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YOUR BALANCE
Questions for the Fire Brownell crowd
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Questions for the Fire Brownell crowd


Mar 9, 2017, 10:46 AM

So let's assume DRad relieves CBB of his responsibilities after the season is over. Who exactly is this proven D1 coach that would even give Clemson a sniff? Or do we go with another mid-major up-and-comer and wait 4-5 years to see if he will pan out?

Even if we throw enough $$ at a proven D1 coach to convince them to come, what will we do differently to keep them happy here for more than 3-4 years?

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Aspiring member of the TigerNet Sewer Dwellers


I can't answer who the coach should be, but I will say that


Mar 9, 2017, 10:49 AM

in order for us to have a shot at a proven winner, Clemson will have to make promises/show that we're willing to spend the time and more importantly money to aggressively make the changes needed to make Clemson basketball relevant.

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"Clemson has been historically better than Carolina. That's pretty obvious." - Classof09

"No one knew we were overhyped until the season started." - Classof09


So is the LJC renovation enough to convince a coach that


Mar 9, 2017, 10:51 AM

we're willing to spend the money?

What else is needed?

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Aspiring member of the TigerNet Sewer Dwellers


in conjunction with a competitive salary, yes, it is.


Mar 9, 2017, 10:56 AM

Is it simply a question of more time for Brownell? A pay raise?

What else do you think is needed?

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It's a start, but no it's not enough. There needs to be a


Mar 9, 2017, 11:00 AM [ in reply to So is the LJC renovation enough to convince a coach that ]

plan of upgrades in place like we have with football. The upgrade process should be never-ending.

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"Clemson has been historically better than Carolina. That's pretty obvious." - Classof09

"No one knew we were overhyped until the season started." - Classof09


Dare I say it?


Mar 10, 2017, 1:50 AM

Oculus

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Re: I can't answer who the coach should be, but I will say that


Mar 9, 2017, 10:53 AM [ in reply to I can't answer who the coach should be, but I will say that ]

I WOULD SAY THAT 65 MILLION WAS A PRETTY #### GOOD START.

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What else does Coach Brownell need to build a decent team?


Mar 9, 2017, 10:59 AM

Time? Money?

Why do you want to keep him?

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Re: What else does Coach Brownell need to build a decent team?


Mar 9, 2017, 11:00 AM

I dont think I have read deroberts say he wants to keep him.

Deroberts just supports our coaches until the end. He did the same with Leggett.

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March 4th 2016- "Lee won't be here 4 years from today" - Viztiz


Re: What else does Coach Brownell need to build a decent team?


Mar 9, 2017, 11:45 AM

correct 07. that aint our job. when i have complaints i send emails to the proper people. what good does spewing venom do on the internet. only hurts what needs to be fixed.

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I sent DRad a letter after last season's disappointment.


Mar 9, 2017, 11:59 AM

and here we are. Have you done that?

I don't see how pointing out the shortcomings of our coach on Tigernet "hurts what needs to be fixed." It is what needs to be fixed.

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Re: What else does Coach Brownell need to build a decent team?


Mar 9, 2017, 11:43 AM [ in reply to What else does Coach Brownell need to build a decent team? ]

never said i wanted to keep him. said if he was there i was going to support him.

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$65 mil is a good start, but compared to most of the ACC


Mar 9, 2017, 10:59 AM [ in reply to Re: I can't answer who the coach should be, but I will say that ]

we're still in catch up mode.

Kids care more about these things nowadays.

2024 orange level memberbadge-donor-05yr.jpg flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up

"Clemson has been historically better than Carolina. That's pretty obvious." - Classof09

"No one knew we were overhyped until the season started." - Classof09


Re: $65 mil is a good start, but compared to most of the ACC


Mar 9, 2017, 11:42 AM

NO DOUBT. kelly that works with qualk and played at clemson says our arena is now easily in the top 5 of the acc especially the player ammenities. got to get a few more guys in. looks like a pretty good class coming in. hopefully the new stuff helps. trust me i got my doubts about brad but if he is gonna be my coach i am gonna support him 100%

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Build a basketball oculous, coaching and players will come***


Mar 9, 2017, 10:51 AM



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Re: Build a basketball oculous, coaching and players will come***


Mar 9, 2017, 4:19 PM

;)

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Relax.


Mar 9, 2017, 10:52 AM

It's just basketball.

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"I've played multiple sports and would bet any amount that I'm still more athletic than you at this present time...."


