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CU Medallion [73569]
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You want to know I side with the cops 99.5% of the time
Jul 1, 2020, 2:20 PM
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The George death wasnt one of them. That cop needs to go to jail forever.
But Their life is gone in milliseconds. They have to make split second decisions that could cost their life, orphan babies, leave wives.
Monday morning quarterbacking is easy. You dont get abused by dickheads on a daily basis.
Get guns pulled on you. Get beaten, get spit upon.
No way in #### would i do what they do. I'd be jumpy as #### all the time. A simple traffic stop and this cop is dead.
https://www.policeone.com/officer-down/tulsa-cop-shot-during-traffic-stop-dies-2nd-officer-remains-critical-176lF7GUy9al4SUE/
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All-In [26968]
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I feel the same way..
Jul 1, 2020, 3:01 PM
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Maybe I wouldn't say I "side with" them. But I certainly don't "side against" them. I'd rather leave any judgments up to their superiors. It is not a job I envy, and I think significantly increasing the pay scale for these jobs would make for better police officers, and better policing.
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Oculus Spirit [93668]
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I think perhaps it's not a matter of siding with police.
Jul 1, 2020, 3:18 PM
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I think it's a matter of supporting the laws of our nation, state, cities and towns and fact finding when evidence is provided that indicates or even suggest that police broke the public trust. That sounds a bit like I'm understating police actions which are counter to policy but I am not. Innocent until proven guilty in a court of law by a jury of peers.
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All-In [26968]
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Yes, that's more the way I think of it.
Jul 1, 2020, 3:22 PM
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I don't like "taking sides" in something I'm really not in a position to know enough about. I support right, and good, and I trust the right people to decide what right and good are in these circumstances.
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Oculus Spirit [93668]
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Instant judgement is a way of life for man Americans.
Jul 1, 2020, 8:01 PM
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Of course those who jump to conclusions mostly remain silent to stay about the fray so we only hear the others.
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All-In [26968]
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The worst kind of judgment is always
Jul 2, 2020, 9:33 AM
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a quick judgment.
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Oculus Spirit [83119]
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You give them too much credit. I’d give them
Jul 1, 2020, 4:06 PM
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89.5.
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Rock Defender [53]
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Now taxpayers have to pay for this dirtbag suspect
Jul 1, 2020, 4:13 PM
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All-In [34486]
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It's almost like the cops who do stuff like this,
Jul 1, 2020, 4:53 PM
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and then get to keep their taxpayer-funded job for the next 20 years and draw a pension.
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Rock Defender [53]
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Do you want to compare numbers or
Jul 1, 2020, 5:44 PM
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110%er [7207]
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Here's the thing
Jul 1, 2020, 4:38 PM
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police officers are routinely one of the most respected professions up there with teachers and military. Systemic change doesn't have to be anti cop. It's a dangerous (kinda) profession and I assume lots of them become cops because they want to make a positive change. This is tragic and my guess is that BOTH SIDES want to avoid this from happening.
Let's use a different example; most people probably don't want US military being killed by Taliban. The best way to accomplish that is by not fighting endless wars in the middle east. You see, avoiding the conflict doesn't make you side with the Taliban.
When you post an example like this, you're the Monday morning QB. Knowing how it ended it's easy to say they should have just executed him before he got out of the car. The much tougher thing to do is ask what led to this. Shooting a cop in Oklahoma is quite literally a death sentence, so why would he do it? Did he fear for his life after being tasered and pepper prayed? Is our militarization of the police making it more likely that they'll be shot? This is a real thing where the more you look like a GI Joe the easier it is to justify shooting you because it reinforces the us vs. them mentality. Are we teaching police the best methods if a traffic stop can turn into tasering and pepper spraying which can still somehow lead to both officers being shot and maybe killed?
There are insanely complicated nuances to these issues and in a country the size of America there probably aren't one size fits all solutions, but change isn't always bad and questioning the status quo doesn't mean you're siding with the criminals.
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All-In [40344]
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110%er [7207]
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Yes, more dangerous than average and less dangerous than
Jul 1, 2020, 4:46 PM
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loggers or garbage collectors.
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CU Medallion [60043]
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Re: Yes, more dangerous than average and less dangerous than
Jul 1, 2020, 5:20 PM
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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problem is...
Jul 1, 2020, 4:58 PM
[ in reply to Here's the thing ] |
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1) true, we can avoid engagement with the enemy (the Taliban) by not being in war
2) to make the analogy work, police would have to never enforce any law. "The best way to avoid being killed is not to pull anybody over." "If you don't want to get shot, avoid the Taliban."
3) to make your analogy work, everybody that breaks the law is the enemy (the Taliban). I don't think that is a comparison you want to make.
Are people profiled? Yes. Is it okay? No. It's not right to assume somebody is going to be lawless or unruly because they look a certain way.
Your approach seems to go the other way. We should assume the police officer approaching the car is going to abuse his authority because he looks like a GI Joe.
All police are not great, but I don't know a single profession that is under more scrutiny than law enforcement right now. Should they be held accountable? Yes. But I don't think any of us want to have our every stepped analyzed in this manner at our jobs.
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110%er [7207]
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Re: problem is...
Jul 1, 2020, 5:12 PM
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It doesn't have to be a perfect analogy. The whole point was to move the discussion away from "I side with the cops."
Are cops really under that much scrutiny? Most of the coverage I've seen occurs when someone ends up injured or worse, not typos on their paperwork. To be fair, you're probably talking about not wanting cops to be worried about making the wrong decision in a life or death situation, but they should either be qualified to make the correct decision or not issued a weapon. The better solution is probably to have fewer encounters that end in a life or death situation.
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Oculus Spirit [83625]
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I agree that analogies are rarely perfect...
Jul 1, 2020, 5:22 PM
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I guess the question is did the cops in the OP make the right decisions? Or, if they had shot the people that shot them, would that have been the right decision?
I acknowledge that there are bad cops. I do not assume they will be bad before I encounter them. I never am happy that they pull me over. My experience with cops is I have met some very nice ones and some jerks.
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Lot o points [155907]
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You’re trying a lot harder than I would have
Jul 2, 2020, 12:18 AM
[ in reply to problem is... ] |
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To polish this turd of an analogy.
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Rock Defender [53]
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110%er [7207]
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Thanks for proving my point.***
Jul 1, 2020, 11:55 PM
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Rock Defender [53]
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Bro I’m not proving anything
Jul 2, 2020, 12:09 AM
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110%er [7207]
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Re: Bro I’m not proving anything
Jul 2, 2020, 12:34 AM
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I'm trying to be nice. The whole point is you shouldn't have to choose between cops dying or living.
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All-In [42161]
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Re: You want to know I side with the cops 99.5% of the time
Jul 2, 2020, 10:53 AM
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I've seen several statements in all of this mess from current and former soldiers who explain the protocol they must follow before using deadly force on civilians in foreign countries, and it's far more extensive than what's apparently required of police as they can make "split second" decisions--or not so split second--and get off clean for a bad kill.
We have too many police forces that have exercised bad training philosophies and instilled bad mentalities in a few bad people/idiots (which are the minority in police forces). Yeah, am I going to give the cop the benefit of the doubt if someone reaches quick into their pants? Sure.
But you've got guys like in the Walter Scott shooting who, if there wasn't video of the incident, was going to fabricate a story that made it look like he had to make a split second decision when he really just murdered a guy.
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