Replies: 71
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CU Medallion [60238]
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Lol. Everyone thought Putin
Feb 23, 2022, 10:24 PM
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owned Trump, now we have full blown explosions in the Ukrainian Capital after President Biden made a completely incoherent speech and showed just how weak he and VP Kamala are with foreign relations. Next up? Iran will start popping off. Guarantee it.
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Orange Blooded [4679]
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Re: Lol. Everyone thought Putin
Feb 23, 2022, 10:27 PM
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Elections have consequences and now we are living history. This is a very dark day.
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All-TigerNet [10997]
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So what?***
Feb 23, 2022, 10:40 PM
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Hall of Famer [24963]
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Petroleum prices about to skyrocket and then everything else***
Feb 24, 2022, 12:20 AM
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Walk-On [110]
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Re: Petroleum prices about to skyrocket and then everything else***
Feb 24, 2022, 9:35 AM
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Biden did that on his own with his energy policies. Did not need Putin's help, but can now blame his failed policies on him!
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Rock Defender [54]
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Re: Petroleum prices about to skyrocket and then everything else***
Feb 24, 2022, 9:51 AM
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Wow, you beat me to it I was gonna say oil prices are going up because of Biden, has nothing to do with war.
Funny thing is you believe that, I do not.
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All-TigerNet [10997]
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110%er [6692]
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Re: Lol. Everyone thought Putin
Feb 23, 2022, 10:42 PM
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He did own Trump. Trump would have done nothing in this same scenario. The thing is, at least the Russians wouldn't me messing with the oil supply. It's not like we are going to stop them anyway.
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110%er [5712]
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Re: Lol. Everyone thought Putin
Feb 24, 2022, 7:44 AM
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Well, at least Biden prevented anyone from dying from COVID.
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Associate AD [845]
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Putin still owns Trump
Feb 26, 2022, 12:41 AM
[ in reply to Re: Lol. Everyone thought Putin ] |
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Directly or indirectly, he holds enough Trump debt to bankrupt them twice over.
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110%er [7269]
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Re: Putin still owns Trump
Feb 26, 2022, 7:00 PM
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OK, I get it AustinPounders®... because Putin 'owns' Trump, then that absolves Biden for shizzing the bed again with his foreign policies. Pretty impressive that Biden's RUS/UKR failed policies only took ~ 1 year to yield bitter fruit. Most foreign policy failures take longer for the consequences to become manifest.
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110%er [7269]
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CU Medallion [58632]
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Make no mistake, Putin is in complete control here.
Feb 23, 2022, 10:52 PM
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He's running the show and Biden and all of the rest are scrambling trying to figure out what to do.
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110%er [6692]
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Re: Make no mistake, Putin is in complete control here.
Feb 23, 2022, 11:42 PM
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Because there isn't much we can do. All if the EU is scrambling and wonder what the world can really do.
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CU Medallion [58632]
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Re: Make no mistake, Putin is in complete control here.
Feb 24, 2022, 12:22 AM
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Sure there is. The question is, do we, or should we? If we and the rest of the world do nothing (effectively, to stop it), what's next? What's to prevent China from rolling into Taiwan? What would stop Russia from invading other sovereign nations, if there's "nothing we can do"? I'm not saying that we should, just saying that Putin, and China, and possibly other bad actors are counting on the rest of the world doing nothing.
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110%er [6692]
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Re: Make no mistake, Putin is in complete control here.
Feb 24, 2022, 12:25 AM
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We can lose one hundred thousand men or more possibly and have a complete world meltdown. We do have that option. That's why I say there in reality there is nothing we can really do.
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CU Medallion [58632]
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Re: Make no mistake, Putin is in complete control here.
Feb 24, 2022, 12:43 AM
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If it's just Putin going after Ukraine, then no. If Putin continues, and others join him, we will have a complete world meltdown, and hundreds of thousands will die, and something will have to be done.
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Legend [18026]
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Putin will not attack any NATO countries.