^^^gets it^^^***


Mar 9, 2017, 10:52 AM



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I for one am glad you are stopping. You are one of the most ignorant posters ever. You obviously think very highly of your own opinion, unlike the rest of us - RockHillTiger


Re: Relax.


Mar 9, 2017, 10:52 AM [ in reply to Relax. ]

out you...



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March 4th 2016- "Lee won't be here 4 years from today" - Viztiz


Just basketball? Just basketball?


Mar 9, 2017, 11:04 AM [ in reply to Relax. ]

How dare you!

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Re: Relax.


Mar 9, 2017, 11:51 AM [ in reply to Relax. ]

not sure if you're just be "flip" here or not. but its the "its just basketball mentality" that clemson has been fighting for years. its not "just basketball"... its CLEMSON basketball. i don't care if its fighting, frigging or running foot races.. i want CU to be the very best it can be in all endeavors.

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Relax. Francis Marion is a well-known troll on TigerNet


Mar 9, 2017, 12:14 PM

Trolls are why I rarely use Tigernet anymore.

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Aspiring member of the TigerNet Sewer Dwellers


You should be happy...


Mar 9, 2017, 12:53 PM [ in reply to Re: Relax. ]

Pretty sure bottom of the ACC barrel is the very best Clemson can do in basketball.

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"I've played multiple sports and would bet any amount that I'm still more athletic than you at this present time...."


Re: Questions for the Fire Brownell crowd


Mar 9, 2017, 10:52 AM

well, aggressively pursuing zion and hiring a family member would do wonders

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I for one am glad you are stopping. You are one of the most ignorant posters ever. You obviously think very highly of your own opinion, unlike the rest of us - RockHillTiger


That's true. We could take a step backwards and not even


Mar 9, 2017, 10:53 AM

make the tournament or be relevant.
Wait.....

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'I Cannot Sanction Your Buffoonery'


Depends what you consider proven.


Mar 9, 2017, 10:55 AM

This is ptobably long of young coaches who have done well at smaller schools. Who knows? We haven't looked.

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I would have a list with one name on it, Will Wade.


Mar 9, 2017, 10:56 AM

And, I counter your argument with this. Just how proven was Dabo, or for that matter Monte Lee, at the D1 level prior to their being named head coach at Clemson? I wouldn't call College of Charleston exactly big time D1 experience, and Dabo obviously had NO head coaching experience, which is why it took him a little while to find his way. I think the personality has to fit the job as much as anything, and I just don't see the necessary passion for the job in Brownell. I almost wish he would pull a Bobby Knight and throw a chair across the court sometime. At least then we would know it means something to him.

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Re: Questions for the Fire Brownell crowd


Mar 9, 2017, 10:57 AM

Current or former Duke assistant, same for Louisville, Kentucky, or UNC.

Get someone from a blueblood bball program that knows how to win and can bring energy and excitement.

Seems to have worked with the football program ... no?

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Exactly. There are young coaches all over the place.****


Mar 9, 2017, 11:03 AM



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Re: Questions for the Fire Brownell crowd


Mar 9, 2017, 11:07 AM [ in reply to Re: Questions for the Fire Brownell crowd ]

if you're referring to Dabo... really your comparison isn't that valid. TB hired Dabo after Dabo had been fired at Bama. he wasn't even in coaching at the time. and when we promoted Dabo, we were a mediocre football team. just not sure there is a one size fits all formula when it comes to hiring coaches.

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Start the conversation with Will Wade


Mar 9, 2017, 11:15 AM

The alumni ties should help. If not, we move on to Keatts at UNC Wilmington. Former coach at Hargrave Military Academy, assistant under Pitino, and is now taking UNC Wilmington to their second NCAA tournament in a row. The team he inherited was 9-23.

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So...take a chance with a mid-major up-and-comer?


Mar 9, 2017, 11:21 AM

And wait 4-5 years to see if our plan worked?

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Aspiring member of the TigerNet Sewer Dwellers


Re: So...take a chance with a mid-major up-and-comer?


Mar 9, 2017, 11:23 AM

That is pretty much all that Clemson bball will be able to do.

Big time coaches from big time programs arent going to want to come to a place where Bball is a very distant second to Football.

The reason I am 100% wanting Will Wade is if he is successful here he will be less likely to jump ship to a better job in the future.

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March 4th 2016- "Lee won't be here 4 years from today" - Viztiz


Why would it take 4-5 years?


