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Replies: 30
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Walk-On [141]
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DJ's Passing Chart After 3 Games
Sep 19, 2022, 9:32 AM
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Wanted to share my new graphic with my friends on Tnet.
I have also done game-by-game charts.
Those worried about the middle-of-the-field usage...1 pass vs La Tech...9 passes vs Furman...3 passes vs Ga Tech.
https://twitter.com/TheMorganTShow/status/1571683932822970368
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110%er [8538]
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Re: DJ's Passing Chart After 3 Games
Sep 19, 2022, 9:42 AM
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I am worried when we lose and we are undefeated.
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All-TigerNet [10360]
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Definitely confirms that DJ's not the issue***
Sep 19, 2022, 10:12 AM
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Freshman [-79]
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Lol. No it doesn't. At all.
Sep 19, 2022, 10:44 AM
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Yet again, you try too hard and your shtick is tired, pheeblecoot.
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All-TigerNet [10360]
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so you disagree?.......elaborate on your take.***
Sep 19, 2022, 11:00 AM
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Rock Defender [53]
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Re: so you disagree?.......elaborate on your take.***
Sep 19, 2022, 1:23 PM
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Well, first, there aren't as many drops as some of the DJ defenders would want people to believe. Also, interesting that the drops largely come on the left hash. That's the side DJ throws it with less touch to, so the balls are less catchable. This also shows severe inaccuracy between 10 and 20 yards. Those balls that are catchable are often touchdowns. That falls on DJ. But I do admit there are some serious issues that aren't on him. Why are 2/3 of all passes behind or within 5 yards of the line of scrimmage? No good team uses that many bubble screens and short passes. Why are there almost 4 times more intermediate/long passes to the right side of the field vs. the middle, traditionally the weakest point on the field for defenses?
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Legend [19694]
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It's also where EJ has been targeted
Sep 19, 2022, 1:50 PM
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and he has the most drops
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Rock Defender [53]
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Re: It's also where EJ has been targeted
Sep 19, 2022, 3:22 PM
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That's a fair point. I do think drops are shared blame, because a ball is a lot harder to catch when it comes to you as fast as DJ throws it (he's a beast of a man) and not always in a spiral. But EJ Williams and Joseph Ngata were both highly touted recruits, who want to play on Sundays, and have NIL deals of their own. Their inability to get open or to catch even difficult to catch balls are on them as well, not only on DJ.
Basically, we have a lot of issues on offense. (1) Our pass scheming is poor; (2) Our offensive line scheme, which is designed to make every play look like a pass to allow for misdirections and draws, really makes it difficult for offensive linemen to succeed in run blocking and make holes (which Shipley can handle more than Mafah. Mafah is more of a Bama-style runner that needs more cohesive blocking), (3) even when they have a chance, our blockers don't dominate even much smaller guys, (4) our wide receivers are all tall possession guys who can't get separation and also for some reason have questionable hands and also aren't great at blocking, which is necessary if you're running bubble screens (I hate them, but they're part of our identity); (5) DJ's at his ceiling, which is average QB play. Cade hasn't really had a shot, but I fully admit the team hasn't been as fired up when he was in the game as they were his first drive; and (6) the crowd has been lethargic, which is infectious to the team.
I do not level all the blame on DJ. He's playing a lot better, and shows glimpses of what we thought he could be, even if he still has a lot of issues. It's a chicken and the egg thing. Though honestly, the biggest issue is probably the poor line play/coaching, since elite play in the trenches can mask a lot of other issues.
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All-In [36409]
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Add back just 1/2 the drops he’s over 70%
Sep 19, 2022, 10:16 AM
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Completion
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All-TigerNet [10360]
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Also add 2-3 catches that are "incomplete", but our.........
Sep 19, 2022, 10:24 AM
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2015-2018 WRs would've caught............and 2-3 may be on the lighter side.
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Commissioner [928]
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Re: DJ's Passing Chart After 3 Games
Sep 19, 2022, 10:21 AM
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Great visual, thanks for sharing.
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Commissioner [923]
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watched him turn to right side of side line and stare down
Sep 19, 2022, 10:24 AM
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throw way too many times, never looked any other direction.... too many predetermined passes before he even gets the ball in his hands....
