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Topic: FB Update: Bowden talks 8 win seasons and Arkansas job
Replies: 58   Last Post: Jul 2, 2014 9:41 AM by: Swarley
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FB Update: Bowden talks 8 win seasons and Arkansas job


Posted: Jun 29, 2014 1:08 PM
 

 
Bowden talks 8 win seasons and Arkansas job

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wow, I had flashbacks....***

[1]
Posted: Jun 29, 2014 1:20 PM
 




Re: wow, I had flashbacks....***


Posted: Jun 30, 2014 12:07 AM
 

I would like to see Bowden get another shot at coaching. He has some good qualities and did some good things at Clemson. He could not win enough for us and his time to leave Clemson had come. That said, he surely learned some things which would help him suceed at, maybe, a mid-major school. There are a lot of coaches in the business who are not as good as Bowden could be.


Re: wow, I had flashbacks....***


Posted: Jun 30, 2014 4:11 AM
 

I always like Tommy Bowden. He seems like a decent guy, and he did do a lot for our program. The thing that always bugged me about him, and what probably cost him his job in the end, is that he has exactly zero passion for what he does. Understanding of a thing will only take you so far. You have to have a serious hunger to keep improving and taking steps forward. I think that's the difference between Dabo's program and Bowden's. I liked him, but Im also glad he's gone.


Re: wow, I had flashbacks....***


Posted: Jun 30, 2014 6:41 AM
 

30-35 wins kept me employed at clemson for a long time.
Signed,
Jack


8 wins out of 12 is 66%. That's an F in my book .***

[1]
Posted: Jun 29, 2014 1:31 PM
 




Re: 8 wins out of 12 is 66%. That's an F in my book .***

[2]
Posted: Jun 29, 2014 2:01 PM
 

FYI, some coaching winning percentages:

Urban Meyer = 83.6 percent
Bear Bryant = 76 percent
Spurrier = 73 percent (66.4 percent at USuC)
Dabo = 69 percent
Danny Ford = 65.5 percent


I didn't listen to the whole audio

[4]
Posted: Jun 29, 2014 2:06 PM
 

But reading that quote just about sums up his whole tenure at Clemson.


Re: I didn't listen to the whole audio

[2]
Posted: Jun 29, 2014 8:07 PM
 

Except that he whipped scars butt regularly


Re: I didn't listen to the whole audio

[1]
Posted: Jun 29, 2014 10:07 PM
 

My thought exactly. Never have I seen a quote that sums up a person so precisely.


That may be total win percentages, but imo if you go 8-4

[1]
Posted: Jun 29, 2014 4:12 PM
 

in a season when you're projected to do really well, then something is wrong, especially at Clemson. The ACC has not really been that strong for some time...that is why it is important we schedule strong OOC games and make it to top tier bowls to play the best competition as possible. Clemson has done pretty well against 'elite' bowl competition these past few seasons. If Clemson went 8-4 last season, we would've HAD to have laid an egg to an inferior opponent and lost to all the best competition...several years of that same kind of performance gets you on the hot seat, it doesn't keep you job secure...

Dabo was expected to do great last season...and with a 10-2 regular season, that's pretty darn good...(83% regular season, 85% with bowl). THAT is good enough to keep you employed. The total win % is misleading, especially considering the train wreck he had to inherit. The difference between Dabo and Bowden is Bowden consistently underachieved and failed to deliver against mediocre competition with an occasional surprise against his dad...


Bowden was the victim of his own success


Posted: Jun 30, 2014 10:10 AM
 

He greatly raised the bar at Clemson from the Tommy West years, and he made us all expect to win AT LEAST 8 games rather than being happy winning 8 games. And we certainly weren't going to put up with 7 win seasons anymore.


Re: 8 wins out of 12 is 66%. That's an F in my book .***

[3]
Posted: Jun 29, 2014 5:57 PM
 

Bowden was 72-45...72+45=117 total games...divide 72 by 117 you get 62% for Bowden. He was a winning coach, and did alot to get the Tiger program on solid footing compared to what it was when he took over. He helped create a family atmosphere, player graduation rates improved, facilities improved, recruiting improved, he went to a bowl game every year, and beat the gamecocks almost every year... He was really good for Clemson...Thx Coach Bowden!!!!!