Mar 9, 2017, 11:29 AM [ in reply to So...take a chance with a mid-major up-and-comer? ]

Two good recruiting classes in basketball and you're competitive. See VT

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What happens if things are looking promising after a couple


Mar 9, 2017, 11:35 AM

years, but no really good (top 20?) recruiting classes like you mention. What then? Wait another couple of years and see how things develop?

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Aspiring member of the TigerNet Sewer Dwellers


You're hoping to find a guy like OP


Mar 9, 2017, 11:21 AM

and avoid a guy like Shyatt.

We don't have much to lose. Who cares if we go from a 6 seed in the NIT to missing the NIT.

I know we can "do worse" than Brownell, but all that means is NIT bubble to no NIT. So who cares.

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The risk in firing Brownell is that we get a guy like Shyatt


Mar 9, 2017, 11:28 AM

that will win two fewer games per year. :)

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Re: The risk in firing Brownell is that we get a guy like Shyatt


Mar 9, 2017, 11:33 AM

17.83-14 = 2?

I saw you post that numerous times and decided to check the math.

Turns out you are simply spewing BS.


Message was edited by: Clemalum07®


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March 4th 2016- "Lee won't be here 4 years from today" - Viztiz


16.8 - 14.6 = 2.2


Mar 9, 2017, 12:06 PM

Brownell's record: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brad_Brownell

Shyatt's record: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Larry_Shyatt


Even if you had not been wrong, you are talking about a trivial difference.

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That's 2.2 more losses per year for Larry Shyatt than


Mar 9, 2017, 12:13 PM

Brad Brownell.

Not sure what we have to lose by getting rid of this guy.

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Re: That's 2.2 more losses per year for Larry Shyatt than


Mar 9, 2017, 12:27 PM

Facts aren't his strong point and neither is admitting a mistake.

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Re: That's 2.2 more losses per year for Larry Shyatt than


Mar 9, 2017, 12:31 PM

I have made no mistakes. I can do basic Math.

But nice try Viztiz dont you have a baseball caoch to actively pull against?

20+10+12+13+15= 70/5 = 14

22+16+13+23+16+17= 107/6 = 17.83

Sorry you are a #######.

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March 4th 2016- "Lee won't be here 4 years from today" - Viztiz


Re: That's 2.2 more losses per year for Larry Shyatt than


Mar 9, 2017, 12:40 PM [ in reply to Re: That's 2.2 more losses per year for Larry Shyatt than ]

See the facts above viztiz®

Eventually you will learn not to come after me it never ends well for you.

Let me know when you want to make that donation to fulfill your end of the bet.

Monte isnt going anywhere even with you actively pulling for him to fail due to your Coach Leggett allegiances.


Message was edited by: Clemalum07®


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March 4th 2016- "Lee won't be here 4 years from today" - Viztiz


Re: That's 2.2 more losses per year for Larry Shyatt than


Mar 9, 2017, 12:44 PM

Lol - you just argued elsewhere that you want Will Wade because you think he'd be loyal to Clemson and stay which was exactly my argument against Lee. So the rationale is valid when you use it but not me. You also accused someone else of posting under a new name in one of your most recent posts - something you are also known to do. It only ends poorly for me in your delusional, hypocritical mind.

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Re: That's 2.2 more losses per year for Larry Shyatt than


Mar 9, 2017, 12:59 PM

### does that have to do with you trying to call me out here and being 10000% wrong.

Just like a liberal deflect deflect deflect.

So sad... I really am looking forward to collecting on our bet. Some fan you are to bet against the team you supposedly like.

I have never posted under multiple names. That is simply another lie by you. Very sad. Clemtiger117 and this name have never posted at the same time. The day that B-Meist activated this one clemtiger117 was deactivated. I cant log into it even if I wanted to. Dont let facts get in your way though. Heaven knows you never have in the past.

Who does Coach Lee have loyalty to? Scar because he was an assistant there? GMAFB comparing that to being an Alumus is flat out idiotic... Which for you is par for the course.

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March 4th 2016- "Lee won't be here 4 years from today" - Viztiz


I did not realize that you were clemtiger117.


Mar 9, 2017, 1:07 PM

###, dude! That is enlightening!

I was wondering where that Brownell sycophant went.

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Re: I did not realize that you were clemtiger117.


Mar 9, 2017, 1:08 PM

I am not wanting Brownell to come back...