Feb 24, 2022, 12:51 AM
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He isn't dumb. He's done this 5 other times and "won" them because he knows he can't go past a certain point. This begins and ends with Ukraine. This is why a strong NATO is important and the whole "America First" ethos is wrong.
China won't attack Taiwan because the US has a treaty with Taiwan to defend it if it's attacked. This is where our economic ties are important because China will not see Taiwan as worth a global war for nor will it deem it worth the economic risk.
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110%er [6692]
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Re: Putin will not attack any NATO countries.
Feb 24, 2022, 12:55 AM
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China doesn't care about the US treaty with Taiwan. We will not protect Taiwan and we have already admitted as much. That ship has sailed. There is not even a slim chance we would go to war with China for Taiwan. China has progressed too much so that is no longer a viable option. We are just trying to help Taiwan beef up their self defense. That's the best we can do for them now.
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Legend [18026]
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I don't think either side sees Taiwan worth fighting over
Feb 24, 2022, 1:07 AM
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or I should say, that the risk of an invasion of Taiwan isn't seen as a risk worth taking by either side.
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110%er [6692]
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Re: I don't think either side sees Taiwan worth fighting over
Feb 24, 2022, 2:14 AM
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There is no risk foot China other than what Taiwan musters in defense. The USA is is almost as non factor . China isn't worried about us going over there to get slaughtered.
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Lot o points [156259]
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Associate AD [845]
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Don’t think we have a treaty with Taiwan
Feb 26, 2022, 7:13 PM
[ in reply to Putin will not attack any NATO countries. ] |
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We voided all the official agreements when we derecognized Taiwan as a nation and recognized China.
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Associate AD [845]
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Officially, we don't recognize Taiwan as separate from China
Feb 26, 2022, 12:45 AM
[ in reply to Re: Make no mistake, Putin is in complete control here. ] |
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That's all Nixon and Kissinger. The "One China" doctrine has been in place since then. We convinced the rest of the world to do the same.
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110%er [7269]
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Re: Officially, we don't recognize Taiwan as separate from China
Feb 26, 2022, 7:08 PM
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Indeed, while Nixon and Kissinger started the eventual rise of P.R.China, it was Bill Clinton who put the emergence of P.R.China into overdrive. Even the weakling G.H.Bush maintained strict sanctions on USA businesses which wanted to do business in PRC.
BTW, Clinton's relaxation of USA corporations doing business in PRC is what led to the gradual but inexorable transformation of USA corporations (and especially Wall Street investment bankers) from favoring Republicans to favoring Democrats.
The Democrats were the honest party as recently as Jimmy Carter's tenure in the WH. No longer; the Democrats have enormously eclipsed the Republicans as crony capitalists, although don't worry, the Republicans are doing all that they can do to catch up and overtake the Democrats in this destructive (to the USA) practice.
PRC has been stealing USA technology since 1992, and now are a BFD to try to contain.
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Oculus Spirit [94275]
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All-In [46906]
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CU Medallion [64837]
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Me personally?
Feb 24, 2022, 10:36 AM
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I don't know.
I think that when we were net-positive for oil/gas imports (energy independent), we had more leverage against Russia.
I think prior to Germany shutting down two nuclear plants (to go green... *eyeroll*), then became more dependent on Russian gas, therefore losing leverage.
I think when we lifted the halt we put on the Nord Stream 2, we gave away some of Ukraine's leverage over Russia... Ukraine was a major passageway of getting gas from Russia to Germany.
I think that Trump's "let Europe take care of themselves" stance towards NATO weakened NATO, a perceived adversary to Putin, so Ukraine possibly joining NATO was less of a concern to him.
So I blame Biden for returning to net-negative on oil/gas imports and lifting the halt on the Nord Stream 2. Maybe also for returning power to NATO by restoring our standing. Germany's decision is not Biden's fault.
So Europe and the US will sanction Russia - and rightfully so, but I think that the changes the US and Germany made that I mentioned at the beginning of this post limit the extent to which we can Sanction... or it increases the pain that the average Joe and Johann have to bear... by higher energy prices.
