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Replies: 15
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Team Captain [459]
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RECRUITING
Feb 7, 2019, 8:32 PM
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SB Nation has an article showing the recruiting averages for the last 4 years.(theirs)
While recruiting rankings are important, it is clear by the 4 year averages that good recruiting does not automatically correlate to wins and losses. For example, LSU @ #3, Florida #5, A & M @ #8, and Texas @ 9, hardly have lived up to their recruiting Status. Alabama, meanwhile. @ #1 has been the standard. UGA @ #2 has begun to ascend up the ranks the last 2 years. Meanwhile, Little Ole Clemson, defies the rankings coming in @ #10, and winning 2 of 3 National Championships. How does Dabo do it?
1. Consistency in Coaching Continuity-low turnover
2 Great Coordinators-BV always gets the most out of the D, The OC's are not too shabby either.
3. QB play-In both Championship years/games was superior to opponents
4. Retaining those recruits-Feb is not near as important as 2 years later-having lower turnover-this year 3 high draft eligible players returned for their Senior year. They were vital.
5. Team Unity-Buy in-Swinney just continues to reinvent ways to inspire his team. The last four years, He has managed to have the exact same record as Alabama 55-4, an equal record to them head to head and 2-1 in the NC.
6. Great player evaluation. Hunter Renfro-Grady Jarrett come to mind.
So when the pundits say, Alabama is the better team, what they are mean is that Alabama has more players that will one day play one Sunday. I agree. But what they miss is that Clemson has found a formula that simply is more potent! THE NUMBERS DON'T LIE!
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All-In [27368]
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Re: RECRUITING
Feb 7, 2019, 8:41 PM
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Player development is also a B I G part of the Tigers successes. That goes back to coaching and I am certainly including the S and C guys in this group! Clemson is no longer a good football team ...... they are a good football program and are noticeably improving!
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CU Guru [1105]
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Re: RECRUITING
Feb 7, 2019, 9:26 PM
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A thing that is rarely mentioned is conditioning, and Batson deserves a lot of credit. I've watched replays of many games since the season ended, and I am convinced that Clemson had the best conditioned players of any of the top teams. Dabo's liberal substitution certainly plays a huge role in keeping players fresh, but our players are in better shape than the other teams.
Some like Terrell, Simmons, and Mullen played entire games and showed no signs of fatigue, and our linemen are never blowing for air like Bama's, regardless of how long they play.
You don't see spare tires around our linesmen's bellies like UGA, Bama, FSU, SC, ND, and most others either. The coots and dawgs could do Michelin commercials with the tires around their bellies.
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Legend [19594]
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#4 is important. Bama and UGA may have the top ranked
Feb 7, 2019, 9:01 PM
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classes, but in reality they are stockpiling future entrants into the tranfer portal. They simply try to mine out the best players from each class, using the portal as a sieve. Meanwhile, Clemson gets young players experience and develops them for future roles.
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CU Guru [1409]
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Re: #4 is important. Bama and UGA may have the top ranked
Feb 7, 2019, 9:39 PM
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This...roster management!
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Commissioner [942]
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Re: RECRUITING
Feb 7, 2019, 9:07 PM
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Okay, I agree to a certain extent. Let's remember, however, that a major component in our success has been our QB, Trevor Lawrence, who was not only a five-star recruit, but the number one recruit in the country when we landed him. Also, our recruiting classes have been in the top ten or fifteen in the nation over the past several years. Recruiting is the fuel that drives the engine, and we will slack off on it at our peril. Alabama is typically ranked number one the country tesm-wise and in recruiting. There's definitely a correlation there. We still have some catching up to do.
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Standout [336]
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Re: RECRUITING
Feb 7, 2019, 9:18 PM
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Don’t forget Vic Beasley and Travis. He was the ranked 13 th RB in his class. WRONG!!!!!! I think Lyn J will prove them wrong too.