I have said for the last two years on here that it was NCAA T or bust this season.

I vote Bust.

I however do not think it is ever fair to a person for someone to spout off misinformation like you were with the Wins thing so I checked it and corrected it.

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March 4th 2016- "Lee won't be here 4 years from today" - Viztiz


Larry Shyatt averaged 2 more losses per year than Brownell.


Mar 9, 2017, 1:12 PM

Issa fack jack.

I love these arguments that, even if you weren't wrong, really underscore the futility of the current coaching staff.

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Re: Larry Shyatt averaged 2 more losses per year than Brownell.


Mar 9, 2017, 1:16 PM

Its a fact jack that you said wins in this thread. If you are going to pull out stats at least keep your narrative straight.

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March 4th 2016- "Lee won't be here 4 years from today" - Viztiz


What you like to comment on the fact that Brownell is only


Mar 9, 2017, 1:27 PM

2 losses better than Shyatt and how there is little risk in firing him that we take a step back?

http://www.tigernet.com/forums/message.jspa?messageID=21212960

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Re: What you like to comment on the fact that Brownell is only


Mar 9, 2017, 1:28 PM

Dude I am for firing him as I have stated over the past several days and for the most part the several years after I made the posts saying 2017 was NCAA T or bust.

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March 4th 2016- "Lee won't be here 4 years from today" - Viztiz


Re: That's 2.2 more losses per year for Larry Shyatt than


Mar 9, 2017, 1:12 PM [ in reply to Re: That's 2.2 more losses per year for Larry Shyatt than ]

You are just the worst. You really have no concept how stupid you are.

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Re: That's 2.2 more losses per year for Larry Shyatt than


Mar 9, 2017, 1:14 PM

He said wins not losses in the post I replied to...



Also just a reminder...



Tick Tock Tick Tock one year down 3 to go.

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March 4th 2016- "Lee won't be here 4 years from today" - Viztiz


Re: That's 2.2 more losses per year for Larry Shyatt than


Mar 9, 2017, 1:22 PM

seriously ####### pathetic. Enjoy counting chickens for 2 more years

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Re: That's 2.2 more losses per year for Larry Shyatt than


Mar 9, 2017, 1:23 PM

Aww did you think I didnt take a screen shot of your anti Monte BS?

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March 4th 2016- "Lee won't be here 4 years from today" - Viztiz


Re: That's 2.2 more losses per year for Larry Shyatt than


Mar 9, 2017, 1:25 PM

It was never anti-Monte but truth has never been your game. Since you're so charity driven how much can I donate to make you delete your account and not come back.

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Re: That's 2.2 more losses per year for Larry Shyatt than


Mar 9, 2017, 1:27 PM

I am still waiting on you to tell me what connection that is the equivalent of being an Alumnus Monte has with another major school.

Unless you actually believe he is going to leave us to go back to CofC.

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March 4th 2016- "Lee won't be here 4 years from today" - Viztiz


Re: That's 2.2 more losses per year for Larry Shyatt than


Mar 9, 2017, 1:48 PM

Comversely why would it matter if Will Wade went to Clemson? Jack Leggett / Clemson have a huge coaching tree and we went completely outside of it. It is the exact same logic you are using, you're just too stupid to see it.

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Re: 16.8 - 14.6 = 2.2


Mar 9, 2017, 12:28 PM [ in reply to 16.8 - 14.6 = 2.2 ]

Where the hell are you getting 16.8 from...

Brownells win average not counting this year (Its not over) is 17.8...

You said and I quote "that will win two fewer games per year." You are talking about wins.

17.8 vs 14 that is the win totals from Shyatt to Brownell while at Clemson.

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March 4th 2016- "Lee won't be here 4 years from today" - Viztiz


Here is my original post for your viewing pleasure.


Mar 9, 2017, 12:45 PM

http://www.tigernet.com/forums/message.jspa?messageID=21210942

I did say "wins" on this thread initially, but I mistated a previous point above that I posted that you said you checked out.

So, to clarify, Larry Shyatt lost only 2 more games per year than Brownell on average.

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Re: 16.8 - 14.6 = 2.2


Mar 9, 2017, 12:32 PM [ in reply to 16.8 - 14.6 = 2.2 ]

2 games a year is trivial?... Wow you couldn't be more wrong.

Congrats.

I am not wrong check the numbers below.

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March 4th 2016- "Lee won't be here 4 years from today" - Viztiz


Haha. I know you are joking. That said, there is no risk.