Now I guess that's monday morning quarterbacking at this time.... going forward... I guess we sanction sanction sanction. It'll suck for us, but it needs to be done.
I wouldn't send troop 1 in there at this time. No way in hades.
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Associate AD [845]
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Re: Me personally?
Feb 26, 2022, 4:09 PM
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I don't know.
I think that when we were net-positive for oil/gas imports (energy independent), we had more leverage against Russia.
I think prior to Germany shutting down two nuclear plants (to go green... *eyeroll*), .
Ever heard of something called Fukushima?
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110%er [9149]
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All-In [34745]
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Joe is asleep***
Feb 23, 2022, 11:03 PM
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All-In [46906]
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What would you have Biden do?***
Feb 24, 2022, 7:41 AM
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Legend [18026]
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Real quick, what should Biden have done to stop Russia?
Feb 23, 2022, 11:34 PM
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Or, what would Trump have done differently?
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110%er [6692]
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Re: Real quick, what should Biden have done to stop Russia?
Feb 23, 2022, 11:41 PM
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He would have praised Putin and said it's not our problem. Then he would have trashed talked NATO. That's the difference.
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CU Medallion [64837]
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Yea probably.
Feb 24, 2022, 10:40 AM
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And it would make me sick to hear it... but as I mentioned in an earlier post... some of his policies *may* have been preventing this invasion from happening earlier. *Maybe* because I'm no expert. Who knows.
I have to imagine that Putin planned this out... knew there would be sanctions... and has a plan to deal with sanctions as well.
The body count in Ukraine will have to climb so high, or stuff will have to get so bad in Russia, that he feels the pressure to back down. That's how it's going to have to happen... internal pressure...
Not sure Trump or Biden would handle it differently once the invasion started (other than using different words).
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Associate AD [845]
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I fully believe this was planned to happen a year ago
Feb 26, 2022, 4:12 PM
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Putin was intent on doing this and had a willing pawn in Trump to help him destroy NATO in the process. Make no mistake about it, Putin was always in full control of Trump.
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CU Medallion [58632]
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That's what I'm asking, and the only answer is not one
Feb 24, 2022, 12:31 AM
[ in reply to Real quick, what should Biden have done to stop Russia? ] |
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anybody wants to hear, and understandably so. That's not good though, because if there is zero threat of a significant military response, then it only emboldens bad actors to act badly. That's exactly what is happening now. Don't get me wrong, I'm not suggesting we should respond or get involved (directly, at least) militarily, but knowing he will be unchallenged makes this easy for Putin.
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CU Medallion [60238]
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Legend [18026]
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They don't and that's russian propaganda.
Feb 24, 2022, 3:17 PM
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It would be best to ignore whatever source you got that from.
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Orange Blooded [3123]
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I still don’t get why we should care about Ukraine?
Feb 23, 2022, 11:37 PM
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Spare me some crap about being a democracy. They’re a corrupt oligarchy at their heart.
We should care way more about Canada and way less about Ukraine.
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Hall of Famer [24963]
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Castrudeau has Canada on lockdown... No chance they invade.
Feb 24, 2022, 12:29 AM
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Now, Mexico. That's ongoing. That's where our troops should be.
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110%er [6692]
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Re: Castrudeau has Canada on lockdown... No chance they invade.
Feb 24, 2022, 12:33 AM
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I want tight borders, but it's minor in comparison.
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110%er [7266]
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All-In [42440]
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Oculus Spirit [97931]
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Just wait for the "draft mandate".
Feb 24, 2022, 2:10 AM
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That should go over pretty well.
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All-In [42440]
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Putin owned Trump
Feb 24, 2022, 7:35 AM
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There's no mistake Biden is weak and he sees as an advantage, but Trump served a purpose for Putin to help lead him here. And it would have been strategically unwise for Putin to attack Ukraine while Trump was president.