Re: 8 wins out of 12 is 66%. That's an F in my book .***


Posted: Jun 30, 2014 6:44 AM
 

A lot of times it took him 13 games to get to 8 wins. That's not good, no matter how you rationalize it.


8-4 is more like a C... still a winning season with a bowl


Posted: Jun 29, 2014 3:12 PM
 

but basically average overall. An F would be a losing season, since that would be a complete failure by every stretch of the imagination.

GO TIGERS


Re: 8 wins out of 12 is 66%. That's an F in my book .***


Posted: Jun 29, 2014 5:16 PM
 

I would say D+.


teams that consistently win at least 8 games...


Posted: Jun 30, 2014 10:08 AM
 

are usually among the elite in college football. I agree that 8 should be something like a minimum, but if you look at the records of teams like Arkansas, when they're winning around 8 games/ year, it means they're doing pretty well.


W T F is he talking about?***


Posted: Jun 29, 2014 1:42 PM
 




Love to see Bowden get back into coaching***


Posted: Jun 29, 2014 1:47 PM
 




Re: Love to see Bowden get back into coaching***

[1]
Posted: Jun 29, 2014 4:31 PM
 

Yes, some where else should have to endure his logic.


RichRod is a genius. He got railroaded at Michigan***


Posted: Jun 29, 2014 4:38 PM
 




What about USF?***


Posted: Jun 29, 2014 6:51 PM
 




Exactly why lived with mediocrity...

[3]
Posted: Jun 29, 2014 1:53 PM
 

He coached to keep a paycheck.


Re: Exactly why lived with mediocrity...

[3]
Posted: Jun 29, 2014 2:15 PM
 

He still doesn't get it at all.
No real passion for the game or winning.


He just didn't have what it took to be a coach to lead...

[1]
Posted: Jun 29, 2014 2:47 PM
 

an elite team


Re: He just didn't have what it took to be a coach to lead...


Posted: Jun 29, 2014 3:41 PM
 

Sounds to me he was just trying to draw a paycheck. That is more the norm in this country.


Re: Exactly why lived with mediocrity...

[1]
Posted: Jun 29, 2014 4:35 PM
 

Along with setting TDP up to retain a contract that ended up costing us for years after his AS$ was run off. IMO, that was the worst brain fart TDP had at Clemson!!!


Has he been hired there? I Ark. fans read this, he will not


Posted: Jun 29, 2014 2:10 PM
 

be...


Sense of relief when Friedgen put the nail in the coffin

[1]
Posted: Jun 29, 2014 2:16 PM
 

TB never really thought Clemson was a 10+ win caliber program ... his record shows that.


Re: Sense of relief when Friedgen put the nail in the coffin


Posted: Jun 29, 2014 2:27 PM
 

Friedgen? Wasn't it Wake Forest?


Re: Sense of relief when Friedgen put the nail in the coffin


Posted: Jun 29, 2014 2:31 PM
 

Yep after we lost 12-7


He was gone ... WF accelerated the process***


Posted: Jun 29, 2014 2:52 PM
 




I agree. That 2nd half against Maryland had a lot of people


Posted: Jun 29, 2014 3:50 PM
 

mad. That was a strange game. We jumped on them and then came completely unglued.


Friedgen put the nail in the coffin a few times...

[1]
Posted: Jun 29, 2014 2:54 PM
 

but we still kept Bowden around. That was the most frustrating thing during the Bowden era, Friedgen would own us with like 2 or 3 good players and a bunch of nobodies.


It's not what he thought, it's just that he wasn't....


Posted: Jun 29, 2014 2:50 PM
 

head coach material for a major D 1 football program. Bowden would have done good at a mid major or an FCS program. Bowden did a lot of things the right way, he just couldn't connect with players at all. Which led to teams that were unmotivated and unsure of where the leadership was.


