Topic: Bowden To Receive Contract Extension
Replies: 90   Last Post: Dec 3, 2007 6:10 PM by: Razzmatazz
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Bowden To Receive Contract Extension

Posted: Nov 26, 2007 8:31 PM

Bowden To Receive Contract Extension

Brief meeting with AD Phillips confirmed the issue Monday; Three Tigers undergo surgical procedures. Full Story »


Posted: Nov 26, 2007 8:36 PM


I think I should say that as well

Posted: Nov 26, 2007 8:37 PM

dieses ist Deutsche

Next year

Posted: Nov 26, 2007 8:39 PM

we will return 18 starters if everyone comes back. ACC champs, BCS bowl, National Championship?

Re: Bowden To Receive Contract Extension

Posted: Nov 26, 2007 8:38 PM

What is wrong with Tyler Grisham ?

He's got some unidentified condition where

Posted: Nov 26, 2007 8:40 PM

pigskin sticks to his hands.

Re: He's got some unidentified condition where

Posted: Nov 26, 2007 8:44 PM

funny funny! if you dont know answer, dont waste your wrist

Just making a joke.***

Posted: Nov 26, 2007 8:45 PM

"Jokes are not welcome here"-lildenny***

Posted: Nov 26, 2007 8:46 PM

You are in the wrong place

Posted: Nov 26, 2007 8:54 PM

if you don't expect that kind of response....

Reviewed the game in the 2nd quarter when TG was...

Posted: Nov 26, 2007 9:16 PM


I was able to barely see the hit on TG.

It looked like the SC safety planted his shoulder right into TG's lower rib cage.

When TG went down, he was clearly shaken and injured.

I was then able to catch a brief glimpse of him on the sidelines when he was bent over.

The grimas on his face clearly a concern at the time.

I'm glad that he is okay.


Very good, he deserves it. Good job TB and staff***

Posted: Nov 26, 2007 8:59 PM

Re: Very good, he deserves it. Good job TB and staff***

Posted: Nov 28, 2007 10:44 AM

Agreed. He did a good job and deserves to be rewarded for it as well as his staff.

Good Lord, we're destined to be 'average'.***

Posted: Nov 26, 2007 9:02 PM

On a side note; Spurrier to GT???***

Posted: Nov 26, 2007 9:05 PM

Think GT would have Mr 3-5 ?***

Posted: Nov 26, 2007 9:08 PM

If being in the top 20 every year is average, I don't want

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 8:03 AM

to guess what you're idea of good is. Top 3 every year? Is that good enough.

Does anyone even remember the 90s here?

Top 20 EVERY year? Try ONCE in 9 years under Bowden.

Posted: Nov 28, 2007 1:36 PM

Wow! What on earth would make you think that we're Top 20 every year? Look at the final AP polls. In Bowden's nine years, Clemson has been ranked in the Top 20 only once (his second year before the ACC expansion) in the final AP poll. Clemson has finished ranked in the Top 25 only 3 times under Bowden: 2000 (#16), 2003 (#22), 2005 (#21).

Oh... maybe you mean that at some point in the season, Clemson was ranked in the Top 20 because the pollsters see how much talent the team has. But then we drop out of the Top 25 based on the actual performance that the coaching staff gets from all those talented players. Yeah... I guess if squandered talent is your yardstick, Bowden's crew has done quite well.

Yikes.....sorry to some fans in here with this bad news....

Posted: Nov 26, 2007 9:58 PM

on TB....but gives me faith in the folks that run Clemson and who don't listen to the same type of fans that wanted Ford's head in 1980 just before we whooped the coots that year.

Way to go TB!!!!


YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Good Job Tommy!!!!!!!!! Congratulations!***

Posted: Nov 26, 2007 10:00 PM

Fantastic News! Congratulations Coach Bowden!***

Posted: Nov 26, 2007 10:04 PM

**still curious about Spence

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 12:01 AM

I know its just talk by us fans at the moment, but I wonder if/when the coaching staff situation will be discussed.

Vic has done extremely well, but Spence??

Re: **still curious about Spence

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 10:12 AM

Me too. I checked some stats though and interestingly enough, Clemson is ranked #1 in scoring offense, #2 in rushing, and #2 in passing. Of course the value of that does diminish when we get a few L's instead of W's.