Mar 9, 2017, 12:18 PM [ in reply to The risk in firing Brownell is that we get a guy like Shyatt ]

We don't go to the tournament now with CBB. There is no risk other than financial for the school.

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The real question is...


Mar 9, 2017, 11:24 AM

I know we all love Clemson. Think it is the greatest place on earth and it is, but given our BB history -why would a promising coach or an established coach want to come here?

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Ed Zachary what I am axing***


Mar 9, 2017, 11:32 AM



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Aspiring member of the TigerNet Sewer Dwellers


Spud Webb?***


Mar 9, 2017, 11:24 AM



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"I've played multiple sports and would bet any amount that I'm still more athletic than you at this present time...."


Spud Webb refuses to look felllow players in the eyes. Hard for him


Mar 9, 2017, 11:35 AM

To meet them at their level. Easily lost in tall grass. Wait are we talking spud Webb or bob?


Message was edited by: lovingit®


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grass.***


Mar 9, 2017, 11:35 AM



military_donation.jpg flag link military_tech thumb_downthumb_up

That was a low blow***


Mar 9, 2017, 11:36 AM [ in reply to Spud Webb refuses to look felllow players in the eyes. Hard for him ]



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Aspiring member of the TigerNet Sewer Dwellers


Better than no blow...***


Mar 9, 2017, 11:37 AM



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null


classic dtu


Mar 9, 2017, 11:46 AM

lol

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I for one am glad you are stopping. You are one of the most ignorant posters ever. You obviously think very highly of your own opinion, unlike the rest of us - RockHillTiger


I've never said fire Brownell....


Mar 9, 2017, 11:25 AM

Brownlee, on the other hand....?



yes

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null


Re: Questions for the Fire Brownell crowd


Mar 9, 2017, 12:09 PM

You are starting with the wrong premise. You can't assume that you know who you are going to hire. Has Brownell earned the right to keep his job? No! He made the NCAA tournament with Purnells kids. With his players, he has failed to make the field. He has even failed to make the NIT every year. It's time for a change. Is it a risk to fire Brownell? Given his track record no! Expensive yes! I don't have a name either but to get a top coach it will involve more than a big salary. The administration has to show real financial support in upgrades for the basketball program. Back basketball like you do football. A new coach as well as recruits will like that. The man we need needs to embrace culture change like Dabo did. Recruiter first and x and os second! Exciting offense! He's out there and there is no excuse for putting up with Brownells crap.

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This isn't a shift manager at a manufacturing facility. I


Mar 9, 2017, 12:21 PM

don't think you fire a guy performing at CBB's level unless you feel somewhat certain that you can go out and find someone better...that would be willing to take on the challenge.

DRad would be in a much better position than me (or anyone else on TigerNet except for coachmac) to know this.

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Aspiring member of the TigerNet Sewer Dwellers


What do we have to lose. It's tournament or bust every year.


Mar 9, 2017, 12:23 PM

You don't think we can find someone else to fail as well. Other than the buyout we have absolutely nothing to lose.

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What if we're just


Mar 9, 2017, 12:29 PM

this close



to turning the corner, but we fire Brownell and take a major step back? Like 6-24 back?

How many people wanted Dabo fired after the 2010 season?

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Aspiring member of the TigerNet Sewer Dwellers


I agree. That is the biggest worry.


Mar 9, 2017, 12:33 PM

I am not sold he isn't about to turn the corner within 2 years. I know that will anger some people, but we may have a good class coming in. It feels like we may be turning the corner because of talent level. That's why I don't mind if he returns. If you go by his past he should be gone, but may be getting is there. It would be awesome if he just turned into the coach we are all looking for.

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I'll give it a shot . . .


Mar 9, 2017, 12:22 PM

I don't know who that coach would be or if we should go after a big name, proven winner, or an up and comer, but just because you or I can't answer that, it doesn't by any stretch mean that we should not make a change. Hiring a new coach is always a gamble, as both big names and up-and-comers can and do fail, but that never stops a school that is serious about basketball from making a needed change. And, if we are indeed serious about basketball, we will do what we have to do to keep a good coach.

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Re: Questions for the Fire Brownell crowd


Mar 9, 2017, 12:29 PM

For one thing, you can't get much worse than where the Basketball program is at right now. Brownell is a good MID-Level Coach...Mid-Level. When you get to the ACC this is big time basketball.

Right now we need some new energy injected into the basketball program. We need a quality coach.

