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Legend [19587]
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These are inescapable realities about basketball right now
Mar 15, 2017, 10:41 AM
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1) There really is no way to view next year except as a rebuild
2) If Brad is retained you have to extend his contract at least one year or recruiting becomes almost impossible and he is essentially a lame duck
3) Fan interest is at a low point since Shyatt's last seasons
4) The on the court results clearly have not been there
5) Off the court there are positives
Now, I can inject all kinds of opinion. I feel the culture is stale. We need to fully capitalize on the new facilities. We have no on court identity. We are undisciplined in our play.
But the first four realities are to me inescapable, and outweigh the positives off the court. With them in mind, is the status quo the best way to proceed or is a change of direction the better path?
Other than money, which can be negotiated, what is the case for the status quo?
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All-TigerNet [12942]
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Brad has had to overcome a lot to get to where we are
Mar 15, 2017, 10:45 AM
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3 straight NCAATs
appearance in ACCTCG
unexpected leaving of 2nd round NBA guy
new facilities
best team he has put on the floor in 7 years
at some point, you have to cut him some slack for having to overcome those things
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Legend [19587]
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You forgot
Mar 15, 2017, 10:58 AM
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We're a football school
The ACC is really tough
We don't take juco's
We are a rural school
Lost three assistant's to head coaching jobs
No tradition
3.5 million
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110%er [7913]
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1st Rounder [648]
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Re: you really do....you just can't expect a guy to succeed
Mar 15, 2017, 11:06 AM
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That's bs! He's done a poor job as coach. Can you name any other school in a power 5 conference that would keep him besides Clemson?
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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duck***
Mar 15, 2017, 11:08 AM
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110%er [7913]
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Varsity [231]
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1st Rounder [648]
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Re: These are inescapable realities about basketball right now
Mar 15, 2017, 11:01 AM
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Would adding one year be enough? Most recruits follow the schools recruiting them. They are well aware of Brownells lame duck status. A long extension is out of the question.
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110%er [7913]
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the only way you extend him beyond this year is to cut
Mar 15, 2017, 11:04 AM
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the buyout way down...we will give you this but you give us that so even then you're at a point where recruits would know you're still on shaky ground. When you get to this point it's so rare to see it turn out well. Energy and excitement aren't there for the program.
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Legend [19587]
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Yes, and I'd include staff changes
Mar 15, 2017, 11:11 AM
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Hard to argue that things have not gone stale
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110%er [7913]
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when you get to a point of demanding staff changes
Mar 15, 2017, 11:12 AM
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what's the point of continuing forward together...by that point you've obviously lost the faith of your boss.
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Legend [19587]
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Kind of the point
Mar 14, 2021, 10:32 PM
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if Brad balks and walks, so be it. Even if he is kept surely all involved know the status quo is not acceptable
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110%er [7913]
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if you're unhappy with him to that point just negotiate
Mar 15, 2017, 11:21 AM
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a deal and wipe the slate clean
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Legend [19587]
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Would Leggett have received more time if he'd
Mar 15, 2017, 11:24 AM
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have changed pitching coaches? Sometimes these type things are part of the negotiating process. Helps you come to a mutual agreement
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110%er [7913]
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possible....sometimes guys with egos push back and
Mar 15, 2017, 11:33 AM
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obviously you're trying at that point to get push back for a desired outcome.
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Legend [19587]
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I really feel we're at a crossroads
Mar 15, 2017, 11:37 AM
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and keeping things as is seems like the wrong direction. Even if Brad is retained, some changes are needed
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Orange Blooded [2550]
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Re: These are inescapable realities about basketball right now
Mar 15, 2017, 11:06 AM
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The only case for status quo would be if a suitable replacement is not available or willing to come to Clemson at this time.
I would rather waste this rebuilding year and wait for a situation that is likely to be better than what we have now than to make another 5 year mistake.
Change for the sake of change is not necessarily smart.
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110%er [7913]
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definitely see that happen often...happened at GT two years
Mar 15, 2017, 11:08 AM
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ago....they couldn't find a good replacement for Gregory so he was given another year...it was painful because everyone could see it coming from a mile away.
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All-TigerNet [12942]
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what is "suitable"... -- and does it really matter?
Mar 15, 2017, 11:08 AM
[ in reply to Re: These are inescapable realities about basketball right now ] |
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we've gone from a solid NCAAT program to where we are now-- which is SIGNIFICANT steps backwards... What is the difference in a new guy that takes time to rebuild and BB another 3 years or so?