Re: **still curious about Spence

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 10:40 AM

Those stats don't mean anything. Take away LM, Furman, CM, and Duke. You will notice that those stats are completely useless. The only way to tell if the offense is any good is to look at games against good teams. Not so good after all. FSU, Maryland, and NC State all suck this year so really those games don't count either. Only 3 points against GT ( Pathetic!! ) BC is good no doubt at all, but had we broadened our play book and maybe passed more against pretty much the worst pass defense in the nation.... who knows how many points we could have scored and kept our defense off the field to rest for a while? Although we beat SC it was embarrassing at times sitting in the stands during that game. SC has one of the worst rush defenses in the nation so what do we do.... pass and use the bubble screen wayyyyy to much. I mean heck, JD was averaging like 6 yards a carry. On top of all that, Clemson caused like 5 (not sure on the exact amount but I think thats about right) turnovers and only put up 23 points? Something is wrong, and I'm not going to mention the F (firing) word, but something does need to change.

Re: **still curious about Spence

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 10:48 AM

Like I said, the importance of stats diminish when you have losses instead of wins. By the way, nothing went right during the GT game. How many balls were dropped? How many FGs were missed? This game was definitely one of those "did that really just happen" games.

I agree with you on our game planning aspect. Seems logical to use our strengths to exploit other teams weaknesses. I just hope we learn the lesson and stop trying to get too cute with the plays we run. I think everyone would agree that we need some power football to compliment the finesse offense we've been running. I see no reason we can't have both.

GT Game 2006

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 10:57 AM

Against the #7 rush defence, Spence decided to attack with Spiller and Davis - what a poor decision, get him out of here.

Another note: why throw out games vs bad opponents. They count in the record books, and everybody else in the country plays bad teams too. Seems to even out in the end.

Re: GT Game 2006

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 11:08 AM

I'm not saying get rid of him. There is always room for improvement, and I hope we improve. I think we can take our offense to the next level, make it more dynamic, and have power formations for those situations that simply demand that Mr. Davis pound the ball for a couple of yards.

I agree with you - not sure why one would feel the need to diminish our schedule considering the fact that a lot of college football teams play cupcakes.

Re: GT Game 2006

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 2:06 PM

Good post. I agree that more power plays would definitely help out tremendously on offense. I know we have two very good backs, but they are both the small and fast type. Even though davis is bigger than spiller he is still not even close to the size of a true full back. I dont like it when its a third and two situation and we have to throw. Or a goal line situation where a punch 3 times with a full back would easily get the job done but we have to throw a dangerous pass instead( USC GAME ring a bell ). Does anyone else feel like Clemson has neglected to recruit a Full Back? Full backs are a very important aspect of every football team and I feel like having one would have definitely boosted clemson to at least one more win this season. How many times did we get inside the 20 and settle for a field goal attempt? Clemson really has no power formation. We need one!!

Spence great against cupcakes but not the good teams.

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 2:32 PM

Our overall offensive stats and our win-loss record (especially over the last two years) are inflated greatly by the large number of cupcakes that we play (LaMon, Furman, Central Michigan, & Duke this year). When you put up 70 points on C-Mich, it brings up your average quite a bit. (Heck even Ball St. put 58 points on C-Mich this year.) But when it comes to the good teams, Spence is out-classed. He does not adapt. For example, Spence only managed 3 points against GT.

Sure other teams play cupcakes, but in the Sagarin strength-of-schedule rankings, Clemson's schedule ranks 8th out of the 12 teams in the ACC, and 44th in the country. So if you tout Spence's offensive stats, don't forget the asterisk for the weak schedule. Our offensive stats would rank much lower if we played a stronger out-of-conference schedule like FSU plays this year (Alabama, Colorado, UAB, & Florida).

Clemson is 5-3 in the ACC and 2-3 against the good teams (FSU, GT, VT, BC, & SoCar). Those are the only stats that matter. The defense played well enough to win the ACC for the last two seasons. But Spence's poor play calling cost us the ACC title for a second straight year, in my opinion. Spence looks good against weak teams but he USUALLY loses against the good teams.

Re: Spence great against cupcakes but not the good teams.

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 2:45 PM

Wake is not a good team? Seems that they have that elusive ACC Championship that we all want so bad. Maryland beat BC and Rutgers.