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Freshman [-79]
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This remains his biggest issue.
Sep 19, 2022, 10:51 AM
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Every blue moon you'll see him go thru a progression, but nearly every pass play he gets locked in a the primary target, then essentially stands flat-footed in the pocket hoping he gets open. He also has a tough time understanding where pressure is coming from and isn't escaping the pocket to buy time. I know for a fact he's been coached on these things, but when the lights come on he's still struggling with some of the fundamentals. His mental game is still in the works. The good thing is he's more accurate.
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Oculus Spirit [79311]
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So . . .
Sep 19, 2022, 10:38 AM
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We throw “right” ~50% . . . “left” ~25% . . . between the hashes ~25%.
Our highest completion percentage . . . By Far!!! . . . is between the hashes.
DJ IS NOT the issue.
While our WR’s had their best game vs LA Tech, we are still a “soft” team at that position. (Emphasis on SOFT”!!!)
The “drops” are getting fewer . . . yet we still don’t like to “mix it up” out there. In our offense, Bubble Screens are here to stay . . . so learn how to AND enjoy blocking!!! There is a happiness that comes with putting your opponent on his äss.
(I’ve stated in another post earlier that we do not compete for 50/50 balls anymore . . . we have a passive tendency to wait for the ball to come to us. We must learn to “rebound” the jump balls . . . go up over folks and attack the ball with an attitude.)
Our offense, early season, IS ALWAYS VANILLA . . . get use to it.
Play calling will get more creative as the season plays out . . . it always does.
Praying our TEs play a bigger role as the season progresses . . . they have the “surest hands” on the team!!!
See you all in Winston-Salem!!!
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All-American [590]
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Re: So . . .
Sep 19, 2022, 11:32 AM
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How can you make a comment about what our offense "always does" when we have a brand new OC?
I would argue that since 2019 our offense has not gotten more creative as the season has progressed. We got by on pure talent in 2019/2020, but we don't have talent advantages anymore, which is why you see DBs draped all over our WR--no separation.
Anytime I see a Clemson WR with a 2 yard gap it feels like they're running free with a busted coverage
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Oculus Spirit [90820]
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THX Morgan..
Sep 19, 2022, 11:37 AM
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you are a great Clemson fan with a super podcast that more Tiger & TigerNet Fans should tune in to and support.
Go TiGERS!
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Hall of Famer [24549]
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Re: So . . .
Sep 19, 2022, 12:37 PM
[ in reply to Re: So . . . ] |
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How can you make a comment about what our offense "always does" when we have a brand new OC?
I would argue that since 2019 our offense has not gotten more creative as the season has progressed. We got by on pure talent in 2019/2020, but we don't have talent advantages anymore, which is why you see DBs draped all over our WR--no separation.
Anytime I see a Clemson WR with a 2 yard gap it feels like they're running free with a busted coverage
What are you talking about?..
Your Gamecocks aren't good on offense...
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MVP [523]
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Re: So . . .
Sep 19, 2022, 12:42 PM
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Calling things like they are doesn’t make someone a gamecock. Finding a balance between positives and negatives is always good
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All-American [590]
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Re: So . . .
Sep 19, 2022, 1:56 PM
[ in reply to Re: So . . . ] |
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This is why people make fun of Tnet. Any thing that isn't pumping automatically makes you a Gamecock fan.
Also the forum UI circa 2002 needs a bit of updating, but that's a topic for a different day
I literally just said that our offense has not been creative in 3 years and I'm immediately a Gamecock fan. That's like the idiots in the 50s who would call anyone who disagreed with them a communist during the red scare.
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Legend [15749]
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I agree that Wr is more of a concern and I don’t buy that
Sep 19, 2022, 3:31 PM
[ in reply to So . . . ] |
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DJ throws a pass that’s hard to catch. I haven’t seen him blasting it out there. There’s enough touch on the ball. A Clemson WR should be able to catch it every time.
DJ needs to continue to improve in accuracy and in going through his progressions but he appears to truly be putting the work in. I think the WR group needs to step up. Make the completion. Fight for the ball. Get those routes cleaned up so we have less 50/50 situations.