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Oh bee leave me, it can get much worse. Were you around for


Mar 9, 2017, 12:32 PM

the Shyatt years?

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Re: Oh bee leave me, it can get much worse. Were you around for


Mar 9, 2017, 12:37 PM

Brownell isn't much better than Shyatt.

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Re: Oh bee leave me, it can get much worse. Were you around for


Mar 9, 2017, 12:37 PM

4 wins a year better but yeah that is nothing.

SMH

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Well we'll just have to agree to disagree. I'm not a


Mar 9, 2017, 12:45 PM [ in reply to Re: Oh bee leave me, it can get much worse. Were you around for ]

believer in moral victories, but at least now when we play a team at Carolina's level I feel like we have a chance to win.

Didn't feel that way with Shyatt as coach.

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Re: Well we'll just have to agree to disagree. I'm not a


Mar 9, 2017, 12:57 PM

umm - Shyatt delivered our only victory in basketball over a #1 ranked team and it happened to be UNC.

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I think we all know that was an outlier. And we also beat #1


Mar 9, 2017, 12:59 PM

Duke in 1980

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Re: I think we all know that was an outlier. And we also beat #1


Mar 9, 2017, 1:20 PM

What does it matter if it is an outlier? What is even less significant is what you "feel" is our "chance." That talk softens just how pitiful the last 7 years of Clemson basketball has been. You know what is an outlier? Making the NCAA tournament under Brownell. And he took over a team that had been to 3 straight!!!! Even if you want to argue that Purnell left it in bad shape he took over the Shyatt dumpster fire and got us there in year 5. We're on year 8 with a coach who struggles to get into the NIT and there is devoted faction on this board still trying shove this #### down everyone else's throats.

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I corrected one sentence for you..


Mar 9, 2017, 1:25 PM

That talk softens just how pitiful the last 7 105 years of Clemson basketball has been.

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This is coming from a guy who has been a staunch Brownell


Mar 9, 2017, 12:50 PM

defender up until this year. I think Purnell left a much weaker program than it appeared on the surface, especially at PG after Stitt graduated, and I think he had a lot of bad breaks early on with transfers/KJ leaving. We can all agree the facilities were not up to par.

BUT this was the year when he didn't have any more excuses. We were back in a newly-renovated LJ. We had our best player back and a really solid nucleus of transfers starting.

I genuinely think he is a good coach and I think we had a lot of bad bounces this season. But you don't lose that many close games based on bad luck. For whatever reason this team didn't have the chemistry or the fortitude to weather those close games, obviously our defense really suffered when we brought in a bunch of better offensive players.

I think you give Gregg Marshall a call. When he tells you #### no ('cause he ain't comin' to Clemson but it never hurts to ask), you give Will Wade a call, then maybe someone like Earl Grant. We're never going to get a big lateral hire like UK did with Calipari or any of the bball blue bloods but don't have to. I think the fanbase would be perfectly fine with a coach that goes to the NCAA tourney every year and makes a run at a Final Four once in a while.

We need someone who can recruit. I think the way college bball is right now, getting a couple of really great recruits is more important to a team than having a great Xs and Os guy on the sideline.

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So Will Wade and Earl Grant are proven recruiters?


Mar 9, 2017, 12:54 PM

I don't know, just asking.

What makes you think one of these two would "go to the NCAA tourney every year and make a run at a Final Four once in a while."

And you're correct, Gregg Marshall ain't happenin.

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I think they're better recruiters than BB***


Mar 9, 2017, 1:30 PM



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The good old "who we going to get?" argument


Mar 9, 2017, 12:50 PM

absolutely the lamest reason ever for keeping a coach. An A.D. worth the price of admission can find a capable basketball coach for Clemson University. Clemson can do better than being in the bottom half of the league and playing in the NIT or worse every year

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Re: The good old "who we going to get?" argument


Mar 9, 2017, 1:03 PM

I hate that argument.

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Re: The good old "who we going to get?" argument


Mar 9, 2017, 1:25 PM [ in reply to The good old "who we going to get?" argument ]

Let me ask you pro Brownell people a question. Zion Williamson is in our backyard. His father has Clemson ties and his son is one of the hottest players in the country. I would dearly love to get him at Clemson but he would be insane to come play for Brownell. That's why we need a change now.

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Re: Questions for the Fire Brownell crowd


Mar 9, 2017, 1:31 PM

Was Dabo a proven coach? How'd that work out.
It's just about getting the right person.
And Will Wade is proven.