Re: It's not what he thought, it's just that he wasn't....


Posted: Jun 29, 2014 2:53 PM
 

The secret to his success at Tulane and early on at Clemson was Rich Rodriguez. TB just got credit for it for awhile.


I knew that the first season Rich Rod was gone***

[1]
Posted: Jun 29, 2014 2:55 PM
 




Can we not say the same about Dabo and Morris?***


Posted: Jun 29, 2014 3:35 PM
 




Maybe, but the big difference is dabo will likely hire

[2]
Posted: Jun 29, 2014 4:11 PM
 

the right guy to replace morris. rob spence is taken,so he is out.

so far dabo has had home run hires for his assistance. tommy, not so much. hopefully dab's track record for bringing in the right guy will continue,and the loss of morris and/or venerables will have a minimal impact on the program.

ALL IN!!


Re: Maybe, but the big difference is dabo will likely hire


Posted: Jun 30, 2014 6:53 AM
 

> the right guy to replace morris. rob spence is
> taken,so he is out.
>
> so far dabo has had home run hires for his
> assistance. tommy, not so much. hopefully dab's track
> record for bringing in the right guy will
> continue,and the loss of morris and/or venerables
> will have a minimal impact on the program.

I'm not sure how you can say "so far Dabo has had home run hires". What about Steele and Napier?

All coaches, no matter how long they're in the business, can make some bad hires. Dabo is 50/50 right now as far as hiring coordinators.

FWIW, I still think Steele was a good hire and I'm not sure why Dabo canned him. That 2010 defense was the best in Dabo's tenure as HC and the stats prove it. Steele was unprepared for coaching a defense with a HUNH offense and that had as much to do with the struggles in 2011 as anything else. But, even as much as the defense may have fallen off in 2011, the YPG allowed in 2011 are just as good as anything Venables has done in 2 years.

So, that being said, maybe Dabo is actually 3/4 on coordinator hires.


Re: Maybe, but the big difference is dabo will likely hire


Posted: Jun 30, 2014 7:13 AM
 

TB owned the Coots. He beat the pants off of our rival @ 7-2 . He will always live fondly in my memory banks if for nothing else than this trivial fact.
Tommy was the 63-17 coach. Show him his due respect.

DB23


When will everyone accept...

[2]
Posted: Jun 30, 2014 11:27 AM
 

that we now face a different u$uc than TB did?

It's apples and oranges.


Re: When will everyone accept...


Posted: Jun 30, 2014 11:57 AM
 

> that we now face a different u$uc than TB did?
>
> It's apples and oranges.

This is true. But one could argue that Dabo has enjoyed an incredibly weak ACC. I don't know what happened to the conference football-wise from about 2005-2012 but it got bad.

During TB's tenure VT and BC had some really good teams and FSU had not started to go downhill yet. Boston College and VT were only losing about 2-3 games a year in the early 00's. Even Maryland and NC State had some really good teams at times....Maryland only lost 3 games in '02 and '03.

We now have the Duke's and WF's of the conference getting to the ACCCG. It's a different football conference than what TB dealt with, it's getting better obviously but it's still not where it was when TB was coaching IMO.


I don't know about all that, but....


Posted: Jun 30, 2014 5:02 PM
 

it's off the topic. I am referring to everyone going crazy about the u$uc run of late. Yes, we should have picked one or two of these off, but this is not the same old u$uc program.

my money is on them falling down in the next year or so, while we continue to stay at, or above our current level.

The tide will change, and all will be right in the world again.

And in the mean time, I can still buy my nephew that Clemson shirt with the big Tiger Paw that simply states, "One day, I'm going to be your boss". That's one thing that HASN'T changed.


Re: Maybe, but the big difference is dabo will likely hire


Posted: Jun 30, 2014 11:59 AM
 

> TB owned the Coots. He beat the pants off of our
> rival @ 7-2 . He will always live fondly in my memory
> banks if for nothing else than this trivial fact.
> Tommy was the 63-17 coach. Show him his due respect.

Did TB ever lose in Columbia? I remember him saying he always liked hearing 2001 because that meant he was gonna win.


