pass attempt that was a completion of 29 yards.
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CU Guru [1476]
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Orange Blooded [2984]
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Re: After Watson throws TD to Peake...
Jan 2, 2018, 11:19 AM
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EXACTLY MY POINT. He threw two 30 yard passes back to back as his first two attempts at the collegiate level and they were throws that Stoudt had never made. Don’t see how you take him out of that game.
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CU Medallion [58415]
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And it is a myth, and it's mind-bottling to think that folks
Jan 2, 2018, 11:19 AM
[ in reply to Re: Myth about Dabo playing seniority over the better player. ] |
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still believe it. There are two very, very valid and correct reasons DW did not start game one. First, he was behind the other QBs in several regards, missing most of spring practice with a broken collarbone and having to recover over the summer; so by fall camp he was already behind, both physically and certainly experience-wise. Secondly, Dabo and staff were understandably hesitant to throw a true freshman who was behind the curve into a super hostile, nationally telivised road game against UGA in the season opener. In retrospect, it's easy for armchair coaches to say what was "obvious" and what should have been done, but the fact is they really don't know squat. Contrary to what a lot of them think, loyalty to Stoudt had nothing to do with it. Confidence in Stoudt had everything to do with it, however.
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Orange Blooded [2984]
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Re: And it is a myth, and it's mind-bottling to think that folks
Jan 2, 2018, 11:22 AM
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Watson throws two 30 yard passes as his first two attempts, one to put get us in a pass TD range and the other as the TD.
Two throws that are very hard to make (over the shoulder sideline and then a dart between two defenders). That seems obvious to me that he was ready to play but yes, as you say, the fan at home doesn’t know the entire situation. I just find it very hard to believe the fact Stoudt sat behind Boyd for 4 years and wasn’t granted some edge for being a 5th year player.
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CU Medallion [58415]
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He was believed to have an edge because of experience, an
Jan 2, 2018, 11:59 AM
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edge that would give us a better chance to win. Dabo and staff may have been wrong about that, given the benefit of hindsight, but it is absurd to suggest that they risked losing games out of some sense of loyalty to a player with seniority - it's a joke.
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Orange Blooded [2984]
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Re: He was believed to have an edge because of experience, an
Jan 2, 2018, 12:37 PM
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I didn’t say the staff would rather lose than play a better you get player. You’re putting words in my mouth. I simply said he was better than Stoudt and should have seen the field more earlier.
Appreciate all the TD’s too.
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CU Medallion [58415]
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FYI, I never TD anybody. I give plenty of TU's, but if I
Jan 3, 2018, 12:33 AM
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disagree I see no point in giving a TD - I'll just tell you and state my case.
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Orange Blooded [2984]
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Re: FYI, I never TD anybody. I give plenty of TU's, but if I
Jan 3, 2018, 11:44 AM
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Ah I assumed. We all know what assuming does lolz Someone came through and TD’d all my responses and considering they were all in conversation with you, it happend to be you.
I apologize.
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CU Medallion [58415]
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No problem, my good man.***
Jan 3, 2018, 5:11 PM
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Legend [16136]
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Orange Blooded [2984]
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Re: DW did NOT throw a TD on his 1st play, quit telling fairy
Jan 2, 2018, 11:37 AM
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I corrected myself in a later comment. He made two 30 yard passes as his his first two attempts in college. One of which was an over the shoulder pads and the other a TD to Peake between two defenders.
Not just any QB can make those passes, especially a true freshman. He was ready to go in game 1 and should have played more.
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All-TigerNet [13038]
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He played two more series in that game - both 3 and outs.
Jan 3, 2018, 12:50 AM
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One incomplete pass and two sacks on those 6 plays.
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Legend [15914]
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Orange Blooded [2984]
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Re: And the tall tale begins.. he led a full drive bro.
Jan 3, 2018, 11:45 AM
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I corrected my self in an earlier response. It was his 2nd pass attempt, 4th play of his career I believe
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1st Rounder [632]
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Re: Myth about Dabo playing seniority over the better player.
Jan 2, 2018, 11:04 AM
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If someone else besides KB2 doesn’t start at qb next year. We have either more bad qbs on the bench or idiot coaching. Which is it?