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Re: Questions for the Fire Brownell crowd


Mar 9, 2017, 1:32 PM

He was a great recruiter.

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Re: Questions for the Fire Brownell crowd


Mar 9, 2017, 9:25 PM

And we have seen this staff is not strong with that.

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So you would be willing to fire Brownell and promote


Mar 9, 2017, 1:38 PM [ in reply to Re: Questions for the Fire Brownell crowd ]

Steve Smith to Head Coach?

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Re: So you would be willing to fire Brownell and promote


Mar 9, 2017, 1:46 PM

He should have some head coaching experience.

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That depends. Does Clemson really care about basketball?


Mar 9, 2017, 4:50 PM

Or is it just something we pay lip service to once in a while?

The facility upgrades are wonderful, and long overdue. But do these upgrades represent the start of a real, legitimate commitment to basketball success? If so, then great! We should also expect to see continued investments in our basketball program to give our coaches all of the resources they want and need to be successful. In that case, I would be excited to hire a new coach (at a higher salary than Brownell makes, of course) who is a proven winner at the high major level. It would signal that Clemson DOES care about basketball and that we aren't just a "football school."

On the other hand, if we aren't going to truly commit to basketball success at Clemson, we should stick with Brownell for another year or two. He runs a clean program, he recruits good student-athletes, and he graduates his players at a record rate. He represents our school well, and that counts for a lot. You keep him and hope that the continuity of his tenure, the relationships he has built, and the new facilities will allow us to turn the corner as a program. After all, he has built extremely competitive teams which play hard and put us in a position to win almost every game, despite usually being at a significant talent disadvantage.

In either scenario, we must accept that a large portion of our fan base is ignorant when it comes to basketball. They think that we pay Brownell a high salary for a basketball coach (even though we don't), that his buyout is really high (it isn't), and that the new facilities should result in an immediate improvement in talent and wins (they shouldn't). These fans are pretty ignorant with regard to basketball and have no idea what it takes to succeed. A new coach is not going to make us an overnight success, especially in the current environment, unless his last name is Krzyzewski or Pitino.

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Re: That depends. Does Clemson really care about basketball?


Mar 9, 2017, 5:25 PM

Good points and well laid out. I just wonder if there is a 3rd scenario - one where that "tops down" commitment is applied to the current situation. Obviously something is missing and I believe you nailed it. Money can't buy everything. Just like in any organization, real change only happens when leadership is on board - and not just with benign words but real tangible actions.

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Judge, you have to ask yourself why the last part of your


Mar 9, 2017, 6:20 PM [ in reply to That depends. Does Clemson really care about basketball? ]

post is true. It is because:

a) Coach K or Pitino can recruit.
b) Either of those guys can develop recruits once they get there.

Our guy seems to be rarely able to do a) or b, DEFINITELY not at the Center or shooting guard positions.


Message was edited by: 76er®


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Re: That depends. Does Clemson really care about basketball?


Mar 10, 2017, 9:45 AM [ in reply to That depends. Does Clemson really care about basketball? ]

Those are good questions.

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We didn't find a coach with those credentials for football


Mar 9, 2017, 9:42 PM

> So let's assume DRad relieves CBB of his
> responsibilities after the season is over. Who
> exactly
is this proven D1 coach that would even
> give Clemson a sniff? Or do we go with another
> mid-major up-and-comer and wait 4-5 years to see if
> he will pan out?
>
> Even if we throw enough $$ at a proven D1 coach to
> convince them to come, what will we do differently to
> keep them happy here for more than 3-4 years?

and look what happened.

We haven't made the 68 team tournament in 6 years.

When does it become time to do something different?

Our last three years' records
16-15 8-10 in the ACC
17-14 10-8 in the ACc
17-15 6-12 in the ACC

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Re: Questions for the Fire Brownell crowd


Mar 9, 2017, 10:15 PM

That's how a loser thinks, not being negative just the lamest excuse ever that only losers come up with.

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The only coach we have hired from a Power


Mar 10, 2017, 2:01 AM

Conference in the last 40+ years is Barnes...When OP left, we tried to interview at least 4 Power 5 coaches, 2 of whom declined the invite to meet...And that was with a SR lead team coming off of 3 straight NCAA appearances.I would assume we have to settle for another mid major flavor of the month and hope it doesn't take him several years to get on his feet recruiting too

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