Re: FB Update: Bowden talks 8 win seasons and Arkansas job

[1]
Posted: Jun 29, 2014 2:35 PM
 

Go away Tommy.


Reminds me of how glad I am we are out of the Prez Barker...

[2]
Posted: Jun 29, 2014 2:46 PM
 

era of Clemson Athletics, where being mediocre and bending over for your rival was smiled upon.


Re: Reminds me of how glad I am we are out of the Prez Barker...


Posted: Jun 29, 2014 5:52 PM
 

amen I was glad to "President photo op" go


Re: Reminds me of how glad I am we are out of the Prez Barker...


Posted: Jun 30, 2014 8:15 AM
 

So do you give Pres Barker credit for Dabo or is that TDP?

I think Barker and TDP were in place with Bowden.

Barker was one f the best University Presidents Clemson has ever had. His job is for the whole University... And I believe that Clemson has become even stronger across the board during his tenure.

ADs job is to manage the entire athletic areas. You tell me... Was that Barkers job or TDPs job?

Blaming Barker for Football is silly. It took a leader of football to get Clemson moving back in right direction. It took a salesman to sell it to AD, board, President and University. That is why Dabo is succeeding and Bowden failed.


That post makes zero sense.


Posted: Jul 2, 2014 9:41 AM
 

Even overlooking the absurdity of thinking that a President's job revolves around not just athletics...but athletics as relates to our rivals...

"Bending over for your rival"? We were 7-2 in Barker's era before we hired Dabo. Are you saying that you both BLAME Barker for Dabo's 1-5 record against South Carolina and CELEBRATE that we are "out of that era"?

null


Re: FB Update: Bowden talks 8 win seasons and Arkansas job

[1]
Posted: Jun 29, 2014 3:53 PM
 

Tommy was given the keys to a Pinto as far as money and facilities. Dabo was given the keys to a Cadillac. But he is fine. Life is good.


We were reasonably competitive as well.***


Posted: Jun 29, 2014 4:26 PM
 




There's just something about TB that makes him hard to like.

[1]
Posted: Jun 29, 2014 7:54 PM
 

I don't know that I dislike him, but he can blabber and jabber and say absolutely nothing about as good as anybody.

"Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard."
- H. L. Mencken


Who cares

[1]
Posted: Jun 29, 2014 9:08 PM
 

What is this? Hawgnet?


What is TB's overall HC record?***


Posted: Jun 29, 2014 10:18 PM
 




Unfortunately, we could never do much better than 8 wins


Posted: Jun 30, 2014 10:07 AM
 

I liked Bowden, but the success that Swinney's had with his own recruits tells me that something was missing in the Bowden regime. I think if he'd had a little less loyalty to sub- par assistants and if he'd been willing to go to bat a little more for resources, he'd probably have done better. But maybe he was just a little too genteel, coming from the Bowden family, to ask forcefully for what he needed. Swinney's background in insurance sales probably serves him better in that regard.

And people forget that we'd been pretty terrible for 5 or 6 years before he got here, and he at least made us respectable again. The way I think of it is that if it weren't for Bowden, we'd never have gotten to where we are now under Swinney.


He's definitely not wrong that Arkansas needs to set 8 wins as a minimum for its program to be successfull. They've only won 8 or more games 10 times out of the last 20 years. My guess is that nearly all of the elite teams in college football have done better than that (Clemson has had 13).


Re: FB Update: Bowden talks 8 win seasons and Arkansas job


Posted: Jun 30, 2014 10:07 AM
 

This is why he didn't last at Clemson. He thinks 8 wins a year is doing a good job.


Dang don't get me started.


Posted: Jul 1, 2014 7:43 PM
 

A career 8 win coach sees nothing wrong with it.


Boy, Bowden really sets the bar high.


Posted: Jul 2, 2014 9:06 AM
 

8 wins is his benchmark, and it seems like he was always hovering right around it during his tenure at Clemson. I'm so glad he's gone. At least Dabo has some aspirations beyond winning the minimum # of games requires to not get fired.


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