Why should we play a tough non-conference? If only we had come up with wins against GT and BC - obviously two big ifs, then our schedule would be taking us to the ACCCG where a win would lead to a national championship game appearance - why take a chance in non-conf games?

Not asking for a tough schedule. Just handicapping O-stats.

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 7:23 PM

I wasn't complaining about our weak schedule. I was pointing out that if you're going to tout Spence's stats, then you should de-rate the stats because of the weak schedule.

It's subjective, but UMD and Wake don't worry me like FSU, GT, VT, & BC. VT & BC beat us every year. But I guess I'd buy an argument that Wake & UMD are "good".

More 5-3's. I hope there's an escape clause for mediocrity.

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 3:05 AM

I don't mind if they give Bowden an extension so that he can recruit and keep his staff, but ONLY if there's a gaping escape clause that allows his termination if he doesn't win the ACC in 2008, and only if they fire Spence. I doubt either is the case.

I just can't believe the administration is happy with perennial 5-3 seasons and no ACC titles after NINE freaking years. Personally I'm disgusted. The announcement is very good timing for me because I was just about to mail in my donations to the university and to IPTAY today. But TDP just saved me several hundred dollars. Thanks TDP!

It always cracks me up when people say that the program is headed in the right direction, because we've been roughly at the same level of mediocrity ever since Bowden arrived. And it always amazes me that Bowden fans pose a false dichotomy of either having a clean program or a championship program, like our only choice is mediocrity under Bowden or excellence under Satan. Like Pete Carrol and Jim Tressel are devil worshippers.

Re: More 5-3's. Here's what amazes me..................

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 5:40 AM

That you can't differentiate between TB fans and CU fans.


Posted: Nov 27, 2007 7:28 AM


I've dropped my IPTAY donation by $2300

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 8:07 AM

If you are not happy with the extension it is the only thing you can do.

Re: I've dropped my IPTAY donation by $2300

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 8:11 AM

here is an idea. get out all together.

Re: I've dropped my IPTAY donation by $2300

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 8:32 AM

Ya'll need to show your support of this extension and up your donation to IPTAY.

you should stop lying about giving money and

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 8:37 AM

go back to FGF......

Better seats for the rest of us***

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 8:19 AM

if you give $2300 then you must really believe in Bowden...

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 8:28 AM

Thank You......

Re: I've dropped my IPTAY donation by $2300

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 9:12 AM

Ok as a huge Tiger fan that even went to FSU from 98-2002 I still stayed a Tiger fan....I used to hear the Clemson jokes and have to take it as we were just not good....Now we are not a laughing stock anymore and you guys still want to bash a coaching staff that has only put us back on the map of college football....Some Clemson fans around here are delusional.....Listen to some of you....You want Bowden gone when all he has done is help make the stadium and facilities state of the art, brought in high recruiting classes and has gotten us to one of the threats to win the ACC which is much better now than it ever was in the 80's, He has also help make this program respectable in the NCAA eyes, and our kids are hardly ever in the news for misbehavior....Who do some of you think Clemson is....Michigan, Alabama, Ohio State???? We have never had the track record to be put in those teams catagories.....1 National Championship people....Not 5 or 6 National Championships....Sure we have few ACC championship but it was a weak conference in the 80's.....Lets be realistic....TB makes some bad decisions sure but he is still a young coach...Bobby made bad decisions when he was younger but FSU stuck with him.....Now wouldn't it be great to have a decade like they had....It takes time and it takes patience to let a man finish his work...Its called growing pains....As far as Spence is concerned, He is one of the most saught after Offensive Cordinators in America so lay off him..He knows what he is doing...Does he make bad calls yes but if the plays you guys are talking about worked then you would praise him for being original....We need to step back look at the Clemosn program and realize we have never been a college football powerhouse (we have had our good years in a row but so has all programs)so quit expecting us to be one in a matter or 8 to 10 years..It takes time and we are headed in the right direction........Some of us need to step down from our clouds and hop back into reality......Saying all that I think Clemson fans are great and Death Valley is a great atmosphere and I am proud to be a Clemson fan........We just need to understand reality some times

Would you please give proof that Spence is sought after?

