Topic: Brad Brownell has
Replies: 17   Last Post: Feb 17, 2019 4:01 PM by: PetesPonies
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Brad Brownell has

Posted: Feb 16, 2019 10:20 PM

Clemson competing consistently in the top half of the ACC. Maybe not with Duke, UNC and UVA right now. But there is no other team in the league that Clemson does not compete with and beat over the last few years. While running a clean program, graduating players and as far as I can see not getting in the weeds with recruiting. I bet there are at least 6-8 ACC schools including some with a much more storied basketball history than clemson who would be thrilled to have Brownell as coach and be where Clemson basketball is right now. He also beats our in state rival lately. Good time to be a Clemson basketball fan. And with the last 2 recruiting classes along with the one coming in next year it only gets better.

Good points.

Posted: Feb 16, 2019 10:22 PM

We need that one big recruit to push Brownell and cu basketball over the hump

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We need more than 1 blue chip recruit

Posted: Feb 17, 2019 1:27 PM

We need for Brownell to take the good talent / transfers and coach them up into great players. We need to see players progress under him - not stagnate or regress (as is the pattern).

This team of seniors went to the sweet 16 last season - this season they won’t even make the tournament. Can it be any clearer that Brownell isn’t capable of building a program? He can’t even get the SAME results from one season to the next.

Whether the next coach will fare better, only time will tell; but it is CLEAR that Clemson basketball will never go very far under Brad Brownell. You and Judge Keller can wish that weren’t the case all day and until the cow’s come home; doesn’t change a thing.

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Re: Good points.

Posted: Feb 17, 2019 4:01 PM

Two recruits. Basketball needs two top players ,on a team, to be at the top with the best schools.

We are so close it's maddening.

Posted: Feb 16, 2019 10:31 PM

A big recruit or two that didn't choose us at the 11th hour, a few shots that fell for the other team and not for us. Arrgh!

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Brad Brownell: all-time winningest coach in Clemson men's basketball history, and only coach to beat North Carolina in Chapel Hill.

Re: Brad Brownell has

Posted: Feb 16, 2019 11:00 PM

I believe the Clemson brand is better than ever and that has to help recruiting along with our investment in the program with the new Little John!

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The best is yet to come!! I’m so grateful for Clemson Football going into the 2020’s

We can be better.

Posted: Feb 16, 2019 11:05 PM

It's not all Brownell's fault (this was discussed earlier), but at this point, I am not convinced he's part of the solution either. In my opinion, Brownell is a great guy and a very good coach, and I wish things were different for his sake, but I think he's approaching the end of his run here.

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"Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard."
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I agree on all points.

Posted: Feb 17, 2019 10:57 AM

I’m hoping for a few things:

1. A great end to this season. Finding a way to rally and make the Big Dance would help with momentum a lot.
2. That we get great improvement next year from Simms, Trapp, Jemison, and White.
3. That Jonathan Baehre provides nice minutes down low next year.
4. That our 35th ranked class for 2019 is even better than advertised. I truly think it will be, as Dawes and Hemenway are the tough PG and great shooter, respectively, we so desperately need.

I don’t think next year will be as awful as we sometimes think. Whether it will be enough to save Brownell’s job, I don’t know.

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Brad Brownell: all-time winningest coach in Clemson men's basketball history, and only coach to beat North Carolina in Chapel Hill.

Re: Brad Brownell has

Posted: Feb 17, 2019 2:06 AM

He also has us in the tourney. But we can be bettter.


Re: Brad Brownell has

Posted: Feb 17, 2019 7:08 AM

No, he has us in the need work to do category. We are nowhere near being in yet.

Re: Brad Brownell has

Posted: Feb 17, 2019 7:49 AM

Under the comments it says 10-11 seed as of now. But we lose vs FSU it would pretty much end it.

Re: Brad Brownell has

Posted: Feb 17, 2019 7:05 AM

Not including this season(still in progress but not looking good for advancing to the NCAA's)he is 72-80 in ACC play and has finished in the top tier only twice while finishing in the middle, or bottom of the pack or 6 times. If that is being consistent in playing in the top half of the league, I would hate to see your definition of inconsistency.
Like you say forget Duke, UNC, or even Virginia, he has made the tournament only twice, and his best year was last when he made the Sweet sixteen with a senior-laden team.
I will admit he runs a clean program and avoiding the weeds, but "recruiting" leaves a lot to be desired.
But the problems I am seeing this season, and in the past is this; Clemson can't seem to keep from tripping over their own two feet in the closing minutes of a ball game.
At 5-7 we have lost 6 games on the road, and I know of three where we let leads get away in the final minute.
Whether or not the next two seasons get better is yet to be determined.
Next year is not the issue. This year is. And the main issue is how to turn consistent buzzer-beating losses into wins.
But unless the coach, the assistants, the players, or even the cheerleaders figure out a way to close out a game, this season will not go down as being consistent, unless of course you look at close losses as being consistent.

"Mediocre is the standard!"

Posted: Feb 17, 2019 8:23 AM

It just doesn't have the same ring to it.