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110%er [7173]
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I disagree. Recruiting rankings Don't win NC's
Feb 7, 2019, 9:25 PM
[ in reply to Re: RECRUITING ] |
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Recruiting Rankings don't win National Titles all the time. They don't get you there all the time. It helps a ton. I'll give you that.
I can't help but use Oregon and Boise St. who both had athletes other teams looked over a few years ago(when both were whipping everybody take a look at where they ranked in the recruiting poll, LOL).
I mean, "I think our coaches asked the question: how is that possible?" The answer: RS the big guys as needed. Recruit speed at certain positions. Our WR group rankings are top3 every year if not 1st almost every year. Same with DB. That's the difference between us and Boise St and Oregon - we do get some really good players! Top 10 classes!
As Coach Swinney said, "we probably won't ever win the recruiting title"! He was laughing ear to ear when he said it! Me too! He remembers how dominant Boise St and Oregon were with far and away less talent than we have here at Clemson. And he knows, "good coaching, good schemes and great S&C program" evens the playing field to schools who get the "higher rated players"!
p.s. you all really would have an eye opening experience if you look back at the top recruits who were considered 4 and 5 stars 4 to 15 years ago! You would be amazed at how some of those can't miss prospects never panned out in college! Let alone the NFL. And even more amazed how many 3 star guys ended up in the NFL. All the small schools you have never even heard of when the players announce their schools should be telling you all something! But, sadly like UGA it's not. Or rather, don't ever get it! Our coaches know which kids they want and "don't want" on campus. If the kid is only rated a 3 star so be it. It's the kid they want and they want that kid for a reason. Bellicheck just wins with players everyone else tosses aside! Something else to remember! Scheme and how you prepare means something! It's not just a physical game..........this game of football............if you don't understand that. You will continue believing Georgia has won the National Title b/c they get loads and loads of 4 and 5 star talent! But, let's see about that!
Go Tigers!
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CU Guru [1852]
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Re: I disagree. Recruiting rankings Don't win NC's
Feb 7, 2019, 9:34 PM
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Quick question... how many national championships has Oregon and Boise St won? Blue chip prospects matter 100% and that isn’t debatable. What sets Dabo apart is he gets blue chips rated by services and blue chips that for the culture. Make no mistake... we don’t win the national championship 2 of the last 3 years without 4 and 5 star players. For every Vic and Hunter I’ll raise you a 5 star impact player. We will reload with the 2020 class and win another 3 championships to match our next 3 of 4.
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110%er [7173]
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Re: I disagree. Recruiting rankings Don't win NC's
Feb 8, 2019, 12:40 PM
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ClemsonME08 Again, you fail to understand! I see why your pulse is so low. You have that UGA mentality of if we get all the best players according to ESPN 300 and Rivals and 247 composite, that should equal wins.
Nah!
Oregon and Boise St. didn't win any. Oregon did win a ton of games and in dominating fashion! Boise St. probably should have had the right to play for a couple; but couldn't. Nobody beat them on the field during that time.
When Urban Meyer was at Utah, it's not like he was getting all 4 and 5 star players; yet they were kicking everybody's collective butts. No. He didn't win one there; but it's Utah.
Here at Clemson and this is the part you are missing that I am saying as it relates to Oregon and Boise St. - we have great scheme, great talent evaluation and "enough blue chip prospects to make the difference"! The difference being from being an Oregon who could out scheme you but not get over the hump. We can; because blue chip prospects want to come here. They didn't necessarily want to go to Utah when Urban was there. Yet; he won with what he had!
To suggest only great talent wins championships is to suggest - "there is no need to play the games. Because unless you have more blue chip talent than the other team; you can't win"! And, it takes the coaches ability to coach up talent away!
Again, Hunter Renfrow for the win! He was a walk on that lit up the 5 star laden bamer secondary. Because some recruiting service "missed on him"!
Recruiting service rankings I think can be influenced.
How many blue chip players did App St. have when they went and beat #4 Michigan? Just one of hundreds maybe even thousands of examples of it taking more than just: "recruiting services highly ranked talent polls"!
