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Replies: 22
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Rock Defender [53]
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Hypocrisy of the MSM and the left
Apr 21, 2020, 2:45 PM
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CU Medallion [73569]
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what we have done with testing is pretty incredible imo
Apr 21, 2020, 2:53 PM
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we went from no such test to millions of tests already performed in 6ish weeks to 5 minute tests
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Oculus Spirit [97722]
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You will find we've done more test than anyone on Earth
Apr 21, 2020, 2:58 PM
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And honestly, no virus EVER has been tested as much as this one. And it's really pointless to even get tested until you get admitted to a hospital. The test would have more meaning if they were done randomly, to ascertain the level of community spread and prevalence. Whatever capacity you have to test beyond those admitted to hospitals, they should be used for random community testing.
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All-In [49046]
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All-In [34592]
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and deaths are even lower***
Apr 21, 2020, 3:17 PM
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Rock Defender [53]
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Rock Defender [53]
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Which is another thing Trump was mocked about
Apr 21, 2020, 3:10 PM
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CU Medallion [56087]
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Oculus Spirit [97722]
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I want averages, random studies, no other way to know what
Apr 21, 2020, 3:37 PM
[ in reply to No, "everyone" needs to be tested ] |
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we face. We simply can not ever test everyone for this who feels sick. That will be more tests than we have. Yet that's what we're doing. And we can't keep up with that. But that leaves us clueless about prevalence in the community. In China they perfected a 90%+ accurate way to diagnose without a lab test, using a simple partial CT scan of the lung. They streamlined the process and in 5 minutes could confirm with over 90% accuracy is someone had covid. That frees up tests that can be done in labs among the community, and lets you have a diagnosis for the sick, then also an idea about community spread.
We have 8,000 ct machines in the US. Take half, and they can diagnose 200 people a day each. That's 800,000 tests a day that can be done using half the CT machines in the US. 800,000 less lab tests we have to do, and we end up knowing exactly what we face in communities nationwide with random sampling.
Just a thought. Doesn't mean we'll do it.
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Rock Defender [53]
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You do realize that CT scans run about $1k-$5k apiece
Apr 21, 2020, 3:58 PM
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Oculus Spirit [97722]
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Thats because we take full chest scans, and spend an hour
Apr 21, 2020, 4:31 PM
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per scan, and billing through the nose. You can also line people up and in a partial scan of a section of the lings, that takes 5 minutes, can give an accurate diagnosis. And you can do 200 tests per day.
Again, doesn't mean we will. I expect a week or two on a ventilator in ICU runs in the millions.
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Rock Defender [53]
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You can line up if you want
Apr 21, 2020, 5:20 PM
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Oculus Spirit [97722]
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Sams and Publix for me.
Apr 21, 2020, 6:32 PM
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Do it every two weeks. And all five of us are eating from home 100%. Incredible how much different it is eating 100% from home like I did growing up. Haven't had fast food in a month.
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Legend [16256]
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Random surveillance testing doesn't require testing
Apr 21, 2020, 5:49 PM
[ in reply to No, "everyone" needs to be tested ] |
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every person, and can be performed accurately and in individual settings to provide spread and symptom data that we will NEVER get from the haphazard approach of testing only suspected cases or critical front line folks we've been on since the beginning. Contact tracing would have been effective back in January and February but that is old news and that time has past. What's done is done.
I've always kind of felt like most of us have already been exposed to this to some degree, and the few sample surveillance testings that have taken place seem to be bearing that out. Taking care of yourself and following the distance and hygiene procedures, getting fresh air and exercise, all of this I'm sure helps keep the virus from gathering enough friends together and wreaking havoc on a person. And we've seen what tight quarters and incubating spaces can do in terms of spread and harm.
What I'm curious and more concerned about now is why most models show cases tapering off down to near zero over the summer after peaks this month, when we're no closer to finding a curing agent or vaccine, don't have the data to determine spread, don't have enough data to identify early signs, don't have the data for antibody resilience found in the asymptomatic, and are beginning to scale back the extreme social distancing measures that are proving to be effective in limiting dangerous and overwhelming outbreaks.
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Rock Defender [53]
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Re: Random surveillance testing doesn't require testing
Apr 21, 2020, 6:32 PM
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Legend [15492]
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Re: Hypocrisy of the MSM and the left
Apr 21, 2020, 8:19 PM
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Try doing some research into actual information, not filtered through any media, whether conservative or liberal.
The 2 million came from a study done by the Imperial College in London that showed that if the U.S. didn't do any mitigation, then millions would be infected or die. It listed 3 options and the corresponding fatalities for each option. We chose the last option, full mitigation, no human contact and the effect of the virus will be diminished. This option has worked, so far. It is worth noting that the Imperial College study came out on March 16th, on March 18th Trump addressed the nation as to the seriousness of the Covid-19 threat. On the same day Hannity, Ingraham, Carlson and all the Fox talking heads read very similar statements. Both Trump and Fox News did a complete 180 in a 48 hr. period.
The need for ventilators was very real. The U.S. National Stockpile only held 10,000 ventilators...for a population of 330 million. The stockpile had been diminished during the Obama Administration and it wasn't built back up. Neither did the Trump Administration replenish it. So we got caught with our pants down.
Based on the "projections" by the CDC and the Trump administration, the shortage of ventilators was very real. When the CDC tells NY that you're going to need 30,000 ventilators and they have half that, then of course, there will be a cry for ventilators.
One must remember that the projections that the CDC, the Trump Administration, were putting out, were the guidelines everyone was following and they were trying to be ready for the outbreaks when they occured.