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 10:15 AM

I think Spence stinks, and I don't think that any major BCS programs would hire him. Maybe somebody like Toledo would have him. Do you have anything to back up your claim that he's highly ought after? Perhaps you could copy and paste some URLs of news stories about other schools trying to recruit Spence.

Re: Would you please give proof that Spence is sought after?

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 10:20 AM


Alabama, Minnesota, Oakland

Enjoy your glass of STeffU.

WOW-somebody got served******

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 11:03 AM

lol...that's a smack-down right there.***

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 11:48 AM

Thanks. No offer from Raiders. MN stinks. Bama surprising.

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 1:24 PM

I did some more searching on the web after seeing your link.

The Oakland Raiders job was only for a QB coach (where I think Spence is good), not for an OC job (where I think Spence is bad), and I don't think he was actually offered the job. But I think he's probably a pretty good QB coach. I think it would be great if Spence remained Clemson's QB coach and Clemson hired a real OC.

Minnesota is so terrible (1-11, 0-8 Big Ten) that for them Spence would be a major upgrade. Not a great endorsement.

The big endorsement that surprised me is that Nick Saban was supposedly interested in Spence as an OC. If that's true, I wonder if Saban would have rather had Spence over Major Applewhite or if Spence was just one of several candidates considered. Supposedly Saban offered to double Spence's salary but Spence turned him down. That seems a bit fishy.

Anyway, I guess I stand corrected. Maybe some decent school would hire Spence. I wish.


Posted: Nov 27, 2007 10:16 AM

Why do other coaches win conference & national titles sooner

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 11:07 AM

We need to give Tommy Bowden another decade?

Rich Rodriguez took WVU (located in a small, rural state like Clemson) to a conference title by his 3rd year, and has led them to 4 conference titles in 7 years, with the possibility of a national title this year. I would argue that WVU has a weaker football tradition and recruiting base than Clemson.

When Pete Carroll took over USC, they had been in a decade of decline. By his second year he started taking them to PAC-10 championships and he led them to national championships in his 3rd and 4th years.

Urban Meyer took Utah to two conference titles in his first two years. He took Florida to a national title in his second year.

Jim Tressel took Youngstown State to a conference title in 2 years. He then took Ohio State to a national title in 2 years, and 4 conference titles in 7 years.

The list goes on and on.

Then there's Tommy Bowden. In NINE YEARS he has never finished better than upper middle of the ACC. Clemson finished 4th (out of 12) in the ACC this year, and 5th, 6th, and 7th (including tiebreaker criteria) over the previous three years. That warrants a contract extension? Talk about being satisfied with mediocrity.

Clemson is a football school with a football loving fan-base. That's why the Peach Bowl or the Gator Bowl will likely choose Clemson over BC or maybe UVA. I suspect that part of the reason that Clemson fans are so avid, is that many of them look at the Danny Ford years and see no reason (other than a coaching change) why Clemson can't be regular ACC champions and occassional national champions. I worry that as those glory years fade further and further away (and some of those fans die, get tired of investing the time, money, and hearts in mediocrity) Clemson will no longer be a football school. Other schools strive for championship programs by hiring great coaches. Clemson seems to be satisfied with 5-3 records and 2nd-3rd tier bowls from an above average coach. That makes me very sad.

Oh, and if you think that the ACC was weak during the Danny Ford years, then please explain why the ACC had a winning bowl record during that decade (whereas, the Big Ten had a losing bowl record). And as I recall, we used to schedule tough out-of-conference opponents (like our annual rivalry game with UGA who was a perennial national powerhouse and national champion in 1980), rather than Louisiana Monroe, Furman, and Central Michigan.

I fear that we are forever saying goodbye to championship-caliber football at Clemson. How very sad.

The coaches you mentioned

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 11:22 AM

Have lost to traditional powerhouses Illinois, Stanford, South Florida and Kentucky, among others this very year despite the fact that they turn away 4 star recruits because they have too many 5 stars. The programs at those schools have players compete for the Heisman year in year out. They have halls full of National Championship trophies.

We are getting there. It takes time. If everyone sticks around, we will return arguably the most skilled/experienced backfield in the country (Harper, Davis, Spiller, Kelly, Ford, toss in Grisham - WOW!!!) Don't try and ruin something that could be so special

WVU had zero NCs &1 Big East title prior to Rich Rodriguez.

