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Hall of Famer [21614]
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Do Clemson fans have any right to trash the ACC?
Dec 6, 2012, 7:55 PM
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Isn't it as much our fault as anyone that the ACC sucks so bad? Seriously. Look what WE have done lately to represent the conference.
We whine and cry about how all the crappy teams pull down our strength of schedule. But look what happens when we get a chance to prove ourselves? We are only 10-2 BECAUSE we played in the ACC this year.
All these posts about how the ACC is so bad for Clemson seems like some idiot who crapped in his bed and then starts screaming at other people in the house because he has to sleep next to poop.
Is it so hard to have a little introspection? I love Clemson. I'm proud to be an alum... but I refuse to look like such a fool about football.
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Orange Blooded [3677]
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Shooting straight bro, once agian .
Dec 6, 2012, 8:01 PM
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Point+
Glad you have the stones to speak the truth and withstand the flame.
I love being a charter member of tha ACC myself and have never really had any complaints.
but the interwebs bring sofa savants on all topics, with no risk of repercussions.
Thanks again
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All-TigerNet [11435]
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Like i've always said, it isn't Swoffords
Dec 6, 2012, 8:05 PM
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fault these teams aren't winning. Miami hasn't won, FSU and Clemson are just now starting to win. Bringing in Miami and VT were great moves, but they have to do their part and win.
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Orange Blooded [2441]
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Right on the money. See my post below.
Dec 6, 2012, 8:05 PM
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Couldn't have said it better.
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Rock Defender [53]
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110%er [6937]
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Re:The truth is hard to accept sometimes.***
Dec 6, 2012, 8:03 PM
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Heisman Winner [108390]
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ap poll 1990s final ranking
Dec 6, 2012, 8:03 PM
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1990 AP National Champions: 1990 Colorado - 1991 Miami - 1992 Alabama - 1993 Florida St - 1994 Nebraska - 1995 Nebraska - 1996 Florida - 1997 Michigan - 1998 Tennessee - 1999 Florida St
RANK TEAM POINTS
1 Florida State 231
2 Florida 194
3 Nebraska 172
4 Tennessee 163
5 Michigan 154
6 Penn State 146
7 Miami, Fla. 137
T8 Alabama 117
T8 Ohio State 117
10 Colorado 116
11 Texas A&M 115
12 Notre Dame 105
13 Kansas St 95
14 Washington 78
15 Virginia Tech 70
16 Auburn 67
17 Georgia 65
18 Wisconsin 62
19 UCLA 54
20 Syracuse 53
21 North Carolina 50
22 Arizona 44
23 Georgia Tech 48
24 Texas 43
25 Iowa 42
others receiving votes
26 BYU 36
27 Arizona St 34
T28 USC 33
T28 Wash St 33
30 Oregon 30
T31 Michigan St 29
T31 Northwestern 29
T33 Clemson 28
ap poll 2000s final ranking
2000 AP National Champions: 2000 Oklahoma - 2001 Miami - 2002 Ohio State - 2003 USC - 2004 USC - 2005 Texas - 2006 Florida - 2007 LSU - 2008 Florida - 2009 Alabama
1 Texas 190
2 Oklahoma 170
3 USC 168
4 Ohio State 158
5 Florida 141
6 LSU 134
7 Georgia 127
8 Miami 125
9 Virginia Tech 122
10 Michigan 96
11 Boise State 93
12 Oregon 90
13 Auburn 84
14 Iowa 79
15 Alabama 78
16 Florida State 71
17 Penn State 70
18 TCU 67
19 West Virginia 62
20 Tennessee 61
21 Utah 59
22 Nebraska 57
23 Louisville 56
24 Wisconsin 54
25 Washington State 49
OTHERS RECEIVING VOTES
BYU 48
Kansas State 48
Notre Dame 46
Boston College 39
Maryland 37
Mississippi 37
Texas Tech 37
Cincinnati 36
Oregon State 36
California 30
Washington 30
Missouri 29
Georgia Tech 28
Clemson 26
scoring system
The AP rankings might now be irrelevant since they don't have anything to do with determining a national champion anymore, but they're still great to use when analyzing college football on a historical scale.
Around since 1936, the AP college football poll has been through World War II, has changed and adapted with the times, and has often looked to make a statement when needed - like in 2003 by naming USC the national champion, even though LSU took home the BCS title..
Since the AP poll is the only consistent ranking system from 1936 through today, CFN came up with a scoring system to compare and contrast how the programs finished over the decades. Every time a team finished No. 1 in the final poll, it got 25 points. The No. 2 team got 24 points, No. 3 got 23 points, and so on. Through the decades, the AP ranked the top ten teams for a few years before going back to the top 20 rankings, and eventually, the it went to the top 25 system it's at now.