Your characterization of "MSM Hypocracy" is completely backward. The MSM reported exactly what the Trump Administration's CDC was projecting. Remember, the Coronavirus Briefing where the CDC, Fauci, Birx and Trump all said that deaths could be from 100,000 to 240,000. That was the Trump Administration, not CBS, CNN or NBC.
As far as testing, the research shows that the time an infected person is likely to infect another is early on when they themselves feel no symptoms. They learned this from how the virus spread on the USS Roosevelt.
Testing someone after their sick tells you nothing. What we need to know is who is infected, even if they have no symptoms and then isolate them from everyone else. It's common ####### sense.
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Rock Defender [53]
TigerPulse: 90%
Posts: 35
Joined: 11/30/98
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Re: Hypocrisy of the MSM and the left
Apr 21, 2020, 9:02 PM
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Legend [15492]
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Re: Hypocrisy of the MSM and the left
Apr 21, 2020, 9:47 PM
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Felix I get my info from a lot of places, including all of the links in that article. It’s funny you’re now apparently trying to blame Trump even for what they said. You’re a joke.
Btw turns out the mortality rate is now estimated between .1-.3% according to a study by U of So Cal and LA Health dept. But please keep ranting about your bs and Trump.
Not sure why you want to make these discussions so personal, but have at it. What "they said" came from Trump's administration. The CDC and the NIH are part of the Trump administration. It was their projections everyone was reporting.
And the decrease in mortality rate is a direct result of more testing in THAT study. But, if you look at the mortality rate from the CDC it's at 5.38%.
Like any President, Trump is the head of the govt and head of the response to this Pandemic, whether it goes good or bad, the President is ultimately responsible.
I don't understand where you see the hypocrisy? The MSM reports what it sees. Is it biased, of course it is. But it's no more biased than conservative media. That's why they call it "conservative media". So where's the hypocricy? The CDC IS the Trump administration.
(Mortality: CDC updated April 21. ?776,093 cases; ?41,758 deaths = 5.38% mortality.)
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/cases-updates/cases-in-us.html
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Rock Defender [53]
TigerPulse: 90%
Posts: 35
Joined: 11/30/98
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Re: Hypocrisy of the MSM and the left
Apr 21, 2020, 10:08 PM
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Legend [15492]
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Re: Hypocrisy of the MSM and the left
Apr 21, 2020, 11:53 PM
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What the MSM reported in Jan. and Feb. was mostly Trump mischaracterizing the threat of Pandemic. The U.S. Military Medical Intelligence warned Trump of a virus circulating in China in November that could be a threat to U.S. forces in Asia and would be catastrophic if it were to enter the U.S. Now those are facts.
There is no hope for anyone who can simply ignore facts. The mortality rate isn't some fantasy 'guess' as to estimated cases and then use actual known deaths in order to calculate mortality. The mortality rate of cancer last year was the number of cancer deaths divided by the number of cancer cases. Now, in a Pandemic, people want to 'guestimate' cases and then come up with some number of mortality. That's nonsense.
The same people who mimicked Trump in the beginning and said the this was the Dems. new hoax, are now the same people who are saying the very restrictions that minimized potential deaths should be removed because they violate their constitutional rights. Again, they/you attempt to minimize the danger of the Pandemic because they appear to think that helps Trump. It's really quite amazing and contrary to Trump's own administration.
Just today, Trump's director of the CDC says the 2nd wave of this virus will likely coincide with the flu season and overwhelm our healthcare system. It is astonishing to me how people don't seem to understand the concept of contagion. AND the MSM is reporting it. This is from the Trump Administration, not CNN,NYTimes, MSNBC...this is Trump!
https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2020/04/21/coronavirus-secondwave-cdcdirector/
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Rock Defender [53]
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Trump didn't make them say any of that stuff
Apr 22, 2020, 12:38 AM
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Legend [15492]
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Re: Trump didn't make them say any of that stuff
Apr 22, 2020, 12:57 AM
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The media reflected what it was being told. They cover Trump and report what Trump says, does, doesn't do, and covers him incessantly. They don't just make up stories. Now, of course, they have talking heads too. If you watch Lawrence O'Donell on MSNBC Trump is Satan and is bringing about the end of mankind. It's the same kind of opinion you see in conservative media, just the opposite flavor.
Ultimately, it is my view that the media is a very large problem in our country. People listen to O'Donell's opinion and take it as fact. That's misleading and dangerous. It may not be intended that way, but that's how it comes across.
I have little doubt that Laura Ingraham is sincere in her conservatism. But at the same time, intended or not, people can take her opinion and perceive it as fact. That is dangerous.
Both examples are networks that are owned by corporations and operate for profit.
Here's how, in my humble opinion, this argument tends to go. People who receive their news from an outlet believe that those who disagree with what they've heard and believe, are either corrupt or willfully ignorant. Let's call this phenomenon "PerceptionZero".
The source of the information doesn't matter, the argument and belief are the same no matter the source whether conservative or MSM.
In my view, the media is part of the problem. You annoy me and pisz me off, and I annoy you and pizs you off. We experience this because each of us operates, knowingly or unknowingly via "PerceptionZero.
I did send you an email and I was truly sincere. But, as you say, I can be arrogant and insulting. It's wrong, but it happens. Humans can be ugly. And we're both humans. This doesn't have to be as personal as it has been. I can insult as easily as you can. Let's try not to and try to get beyond the basis of the problem.
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Rock Defender [53]
TigerPulse: 90%
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You just went in about 10 different directions
Apr 22, 2020, 1:17 AM
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