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All-TigerNet [13273]
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Re: Putin owned Trump
Feb 24, 2022, 7:39 AM
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lolololol
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110%er [5712]
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Re: Putin owned Trump
Feb 24, 2022, 7:48 AM
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Those dumba$$ gender studies majors dominate the echo chamber with their crazy BS, don't they? You can tell when it leaks out here.
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Lot o points [156259]
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If you ignore all facts and go with feelings, sure.***
Feb 24, 2022, 8:16 AM
[ in reply to Putin owned Trump ] |
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All-In [42440]
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Nah.
Feb 24, 2022, 8:39 AM
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Failing to see how Putin controlled Trump is, at best, just being a Trump apologist.
His comments yesterday show how he's beholden to the man.
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Lot o points [156259]
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That’s the feelings part of it.
Feb 24, 2022, 8:57 AM
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The facts show Russia’s military activity staying static for 4 years and an economy in shambles, helped greatly by our net exporter status.
There are feeling-based observations galore, but facts show Russia in a pretty low place during Trump’s term, even in areas where Trump could have been in a position to help and didn’t.
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All-In [42440]
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Re: That’s the feelings part of it.
Feb 24, 2022, 9:05 AM
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The idea that Russia held off because they were scared of Trump or that Trump is tough is folly, as insinuated by the OP. It would have been strategically dumb for Putin to invade while a president that most of the world thought was his lap dog and hating on NATO was in power. It was far smarter to do it with a divided America and a weak Biden.
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Lot o points [156259]
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I don’t buy the Trump was a lapdog theory any more than I
Feb 24, 2022, 9:08 AM
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Buy the converse theory that he was a modern-day John Wayne.
What he was, was a strange guy, and the usual suspects of Russia, NK, etc couldn’t figure him out (I couldn’t either) to feel comfortable predicting how he’d act to moves like this one. Ironically , his bizarre personality gave him strength in the form of extreme unpredictability.
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All-In [42440]
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If you don't want someone to think you're someone's lap dog
Feb 24, 2022, 9:29 AM
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Don't shower him with undue praise all through your presidency, state that you trust him more than your own intelligence agencies, and attack our NATO allies whom he hates.
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Lot o points [156259]
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Again, you’re talking about words, not actions.
Feb 24, 2022, 9:33 AM
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Name one thing Trump did that was as beneficial to Russia’s economy as Biden’s swift sign-off of Nordstream 2.
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All-In [42440]
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Walk-On [110]
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Re: Again, you’re talking about words, not actions.
Feb 24, 2022, 10:19 AM
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That's from 2 years ago.......
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Heisman Winner [105934]
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Wait until you learn how long Biden has been President
Feb 24, 2022, 10:33 AM
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and not Trump
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All-In [42440]
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Walk-On [110]
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Re: Again, you’re talking about words, not actions.
Feb 24, 2022, 2:13 PM
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You are certainly welcome...you may want to find an updated article because some of their points are now questionable if not down right wrong. You probably shouldn't post random articles from 2 years ago, with outdated information, if you don't want "random lurkers" to point it out.
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All-In [42440]
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Try reading the thread
Feb 24, 2022, 2:37 PM
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Obed asked a question. I provided information. It didn't have to be a current article. Why wouldn't it be one from when Trump was in office.
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Walk-On [110]
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Re: Try reading the thread
Feb 24, 2022, 4:00 PM
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If you want to try to prove your point with outdated, now partly false information I guess that's your prerogative to do so.
Aside from the recent lip service and selective quotes out of context, I'm sure a man of your caliber can find some more recent articles with proof that show Trump is a Russian puppet
You can characterize anyone as anything with outdated, incorrect information.
Think I'll go back to lurking now...thank you!
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All-In [46906]
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I'll be honest, I didn't expect him to actually do it.
Feb 24, 2022, 7:52 AM
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I hope him and his oligarch friends are ready for the financial ### cutting they will (hopefully) be getting
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Associate AD [845]
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This was delayed one year because Trump lost
Feb 24, 2022, 8:36 AM
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The Putin/Trump plan was to take over Ukraine and weaken or destroy NATO as an alliance.