According to the scoring system, consistent production isn't necessarily rewarded. For example, if a team finished 17th for four straight years, it would get a total of 36 points (No. 17 gets 9 points). A team that finished the beginning of the decade No. 2 (24 points) and the end of the decade ranked tent
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Orange Blooded [3677]
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Re: ap poll 1990s final ranking
Dec 6, 2012, 8:07 PM
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I am guessing there is a point somewhere in this ?
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Heisman Winner [108390]
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i guessed most were bright enough to use the data
Dec 6, 2012, 8:18 PM
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as they saw fit. was i wrong about you?
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Orange Blooded [3677]
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No, I could pull that up too
Dec 6, 2012, 8:32 PM
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We were discussing our position in the ACC.
I think it is pretty good. Love where we are compared to TB. Falling a bit short of the Danny Ford era, but to be honest, that got boring.
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Heisman Winner [108390]
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so if you know it's a ranking system for where programs
Dec 6, 2012, 8:38 PM
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stood in the 90s and 00s then what's your issue?
gratz on being able to pull it up too, but you didn't.
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Orange Blooded [3677]
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do you live in Chicago, or near
Dec 6, 2012, 8:46 PM
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If so ...we use to go back and forth a bit, talk about Twin Peaks and such.
I have been away for about 18 months, I recognize the bite !
Va. guy I am thinking, Richmod or w & M
close ?
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Heisman Winner [108390]
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william n mary is the only college named after 2 queens, but
Dec 6, 2012, 8:49 PM
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also an excellent school.
washington and lee.
not going back and forth. it's just information. it doesn't pick a side.
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Orange Blooded [3677]
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Dang I should have remembered Washington and Lee
Dec 6, 2012, 8:55 PM
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no , I love going back and forth. But i learned years ago not to go against you. enjoyed your opinions and conversation back then.
Like I say, I have been gone and got you confused with completelysolid orange, sorry.....I know that must floor you....lol
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Heisman Winner [108390]
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dammmmm you!!!!! haha. i miss good conversations, my momma
Dec 6, 2012, 8:57 PM
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turned me into a ####### earlier or so i was told.
hope all's well with you and yours.
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Orange Blooded [3677]
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same to you
Dec 6, 2012, 9:00 PM
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still in the windy city ? Still in Houston but made it home for the Thanksgiving weekend.
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Heisman Winner [108390]
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nah, chicago is in my rearview now for a couple years. this
Dec 6, 2012, 9:06 PM
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time of year i miss it none too much. well, not at all tbh.
in greenville now, closer to family which is great. chicago was great, met some great people, had some great great fun, but good to back in the est.
thanksgiving is a great time to make it home or always was for me. good for you.
be well, headin out for a bit.
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Orange Blooded [3677]
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Peace !***
Dec 6, 2012, 9:10 PM
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Orange Blooded [2929]
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Re: ap poll 1990s final ranking
Dec 7, 2012, 9:24 AM
[ in reply to ap poll 1990s final ranking ] |
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The most interesting part of your poat...
From 1990 to 2005 (a 16 year period), the SEC only won 3 national championships.
Interesting that the 6 year streak started around the same time as the ESECPN deal....
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Orange Blooded [2441]
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I'm with you. Add to that the fact that we have only won
Dec 6, 2012, 8:05 PM
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the conference once in the last 20 years or so. It's not like we are dominating the league and the other schools are making us look bad. Now if we were dominating the league like FSU was back in the 90's, I think we would have every right to bash the conference and its lack of commitment in general to football.
And also remember, before expansion became en vogue, Swofford moved to get Miami (which everyone thought was the big prize) and to expand the ACC footprint to the northeast with Syracuse and BC (exactly what the SEC, PAC 12, Big 12 and Big 10 have done since). Even after Va power-played Va Tech's way into the conference, it appeared the ACC had gotten much better in football and solidified its future. I blame the individual schools more than Swofford for the ACC's current state.
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Legend [16120]
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Battered Wife Syndrome... I guess it's our fault the ACC
Dec 6, 2012, 8:37 PM
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sucks...
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Rock Defender [53]
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Re: Watchout, the kool-aid drinking
Dec 6, 2012, 8:37 PM
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will TD you for that!! If that really matters!! LMAO!!
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Associate AD [833]
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Facts are stubborn things
Dec 6, 2012, 8:45 PM
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I am not against leaving the ACC but it is a fact that when we have chances on a national stage we wet the bed more times than not
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Oculus Spirit [93608]
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There is no relationship between...
Dec 6, 2012, 8:48 PM
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the ACC suckhood and Clemson furnishing ### to USCe. Until we can win the state there is no reason to look for greener pastures in another conference.
Actually, most worry about being left out of the national picture "next," year. Every year, we worry about next year. We are starting to sound quite cootishful lately.
We should beat everybody on our schedule and suffer some real damage then we'll have something to bich about.