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All-In [48078]
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KB may start game 1 while we work TL in slowly, but...
Jan 2, 2018, 11:34 AM
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TL will be the starter within a few weeks. TL will play plenty in game 1 though. TL will be the starter within a few games though.
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110%er [7555]
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Re: Myth about Dabo playing seniority over the better player.
Jan 2, 2018, 11:04 AM
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we shall see...........if it is myth or fact.........next season will be the real test if there is a seniority rule.....Go Tigers!!!!
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Legend [18133]
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Actually, Feaster started.
Jan 2, 2018, 11:12 AM
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But I agree with your point.
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110%er [6075]
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You forgot to mention Howard starting at RB***
Jan 2, 2018, 11:42 AM
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All-In [44050]
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It depends on how one defines "better."
Jan 2, 2018, 12:49 PM
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Is the better player the one who has the most raw ability? The one who plays best in practice? The one who knows the playbook better? The one who has game experience? The one who has been in the program the longest?
There is no doubt that the coaches play who they think gives us the best chance of winning, but that doesn't mean that they are always right. They have no reason to play an inferior player, just because he is older. However, I do feel that our coaches value time in the program and game experience more than they should at times, especially when it comes to QBs. We have seen it time and time again, when a QB isn't playing well Dabo refuses to give anyone else a chance until it's apparent that the backup deserves more opportunities. We saw it with Stoudt and Watson, and we saw it this year in the Syracuse game. Heck, we even saw it with our backups, when Cooper was struggling mightily and Johnson didn't get a shot.
The concern is that Bryant, as talented as he is and as successful as he's been, will be the starter and it won't truly be an open competition, simply because "Kelly has been there."
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110%er [7555]
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Re: It depends on how one defines "better."
Jan 2, 2018, 2:17 PM
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exactly.......POTD........Go Tigers!!!!!!
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Orange Blooded [2984]
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Walk-On [149]
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Re: Myth about Dabo playing seniority over the better player.
Jan 2, 2018, 3:16 PM
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It’s not a myth. Dabo gives his veterans the opportunity to start, until they start costing Clemson games. Cole Stoudt was pulled for Deshaun against FSU because Dabo realized that they couldn’t win that game with Cole at QB, but it was obvious in week one that Deshaun was the better QB. CJ Fuller started the first couple of games this year, even though we all knew Feaster was better. Fuller fumbled against Auburn and continued to look awful against UL and VT. Dabo gave him his opportunity, and he played too poorly. Like Cole Stoudt, Dabo was going to ride KB until he started costing Clemson games. That never happened like it did in 2014. Mainly because Clemson is much better now than they were then.
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Lot o points [155941]
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Kyle Parker, snake-bit post Auburn rib injury continuing to
Jan 3, 2018, 12:51 AM
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start over Tajh. Harper being ahead of Ellington in the lineup.....etc
Let's not act like evidence for the theory is nonexistent.
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110%er [6692]
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Re: Kyle Parker, snake-bit post Auburn rib injury continuing to
Jan 3, 2018, 11:13 AM
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Harper and Ellington came in the same class, Ellington redshirted.
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Orange Blooded [2352]
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When will Dabo do what’s best for KB?
Jan 3, 2018, 11:39 AM
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What do I mean by that? I could be wrong, but Bryant will never be an NFL QB. Why not open the QB competition between Lawrence, HJ, Brice, and Cooper and talk to Bryant about becoming a WR/RB? Think about this. If we make it back to the playoffs next year there is no way Bryant is capable of beating a team like Alabama. So we either play KB at QB next year and make it as far as we can which will most likely end in a loss against an elite team who makes Clemson very one dimensional and predictable and waste a year, or we go ahead and use Trevor Lawrence (if he wins the job) and work towards the future, which may or may not include 2018 as being a very successful year.
Dabo would be doing KB a favor to discuss moving him to another position. I know this will not be a popular idea and I’ll probably catch crap for posting it, but it just seems illogical to play a QB who is very limited in the vertical passing game and waste one of TL’s 3 or 4 years here at Clemson.
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