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 2:01 PM

Dennis Erickson took a traditionally weak ASU team with an empty trophy case to the top of the PAC-10 in one season.

Bobby Bowden took a previously weak (zero national championships) FSU team to 10-1 by his second season and incredible success for the next few decades.

The list goes on. Though I will grant you that there are a few good coaches out there (like Beamer) that took a decade or so to get their teams into a championship caliber-- but that's usually at programs with no football tradition (unlike Clemson).

I didn't say that great coaches never lose a game. I said that it doesn't take a decade or two for a great coach to lead their team to a conference championship.

Re: WVU had zero NCs &1 Big East title prior to Rich Rodriguez.

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 2:36 PM

Does Arizona State really impress you? Seriously??? The Pac-10 is a miserably weak conference. They won games against inferior opponents, which Clemson seems to be endlessly attacked for on the message boards.

Bobby Bowden turned a program around 3 decades ago. I wasn't even born then, so maybe that's a good point, but that certainly happened in a different age.

Sports programs go in swings (see JoePa, Bobby Bowden) but when you look at the big picture, finding a good coach and hanging on to him for 15 - 20+ years tends to be a good thing. Tommy Bowden improves as a coach every year. His recruiting base has continued to improve.

Ask Notre Dame if they are happy with their trigger-happy AD.

ASU's strength of schedule rank: #27. Clemson's is #42.

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 6:58 PM

Virtually every national media pundit ranks the PAC-10 as a nuch stronger conference than the ACC. Sagarin ranks the PAC-10 3rd, and the ACC 5th out of the 6 BCS conferences.

ASU's Sagarin ranking for strength-of-schedule is #27. Clemson's rank is #42.

After NINE YEARS Bowden led Clemson to 4th in the ACC. After ONE YEAR, Dennis Erickson led ASU to tied-for-1st in the PAC-10 using somebody else's mediocre recruits.

Yes, I'm far more impressed with with Dennis Erickson than Tommy Bowden. Aren't you?

Could Clemson hire somebody worse than Bowden? Yes. Could Clemson hire somebody better than Bowden? Yes.

Clemson has finished in the upper middle of the pack for NINE YEARS under Bowden. I'm not sure how you measure improvement.

Moot point now. TDP is satisfied with 5-3, and a 4th place finish. Bummer.



Posted: Nov 28, 2007 5:29 PM

Hawaii's coach won TWO conference titles since 1999. Ha!***

Posted: Nov 28, 2007 11:29 PM



Posted: Nov 29, 2007 9:26 AM


Or maybe get a coach that can win the ACC once in 9 yrs.***

Posted: Nov 30, 2007 5:08 PM

Re: Why do other coaches win conference & national titles sooner

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 1:35 PM

Don't be so down. Clemson is and always will be a football school.

Even over the past 9 years, attendance has increased and IPTAY contributions have increased. All inspite of so-so seasons or "mediocrity" as you refer to it. Maybe I'm wrong, but I think that's a good indicator that our fan base for the most part sticks with this team through thick and thin. BTW - I don't think anyone is "satisfied" with mediocrity.

Patience is hard to come by, and I know that 9 years is a long time in the college football coaching world. I do think that our program was in much worse shape when CTB took over than most of us would like to admit. It takes time to right the ship... yes, sometimes it takes a decade. It's tough to compare Clemson to some of the schools you mentioned in your post. Reality is while we have a winning football tradition at Clemson, nationally we pale in comparrison to programs like Ohio St. and USC (the real one). These type of schools carry more recruiting momentum with them and can bounce back much more quickly through down years than schools who do not have that kind of national clout. Florida through the 90's has been stellar which definitely helps Coach Meyer, and hey, we all know Coach Rodriguez is good.

Bottom line is CTB's getting an extension. He should get an extension, especially considering our circumstances (recruiting, wealth of young talent and starters returning next year - I think next year will be the best chance we've had to win the ACC and get to a BCS bowl in a long time, IMHO). Now is not the time to make a head coaching change.

Also, since we finished 4th this year in the ACC and 5th, 6th, and 7th the previous 3 years, isn't that progress in the right direction? I guess it's just not happening quick enough for some of us.

