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CU Guru [1341]
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Jack's commitment to his coaches
Jun 5, 2015, 7:14 AM
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One thing I have to admire about Jack is his commitment to his coaches. I believe some of you don't understand what it really means to stand behind your players and your coaches. DRad comes in and wants Jack to fire some of his coaches. Jack's thinking, these are by brothers. These are the same men that have supported me and brought success, integrity, and admiration to this program.
It's much the same as real world business. You get a new VP come in, he wants to fire half the management because "We aren't being as profitable as we used to be". Doesn't matter that your revenue and profits have increased 20 of the last 22 years. Kind of like being successful in college sports for 20 plus years, then having a couple bad years, and upper management wants to replace the same people that built the program into a winner.
When it's "ALL ABOUT THE MONEY", bad things usually happen.
Hope Clemson baseball doesn't lose sight of what really matters in life!
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All-TigerNet [10614]
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How about Jack's coaches' commitment to him? Don't
Jun 5, 2015, 7:20 AM
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they have an obligation to help him, like maybe "Jack, if I'm the problem, I don't want you to to be fired because of me"? I personally liked Jack and hate that it came to this, but he had several years to right the ship. He shouldn't have been surprised.
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110%er [7191]
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Re: Jack's commitment to his coaches
Jun 5, 2015, 7:28 AM
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This was,imo,the same attitude that got Tommy Bowden canned.
It is about loyality,but it's also about winning.
Fans are not going to continue to support a program that is
floundering in mediocrity.And that is what Clemson baseball had become,a mediocre product.
I belive it was Roy Philpott who said on is show yesterday how bad attendance had gotten
at Doug Kingsmore this past season.
So changes had to be made,either to the coaching staff,or to the Head Coach.
Clemson baseball has too much of a storied past to continue on the downward spiral
of the last 4 or 5 seasons.
Like Jack,or not,support his decision to stand behind his coaches ,or don't something had
to give,especially in light of last years season ending evaluation of the program.
Yes "MONEY"was part of it but so was "WINNING".
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Legend [16186]
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Re: Jack's commitment to his coaches
Jun 5, 2015, 8:27 AM
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Jack was fired because his performance was not satisfactory. The whole assistant coaches issue is a sideshow.
A coach's loyalty should be to the institution who pays him and the program/team he manages. Jack never had a problem cutting players whose were not good enough to help the team. He never had a problem pulling or not playing pitchers who had lost their 'stuff.' He just could not/would not recognize that HE was the problem.
Jack had a lot of time to think about his program slipping, about his losing his fan base. He seemingly had a year's notice that he needed to get better or get gone. This past year was his trial year and everyone knew it, including Jack. This year he lost games he should have won.
So he should have resigned, saved the institution to whom he should have been loyal the trouble of firing him and left because it was time for a change. Instead, he was fired. And it was his fault. PERIOD.
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Rock Defender [65]
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Re: Jack's commitment to his coaches
Jun 5, 2015, 8:35 AM
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I agree the assitent coach thing is a side show.I also find it odd that LeCroy is allowing Clemson to use him knowing he has no shot at the HC position.DRad made it clear in his press conference that they would hire an experienced coach with a winning track record to replace Jack.
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All-TigerNet [14451]
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Re: Jack's commitment to his coaches
Jun 5, 2015, 8:36 AM
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BRADLEY COULD VERY WELL BE RETAINED BY THE NEW GUY.
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Rock Defender [65]
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Re: Jack's commitment to his coaches
Jun 5, 2015, 8:41 AM
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Agreed.
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CU Guru [1851]
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110%er [6937]
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Clean house***
Jun 5, 2015, 8:46 AM
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Heisman Winner [108390]
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yes, i never fired anyone, they fired themselves, but he
Jun 5, 2015, 8:41 AM
[ in reply to Re: Jack's commitment to his coaches ] |
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believed in his program, HE believed in the direction and HE stood by those beliefs until the end.
the next coach will & better hold the same convictions or he should not be hired. he will be hired to run HIS program and if the next coach succumbs to pressure from a fan base or administration, isn't true to his convictions, then clemson has already lost.
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Commissioner [989]
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when your boss comes to you
Jun 5, 2015, 9:13 AM
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sits down and discusses items of issue, and you completely blow it off...you should be fired. its disrespectful to him as your supervisor and your employer who is counting on you to perform for them. you do it the way that gets results, not your own way. being confident is different than being stubborn and defiant.
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Hall of Famer [23100]
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especially after being given a chance to do things his way
Jun 5, 2015, 9:17 AM
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last year. Arrogant thinking he couldn't be told what to do. Had nothing to do with loyalty.
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Heisman Winner [108390]
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he made the tournament. he was still doing business
Jun 5, 2015, 9:25 AM
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with significant disadvantages, which drad stipulated to, but he was not willing to make changes he did not agree with... it happens.
and so we move on to the next chapter in clemson tiger baseball.
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Hall of Famer [23100]
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Under normal conditions ,you'd be right.