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All-Pro [669]
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very true***
Dec 6, 2012, 8:58 PM
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110%er [7913]
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agreed***
Dec 6, 2012, 9:25 PM
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110%er [6468]
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Re: Do Clemson fans have any right to trash the ACC?
Dec 6, 2012, 10:00 PM
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I think we would be a stronger program if we played a tougher schedule. Being in the ACC allows us to suck and still have a good record every year.
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All-In [39020]
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The arguments are the same.
Dec 6, 2012, 11:10 PM
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We are soft because we play in the ACC. If we played better competition on an annual basis, we would HAVE to become stronger in order to be competitive, which the boosters require. Right now we look competitive, and are in fact more than competitive in the ACC. As soon as we play an out of conference game against a quality opponent, we get exposed.
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Walk-On [149]
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Re: Do Clemson fans have any right to trash the ACC?
Dec 7, 2012, 1:36 AM
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Yes, it's our fault for not representing our conference by winning games outside of the conference. The ACC has the brand name schools to be successful such as FSU, VT, Miami, GT, and even schools like NC. However, I think we are losing the BIG games because of a few factors. First, I believe that we lack a mental toughness that is required to make a statement. Teams in the SEC have a mind set that they are the best. We've all seen that by all of the ridiculous LSU fans lately. I truly believe that they believe we can beat them, and that we might be the better team. The question is does our player believe? Our fans? It's a mindset you have to have.
My next point about the ACC, and how we fail on the BIG stage is that we don't play teams who push us physically and mentally. I Feel like this never allows our players to develop a mentality that they need to push through when they don't score every drive, or things are not going our way. How many games this year did we really get challenged? We need more adversity to help our players develop a mindset crucial to be nationally recognizable, and worthy. We need to play teams that are better or just as good as we are. Mainly, we need the rest of the conference to recruit and play to their potential. We can beat LSU as far as athletic ability. It all comes down to mentality.
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Orange Blooded [2609]
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Re: Do Clemson fans have any right to trash the ACC?
Dec 7, 2012, 9:13 AM
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No we are the top representative unlike how the coots represent the bottom of the sec but are just dang glad to be in it...
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All-TigerNet [10866]
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The ACC is bad for Clemson.
Dec 7, 2012, 9:17 AM
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This place is special, and we belong in the SEC. We have the stadium, the fans, the enthusiasm, the college town, the ability to recruit, the booster club, the tradition, the history, etc, etc, etc. We are better than the rest of the ACC in this respect - we are a real football school, and we're stuck in a basketball conference.
As to our performance in recent history - yes I agree, we suck. This is a great reason to leave the ACC and go to a real football conference like the SEC. Only in the ACC could our horrible coaches get by with the mediocrity and failure that they continue to present us year in and year out, for about the last 20 years or so, and still keep their jobs. The ACC let Tommy Bowden stick around for 10 years. In a real football conference, these jokes of coaches wouldn't last 2 years. Clemson would be forced to grow up and get real about the coaching staff, instead of hiring a cheerleader WR coach, or else.
For this reason alone I support moving to a real football conference.
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All-TigerNet [14233]
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BOOM!
Dec 7, 2012, 9:24 AM
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If Clemson takes care of business and beats WVU, The Coots, and any other non-conference team worth a darn, the view of the ACC is changed.
Same for FSU. Beat UF and perspective changes.
Luckilly Clemson has another chance to change things for the ACC.
Beat LSU and beat UGA. Then everything changes
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Orange Blooded [2111]
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Re: Do Clemson fans have any right to trash the ACC?
Dec 7, 2012, 9:28 AM
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I think it has as much to do with those other schools lack of commitment to football as it does the winning and losing. What big time recruit wants to go play in front of 15000 at Wallace Wade or who wants to watch Wake play Miami in front of 500.
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Legend [15730]
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Additionally, although I am diappointed in Maryland for
Dec 7, 2012, 9:42 AM
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managing their affairs so poorly that they HAD to jump ship, one of the issues in the ACC is trust, and Clemson and FSU may have really inflated that issue with the Big 12 issues this summer.
I've always believed that if we stay together, we'll be a good conference. But IF Clemson and FSU used the Big 12 talk as a leverage point with the conference, no doubt it would spook schools like VT, NCSU, UNC, UVA, GT and Maryland. Schools that belong in the ACC but know that they have things to offer the Big 10 and SEC and, hey, you know they don't want to try to prop up this conference if Clemson and FSU leave.
But back to your original point - while it is true that we have contributed to the image of the ACC recently with our Orange Bowl performance and our South Carolina losing streak, we also show a huge administrative commitment to the sport that pays most of the bills. I think that is the difference between Clemson and some of the other schools in the ACC (at least that is the argument).
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110%er [7219]
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Re: Do Clemson fans have any right to trash the ACC?
Dec 7, 2012, 10:09 AM
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I am with you. No need to trash the ACC. It does a fine job of trashing itself.
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