Re: Why do other coaches win conference & national titles sooner

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 4:03 PM

Big East v. ACC.... do you really think the big east was a tougher conference than the ACC in 2003? once again, you are an idiot

Who said Big East is better than the ACC?

Posted: Nov 28, 2007 2:29 PM

Maybe you should work on your reading skills before you call other people idiots. Or better still, maybe you could just have an adult discussion without calling other people idiots. Most of us gave up name calling in grade school.

Sounds like I'm getting better seats***

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 9:29 AM

Thanks, I'll get better seats***

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 9:35 AM

I've upped mine to more than cover the loss of yours.

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 10:35 AM

Sleep well.

There's no such thing as a stupid question, just stupid people who ask questions.

I've raised my IPTAY donation by $23,000

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 10:51 AM

First liar never has a chance.

That there's funny.***

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 12:52 PM

Re: Bowden To Receive Contract Extension

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 10:09 AM

Good. This was no doubt the right thing to do, and it is definitely in the best interests of our team, our recruiting, and our program.

Just a couple of quick thoughts about this season...

Did anyone think at the beginning of this season that we would be 9-3 with a legitimate chance to play in the ACCCG? Did anyone really think that this was going to be our year?

I mean seriously - we had major question marks at the QB position, and a lot of people were speculating that Willy K would be starting early on. Our O-Line was in question, and while this may have been our Achilles heal, I saw them get better as the season went on. Most college football "experts" projected us to finish much worse than where we ended up.

So what happened? Cullen Harper exceeded everyone's wildest expectations, our defense played well all season, we found ourselves losing back to back games in the middle of the year only to rally into a shot at the Atlantic title, we finished the year 9-3 downing our arch-rival, and we are ranked #16 in the BCS. Dare I say that most Clemson fans would have gladly taken 9-3 at the beginning of the season - I know I would.

No, I am not happy with the fact that we didn't close the deal and make it to the ACCCG. I don't like the fact that we lost to GT - a game that we should have definitely won. I was not happy with the VT game, bad breaks and special teams coverage mistakes, but I was proud of the fact that this team did not quit like I had seen teams do in the past. They played their guts out until the end. We had our opportunities with BC, but we lost to the better team that night. Once again, our team left it all on the field. And after that, they rebounded from one heck of an emotional low to win in Columbia.

I am guilty of thinking that Clemson is going to beat everyone we play every weekend, and it is easy to dissect each game, each play call, and play coulda, woulda, shoulda. All I am saying is that I didn't think that this was going to be our year to take it all the way. We did, however, play much better than expected, and I think most reasonable people would agree.

In summary, I am staying positive. There is just simply too much to be positive about. Realistically, I think next year will be the best chance our team has had in 10 years to win the conference and make it to a BCS bowl. We only lose 12 seniors from this team and 2 defensive starters (hoping none go pro early). We return Kelly, Grisham, Taylor, Harper, Davis, Spiller, and a healthy Ford (once again, hoping none go pro early) - Buchholtz is also coming back (while he did miss some key FGs this season he did lead the ACC in scoring - I'm thinking that his accuracy will improve in the off-season). We played a lot of young talent this year, and it looks as though we will be bringing in another excellent recruiting class - both of which bode well for us next season. Currently, we are 9-3, we are going to a decent bowl, we have a chance to finish on a strong note and go 10-3, and if that happens, that would not be mediocre by any reasonable persons' standards - especially in light of how crazy this season has been. Yes, sir. There is a lot to be excited and positive about.

Sorry for the long post and the preaching, but I had to get that off of my chest. Hopefully, some of you may feel the same way.


Buchholtz won't be doing double duty with soccer next year,

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 10:58 AM

which may be a plus !

Re: Buchholtz won't be doing double duty with soccer next year,

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 11:09 AM

That's great news! I thought I read that somewhere, but wasn't 100% sure on it. That has got to help to have him dedicated fully to placekicking.

Re: Bowden To Receive Contract Extension

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 1:27 PM

I agree as those are some of my own thoughts. It's easy to be critical but we all need to be positive about where Clemson football is heading. It could have been a pretty rough season but look where we stand today. Bowden and the staff deserve more time especially considering all those starters likely returning next year.