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Legend [19587]
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110%er [7913]
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you might be able to get Will Wade to come home
Mar 15, 2017, 11:11 AM
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with the new facilities if you give him $ for assistants and recruiting budget.
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Legend [19587]
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As a potential long term fit
Mar 15, 2017, 11:12 AM
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Wade would seem to be a top of the list guy.
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110%er [7913]
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He's a guy you could hopefully build around for years to
Mar 15, 2017, 11:14 AM
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come with his connection may stay if he has success.
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Orange Blooded [2550]
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Re: Agreed, but with the new facilities
Mar 15, 2017, 11:16 AM
[ in reply to Agreed, but with the new facilities ] |
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You may well be right, but I would think that DRad is exploring these possibilities, and right now, is the only one who really knows what interest there is.
I firmly believe that if there was such a coach at this time, then negotiations would be ongoing.
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Legend [19587]
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Would be done through agents at this point
Mar 15, 2017, 11:18 AM
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as the guys you'd be targeting are in the tourney. There are numerous quality guys out there
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Legend [16132]
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will they come to Clemson is the question***
Mar 15, 2017, 12:22 PM
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Legend [19587]
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A Pat Kelsey would fit sure
Mar 15, 2017, 12:24 PM
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no comparison between Winthrop and us. I actually think with the facilities we'd garner a lot of interest from some young guns
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110%er [7718]
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Legend [16132]
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no, it can get worse***
Mar 15, 2017, 2:20 PM
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Legend [19587]
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It surely can
Mar 15, 2017, 2:22 PM
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It can get worse by keeping him or moving on. Question is where is your best chance to try to get better
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Legend [16132]
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and that is the Million Dollar Question Striperfan***
Mar 15, 2017, 4:40 PM
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All-In [28349]
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Re: and that is the Million Dollar Question Striperfan***
Mar 15, 2017, 4:47 PM
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sirius question - wouldn't you like to see, after 7 yrs, someone burning the midnight oil recruiting? end game situations approached differently? playing the right personnel? advancing and being a threat in acc tourney? getting an ncaa bid?
if every team sat back and let things just happen, without making any changes, well, we would not be national football champions.
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110%er [7718]
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Re: and that is the Million Dollar Question Striperfan***
Dec 15, 2021, 4:52 PM
[ in reply to and that is the Million Dollar Question Striperfan*** ] |
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I would rahter try to get better and have the possibility of getting worse than to tread water doing the same #### over and over again with a failure of a coach.
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All-TigerNet [13038]
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#2 is the one that really worries me.***
Mar 15, 2017, 11:25 AM
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Orange Blooded [4098]
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Re: These are inescapable realities about basketball right now
Mar 15, 2017, 11:35 AM
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Why in the world are U worried about RECRUITING??????????? Our recruiting has been nonexistent for all the years that BB has been here!!The only recruits we get are those that no other power conf team will have!!
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Legend [19587]
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This latest class isn't bad
Mar 15, 2017, 12:18 PM
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Simms had multiple ACC offers. William was offered by WVU. Oliver would have had major offers had he not committed so early and enrolled in January.
You have to consider it. If you're retaining him you have to give him the chance to recruit, meaning he needs at least a 4 year deal. It's not the direction I go, but it's part of the things you have to consider
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1st Rounder [648]
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Re: This latest class isn't bad
Mar 15, 2017, 12:29 PM
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Maybe but given the current state of the program, there is no way you can give Brownell 4 more years. Drad won't put his neck on the line for another bad contract.
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Legend [19587]
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I never said that
Mar 15, 2017, 12:35 PM
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but if you're sticking with him, you have to give him the chance to recruit. A three year deal gives him no chance
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1st Rounder [648]
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Re: I never said that
Mar 15, 2017, 1:31 PM
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My bad! Drad is in a horrible situation. Any extension after last night coupled with that big buyout a few years ago looks bad. Maybe he do what he did wth Leggett. Offer him a short extension with changes required in the program. If Brownell refuses those changes, firing him will be easy.
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CU Medallion [58406]
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There is no case that can be made. Any attempt to spin
Mar 15, 2017, 11:54 AM
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it that way is nothing but insulting BS. I don't recall ever having been this disappointed in anything from the Clemson athletic department (should he be retained).
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Replies: 40
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