Clemson Coaches do a tremendous job of hand picking talent! A 3 star kid like Grady Jarrett who is tied for the Super Bowl record in sacks comes to mind.
Jordan Matthews - was skipped over coming out of Alabama! He holds the SEC record in receptions and yards(3759). He was a 3 star recruit. How is that? Again, they miss as much as they get it right(recruiting services that is).
I trust national championship winning coaches more than them! We will be more than fine with this years class!
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Team Captain [459]
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Re: RECRUITING
Feb 8, 2019, 11:52 AM
[ in reply to Re: RECRUITING ] |
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superior QB is point 3. Guessed you missed that
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CU Guru [1052]
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It's like Dabo said..
Feb 7, 2019, 9:19 PM
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He's never had the #1 rated recruiting class and probably never will. Narrow gate mentality. He stated he evaluates a class after their senior year by their accomplishments. I would say his system has been successful.
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CU Guru [1852]
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Re: It's like Dabo said..
Feb 7, 2019, 9:58 PM
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I agree his system has been successful. It’s been a blue chip ratio of around 60% with 2018 bring the standard. No way to put it other than the 2019 class is a depth class that doesn’t meet the blue chip count. As long as 2020 and 2021 does it won’t matter. Just don’t pretend you win national championships with blue chip ratio under 50%.
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Athletic Dir [865]
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The QB is the most important player on the Field
Feb 8, 2019, 12:50 PM
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We have been great over the last 4 years when our QB was great.
A great QB can make the "players" around him look great.
To further illustrate my point.
I think it is obvious that a 5star like TL has a bigger impact on the game/team that a 5star like Big Dex.
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110%er [7173]
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Then How
Feb 8, 2019, 1:07 PM
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I'll give you the QB has to be a gamer! Has to be calm under pressure. The moment can't be too big for whoever it is.
But, his OL had better be able to keep him upright. Our OL is not 5* per the recruiting services! Have they failed? NO.
Our RB's have done well playing behind those 3* guys. Etienne was not rated as high as Feaster coming out of H.S. yet; I think Etienne is a better overall RB. Feaster is great too; just not as good. Most I am sure would agree with that!
I am so happy the coaches play who "they see as the better player" over who the recruiting services! The fans who look at recruiting services evaluations are the fans who run good coaches off. Sometimes the recruiting services are just wrong on their evaluation of a player folks! Sorry!
Hunter Renfrow for example played QB in H.S. Of course, Clemson wasn't going to change to the option to suit his skill set so he could play QB. Would be smallish to take that many hits anyway on an option team as the QB gets hit often even when he has given up the ball. But, as a WR, to which Clemson asked him to be a preferred walk on as, "he excelled"!
See many of these kids don't play the position "they will play in college"! They play the position their H.S. team needs them. It may not be the position that best suit what they can do. And the recruiting services miss on them.
This story plays out every year. Time after time and player after player. Only those who put all their faith in a star ranking are sold on "who is and isn't a blue chip player"! And they certainly can't be paying attention to all the 2 and 3 star players who make it to the NFL and all the 5 star talent who don't!
I trust the Clemson coaches to make the right call on talent! This recruiting class will be held in high regard by the end of their time here! Bookmark it.
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110%er [7173]
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What a 3, 4 and 5 Star are.
Feb 8, 2019, 5:55 PM
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Please Read. Especially, where it breaks down what each star means!
Kids come to Clemson and graduate. They RS and even if they can leave they don't always! Which means - you have time to develop your talent!
Only teams void of "the ability to consistently get talent" is worried about getting "all 5 star talent"! Which literally is no team out there that's competing for national titles! Bamer has 3 star recruits just like we do.
Please read the part about Eddie Jackson who was a 3 star recruit! The data will amaze you folks who are so "strung out" on recruiting services data!
https://www.foxsports.com/college-football/story/what-s-the-difference-between-a-3-4-and-5-star-football-recruit-013017
Having a day 1. Immediate impact player is nice! But, give me a salty veteran that came up the hard way that had to work to get to that level as well!
Go Tigers!
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