Am I happy with those 3 losses? No. Could we have done better and actually won? You bet. Yes, it hurt bad and felt so sick the way we lost to BC in the final minute. But the fact of the matter is that Clemson is not going to win every game that it plays no matter how we diehards want them every single time. Just look at all the shuffling that went on in top 10 teams all season long. I wonder how LSU fans felt the other night though it?s not a direct comparison by any means. I think we are getting way ahead of ourselves calling for someone's head in the football staff...let it be Spence, Scott or even Bowden as it has been going on all season long. Though some people will never be happy...I seriously think they are delusional...mistaking our football program with the likes of OSU, Michigan, Oklahoma and such as if that has always been the norm at Clemson. We haven't really been there before...truly, but do seem to be heading in that direction IMHO.

We WERE there in the 80's but we let it slip away.***

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 2:09 PM

Re: We WERE there in the 80's but we let it slip away.***

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 2:44 PM

It's called a NCAA investigation and then poor choices for head coaches - 1 of which was a Ford disciple. I was at Clemson during the end of the Ford era and it was time for him to go. The program was starting to become a joke in terms of off-field incidents and lack of attention to academics. Hatfield cleaned up the program, but just didn't fit for Clemson. West was over his head, IMO.

I think everybody knows where you stand on TB as coach. Coaching today (NCAA rules, academic requirements, etc.) is much different though than during the glory days you reference.

I think TB has done a solid job. Would I like better results, YES. However, I don't care what coach you have, Clemson is not going to be a powerhouse every year. Why don't you put some of your efforts in supporting the team, which includes coaches & players, or go get a coaching job yourself. When the Clemson position comes open, then we can all blast you on your results!

Not asking for perennial power. Just one ACCC in 10 yrs.

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 11:55 PM

I don't think that's unreasonable to ask for one ACC title in a decade when there's only 12 teams in the conference. If I do get the head coaching job and make over a million a year for NINE YEARS of mediocrity, I won't mind if y'all call for me to be fired. I'll be laughing my balls off at the amount of money that I banked for delivering NINE YEARS of mediocrity.

After 9 years, a 4th place finish in the ACC impresses you?

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 2:18 PM

Then you should be happy for the next 5 years. I'm sure that Bowden will have no problem leading Clemson to 5 more years of 4th-place finishes.

Nothing would make me happier than to eat my words and flog myself on TigerNet.

4th place is excellent......much better

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 2:21 PM

than 5th 6th or 7th......3rd would be acting uppity

Orange Googlers Unite

Save Tigernet--Boot the coots(you know who I mean).

Re: After 9 years, a 4th place finish in the ACC impresses you?

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 3:38 PM

I never said that 4th in the ACC impresses me. I said that 9-3 this year is better than myself and most people thought we would be this year. Realistically, I did not think we would win the ACC this year. I just didn't think it was our time yet...

As far as the next 5 years go, I guess we'll all just have to wait and see how it turns out, but I can tell you that I'm not going to just write them off. I know I've said this before, but I really have a great feeling about next year in particular. Things look really bright for our team, brighter than they have in several seasons. Considering this, I do not think that now is the time to make a change as I think it would cause us to take a step backwards.

We can site examples of coaching changes that netted quick results and examples where changes caused a bigger tailspin all day long. Truth is we don't know what would happen tomorrow if a change was made.

TB is our coach, and in the meantime, I will support our team, which also means I will support our staff, whomever that may be. Kind of hard to do one without the other, IHMO.

Agreed. I didn't call for Bowden's head, just no extension.

Posted: Nov 28, 2007 12:01 AM

I didn't mean to put words in your mouth about you being impressed with 4th. If you look at my original post I didn't call for Bowden to be fired. I said that I wouldn't give him an extension unless it had a gaping escape clause for performance. I too would give him one more year. But I wouldn't give him 5 more years.

Re: I'm with you on that...

Posted: Nov 28, 2007 9:45 AM

Wow - I hope we don't give him 5 years at this point. I was thinking more along the lines of 2 no more than 3 years. It has to be enough to secure the stability of the program in terms of recruiting purposes and present team, but we don't need to hang ourselves out to dry.

I just didn't want to make him a lame duck coach at this point with the future looking as bright as it does by not extending him. I'm not an expert on this by any means, but my understanding is that while this wouldn't be as final as termination, it would yield the same kind of result and set our program back.