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All-TigerNet [13117]
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Definitely need more screens
Sep 19, 2022, 12:44 PM
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110%er [6395]
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Re: DJ's Passing Chart After 3 Games
Sep 19, 2022, 1:01 PM
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Not utilizing the middle of the field has been an issue for this offense for years. The only difference is that we don't have that alpha on the outside.
This seems like the biggest risk for our offensive philosophy. We primarily recruit outside WRs, which is fine when they are consistently winning 50/50 balls. But when they can't, our offense has nothing else to offer in the passing game. We can't attack the middle of the field because we have recruited mostly WRs that are supposed to excel outside the hashes.
Keep in mind, the coaches wanted Andre Greene over Antonio Williams. And we have two outside WRs committed this year in Noble Johnson and Ronan Hanafin.
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Oculus Spirit [93672]
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I'm not a worrier and certainly not worried about anything..
Sep 19, 2022, 1:26 PM
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as unimportant in my life as a game of any kind. Although, I'm sure with my comments on DJ's lack of ability to hit a receiver moving perpendicular to the sideline is the focus of your address to those concerned.
If a target it stationary or running away from DJ the accuracy of his passes is fairly good. What I've observed is that as that angle deviates from 180 degrees either way his accuracy declines with the magnitude of the change. Those passes are behind, in front or too high making them difficult to be caught and susceptible to being tipped and caught thereafter by those wearing the wrong color jersey.
That boy couldn't hit a rabbit with a shotgun. He might squat down and hit it right square in the butt if it's running straight away from him though.
Nevertheless, we put our best QB on the field, imo, and I hope we continue doing that. What you will not accuse me of is ranting for a change at the position. You will likely see that from me in about another month if it doesn't happen. DJ's still my guy for the time being.
Your graph doesn't address my concerns.
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All-American [590]
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Re: I'm not a worrier and certainly not worried about anything..
Sep 19, 2022, 1:58 PM
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DJ's accuracy on sideline routes is pretty weak too. I would say it's at best on-par with Kelly Bryant, but other than that it's the worst we've seen in about 10 years.
We've had the luxury of QBs that give our WRs a chance to catch the ball on almost every single fly route or back shoulder catch. I honestly don't recall the last time I've seen a Clemson QB who will throw so many passes that are off the mark by 5+ yards, where neither the WR or the defender even bother trying to catch it because it's absolutely airmailed.
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Rock Defender [53]
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Re: DJ's Passing Chart After 3 Games
Sep 19, 2022, 1:32 PM
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*Someone* asked Streeter about "overwhelming the middle of the field" ... he said:
"Depends on the game plan and what they're giving us ... totally depends on what type of defense they're playing."
He said GaTech played man/man with a high safety and that was conducive for our QB to "attack the edges"
"There's always inside routes in every game plan. It just depends on what the QB's read is and how the progression works out."
So ... yeah. There it is.
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Rock Defender [53]
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Re: DJ's Passing Chart After 3 Games
Sep 19, 2022, 1:33 PM
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sorry .. LaTetch not GaTetch.
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Legend [19694]
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I count 20 throws between the hashes (over the middle)
Sep 19, 2022, 1:47 PM
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16 completed. I thought we didn't throw over the middle?
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All-American [590]
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Re: I count 20 throws between the hashes (over the middle)
Sep 19, 2022, 1:53 PM
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You counted 5 passes behind the LOS. For some reason I don't think people are considering shovel passes "the middle of the field".
Take those away and you're looking at 15 pass attempts in 3 games. Really though we care about passes 10+ yards down the field in the middle. A 4 yard stick route by the TE or RB is not really "middle of the field.
So that brings us to 6 passes 10+ yards down field in the hash marks, of which DJ is 5/6. So 2 attempts per game even though it is far more successful than passes down the line
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Legend [19694]
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So you***
Sep 19, 2022, 1:55 PM
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Legend [19694]
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Walk-On [102]
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Re: DJ's Passing Chart After 3 Games
Sep 19, 2022, 3:43 PM
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Ok. Shows a lot of play calls for swing pass or passes behind line. That seems like a lot.
How does that compare to Stetson Bennett or Cj stroud?
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50