Jun 5, 2015, 9:39 AM
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Everyone complaining forgets, they already had this meeting last year. Jack was allowed to do things his way this year and showed no improvement.This year it was time to listen to his boss.
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Heisman Winner [108390]
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no, not in the least, he made the tournament. jack didn't
Jun 5, 2015, 9:50 AM
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agree last year and apparently jack wasn't going to drop his value system then agree this year in the light of making it 21/22. it needs to be better, jack knows this, drad knows this, you and i know this, but the how is philosophical. marriages end for less.
clemson has a proud tradition, a great one, but it has relied solely on 2 things to drive the program while all resources were turned toward the money makers... the good names of jack leggett & clemson.
i get that the money needed to go elsewhere first, but to step in while stipulating to the disadvantages, demand changes while patting coach leggett on the butt and telling him to get back in there, wasn't getting it done by the admin either.
people got what they wanted, just maybe not the way they wanted it.
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Heisman Winner [108390]
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he made 21/22 ncaa tournaments, he stood on his record, he
Jun 5, 2015, 9:20 AM
[ in reply to when your boss comes to you ] |
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stood on his beliefs & he believed staying the course was going to get clemson where clemson belonged.
drad disagreed. there's no doubt coach leggett left drad no choice, but that's his choice & even drad recognized that.
you guys that say jack leggett needed to do what's best for the program don't agree with his vision of what's best for the program. sometimes there are philosophical differences as appears to be the case here. it's happened before, it will happen again.
that's business too and you better d@mn well believe the next HC will be as #### sure about his program and its direction or clemson doesn't need him.
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Commissioner [989]
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yes
Jun 5, 2015, 3:03 PM
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if an employee is stubborn enough to turn his nose up at his boss, I guess that is part of business, and that employee can also figure out another part of business...the unemployment line. Again, a big difference in confidence in what you do and being too stubborn to work with anyone else on corrective measures. You talk about his vision, well he has a boss that is responsible for the entirety of the athletic department that also is involved in the vision. When you are a manager on a project for a corporation, it is your baby. You are making the day to day decisions and have a purpose in mind with how you want it to come out. But there are also VPs and CEOs with invested interest in what you are doing, and you better make darn sure you take their input into account. If you have differences you work those out. And if you cant, then you do what DRAD and Jack have done and part ways. But more often than not, professional adults figure out a way to work together.
as far as his record: I suppose it comes down to measureables and expectations. Some people have different expectations and use different measurables. What might look good to one person, doesn't sit as well with another. Personally, making an NCAA baseball tournament doesn't mean nearly as much as one for basketball. It used to be akin to Soccer, but Soccer really came along at the college level over the past 15 years, so it does mean something to make that now. I appreciate the effort the man put into the program and the students and coaches he mentored. I am sure he will go on to some other place and be very successful there as well. I think this is best for both parties at this time.
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Heisman Winner [108390]
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and, that's where we are... a boss with no work experience
Jun 5, 2015, 3:21 PM
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in the field trying to manage a coach with HOF experience.
drad was his boss in title alone, not baseball or coaching experience, that's where the corrective measures, the philosophical differences, begin and end.
the how to fix it.
wars have been started over less, we've got a parting of the way.
i don't see the problem[from what we know], not as jack's, or where you believe for a moment in time jack leggett needed to fall in line to save his job?
if i'm going down, i'm going down with both guns, not with an arm tied behind my back.
maybe drad needs a young, up and coming coach he can threaten? boy, won't clemson be lucky to find one where the AD can wrench it up a notch to scare changes on the field.
can't wait.
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Starter [375]
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I think it is more than just a couple of bad
Jun 5, 2015, 8:39 AM
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years. Looking at our baseball program the past few years, it reminds me of the FSU football program. Bowden made that program and is certainly a HOF coach, but it fell off his last few years and wasn't coming back. FSU made a difficult and awkward decision to force him out and it allowed them to move forward and win another NC. Hope our baseball program takes a step forward in the next few years and we get back to Omaha. I just don't see it happening if Jack stayed, as sad as that may be. I hope the University finds an appropriate way to honor Jack for the many great years he did have.
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110%er [6937]
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Re: He got paid for doing a sub par job. That is more
Jun 5, 2015, 8:49 AM
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honor than deserved.
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Hall of Famer [23100]
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More like he was hardheaded, arrogant ,stubburn ,thinking
Jun 5, 2015, 8:59 AM
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he was a Legend and couldn't be told what to do.
People running to Jack's defense seem to OVERLOOK that he was given a year to straighten things out his way and FAILED. In order to stay on the job after that, he should have listened to his boss.
That in no way shape or form takes away from what Jack accomplished during his time at Clemson. With his REFUSAL to take direction from his boss, a change was needed.
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Legend [18544]
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You live and die by your assistants. Jack chose the latter.***
Jun 5, 2015, 9:51 AM
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CU Guru [1893]
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Same thing that did in Tommy Bowden.
Jun 5, 2015, 10:31 AM
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You will remember that the first thing Dabo did was clean house (Rob Spence). If the boat starts to sink, you throw away the dead weight regardless of your personal feelings or else everyone drowns.
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