I think I understand now. Cheaper to fire Bowden next year.

Posted: Nov 28, 2007 1:58 PM

I just read this about Bowden's old contract.

"Bowden's current contract runs through the 2010 season with guaranteed compensation over $1.4 million plus incentives. This current buyout is $2.5 million and drops to $500,000 after the 2008 regular season."

So hopefully TDP gave Bowden a one-year extension for recruiting and staff-retention purposes, with the intent of making the real decision about Bowden's future after the 2008 season, when it would be a lot cheaper to fire him. Hopefully, TDP didn't extend the buyout. I don't think TDP could possibly be that stupid. It's not like any other top programs are looking to hire a coach that will lead them to the upper-middle of the conference for a decade, so I don't think TDP has to worry about Bowden leaving and I don't think that Bowden has any negotiating leverage at all.

Re: I think I understand now. Cheaper to fire Bowden next year.

Posted: Nov 28, 2007 11:47 PM

Well... I wouldn't exactly phrase it that way... but I do hope that we win the ACC next year and this all becomes a moot point. If things don't work out next year, then that would be a better time to make a coaching change. It would be nice to have the 500K out if we need it though. If CTB doesn't lead us to the ACCCG+, I know that the "powers that be" can make the right move, whatever that might be.

I too hope we win the ACC next yr. & periodically thereafter

Posted: Nov 30, 2007 5:21 PM

And I hope a nice guy like Bowden leads Clemson to many years of ACC titles, retiring at a very old age as the winningest coach in college football history. But if he doesn't win an ACC title next year, I think it's time to get somebody who can. Ten years should be enough time to get one at a football school like Clemson.

But I think that TDP will keep Bowden as long as he keeps having 8-4 or 9-3 cupcake-filled records.


Posted: Nov 27, 2007 10:57 AM

5 more years of no ACC championships

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 11:06 AM

Mark it down now

Re: 5 more years of no ACC championships

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 11:13 AM

I hope for Clemson's sake that you have to eat those words.

Re: 5 more years of no ACC championships

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 11:13 AM

Will you please go be a coot fan? Negative Nancy.

I guess that's one way to think. Your life makes me sad***

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 12:29 PM

^^^^That comment is directed to MacinTiger***

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 12:30 PM

Re: Bowden To Receive Contract Extension

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 11:32 AM

i heard that TG broke his sternum from some one in the athletic dept

Re: Bowden To Receive Contract Extension

Posted: Nov 27, 2007 3:41 PM

He's Terrible! FIRE BOWDEN. 9 years no ACC champ and you guys are happy?


Re: Bowden To Receive Contract Extension

Posted: Nov 29, 2007 9:21 AM



Here are some candidates to replace Bowden...

Posted: Nov 30, 2007 5:43 PM

Here's a list of head-coach candidates from Rivals.com.

And here's a list from Sporting News.

Are you really saying that there is no coach out there that Clemson could hire that would do a better job than Bowden? If so, you think very highly of a coach that hasn't won the ACC once in 9 years, and hasn't gotten closer than 4th since the ACC expanded.

And fans shouldn't call for Bowden's head if they can't come up with a better head coach candidate? TDP surely has infinitely better resources and connections to find a great coach to replace our above-average coach, than the average fan has. Other ADs seem to hire great coaches, Rich Rodriguez, Dennis Erickson, et al.

And here's a new list of coaching candidates from ESPN.com

Posted: Dec 3, 2007 6:10 PM


Re: Bowden To Receive Contract Extension

Posted: Nov 29, 2007 3:52 PM

Ugggg. I'll give Tommy credit for improving the recruiting prowess of the program, but the execution at coaching is an absolute nightmare. Clemson is NEVER prepared for games against unfamiliar opponents (a la Kentucky last year), and generally looks unprepared when playing against teams with strong coaching staffs (a la Va. Tech). With the state of the ACC and the incredible talent that Clemson had this year, it's an absolute joke that they couldn't win the ACC championship, much less get there.

I'm sorry, but avoiding a losing season and posting terrible performances in mediocre (at best) bowl games is not ok by me. Tommy did a good job getting the team "to the game", but he's had nine years to show that he can't execute and actually win it.

Forget about Tommy. Fire Terry Phillips.

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