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Lot o points [156259]
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LOL. Quality.***
Feb 24, 2022, 8:38 AM
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Rock Defender [54]
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Re: Lol. Everyone thought Putin
Feb 24, 2022, 9:49 AM
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Trump and Putin depend on the stupidity of their followers / subjects / lap dogs.
Darwin says hello.
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110%er [9149]
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Biden has now given an implicit green light to
Feb 24, 2022, 10:22 AM
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Russia, Iran, China, and any other belligerent, to do pretty much whatever they want and we will do nothing. Except sanctions. We all know how many wars sanctions have prevented. Zero, at last check.
Will we defend Taiwan if China moves on them? Israel, if Iran attacks? Or any other European nation that Putin feels he's entitled to? Current precedent says a big fat NOPE.
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All-In [31938]
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So, to be clear, you believe the US should be sending....
Feb 24, 2022, 10:37 AM
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into Ukraine to defend it from Russia?
That's an honest question. I, personally, don't think we should be sending troops to fight against Russia right now, but I think there is a respectable argument to be made that we should be considering military action.
With that said, I don't think the situation is directly comparable to China/Taiwan or Iran/Israel or Russia/NATO country.
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All-In [31938]
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hello? is this thing on?***
Feb 24, 2022, 3:19 PM
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110%er [9149]
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Re: So, to be clear, you believe the US should be sending....
Feb 25, 2022, 2:01 PM
[ in reply to So, to be clear, you believe the US should be sending.... ] |
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I think at this point it's too late for us to do anything. I think we should have been much stronger at the outset when all the signs were pointing to a Russian build-up. I'm no military or political strategist, but I think if we and some European allies had put boots on the ground in Ukraine early on and then initiated an offering to work with Russia and Ukraine to figure things out peacefully we would be looking at an entirely different situation. The Russian soldiers and people want no part of this. Vlad would not challenge the US and allies if they were on the ground in Ukraine. He's a bully and bullies only pick on the vulnerable, those that are easy wins. I do NOT think the US military should fight Russia, and that would be the point - put them in there EARLY ON before things got ramped up to 11 and let Vlad know that the free world will not tolerate his aggression.
The other situations may not be directly comparable, but they're comparable in that they're brewing hostilities. China/Taiwan is very comparable in that China claims Taiwan like Russia claims Ukraine (or at least part of it). Iran/Israel has been brewing for decades. Russia and NATO, I'm not as concerned about at this point. But my point, and the point others have made, is that the policy of the US toward this invasion does not radiate strength or reliability. I think it gives the international bullies of the world the signal that while we will certainly condemn and sign some aggressive paperwork, we won't stop them from doing whatever it is they aim to do.
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All-In [31938]
TigerPulse: 100%
Posts: 37222
Joined: 11/22/03
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Then your statements sound inconsistent...
Feb 25, 2022, 3:38 PM
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first you say Biden is signaling that the US won't do anything to stop aggressors (and we'll ignore the fact that we aren't the only member of NATO right now) and then you say "I think at this point it's too late for us to do anything."
Russia took Crimea in 2014. Biden's been in office for 1 year and it's his fault we did respond to Russia more in regards to it's previous posture regarding Ukraine? That doesn't make a lot of sense to me.
As for Taiwan, I think that situation is quite different. We have the Taiwan Relations Act and while that doesn't bind the US to defend Tiawan from attack, it certainly is stated US policy that the US will stand with Taiwan against China.
And Israel is an entirely different matter altogether which a much different history. Iran KNOWS if they try to invade Israel, that the US will react.
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Rock Defender [54]
TigerPulse: 90%
Posts: 35
Joined: 11/30/98
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Re: Lol. Everyone thought Putin
Feb 26, 2022, 12:35 AM
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You exhibit exactly what Putin wants to hear from Americans. You and the fat orange slob are the easy gullible targets Putin loves.
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