(Kind of like your pulse.)

Re: "Mediocre is the standard!"

Posted: Feb 17, 2019 9:40 AM

I love you bengalbilly and I hope you will consider having my next baby. I don't know what a pulse is. But the fact that you are concerned about my pulse makes me feel like I am in good hands and don't need to worry about it. Thank you for caring.

Tell em, coot!***

Posted: Feb 17, 2019 10:39 AM

FWIW i was working on a big post the other day about

Posted: Feb 17, 2019 11:51 AM

Brownell vs what we should actually expect from Clemson basketball from looking at 40+ years of our history (Foster era through to today). I decided not to post it because it was too long and involved a lot of numbers - things that aren't typically received well here, but i will post a synopsis and my conclusions (which is still going to be pretty long, sorry).

I looked at how Brad stacked up with our previous 5 coaches in 4 areas - overall winning %, ACC winning %, NCAA appearances, and talent acquisition.

Brad was fairly average in overall winning % but lagged behind our more successful coaches (Purnell, Barnes, and Ellis) by several % points. I did find it interesting that all 3 of those guys were right around 61% during their Clemson tenures and no Clemson coach has ever won a higher %. That does kind of suggest a theoretical ceiling for what we can expect at Clemson.

Brad was pretty significantly ahead of everyone in ACC winning %. I think a pretty strong argument can be made that expansion has watered down the ACC a bit and made it easier to win conference games in 2019 than 1992, but he was still substantially ahead of most of our coaches and even outpaced Purnell who coaches in a similar are of ACC basketball. In fact, Purnell coached during some of the weakest years for ACC basketball that i can remember.

Brad was maybe slightly below average in NCAA appearances, but he did trail Barnes and Purnell by a substantial margin. Barnes made the tournament in 3/4 years including his final 3 and likely would've made it 4 in a row if he had stayed. Ditto for Purnell who made the tourney 3/7 years including his final 3 and likely would've made it 4 in a row. The success of Barnes and Purnell proves that more is possible at Clemson in terms of making the tournament.

Talent acquisition was really the most difficult thing to assess and it was difficult to draw conclusions. Recruiting rankings only date back to around 2002ish and looking at NBA draft picks only gives an idea of how many star players coaches were recruiting and doesn't accurate gauge the talent level of the entire roster. I did find that Foster and Ellis produced far more draft picks than our more reason coaches and also numerous high draft picks (top 20ish), the likes of which we haven't seen since. When compared to Barnes, Shyatt, and Purnell, Brad was fairly average at producing draft picks, but just from watching the teams during those eras i think Brad's overall talent level has been closer to Shyatt's than Purnell or Barnes.

Overall conclusions:

1) Brad has really cost himself NCAA tournament bids by struggling early in the year in non-conference games. That shouldn't come as any surprise to people that follow Clemson basketball, but Brad has two teams in particular, 2014 and 2016 that both finished 10-8 in the ACC and both really shouldve made the tournament but those teams lost 5 and 6 non-conference games, respectively, and many of those losses were to bad teams. With his success in the conference it is a little puzzling as to why his teams struggle to consistently beat bad competition in the first two months of the season. How much differently would we think of Brad right now if he had made 4/8 NCAA tournaments. Quite a lot i think.

2) I think it is fair to expect more out of recruiting. Bad facilities or not, Brad is the 2nd worst recruiter we've had out of the last 6 coaches and his talent level, while higher than Shyatt's, trails the other 4 coaches pretty significantly IMO. The poor facilities excuse has some merit, but most of these other coaches dealt with similar issues while at Clemson and had more success.

3) While it is fair to expect a little more out of Clemson basketball, Brad really hasn't been bad in an historical context. He's consistently competitive in the ACC and runs a very clean program. As long as he's at Clemson we aren't likely to be an ACC doormat. If we fire Brad it's probably going to be a 50/50 proposition as to whether the next coach will be better or worse. And if that coach is better will he stay? Like it or not, Clemson basketball isn't a destination program for coaches. If we bring in a young up-and-comer and he does well, it's fairly likely he does something like leave after 4 years to take the Texas job. While the Purnell situations was admittedly bizarre, we do have to acknowledge that 2 of the most successful coaches in Clemson history left the school at the height of their success to take other jobs. If we find another successful coach can we keep him?

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Re: FWIW i was working on a big post the other day about

Posted: Feb 17, 2019 2:05 PM

so 12-15 more years of 16-14,10=10 records to look forward to? i guess it's a given but i don't get the raise and extension for last year. isn't that what he;s supposed to do 1 out of 9 seasons? imo it's like with bowden and arkansas. if they want you the by all means go asap

I'm not saying that. What i am saying is that 12-15 more

Posted: Feb 17, 2019 2:11 PM

years of seasons like that is fairly likely no matter who we hire. Except if we change coaches there's likely going to be more variance. For instance we could fire Brad and hire a coach that averages 20 wins for 4 years before taking a better job and then his replacement stinks and only wins 13 games a year until we fire him. And then eventually we will end up with another guy like Brad who's just good enough to stick around for quite awhile.

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